[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Fed LE or Local LE? (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 8/7/2017 7:15:41 AM EDT
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I'm former .mil with a graduate degree working in a professional environment. I really like the money where I'm at right now. I grew up poor enough to tell stories I'd rather not share on the internet, and this job will put me in the top 1% of earners in my state if I stay around long enough. With that said, I hate it. I literally wake up every single day dreading to go into work. Some days I've wondered
I have applied, and been "Accepted" (I'm not sure what the correct term is - I've taken the exams, interviews, etc but haven't gotten to the formal offer yet) for a large local SO, a fed LEO job in DC, and a fed special agent job that could send me anywhere. Given my particular career choice, the special agent job would see the most use of my education and skills. However, in my inexperienced view I almost see that like certain jobs the military. You can go into the grunts and kick in doors, or you can be supply and get paid the same to sit back and chill with the ladies. Local LE would be the grunts doing the cool shit. Not a whole lot of computer analyst special agents kicking in doors (I know some actually do it, but not the guys sitting behind computers arresting white collar criminals) On the flip side, kicking in doors is a young man's game. I've got a family now and I've BTDT - it's not fun to get shot at...or tackle homeless people I imagine. I don't care about the money. I don't care about the AO (although I've never seen snow, so somewhere cold would be interesting) I don't care about the agency. I only care about doing something that leaves me feeling fulfilled at the end of the day. I feel blessed to have so many opportunities and I'd like to make sure I go the right route. What do you guys think? (I'm asking here instead of the LE forum because I'd like to get non-LE opinions as well) |
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Frankly, benefits and retirement are what you need to be considering, IMO. Your career will be over before you know it. However, the local job isn't gonna make you move your family from one coast to the other if you piss the wrong person off. That's gotta be considered, as you said you have a family. (And dealing with the homeless isn't too bad... you get to know them after a while) |
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I'm local LE for almost ten years.
As a local cop (Sheriff Dept in my case), I am a professional problem solver. Sometimes it's crime, sometimes it's helping a kid with homework at a park, sometimes it's getting people back on the road after car troubles. It's a varied job, I get to deal with the dregs of society, and normal people too. I've done everything from locking up drug dealers to buying a mentally disabled man a bus ticket home across the country after he fell for a scam and ended up in Ohio. I love my job and wouldn't do anything else. |
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A lot will depend on the fed agency you will work for. Some have much greater room for career advancement than others. The benefits are nice now, however they are constant point of discussion based on the political winds.
Fed LEO is 57 mandatory retirement. Well, at least my agency is. |
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(I'm asking here instead of the LE forum because I'd like to get non-LE opinions as well) ... |
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Saying that you don't care about money is very foolish. You have a family that is counting on you. When your kids will want to go to college, or when you will want to retire, your personal fulfillment isn't going to pay for that. Because of that, it matters where you get hired.
Regardless, IMO unless you know you want to be a cop, you don't really want to be a cop. |
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IDK how it is there, but here we have Sheriff elections every 4 years. If your guy doesn't win it can be back to the flour mill Pappy. Some new Sheriffs make the whole SO re-apply and go through the hiring process again. |
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A friend went from an Army Civilian to a Federal special agent in his mid 30's. It was tough but he passed. He enjoys the job and makes about the same money he did at his old position after factoring in the pay differentials for being an LEO and a couple other things they tack on as the GS level was actually lower then where he was. He said the internal politics i.e. management are just as bad as pretty much anywhere else in the government and finally made the hard decision he's not going into leadership in the organization as it completely destroys your work/life balance. He's always done well with his money so when he hits his 20 years of federal service he'll have a nice retirement saved up and still be able to make a nice salary somewhere else until real retirement.
Also, Fed application process takes A LONG TIME. For places like the FBI and DEA off the top of my head you'll have a written test, PT test, and poly exam that you need to phase in three phases before you even get the offer to go to the academy. Do not underestimate any of them, particularly the PT test. Military people seem to do the worst since they score things like situps/pushups differently. Expect a year, possibly more if they/you fuck anything up in the process before even thinking about seeing a date to go to academy. The one thing I will say is if you want to be a special agent at some place like the FBI/DEA/ATF etc. it will be pretty hard on relationships. When he's heavy into a case it's pretty much 24/7 for as long as it takes. The few relationships he's had since he had the job didn't last and it seems like all his co-workers have been divorced at least once. There's a lot of non special agent jobs you can do as a government civilian or a contractor for Federal LEO agencies though that required a variety of skills depending on the area you want to live in. Obviously for federal the National Capital Region will hold the largest amount of non-agent jobs but there are centers around the country of support organizations if you look. |
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I know a lot of guys in Fed LE, they all hate it. Most SA's seem to enjoy it for the most part, most PD guys range from mall cops living a wet dream, to guys who enjoy the job, guys who treat it as a job, to guys who couldn't get hired as a janitor, to Extorris so pick your poison.
