Posted: 8/27/2022 1:05:57 AM EDT
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I'm trying to figure out what would be more ideal and useful for competitions and just general use/SHTF. I already have a plate carrier but I don't know if you think i should put money more towards one over the other. I think a battle belt would be more useful but I am very new to this stuff and would prefer some input before making a purchase. |
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Quoted: sorry, but i don't know what LC2 and OTOH is LC2 is a USGI belt used for a long time, basic but cuts the mustard for some people. I personally went with a HSGI operator belt and it is very nice in my opinion. OTOH means on the other hand, meaning Mr. Enchanter doesn't like to "Larp". |
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Quoted: I'm still a belt and suspenders kind of guy. LC2 stuff works for me. OTOH, I'm not going to war, or playing war. Suspenders have never made sense to me. Aren’t your hips the strongest area on the human body? Why would you transfer weight to your back when you don’t need to? |
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Quoted: LC2 is a USGI belt used for a long time, basic but cuts the mustard for some people. I personally went with a HSGI operator belt and it is very nice in my opinion. OTOH means on the other hand, meaning Mr. Enchanter doesn't like to "Larp". awh okay i understand what is going on now. Thank you for that 
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Quoted: Suspenders have never made sense to me. Aren't your hips the strongest area on the human body? Why would you transfer weight to your back when you don't need to? Quoted: Quoted: I'm still a belt and suspenders kind of guy. LC2 stuff works for me. OTOH, I'm not going to war, or playing war. Suspenders have never made sense to me. Aren't your hips the strongest area on the human body? Why would you transfer weight to your back when you don't need to? Edit; To just be clear, it was war fighting training shit. Not actual war fighting. |
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Battle belt first. May not be popular opinion, but in your position...I would buy another plate carrier and simply remove the plate for competition. I would rather own another plate carrier, that has the option of being armor, over a chest rig that can only ever do one job. Noone ever said, "I have too much armor in the house." My Crye belt and suspenders is maybe my favorite piece of gear though. I got a plate carrier first and then a belt.....I would advise anyone to do the opposite. Armor is weight, chest rig is weight without armor.....a belt is fast into action and (as long as there is a holster with a pistol in it) has you armed in seconds. |
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Quoted: Battle belt first. May not be popular opinion, but in your position...I would buy another plate carrier and simply remove the plate for competition. Noone ever said, "I have too much armor in the house." My Crye belt and suspenders is maybe my favorite piece of gear though. I got a plate carrier first and then a belt.....I would advise anyone to do the opposite. Armor is weight, chest rig is weight without armor.....a belt is fast into action and (as long as there is a holster with a pistol in it) has you armed in seconds. I have been looking at getting another plate carrier because my current one is technically a slick plate carrier. (trex arms ac1) and i think that would be good for what i am talking about but i didn't know what would be the best option and i didn't add another plate carrier cause i already had one. but i do understand what you are saying. |
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I know GD hates the police and doesn't want advice. Hell, even my dept has incorporated Load Bearing Vests along with duty belts. But people need to start looking at our duty belt system (even our gross nylon ones). Safariland is the standard. Police duty belts have an inner velcro belt that will stick to the inner velcro on the duty belt. Then you attach keepers that snug the two belts together. Add a level 3 holster and learn how to use it. You can attach other things, it doesn't have to be handcuffs, asps, and tasers. The reason is, you aren't in the middle east, in a war. You are in the USA, and need to stop larping and realize that you can't always shoot someone. You need gun retention, and belt retention (keepers) so someone doesn't just pull your whole belt off. Look at stuff that is proven to work in the environment you are in, not a fantasy world thousands of miles away that America is not in anymore. |
