[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Tax question (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 2/4/2017 4:07:23 PM EDT
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Hi all, quick and simple tax question. I have my w2 from my employer and I'm ready to file.
However, for one day last year I was an extra in a movie. I was paid $250 dollars. I THINK but I'm not sure it was on a 1099? Don't have any experience with 1099 process. Does this income need to be included? I'm not sure if the taxes were taken out when I received my check. Thanks |
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Hi all, quick and simple tax question. I have my w2 from my employer and I'm ready to file. However, for one day last year I was an extra in a movie. I was paid $250 dollars. I THINK but I'm not sure it was on a 1099? Don't have any experience with 1099 process. Does this income need to be included? I'm not sure if the taxes were taken out when I received my check. Thanks No the government is cool with you earning money, tax-free, provided you earned it while acting in a movie.  
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So, you were paid but have no idea how you were paid, under what agreement, and how they treated your employment for taxes? Kind of hard to do taxes when you don't have all the info. May want to call your employer that day. Correct. I'm not even sure I know the employer; it was some casting company based in NYC. Looks like I'm off to do some searching then. |
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If you received an actual paycheck from a company certified with the state, you should be getting a 1099. And if the gig was in another state, that has state income tax, you'd have to file a return with that state. Was in the same state. So I'll have to wait for that to come in the mail then.. |
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Well I wasn't sure since it was a rather small amount and I have no way of knowing if the income was taxed or not. Nah dude, if you read the tax code there is an "extras in a movie" section that covers this. I think it was added during the Reagan administration. |
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Hi all, quick and simple tax question. I have my w2 from my employer and I'm ready to file. However, for one day last year I was an extra in a movie. I was paid $250 dollars. I THINK but I'm not sure it was on a 1099? Don't have any experience with 1099 process. Does this income need to be included? I'm not sure if the taxes were taken out when I received my check. Thanks That is neither a quick nor simple tax question. There are so many complexities and additional questions that may play a role in how you should proceed that are personally tailored to your unique tax situation that I would recommend you sit down with someone who knows what they are doing and go from there. Quick and dirty: If you had earned income then yes, you need to report it. Contact the company that hired you and inquire as to how they reported your income (W2 or 1099). The nature of the income will determine where it is to be reported and whether or not the income is subject to Social Security Tax (this income almost certainly is). |
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Well I wasn't sure since it was a rather small amount and I have no way of knowing if the income was taxed or not. Quoted:
Well I wasn't sure since it was a rather small amount and I have no way of knowing if the income was taxed or not. For future reference: (a)General definition Except as otherwise provided in this subtitle, gross income means all income from whatever source derived, including (but not limited to) the following items: 26 U.S. Code § 61 - Gross income defined |
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This is exactly correct. Quoted:
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Usually you won't get a 1099 for less than $600 Legally you should declare it as income, that being said the IRS has not been informed if you did not receive a 1099 If you do decide to declare it, there also maybe expenses that you can write off as well. You need to see if you get a 1099, it also will have info like tax ids, etc. |
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It was a one-time gig, not a recurring engagement. It's most certainly not going to result in you receiving a W2. You may, or may not, depending on how well they actually kept track of things, give you a 1099. If they just handed you some cash, without getting your information from you, they're not really going to be able to send a 1099 to a person for whom they don't have an address or SSN. That said, it should still be reported as Self-Employment income on a Schedule C, as part of your 1040.