ETA: Although life is too short to be miserable, and you should pursue your dreams, don't rely on a job or profession to make you happy. Most people with the If I only did X I would be happy routine, and yet they are consistently miserable no matter what even if they take the leap. Happiness is internal so don't count on a career change fixing that to the degree you expect. |
| I have a buddy who is a FedLEO for the Forest Service. Seems like a pretty sweet gig as long as you are not the type of LEO who feels like the absolutely have to have communications contact with dispatch. He works a lot of areas with dead radio/phones but he works in some absolutely beautiful country. |
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That's why it's ill advised to work anywhere without a contract. It happens with small SO and small PDs as well. Quoted:
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IDK how it is there, but here we have Sheriff elections every 4 years. If your guy doesn't win it can be back to the flour mill Pappy. Some new Sheriffs make the whole SO re-apply and go through the hiring process again. |
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Not a whole lot of computer analyst special agents kicking in doors (I know some actually do it, but not the guys sitting behind computers arresting white collar criminals) On the flip side, kicking in doors is a young man's game. I would go Fed. Good pay/ retirement etc. Because of GWOT there a lot of computer analyst coming in behind the door kickers. Once in, it is like the military. If you keep yours ears open you can find all the adventure you can take. If you want to go overseas/down range you can do that. Age might matter in some fields but if you stay in shape and have the skills set you'll find most organizations have what some people call "the over the hill gang". The Feds will be most likely to accept you since you currently have a high paying job. A lot of people will take a hit in pay to serve their country for a Fed job. And the hiring authority for a Fed job will take that in consideration. Your military time can count for retirement. Civilian life will always be boring. You only live once, go for it. Regards |
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Local- shift work, lots of weekends with families missed, everyone has a cell phone and is recording everything you do, everyone you stop thinks that they are a lawyer or they have watched too many episodes of Law and Order and CSI, heaven forbid if you ever have to shoot anyone- even if it is justified (ask Darren Wilson). Lots of Feds - less Shiftwork, lots of federal paperwork, depending on the job and location - maybe on call 24/7, more travel and nights away from home, you get sent to other cities for assignments, dealing with more technical crimes, initially you might be working in Detroit, Chicago, Atlanta, NY, LA, etc. you will have to move but if you have seniority you might be to pick a good place. Most of the time you know who you going to arrest and are better prepared and what to expect vs. a domestic you are called to. |
| Look into a state level investigative position. The pay is usually better than local but you will not get moved around. Usually the State AG, State Bureau of Investigation, State Casino regulator, State Auditor, and other state agencies all have investigators. May or may not be a sworn position but the work is usually a little more white collar. |
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I guess it's dependent on locality but local / state retirement tends to be better than fed retirement, but fed pays more around here. Probably about breaks even in the long run. Mind the mandatory fed retirement age, too.
A lot of the really high paying federal LE jobs you see are due to locality premium too. I forget what they make around where I live, but it's not THAT much more than I do as state. My retirement and bennies are way better though, and a state job is easier to get without veteran's preference. The guys really racking up are the local / state guys doing work with the Fed task forces. I am very envious of the guys in my dept that have the marshal fugitives task force gig. |
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Fed LEO is where easy money / benies are at.
Don't have to take the job home. Have many local LEO friends and they do A LOT of baby sitting / politics for their pay. Work next to many w/double BA's and Masters in my AOR as well as folks with just HS education. All hard working. OPM Hiring Office will low-ball your acceptance. Be aware of your Vacancy Announcement. Hold firm. Could be the difference in making more coin starting off. Much luck! -Retired .Mil and current .Fed LEO. |
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Look into a state level investigative position. The pay is usually better than local but you will not get moved around. Usually the State AG, State Bureau of Investigation, State Casino regulator, State Auditor, and other state agencies all have investigators. May or may not be a sworn position but the work is usually a little more white collar. |
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Yep, it definitely varies by area. Our county cops back home make way more than feds and have better benefits. |
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... I have applied, and been "Accepted" (I'm not sure what the correct term is - I've taken the exams, interviews, etc but haven't gotten to the formal offer yet) for a large local SO, a fed LEO job in DC, and a fed special agent job that could send me anywhere. ... I don't care about the money. I don't care about the AO (although I've never seen snow, so somewhere cold would be interesting) I don't care about the agency. I only care about doing something that leaves me feeling fulfilled at the end of the day. I feel blessed to have so many opportunities and I'd like to make sure I go the right route. What do you guys think? (I'm asking here instead of the LE forum because I'd like to get non-LE opinions as well) Anyway, local sheriff's office is like doing street patrol? It's great but 95% of your day will be monotonous or less. This is the route I took. I didn't get any fed special agent job offers. For fed LEO, if you are getting on board with USSS uniformed, Capitol Police, FBI police or Pentagon police, it's going to be very hard to get by on that salary. And you won't be doing the same police work as you would be doing with a local SO. They just patrol protecting property most of the time. Fed special agent job would be the best to leverage your degree, provide interesting work, your pay will be better than the other two and with advancement opportunities and raises that will be better too. Door kicking? You'll be investigating crimes so if you go to serve an arrest warrant on a subject, you'll probably be with multiple guys, your own and/or local police, when serving. Movies showing one or two guys going in to get the bad guy are fake. Safety in numbers. |
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OP how much military time do you have?