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Quoted: My days of carrying war fighting shit on my body are long behind me. However, when I did, the suspenders did what suspenders are expected to do, they kept the belt from falling down. With a loaded ass pack, 2 canteens with a canteen cup and stove, and 2 full mag pouches, it was a joy on occasion to unbuckle the belt, and take the weight off of my hips for a while. Edit; To just be clear, it was war fighting training shit. Not actual war fighting. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I'm still a belt and suspenders kind of guy. LC2 stuff works for me. OTOH, I'm not going to war, or playing war. Suspenders have never made sense to me. Aren't your hips the strongest area on the human body? Why would you transfer weight to your back when you don't need to? Edit; To just be clear, it was war fighting training shit. Not actual war fighting. Fair enough! |
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Quoted: I know GD hates the police and doesn't want advice. Hell, even my dept has incorporated Load Bearing Vests along with duty belts. But people need to start looking at our duty belt system (even our gross nylon ones). Safariland is the standard. Police duty belts have an inner velcro belt that will stick to the inner velcro on the duty belt. Then you attach keepers that snug the two belts together. Add a level 3 holster and learn how to use it. You can attach other things, it doesn't have to be handcuffs, asps, and tasers. The reason is, you aren't in the middle east, in a war. You are in the USA, and need to stop larping and realize that you can't always shoot someone. You need gun retention, and belt retention (keepers) so someone doesn't just pull your whole belt off. Look at stuff that is proven to work in the environment you are in, not a fantasy world thousands of miles away that America is not in anymore. lol so I could be reading your response wrong but all the belts i am looking at have a inner belt that connects to a outer belt that would hold all of my stuff and yes i would be "LARPING" but like I said I would be using it for competitions and SHTF if ever needed but again its mainly for comps. Yes I know what safariland is. They are a very reputable company. Any ways thank you for your information on me LARPING |
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Quoted: My favorite piece of gear is my blue alpha belt with esstac mag pouches and G-Code holster. See that is what i am thinking that a belt would be best. But since i am new to this i thought i would make sure that i am thinking correctly about this and not missing points. I keep hearing people say that a ready rig/recce rig is the best way to go. i am not planing on going on long trips with this stuff on and if i was i would think my plate carrier would suite it. i live in a HOA lol. |
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Quoted: Suspenders have never made sense to me. Aren’t your hips the strongest area on the human body? Why would you transfer weight to your back when you don’t need to? Quoted: Quoted: I'm still a belt and suspenders kind of guy. LC2 stuff works for me. OTOH, I'm not going to war, or playing war. Suspenders have never made sense to me. Aren’t your hips the strongest area on the human body? Why would you transfer weight to your back when you don’t need to? Spreads the weight out over a larger area, making it feel like less than it is. And more importantly, keeps the belt from sagging, which is both uncomfortable and fucks with your mobility. Modern molle belt sleeves with high friction inner material, and the ones with velcro inner belts, help to alleviate the issue to a degree, but simply aren’t as effective as suspenders. The old ALICE rig, and its predecessor, were the best infantry LBE the US ever issued. Chest rigs came about due to mechanizing infantry, where heavy belts are impractical riding, and getting in/out of vehicles. For foot patrols, shooting prone, and just general moving around, a heavy belt with suspenders is where it’s at. |
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If you're leaning towards competition go with a belt. A belt doesn't have to be super complex. Lightweight 2 piece belt (Ferro, HSP, etc.), retention holster (Safariland), 2 pistol mags, 1 rifle mag, a tourniquet and a small IFAK. Can use it for USPSA, 3 Gun, or general training. Keep it slick. People put tons of garbage on them, my first one has far too much crap on it. If you're planning on SHTF, carbine courses or a more rifle centric set up go with a slick PC that accepts removable chest rigs. That way you can wear a light chest rig on range days, 3 Gun, or courses. Can have a few chest rigs ready to roll without breaking the bank. Can also conceal it if you just want some armor. Helmet and NODS anywhere before getting a bunch of extra crap. From there you can do a 24-48 hour "Assault Pack" type deal with light sustainment stuff. Then a 72+ hour pack with longer term stuff. That's my thought process. If you're on a shoestring budget I'd just make a RECCE/general infantry type chest rig. |