Now, the question is, are you required to file? If you are a single person under age 65, you are not required to file if your income is below $10,350 (single standard deduction of $6,300 plus personal exemption of $4,050). There are, however, certain cases where you are still required to file, even if you don't meet that threshold. One such case is if you have net earnings from self-employment of at least $400. So, if you are single, under age 65, have income less than $10,350, and that $250 is your only self-employment income, you aren't required to file. If your income is greater than $10,350, you are required to file, and, if you are required to file, you are required to report any self-employment income, whether or not it is reported on a Form 1099 by the payer. |
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The following is my educated & experienced opinion:
There is no way the casting company made you an employee for a $250 part as an extra in a movie. Therefore, you won't get a W-2 and there was no withholding. The casting company is not required to issue you a 1099 because the threshold is $600 for non-employee compensation (NEC). Therefore you won't get a 1099 and there is typically no withholding on NEC 1099's. Because of the above, the IRS will have no idea of your earnings in the film industry. It is up to you as to whether or not you report the $250. Doing so is the right thing to do under the law. Doing so in the minds of many people is the craziest thing they've ever heard. It boils down to that. Follow your moral compass. The good news is that if you report it and have no other self employment income, you won't owe SE tax (15.3% on top of the income tax you'll owe). |
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Was in the same state. So I'll have to wait for that to come in the mail then.. You are legally required to report it, but as another poster said, it's highly unlikely you'll get a 1099, unless it was over $600, so waiting is most likely a waste of time. |
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It was a one-time gig, not a recurring engagement. It's most certainly not going to result in you receiving a W2. You may, or may not, depending on how well they actually kept track of things, give you a 1099. If they just handed you some cash, without getting your information from you, they're not really going to be able to send a 1099 to a person for whom they don't have an address or SSN. That said, it should still be reported as Self-Employment income on a Schedule C, as part of your 1040. Now, the question is, are you required to file? If you are a single person under age 65, you are not required to file if your income is below $10,350 (single standard deduction of $6,300 plus personal exemption of $4,050). There are, however, certain cases where you are still required to file, even if you don't meet that threshold. One such case is if you have net earnings from self-employment of at least $400. So, if you are single, under age 65, have income less than $10,350, and that $250 is your only self-employment income, you aren't required to file. If your income is greater than $10,350, you are required to file, and, if you are required to file, you are required to report any self-employment income, whether or not it is reported on a Form 1099 by the payer. There is a way to file an income reporting document (W-2, 1099, etc) without a Social but that's on the employer not the employee. Other than that; spot on. 
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It was a one-time gig, not a recurring engagement. It's most certainly not going to result in you receiving a W2. You may, or may not, depending on how well they actually kept track of things, give you a 1099. If they just handed you some cash, without getting your information from you, they're not really going to be able to send a 1099 to a person for whom they don't have an address or SSN. That said, it should still be reported as Self-Employment income on a Schedule C, as part of your 1040. Now, the question is, are you required to file? If you are a single person under age 65, you are not required to file if your income is below $10,350 (single standard deduction of $6,300 plus personal exemption of $4,050). There are, however, certain cases where you are still required to file, even if you don't meet that threshold. One such case is if you have net earnings from self-employment of at least $400. So, if you are single, under age 65, have income less than $10,350, and that $250 is your only self-employment income, you aren't required to file. If your income is greater than $10,350, you are required to file, and, if you are required to file, you are required to report any self-employment income, whether or not it is reported on a Form 1099 by the payer. It is a one off thing. It would go under misc income. |
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No, it's not.  LOL, yes it is. Most people won't get 1099's for one off things that are under $600. And if a 1099 isn't sent to the IRS they won't (the IRS) won't have a record of the payment. The entity that paid him might however. He IS SUPPOSED to declare the income. BTW, I do the taxes for a sports guy (that does a lot of Hollywood stuff now) that everyone here would know. This dude has 20-30 movie/commerical 1099s a year. Movie studios rarely send out 1099's that are > $600. |