You may be required to pay 3% of base pay in order for your mil time to count on a FERS ( federal ) retirement. Remember, Law Enforcement, Air Traffic controllers, and Fire Fighters have the 20 year retirement. Not sure .. . https://www.opm.gov/FAQs/QA.aspx?fid=735eda40-61a8-45df-b6ad-47185f4c91a5&pid=b60614fb-f870-488d-8c3d-d5cc79fcdbde&result=1 https://www.opm.gov/faqs/topic/veterans/index.aspx More info on OPM.gov |
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Is that really a good job??? Quoted:
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neither, TSA So, I'll say no, it's not a good job, but you know, different strokes for different folks. |
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Volunteer at your local homeless shelter if you want to feel fulfilled. Law enforcement is not a job that leaves you fulfilled. It takes from you things you'll never get back. <-------------------------16 year LEO. |
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IDK how it is there, but here we have Sheriff elections every 4 years. If your guy doesn't win it can be back to the flour mill Pappy. Some new Sheriffs make the whole SO re-apply and go through the hiring process again. |
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Work closely with some FLEO agencies, most say they should have taken a local LE job over the Fed. Obviously that will be agency specific, but of the handful of agencies I've dealt with, the majority say to stay local. Better benefits and retirement. Quoted:
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Yep, it definitely varies by area. Our county cops back home make way more than feds and have better benefits. |
| i've done both. About five years as a street cop in a medium sized area and now I'm a fed for the past 19 years in a large city. policing has changed dramatically since I first got hired on. The main reason I left my local department was pay, because it sucked. I know you said you're not concerned with the money, but you will be especially once the novelty of this line of work wears off. if I had to do it over again I'm not sure I would go back into local law-enforcement just because everything is changed so much, public perception etc. I like where I am now. I've got another four years before I am eligible to retire and they force me to retire in 11 more years so somewhere in the middle there I'll go find something else to do. feel free to shoot me a private message if you have any questions |
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Saying that you don't care about money is very foolish. You have a family that is counting on you. When your kids will want to go to college, or when you will want to retire, your personal fulfillment isn't going to pay for that. Because of that, it matters where you get hired. Regardless, IMO unless you know you want to be a cop, you don't really want to be a cop. How about take care of your family, and do about one of a million things you can do as a hobby to be "fulfilled." Like spending time with your kids, learning a new skill, cool vacations, volunteer with a charity, or start a new one. This isnt rocket science. Being a cop for the "thrills" is for all the wrong reasons anyway. |
| While working in LE is rewarding, a ton of fun, and can pay pretty decent, but there are negatives to it. You will see, and be around things that you will never be able to get out of your mind. Much like loosing your virginity, once you have seen, and been around some of the horrible things humans do do each other, you will never be the same again, and you can never get back your wonderful, naive view of the world. Choose carefully. I really enjoyed going to work as no two days were ever the same, but I don't know if I would want one of my kids to experience, and be around some of the stuff I have been around. |
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I'm nearing the end of my 30 years in local LE. When I started it was great. In today's cellphone and youtube environment, it's for the birds.
Since you have a degree and want to go go into LE, federal is the way to go. I agree with the fellas above about retirement benefits (I just got off the phone with my retirement board a minute ago), but think career survival... One minute you're minding your own damn business, when all of a sudden, a black guy jumps into traffic and starts to swing a knife around at pedestrians. You get backup rolling, but they're 5 minutes out. This fucker is going to kill somebody now. You take swift and appropriate action and neutralize the bad guy. It seems textbook, right? The only problem is that 12 people have cellphone video of the incident, which appears to show Mr. Shithead drop the knife just before you engaged him. By the time you get interviewed by homicide detectives, your name, Facebook account, etc. have been splashed all over the news. You are now the most recent victim of our media and weak politicians. You ultimately will be fired by your agency for violating the "didn't wash your hands after the last time you went to the bathroom" policy, only because your shooting was good, but they need cover so that Al Sharpton stays the fuck away from your fair city. BLM will come anyway, just because you're such a horrible, racist cop. You are now a pariah and unemployable in LE. I can't recommend a non-first responder LE job enough. |