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Shameless plug I have a Haley rig for sale if you want one in coyote. Moving on to your question. It depends what you want to do. Everyone is all battle belt and I do have one but a big hike and that would certainly suck. For competition its perfect. I choose to use a safariland holster which slows me down in matches but makes for good crossover to SHTF or battle. No reason not to run your plate carrier in matches for rifle. If you get the Haley rig it can clip in to common plate carrier clip and Velcro systems like most have now. If you perceive you might want to cover a shit ton of ground armor is out the window the Haley rig is ok and at the point we are talking RECCE loadout I actually kinda like the old ALICE gear or current versions of similar load bearing suspender belty chest thingy. I'd say dont just look at some current cool guy photo and say oh yeah that's the good stuff. We are mostly seeing GWOT cool guy teams that are hitting a house and then getting back on the helicopter, if that is what you are doing copy them, otherwise you can look throughout history at what worked and then see what the modern world has to offer. I also like some variety but not so much variety that I can't recall where my shit on my body is. |
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Quoted: If you're leaning towards competition go with a belt. A belt doesn't have to be super complex. Lightweight 2 piece belt (Ferro, HSP, etc.), retention holster (Safariland), 2 pistol mags, 1 rifle mag, a tourniquet and a small IFAK. Can use it for USPSA, 3 Gun, or general training. Keep it slick. People put tons of garbage on them, my first one has far too much crap on it. If you're planning on SHTF, carbine courses or a more rifle centric set up go with a slick PC that accepts removable chest rigs. That way you can wear a light chest rig on range days, 3 Gun, or courses. Can have a few chest rigs ready to roll without breaking the bank. Can also conceal it if you just want some armor. Helmet and NODS anywhere before getting a bunch of extra crap. From there you can do a 24-48 hour "Assault Pack" type deal with light sustainment stuff. Then a 72+ hour pack with longer term stuff. That's my thought process. If you're on a shoestring budget I'd just make a RECCE/general infantry type chest rig. I think you have made the most informative/respectable options on what i should do. after i figured this information out my thought was to look into helmets and nods but i believe that is to expensive for me. |
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Quoted: From everything i have read so far it seems like a battle belt is the best way to go. I still believe i need a recce/ready rig but for comps like i am considering i think the belt is the best way to go. Belts also make a regular day on the range just plain enjoyable. You won’t regret buying one. Beware some companies like Blue Alpha can take a few weeks as they are made to order. I waited about 4 weeks for mine. Worth it. |
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I'd say set up a belt, especially if you already have a PC that you could just run empty. That gives you capability you don't already have versus something that's "like a plate carrier but can't hold armor" and for competition stuff I don't know that I've ever seen a chest rig used (mind you, my competition experience is limited to youtube videos, but still). I think of it using the line gear concept - first line is your belt, second is your chest rig/PC. You're currently missing one of those, and I'd say 'everyone gets served before anyone gets seconds' would be prudent here. ETA: I don't know if it's the best choice out there but I have a Safe Life Defense belt for similar reasons to yours and it's done well whenever I've used it. The velcro is nice to remove the need for keepers. |
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Quoted: I'm still a belt and suspenders kind of guy. LC2 stuff works for me. OTOH, I'm not going to war, or playing war. Me too. I've got sets of a similar system to what I was issued in the 80s. I've tried other stuff, but keep coming back to this - It's not sexy but it works. |