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LOL, yes it is. Most people won't get 1099's for one off things that are under $600. And if a 1099 isn't sent to the IRS they won't (the IRS) won't have a record of the payment. The entity that paid him might however. He IS SUPPOSED to declare the income. BTW, I do the taxes for a sports guy (that does a lot of Hollywood stuff now) that everyone here would know. This dude has 20-30 movie/commerical 1099s a year. Movie studios rarely send out 1099's that are > $600. Quoted:
LOL, yes it is. Most people won't get 1099's for one off things that are under $600. And if a 1099 isn't sent to the IRS they won't (the IRS) won't have a record of the payment. The entity that paid him might however. He IS SUPPOSED to declare the income. BTW, I do the taxes for a sports guy (that does a lot of Hollywood stuff now) that everyone here would know. This dude has 20-30 movie/commerical 1099s a year. Movie studios rarely send out 1099's that are > $600. The person you quoted said the following: Quoted:
Usually you won't get a 1099 for less than $600 Legally you should declare it as income, that being said the IRS has not been informed if you did not receive a 1099 The AUR program doesn't care if the person did not receive their 1099 in the mail so long as the employer e-filed or otherwise sent their records to Austin or whichever applicable service center (as you just referenced in what I just quoted). You have a client and/or multiple clients who sometimes do not receive 1099-MISC forms, or other income documents, from employers who pay income less than the required reporting amount? O.k.. That happens. What about the alternative? Are income documents filed when the employer is not required to file them? Yes. That happens. Are income documents NOT FILED when they are required to file them? Yes. That happens. I just have this picture stuck in my head of someone saying "I didn't get a 1099 so that means I don't have anything to report" and then looking down the road when the CP series pops out followed by what could be an easy fix or a major headache. Or maybe I am just reliving bad memories. Look, I know this is highly pedantic and makes me look borderline autistic (I swear my mother said I was artistic) however words matter and I have seen things posted here (AR15 general) that make me cringe. |
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Actually it would not go on a Sch C. It isn't this guy's biz. It is a one off thing. It would go under misc income. Need more information. There are circumstances where that may completely appropriate to place that income on Schedule C. Regardless of whether or not you report the income on schedule C or line 21, don't forget the to tack on schedule SE. |
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Edit: Need more information. There are circumstances where that may completely appropriate to place that income on Schedule C. Regardless of whether or not you report the income on schedule C or line 21, don't forget the to tack on schedule SE. Quoted:
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Actually it would not go on a Sch C. It isn't this guy's biz. It is a one off thing. It would go under misc income. Need more information. There are circumstances where that may completely appropriate to place that income on Schedule C. Regardless of whether or not you report the income on schedule C or line 21, don't forget the to tack on schedule SE. Of course if if he did several extra parts, especially if he starts deducting expenses, the Sch C would be appropriate and SE tax would apply. |
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My professional opinion is if it a one off activity SE tax doesn't apply. Of course if if he did several extra parts, especially if he starts deducting expenses, the Sch C would be appropriate and SE tax would apply. *Edit assuming the amount was over the filing threshold for Schedule SE. 
*Edit 2: not trying to be argumentative. Never thought I would have this discussion on Arfcom with another professional and am genuinely interested in your research, logic, and train of thought. |
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For the movie gig, you were probably treated as an independent contractor. That's why you didn't get a W-2. The income is "nonemployee compensation." $250 is well below the cutoff for being issued a 1099.
The proper way to report this is on Schedule C or C-EZ. You can deduct related expanses. $250 is below the threshold for filing Schedule SE and paying self-employment tax. You might be able to sock the $250 into a traditional IRA and remove it from your AGI that way. |
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Actually it would not go on a Sch C. It isn't this guy's biz.
It is a one off thing. It would go under misc income. You could do that, but then you couldn't deduct the related expenses. And it wouldn't be "earned income" to support an IRA deduction. Schedule C's are used for all sorts of side jobs. It doesn't have to be the principal business. |
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as stated you should shouldn't get one under $600.