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Quoted: I know GD hates the police and doesn't want advice. Hell, even my dept has incorporated Load Bearing Vests along with duty belts. But people need to start looking at our duty belt system (even our gross nylon ones). Safariland is the standard. Police duty belts have an inner velcro belt that will stick to the inner velcro on the duty belt. Then you attach keepers that snug the two belts together. Add a level 3 holster and learn how to use it. You can attach other things, it doesn't have to be handcuffs, asps, and tasers. The reason is, you aren't in the middle east, in a war. You are in the USA, and need to stop larping and realize that you can't always shoot someone. You need gun retention, and belt retention (keepers) so someone doesn't just pull your whole belt off. Look at stuff that is proven to work in the environment you are in, not a fantasy world thousands of miles away that America is not in anymore. We might be a few more trumped up FBI raids and a couple more stolen elections from it being the Middle East here my dude. Are folks supposed to order a belt on Amazon when the commies are burning their cars in their driveway? |
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What do you mean by “ready-rig/recce-rig”? Below are some ramblings on some thoughts based on some kit I’ve used. In the last decade or so before I retired (and a couple years after as an advisor), I simply ran a battle belt that would integrate with my plate carrier. I think the belt kit is the first place to start, but it depends on our purpose. If kept pretty light, you can use it without suspenders and it will likely integrate with your plate carrier. For the TLDR crew: 1. Belts are a great foundation. Also, perfect for home defense as a stand-alone (very quick to don) or integrated with a plate carrier. If too bulky, they need suspenders and become more of a “load carrying system”. If too bulky, they suck if getting into and out of vehicles. 2. Micro chest rigs have their place. Fine for home defense and even better if adaptable to your plate carrier. There’s value in a minimalist form if you want to carry a larger ruck or pack. You can still use a battle belt with them as well. As a stand-alone, they work well in and out of vehicles/helos. 3. Larger chest rigs are fighting rigs. Most designed for combat loads/more capacity. I prefer split fronts for easy on/off, better for getting into prone and they still integrate well if wearing a large ruck (with hip belt). They can be used in a the recce role. Often a little “hotter” as they cover up most of your torso…as a stand-alone, they work pretty well in and out of vehicles/helos. 4. Patrol rigs. Basically your traditional LBE/LCE; belt with suspenders or harness. These are designed to carry pretty significant loads, ala “recce” or patrolling. They trap less heat and put the weight on your hips where it belongs. They don’t integrate well with a heavy back that needs a hip belt, but work well with “short back bergens” and small patrol packs that kind of sit on top of your belt kit. Best for foot patrolling, a little bulky for tight areas like home defense, kind of suck getting into and out of vehicles, but they’re easy to don and doff. Ramblings in another post somewhere: For those not wanting to read as this turned out longer than I expected, here’s the cliff-notes of my take on your line-2 fighting gear: 1. Minimalist/Micro chest rigs are great for home defense, short missions, and can offer some versatility if attached to a plate carrier. Short duration fight rigs, limited ammo, but more streamlined for dynamic situations. They’re also often the faster reload rigs. 2. Chest rigs are best suited for mounted (water, land, or air modes of transportation) operations when you’re seated or in and out. Can carry more fighting kit than the minimalist/micro rigs, and still integrated well with a larger pack (that uses a waist belt). That can trap heat, hard to go prone unless it’s a split rig, and if too heavy can really screw up your balance. 3. Belt-mounted patrolling rigs (ala the old ALICE LBE) are still a great option for certain applications. They can carry the most amount of field gear, they have better air flow for hot/humid conditions, and if designed right, can balance well and handle running and low-to-the-ground movements. They’re best for those short-duration patrols and field operations, and while they suck (for me) with larger sustainment packs, they’ll work well with smaller sustainment packs. Easy on off, but not the best when in and out of vehicle. ____ Plate carriers are far more prevalent these days. I personally don’t consider them for any long-range or long-duration patrolling. In the house, around the house, driving, getting called