but be advised that if they do send you one, if i remember right from my 1099 days, the employer has until the end of February to mail it to you, so if you want to play it safe, wait it out. i would get so many 1099's that i just waited until April to file because i was always worried one would show up the day after i filed my taxes. |
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Actually it would not go on a Sch C. It isn't this guy's biz. It is a one off thing. It would go under misc income. Straight from the Schedule C instructions: "Use Schedule C (Form 1040) to report income or (loss) from a business you operated or a profession you practiced as a sole proprietor. An activity qualifies as a business if your primary purpose for engaging in the activity is for income or profit and you are involved in the activity with continuity and regularity. For example, a sporadic activity or a hobby does not qualify as a business. To report income from a nonbusiness activity, see the instructions for Form 1040, line 21, or Form 1040NR, line 21." Looks like you're right. One gig and done should most likely go under "Other Income," Line 21. Two gigs or more would be a Schedule C. At least that's what I would do. |
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Hi all, quick and simple tax question. I have my w2 from my employer and I'm ready to file. However, for one day last year I was an extra in a movie. I was paid $250 dollars. I THINK but I'm not sure it was on a 1099? Don't have any experience with 1099 process. Does this income need to be included? I'm not sure if the taxes were taken out when I received my check. Thanks When I worked as an extra they deducted SS, Medicare, CA SDI/SUI, CA income tax, and Federal income tax from my check. Even the extra money I got for supplying my own costume and weapons was taxed. My pay stub included with the check I received in the mail included a breakdown of the deductions. I eventually received a W2 and attached a copy of that with my 1040 when I filed my taxes. This was in Los Angeles, though, not NYC, and for a different company I'm sure. |
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Straight from the Schedule C instructions: "Use Schedule C (Form 1040) to report income or (loss) from a business you operated or a profession you practiced as a sole proprietor. An activity qualifies as a business if your primary purpose for engaging in the activity is for income or profit and you are involved in the activity with continuity and regularity. For example, a sporadic activity or a hobby does not qualify as a business. To report income from a nonbusiness activity, see the instructions for Form 1040, line 21, or Form 1040NR, line 21." Looks like you're right. One gig and done should most likely go under "Other Income," Line 21. Two gigs or more would be a Schedule C. At least that's what I would do. Quoted:
Straight from the Schedule C instructions: "Use Schedule C (Form 1040) to report income or (loss) from a business you operated or a profession you practiced as a sole proprietor. An activity qualifies as a business if your primary purpose for engaging in the activity is for income or profit and you are involved in the activity with continuity and regularity. For example, a sporadic activity or a hobby does not qualify as a business. To report income from a nonbusiness activity, see the instructions for Form 1040, line 21, or Form 1040NR, line 21." Looks like you're right. One gig and done should most likely go under "Other Income," Line 21. Two gigs or more would be a Schedule C. At least that's what I would do. There are two problems with what you just posted. First off, you didn't read far enough down. Here is the top portion of the Schedule C instructions in its entirety: Use Schedule C (Form 1040) to report income or (loss) from a business you operatedor a profession you practiced as a sole proprietor. An activity qualifies as a business if
your primary purpose for engaging in the activity is for income or profit and you are involved in the activity with continuity and regularity. For example, a sporadic activity or a hobby does not qualify as a business. To report income from a nonbusiness activity, see the instructions for Form 1040, line 21, or Form 1040NR, line 21. Also use Schedule C to report (a) wages and expenses you had as a statutory employee, (b) income and deductions of certain qualified joint ventures, and (c) certain income shown on Form 1099-MISC, Miscellaneous Income. See the Instructions for Recipient (back of Copy B of Form 1099-MISC) for the types of income to report on Schedule C. Small businesses and statutory employees with business expenses of $5,000 or less may be able to file Schedule C-EZ instead of Schedule C. See Schedule C-EZ for details. You may be subject to state and local taxes and other requirements such as business licenses and fees. Check with your state and local governments for more information. Here is what the back of the 1099-MISC (referenced above) says: Box 7. Shows nonemployee compensation. If you are in the trade or business ofcatching fish, box 7 may show cash you received for the sale of fish. If the amount in
this box is SE income, report it on Schedule C or F (Form 1040), and complete Schedule SE (Form 1040). You received this form instead of Form W-2 because the payer did not consider you an employee and did not withhold income tax or social security and Medicare tax. If you believe you are an employee and cannot get the payer to correct this form, report the amount from box 7 on Form 1040, line 7 (or Form 1040NR, line 8). You must also complete Form 8919 and attach it to your return. If you are not an employee but the amount in this box is not SE income (for example, it is income from a sporadic activity or a hobby), report it on Form 1040, line 21 (or Form 1040NR, line 21). Problem #2 is that is an IRS publication and IRS publications are not authoritative. |
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As a person who has spent a looooong time researching this issue (not on OP's question), I would really love to hear you justification saying that income, listed in the OP, is NOT subject to SE tax. *Edit assuming the amount was over the filing threshold for Schedule SE.
*Edit 2: not trying to be argumentative. Never thought I would have this discussion on Arfcom with another professional and am genuinely interested in your research, logic, and train of thought. Quoted:
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My professional opinion is if it a one off activity SE tax doesn't apply. Of course if if he did several extra parts, especially if he starts deducting expenses, the Sch C would be appropriate and SE tax would apply. *Edit assuming the amount was over the filing threshold for Schedule SE.
*Edit 2: not trying to be argumentative. Never thought I would have this discussion on Arfcom with another professional and am genuinely interested in your research, logic, and train of thought. First, if the income is under $400 you never pay SE tax. Unless it is church income. Second, did the activity qualified as SELF EMPLOYMENT? Define employment. Is the OP in the trade or business of doing film extra work? If it is not self employment, SE tax doesn't apply. |
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You could do that, but then you couldn't deduct the related expenses. And it wouldn't be "earned income" to support an IRA deduction. Schedule C's are used for all sorts of side jobs. It doesn't have to be the principal business. Quoted:
Actually it would not go on a Sch C. It isn't this guy's biz.
It is a one off thing. It would go under misc income. You could do that, but then you couldn't deduct the related expenses. And it wouldn't be "earned income" to support an IRA deduction. Schedule C's are used for all sorts of side jobs. It doesn't have to be the principal business. Doesnt have to be the primary biz. It should be a biz. Why would you add another schedule when you don't have to? |
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First, if the income is under $400 you never pay SE tax. Unless it is church income. Quoted:
First, if the income is under $400 you never pay SE tax. Unless it is church income. "*Edit assuming the amount was over the filing threshold for Schedule SE. " Assume the person had $1,000.00 in income from acting as an extra in a movie. I am interested in the income CLASSIFICATION and whether or not the income is subject to FICA taxes / SE taxes; not whether or not the amount is over $400. Quoted:
Second, did the activity qualified as SELF EMPLOYMENT? Define employment. Is the OP in the trade or business of doing film extra work? If it is not self employment, SE tax doesn't apply.My professional opinion is if it a one off activity SE tax doesn't apply. The part in red: what is your basis for saying this? I can think of examples of "one off activit[ies]" that are subject to SE tax. This what the IRS says which is not statute and not authoritative; but interesting nonetheless: Who is Self-Employed?
Generally, you are self-employed if any of the following apply to you.
Of course 26 U.S. Code § 1402 is even more interesting here: (a) Net earnings from self-employment The term “net earnings from self-employment” means the gross income derived by an individual from any trade or business carried on by such individual, less the deductions allowed by this subtitle which are attributable to such trade or business, plus his distributive share (whether or not distributed) of income or loss described in section 702(a)(8) from any trade or business carried on by a partnership of which he is a member; except that in computing such gross income and deductions and such distributive share of partnership ordinary income or loss—
... (2) the net earnings from self-employment, if such net earnings for the taxable year are less than $400. ... (b) Self-employment income The term “self-employment income” means the net earnings from self-employment derived by an individual (other than a nonresident alien individual, except as provided by an agreement under section 233 of the Social Security Act) during any taxable year; except that such term shall not include— ... (c)Trade or business The term “trade or business”, when used with reference to self-employment income or net earnings from self-employment, shall have the same meaning as when used in section 162 (relating to trade or business expenses), except that such term shall not include— ... (2) the performance of service by an individual as an employee, other than— ... (d) Employee and wages The term “employee” and the term “wages” shall have the same meaning as when used in chapter 21 (sec. 3101 and following, relating to Federal Insurance Contributions Act). Generally speaking, if you work in a trade or business, unless there is an exception, you are going to owe either self-employment tax or FICA taxes (as per 26 U.S. Code Subtitle A or 26 U.S. Code Subtitle C). This isn't a prize from a game show, or an award from a settlement, or a gift, etc...: this is a job the person worked. So what am I missing here and what, specifically, exempts this type of income (assume > $400) from self-employment or FICA taxes? |
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You are missing that one off things that people get a small amount of money for aren't liable for SE tax.