up to do a direct action mission at the local Bingo Palace…all good uses for plate carriers. I have a slick one for more discreet needs and my overt one can easily attach my Haley or Spiritus micro chest rigs. More for immediate defensive/offensive fighting needs, not really for patrolling. You can add a battle belt in here as well and I have some that are very minimalist and some that start to morph into an LBE kit needing suspenders. My larger ones are pretty much just modern versions of the LBE, but often don’t rival the capacity of a dedicated load-bearing belt kit with harness. Many newer magazine pouches are open topped for faster access. This is fine for standup operations and short term dynamic moves, but if you throw yourself on the ground with a full loadout and rucksack, you’re likely going to lose a mag or two. If you have to stick to the ground and crawl a 100 meters, your pouches will enjoy a lot of dirt, rocks, grass, mud, and twigs collecting in those openings They have their place and while my field patrol kits usually have covered magazine pouches, I do like at least one speed-reload pouch. Open tops are always going to be faster than enclosed mag pouches; but they’re not as secure nor do they keep crap out of your mag/mag pouches. For discreet or low profile rigs, most are for CCW or a minimalist fighting rig. I’ve got the Vertx Firebase for my PCC, Unobtanium Dank Robber for rifle mags, and HPG Kit Bags for pistols. I also toss in the micro rigs like Spiritus and Haley Strategic, but they are a little more versatile and can be worn over, covert, or slapped as a placard on a plate carrier. Spiritus has “wings” to expand capacity even futher. Minimalist in nature, they typically just have ammo, maybe a light, multitool and micro FAK, and CAT. I see these as good home defense rigs given their lower profile and easier to maneuver in tight spaces. Any “fighting” is going to likely be brief and not extended; it carries just the bare essentials. Patrolling. Mounted or on foot…or both? Short-distance/short-duration, or long-distance/duration patrolling? I distinguish between the two for a few reasons. Going back to the old LBE days. Those were mostly an “on foot” patrolling rig. I recall often taking them off when getting into a vehicle and donning them when dismounting and going into patrol mode (we kept them on if in a tracked carrier). We see a slight resurgence of the belt kit, and I’ve added a Jay Jays Commander’s Belt Kit with harness along with the Russian Mersh kit to my collection, where the Mersh is a little more traditional (and perfect for an AK). The Jay Jays kit is a modern and updated version of the old British belt kits. They don’t use a traditional butt pack, but large sustainment pouches. I grew up with the LBE and patrolling the soaking wet environment of Fort Lewis (now JBLM), along with a couple of National Guard training areas. I love them for longer foot patrols, but hated using them with a really large ruck. The Medium ALICE or a similar sized assault pack was about the maximum for pack size and it took some arranging to get the pack on to the top of your butt pack without just sitting on the shelf. It wasn’t always ideal, but it worked. The Jay Jays Belt Kit is an aftermarket replacement to the issued British PLCE webbing set. Mine isn’t the typical belt and pouches; it’s an integrated kit. I like it for hot and humid summer patrolling and while not “jungle” we have areas on our property that are swampy and wet. The design allows more airflow access. I like the capacity and even a small patrol pack that integrates with a belt kit can be an easy 3-4 day patrol setup. The Russian-made Mersh is their variation of a commercially produced belt kit, mush similar to our older LBE, just updated with some new materials and unique features. You can pack a lot of field kit in these setups; much more than just magazines and smokes. It’s also designed for AK mags, but will hold a variety very easily. Whereas the minimalist kits are great for a fast mission or single firefight, these belt kits are great for spending longer time in the field, patrolling, doing recce, etc. The biggest downside to the belt kits are integrating with a larger pack that requires the waist belt for proper load suspension. For a larger pack, I personally go with a chest rig. Chest rigs. I like them quite a bit and as soon as I could I dumped my LBE for a Tactical Tailor MAV and as soon as the Army ignorantly mandated our unfirms with the dumb “universal camo pattern” (UCP), I added a two piece/split UCP MAV. Most of my field stuff was done in a vehicle, I was constantly in and out of vehicles while in a non-combat arms leadership position. While I didn’t need to get into the prone position or low crawl for my duty description, the split/two-piece chest rigs make it much easier; they’re also easier to don and doff. I have several different chest rigs, Blackhawk, Tactical Tailor, Velocity Systems, ESSTAC, HSGI (the massive Denali model), and more a recent Platatac model. I much prefer them when using a larger pack as they integrate better for me, although not as good as the smaller micro rigs like Spiritus, Haley, even the Helikon-Tex version. Most are ammo/munitions oriented, but the large versions do offer a little more water/sustainment capacity. I also like the capability of adding a battle belt for even more capacity and versatility. With the bigger versions, you do have to be cautious to not overload them as they can make you top heavy, screw up your balance and you’ll head will still be three feet off the ground when in the prone. I ran into a security guy in Afghanistan, I can’t recall the make of his chest rig, but he literally had 14 x 30-round mags in an oversized chest rig, a couple of smokes and a few pistol mags. He had to wear his assault pack to help balance him out…it was a little excessive IMHO. My HSGI Denali can be loaded up with 17 x 30-round mags and while it has that capacity, it was an accident waiting to happen when I just wanted to try it out on a little road-march. I do have an older chest-rig/vest from Eagle Industries. I didn’t really include vests, mostly because I never like them. That was likely because I was mostly in hot and/or humid climates and those vests would just trap heat and they sucked for me. I won’t comment much further, but they are a good option for those that just want to grab some essentials and go and don’t have issues with high heat and humidity. Micro or minimalist load kits: Single mission (like a DA or QRF mission), just a few smaller essentials where priority is fast access to a few magazines and it’s on the lower end for load-out capacity. Most of the micro chest rigs integrate well with a larger sustainment pack and many can be covered for discreet carry; also good rigs for mounted/vehicle use. The minimalist design makes it easy to ‘not’ overload, but you do have to prioritize the minimal real estate for maximum capability. I find these the easiest to integrate with a plate carrier as well. Belt Kits (LBE, Mersh, PLCE/Jay Jays): multiday patrol, smaller sustainment pack, field-kit oriented; more for recce than fighting. A great general purpose kit if you don’t need to carry a larger sustainment pack. Offers better balance and stability and if designed right (like Jay Jays), they can really hug your body to allow running without flopping all over. Much better for ground maneuvers and prone fighting positions. A true potential fighting/sustainment Layer 2 kit loadout; a lot more forgiving and heavier loads are easier to manage; very important when water is a higher priority. Chest Rigs: Heavy fighting rigs, more essentials, but not as much as belt mounted kits; a little hotter, but much better for integrating with a larger sustainment pack. Better for mounted use and split rigs are easier to low-to-the-ground maneuvering (plus, much easier to don/doff). The only issue is you can’t bulk it up too much for more sustainment kit on your Layer 2; if too heavy, it will throw off your balance and put a lot of stress on your lower back. Some can be huge, but you need some discipline to not overload the larger chest rigs…it’s not as bad when sitting in a vehicle, but after several kilometers on foot, you’ll quickly curse your lack of discipline. Harness type matters to some. I’ve heard it said that the crossing or “X” in the back harness is more comfortable and it seems that way to some degree when wearing a pack. The “H” harness is often easier to get on and off and wears over a plate carrier better. Some have variation of a larger back panel; some simply mesh, others MOLLE webbing for attaching a hydration bladder or small pack. Padding will depend on how much you’re carrying and if you’re wearing a pack. I don’t typically like padded harnesses for fighting kits; for me, it just adds extra bulk without any significant benefits of comfort. If I needed padded straps, I need to rethink my loadout or consider adding a small assault pack to balance the weight. If I was to prioritize my kit in the various carry systems it would be: Minimum (Spiritus, Haley): 1. Mags/ammo (rifle and pistol mags) 2. Radio (if applicable) 3. FAK/CAT/Shears 4. Light (usually a headlamp, but often a handheld for the micro rigs and home defense) 5. Multitool (if not EDC) 6. Small notebook, pen/pencil, Sharpie 7. Bic/tinder 8. Cyalume/chem-light or two 9. Gloves/attachment ring 10. Earplugs