My firm has never had an examiner object. You can throw out all the things you would like, but isnt the final real test is if the IRS objects? Or do you like to have your clients pay more in tax? |
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(1) You are missing that one off things that people get a small amount of money for aren't liable for SE tax. (2) My firm has never had an examiner object. (3) You can throw out all the things you would like, but isnt the final real test is if the IRS objects? (4) Or do you like to have your clients pay more in tax? Quoted:
(1) You are missing that one off things that people get a small amount of money for aren't liable for SE tax. (2) My firm has never had an examiner object. (3) You can throw out all the things you would like, but isnt the final real test is if the IRS objects? (4) Or do you like to have your clients pay more in tax? (1) We are not talking about a "small amount of money." We are talking about income classification. Of course self employment income on >$400 is not subject to self-employment tax as the statute specifically states that (I quoted that above). What is your source and where can I read in the USC or CFR about "one off things" that "aren't liable for SE tax"? (2) Congratulations for your firm. That fact, in and of itself, is irrelevant especially since the IRS can and does make mistakes. I can tell you that reclassification of income to add SE/FICA taxes happens all the time. (3) No. The final test is as follows: The Supreme Law of the Land (US Constitution) / the United States Code / the Code of Federal Regulations. That's it. The IRS can tell you just about anything and they can be WRONG which is why these matters routinely wind up in either Tax Court or District Court. Mr. Bobrow followed a longstanding IRS interpretation when he filed his tax return, an interpretation that was contained in both a publication and a proposed regulation, that the “once per year” rollover rule in the tax code applies separately to “each IRA” owned by a taxpayer. For reasons that are not entirely clear, although there must have been a perception by the IRS of taxpayers abusing the “each IRA” rollover guidance, after Mr. Bobrow filed his return, the IRS decided that their prior “each IRA” interpretation was wrong, and assessed additional tax, interest and penalties against Mr. Bobrow. Going against their own published guidance, the IRS argued that the “once per year” limitation applies to all of a taxpayer’s IRAs taken together, rather than individually to “each IRA” separately. You might think the IRS would have some sympathy and restrain itself when a taxpayer follows IRS published guidance. Au contraire, mon ami! The IRS even assessed Mr. Bobrow penalties, in addition to tax and interest, for not having “substantial authority” for the way he treated the IRA rollovers in his tax return. To the surprise of some (especially Mr. Bobrow), the U.S. Tax Court agreed with the assessment of the tax, interest and penalties. In their decision, published, ironically, on April 15, Tax Court Judge Joseph W. Nega said the IRS’ published guidance “is not binding precedent” and that “taxpayers rely on IRS guidance at their own peril.” Here is an except from that Tax Court decision: ... The Court was aware of the position taken in Publication 590 prior to the issuance of the opinion in this case. Since neither party discussed Publication 590 in their briefs, the Court did not address it in its holding. Regardless, respondent's
published guidance is not binding precedent. See Johnson v. Commissioner, 620 F.2d 153 (7th Cir. 1980), affg, T.C. Memo. 1978-426; Carpenter v. United States, 495 F.2d 175 (5th Cir. 1974); Adler v. Commissioner, 330 F.2d 91, 93 (9th Cir. 1964), affg, T.C. Memo. 1963-196. Additionally, taxpayers rely on IRS guidance at their own peril. Miller v. Commissioner, 114 T.C. 184, 194-195 (2000), affd sub nom. Lovejoy v. Commissioner, 293 F.3d 1208 (10th Cir. 2002). Thus, had petitioners argued reliance on Publication 590 in their briefs, such an argument would not have served as substantial authority for the position taken on their tax returns (4) I expect taxpayers to pay what they owe by law. Not a penny more. Not a penny less. |