Fighting Chest Rigs (Velocity Systems, Platatac, MAV, ESSTAC, HSGI) 1. All of the above, including more magazines/munitions, plus: 2. Water container, preferably a bottle or canteen, even if smaller 3. Compass 4. Operational/Area Map 5. Gorilla tape or electric tape roll 6. Booboo kit on top of FAK/sometimes an extra CAT 7. Spoon 8. Usually a single energy bar and couple of electrolyte mix packets 9. Optional Specialized Equipment (monocular, thermal, night vision, extra batteries) Patrolling/Belt Kits (ALICE LBE, Mersh, Jay Jays/PLCE, ec.) 1. All of the above plus: 2. Usually two water bottles/canteens 3. At least one canteen cook kit set (canteen cup and lid, spoon) 3. Water purification/filter 4. Tarp/tent stakes/cordage (more cordage than just for the shelter) 5. Extra socks, wool hat (winter), bandana (possibly a compact rain jacket or wind shirt) 6. Small brew kit (possibly a small stove and fuel) 7. Small repair kit 8. Optional Specialized tools (machete, kukri, folding saw, etc.) A small assault pack is a highly desirable addition to your shorter-range or duration patrolling kit and allows some of those comfort/survival essentials too bulky for your first or second lines of gear, such as: Extra ammo/mags, munitions, etc. Specialized equipment (binoculars, thermal, night vision, etc) Insulation layer and/rain jacket/soft shell Tarp, suspension, plus extra cordage Bivvy Bag Small CCF pad Rations, small cook kit (if not part of the 2nd Layer fighting kit) Hydration bottle/bladder for carrying more water Extra batteries Battery pack, USB cords, AC adapter, 12V battery adapter, universal battery charger Wet wipes, TP, small microfiber cloth Shemagh or net scarf Just some long-winded ramblings! ROCK6 |
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I’ve run both in carbine classes. I think it depends on what you are going to be doing and wearing with it. If you are in and out of vehicles, not having stuff on your back might be a benefit. If you are going to be on foot what will fit with your primary pack? For classes, I enjoyed a battle belt but never wore plates or anything like that. Being able to go prone could be affected with a chest rig as well so shooting around VTAC barricades was easier with a belt with everything big staged behind the points of the hips. So I guess what I’m saying is there are pros and cons to each. |
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I shot matches for years out of a DAA belt and some speed pouches. But based on here I wanted to try a chest rig. Bought one BFG 10 speed and wore it around the house a few hours. Didn’t love it. Couldn’t figure out a situation where I would want mags on my chest but NOT be bullet proof. So I sold it to fund a belt upgrade and nice mag shingle for my slickster. I figure almost any time I would have a rifle or need rifle mags, overt is it. Otherwise a small rifle will fit in a backpack and a minimalist battle belt (safariland, 1 pistol mag, 1 rifle mag, IFAK) would be enough. Edited to add. Always listen to @Rock6. It will save you time and money |
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Quoted: So I guess what I’m saying is there are pros and cons to each. Pro's and con's as well as different applications. If I was starting all over. I would invest in a good belt setup first, add a quality plate carrier and one that would integrate with a micro-chest rig like Spiritus. They can all be used together or separately, and the micro chest rigs, by themselves, will still work with a full pack setup. The only think you're lacking is a big combat load, but I'm not doing combat anymore. For just "patrolling" and LARPing around the property, I've really been digging the Jay Jays webbing kit and harness...again, different roles and different purpose. ROCK6 |
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Quoted: That is a good question. I am honestly not sure. I am assuming USPSA and comps similar to it. I have not done a comp yet. I am honestly just thinking about basic comps. Quoted: Quoted: What kind of "competition" are you planning on shooting in? That is a good question. I am honestly not sure. I am assuming USPSA and comps similar to it. I have not done a comp yet. I am honestly just thinking about basic comps. It sounds like you're trying to find and justify buying a jack-of-all-trades system to do everything, but without knowing what you are actually going to do with it, or like "competition" is code word for "I want to buy sexy cool shit without looking like a weirdo," and you're going to be disappointed. Unless the competition is IDPA, in which case you should start off wearing what you wear every day and not worry about it. Competition specific equipment is designed just for competition. There is little to no retention to stop disarming attacks, its not meant for climbing over fences, through brush, or navigating tight areas. The gear is meant to be solid, rigid, and not move or be flexible, and your magazine pouches will stick out way too far in odd angles and get stuck on everything you walk by. None of it will work well in a SHTF environment where you need to be mobile, in and out of cars, carrying a backpack, or taking a nap in a ditch. If you're serious about competition, many of the different leagues give classes for newbies. If you want something specific to SHTF, look at what current military and LEO use, and combine that with survival items from outdoor, hiking, and camping. You had a sarcastic reply to the one cop who was trying to explain this, but the cheap nylon duty gear you see patrol officer wear is meant to be used in those environments. They're designed for standing around for 8-10 hours, or sitting in a car for a couple shifts, or walking a beat for a day. A plain nylon duty belt from Safariland, Bianchi, Uncle Mikes, or even Blackhawk! will make your life easier when you need to add a medical kit, TQ, magazines, radio holder, and a good retention holster. Leg holsters look badass, but there are some serious drawbacks to them, and a belt works with a backpack, is easy to get on/off, and is a secure platform for most items. And you'll figure all this out by using it, hiking with it, running around, sitting in a car, rolling on the ground, climbing shit, and doing practical training with it. Buy one piece of gear, then get used to it for a few days and use it before adding another. Wear it while doing mundane things, because if the SHTF you're going to be doing mundane things while wearing it (like cooking, sleeping, etc.). We make police recruits wear their entire uniform all the time in class, during scenarios, or at lunch, because they need to get used to wearing it all the time. I guess my advice can be broken down to this: If you want competition, you need to figure out what league/style/class/etc., decide if the monetary commitment is what you want, then learn from them. If you want IDPA, just go with what you wear everyday to start. If you want SHTF, start cheap, start slow, and practice with it before dropping a grand on battle belts and chest rigs and other shit that looks good on TV, but may not really be good in real life. Just make sure you have your staples (food, water, shelter, transportation) covered, too, and we're not dropping $10,000 on tactical gear without a stable water supply. |
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Belt. The more stuff I had on my plate carrier the more I hated it. Bulky and top heavy, sling wants to get caught on everything. Now my PC is just a TQ and radio, maybe a bladder and a few mags, if I even want those on it. Anything on a chest rig or added to a plate carrier is just a bonus to add on top of the belt. You can wear a belt all day more comfortably than a chest rig, and with your complete martial kit. It looks like a lot, but once you relocate all that stuff from a PC, its pretty nice. You we're going to carry all that stuff anyway, spread out across your body, so might as well wear it comfortably. War belt under the slick carrier you've already got is a good way to go, in my opinion. 
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Quoted: I'm still a belt and suspenders kind of guy. LC2 stuff works for me. OTOH, I'm not going to war, or playing war. Younger, but battlebelt with suspenders worked for run N gun events for me, didn't like chest rigs as much. These were 3-5 mile runs with around 120 rifle and 50 pistol round counts. Weight shifts with running, hence the suspenders. I did without for a while, but once I got them I didn't go back. They're slim enough that I could probably throw a PC over it and run a full combat-type set up. |
| I will save you time and money. I have an entire foot locker full of safariland belts. I have plate carriers. I have boxes of random belts and pouches and so on. The best setup I have is the inner and outer gun belt from aws. I wear the Velcro inner belt all day with my regular clothes. I keep the outer belt in the car to throw on if needed. It does not need belt keepers. It is solid with the Velcro. I dumped my duty belt at the sheriffs dept for it when I first bought it. Very easy to set up with your ideal holster and pouch setup. Mine does not move around on me. It’s way more comfortable than a safariland duty belt. It has held up well for a year now. And it was pretty cheap compared to most battle/gun belt setups |
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