[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Keto help (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 5/4/2016 1:19:47 AM EDT
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I started Keto about a month ago and I have some problems I hope people can help me with.
1. I have had the runs for the entire month I have been doing Keto. I mean constant diarrhea for 30 days now. Is this normal? Am I gonna die? 2. I used the ruled.me calculators to get my macro numbers. I am having a hard time hitting my fat requirement before hitting my calorie requirement. Suggestions? 3. I have consumed less than 10G of net carbs per day for the last month. People talk about 15G being good for weight loss and 30G being good for maintaining. But at 10G or less net carbs per day am I doing more damage than good? Do I need to actually up my carbs for max weight loss? Edit: I should add I have survived off nothing but eggs, bacon, baked chicken thighs, raw spinach, black coffee, cheese, and water for the last month. I feel like a sexual T-Rex except for the diahrrea thing. |
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I don't know keto but 30 days of diarrhea is usually a sign that something is wrong. I'm doing a paleo type diet and haven't had any digestive problems at all. Perfect turds that you can set your watch by. If you want I can take a picture for you. No? What are you actually eating? eta Holy crap, lol. You need more variety. I'd probably shoot myself after 30 days of that very limited diet. |
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Added my diet to original post. I have consumed literally nothing not listed. No seasonings. No dressings. No nothing.
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I don't know keto but 30 days of diarrhea is usually a sign that something is wrong. I'm doing a paleo type diet and haven't had any digestive problems at all. Perfect turds that you can set your watch by. If you want I can take a picture for you. No? What are you actually eating? |
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I don't know keto but 30 days of diarrhea is usually a sign that something is wrong. I'm doing a paleo type diet and haven't had any digestive problems at all. Perfect turds that you can set your watch by. If you want I can take a picture for you. No? What are you actually eating? eta Holy crap, lol. You need more variety. I'd probably shoot myself after 30 days of that very limited diet. This. The "runs" is actually the exact opposite of my first couple weeks on low carb / paleo. I had to really up the raw veggies to get things moving again. Most people going keto/paleo start with a diet very high in meat/eggs, over cooked veggies, and sometimes even cheese. Its a recipe for disaster. As for your particular case I have no idea. Maybe go back to your old diet, and SLOWLY transition to paleo style. |
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For breakfast I do black coffee, almonds, left over meat from the previous dinner, cheese. Maybe eggs. Lunch and dinner is, well, more of the same, might substitute fish for the meat. Plenty of raw vegetables, luckily I like raw vegetables. Broccoli, cauliflower, radishes, mushrooms, beans (watch the carbs). I sometimes use salad dressings to add some flavor. Salad, usually without dressing, lol. Snacks are almonds and pork rinds. I haven't done a carb count but it's pretty danged low. Never hungry either. I have found some low carb tortillas which aren't bad. Also tried some zero carb noodles that are...interesting. And rubbery. I miss milk and ice cream but there are no cravings. I like water but I do allow myself some diet soda or crystal light. It works for me. Results have been very good. eta Oh yeah, I use a LOT of cayenne pepper too. It's great on almonds. And I just looked it up, cayenne pepper has 1.6 net carbs/Tablespoon. Is that bad? |
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What is your water intake? Exercise? Sodium?
You likely need more fiber. This will help bulk up your bowel movements. If you're hitting your caloric goal before hitting your fat macro, you need to reduce your protein intake. Amino acids in protein can be converted into glucose via gluconeogenesis, while fat cannot. You're hurting your weight loss potential by eating too much protein. Fry your chicken. Heavy cream in your coffee. Lots of little things can get your fat macro where you want it. |
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I drink around a gallon of water daily. For the first week or so it was a little less. But every day after that I have finished the whole jug. I work out every day. An hour of cardio followed by an hour and a half of weights. I don't know about my sodium intake, I haven't been keeping track. I imagine low since I use uncured bacon and don't add salt to anything. I take a multivitamin, forgot that. What are some good high fiber Keto foods?
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What is your water intake? Exercise? Sodium? You likely need more fiber. This will help bulk up your bowel movements. If you're hitting your caloric goal before hitting your fat macro, you need to reduce your protein intake. Amino acids in protein can be converted into glucose via gluconeogenesis, while fat cannot. You're hurting your weight loss potential by eating too much protein. Fry your chicken. Heavy cream in your coffee. Lots of little things can get your fat macro where you want it. |
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I started Keto about a month ago and I have some problems I hope people can help me with. 1. I have had the runs for the entire month I have been doing Keto. I mean constant diarrhea for 30 days now. Is this normal? Am I gonna die? 2. I used the ruled.me calculators to get my macro numbers. I am having a hard time hitting my fat requirement before hitting my calorie requirement. Suggestions? 3. I have consumed less than 10G of net carbs per day for the last month. People talk about 15G being good for weight loss and 30G being good for maintaining. But at 10G or less net carbs per day am I doing more damage than good? Do I need to actually up my carbs for max weight loss? Edit: I should add I have survived off nothing but eggs, bacon, baked chicken thighs, raw spinach, black coffee, cheese, and water for the last month. I feel like a sexual T-Rex except for the diahrrea thing. 1. No. 2. Kerrygold butter, heavy cream, olive and coconut oil. 3. What are your blood ketone levels? |
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For #3 how do I test ketone levels?
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1. No. 2. Kerrygold butter, heavy cream, olive and coconut oil. 3. What are your blood ketone levels? Quoted:
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I started Keto about a month ago and I have some problems I hope people can help me with. 1. I have had the runs for the entire month I have been doing Keto. I mean constant diarrhea for 30 days now. Is this normal? Am I gonna die? 2. I used the ruled.me calculators to get my macro numbers. I am having a hard time hitting my fat requirement before hitting my calorie requirement. Suggestions? 3. I have consumed less than 10G of net carbs per day for the last month. People talk about 15G being good for weight loss and 30G being good for maintaining. But at 10G or less net carbs per day am I doing more damage than good? Do I need to actually up my carbs for max weight loss? Edit: I should add I have survived off nothing but eggs, bacon, baked chicken thighs, raw spinach, black coffee, cheese, and water for the last month. I feel like a sexual T-Rex except for the diahrrea thing. 1. No. 2. Kerrygold butter, heavy cream, olive and coconut oil. 3. What are your blood ketone levels? |
| Ketostix from the diabetes section of walmart will let you know if you're in ketosis. The only way to know if you're in the right level of ketosis is a blood ketone meter. The ketones in urine and blood are different. If you're over .5 mmol, you're not going to get any better by getting deeper. |
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I don't know keto but 30 days of diarrhea is usually a sign that something is wrong. I'm doing a paleo type diet and haven't had any digestive problems at all. Perfect turds that you can set your watch by. If you want I can take a picture for you. No? What are you actually eating? eta Holy crap, lol. You need more variety. I'd probably shoot myself after 30 days of that very limited diet. Why is it that when people try keto they have all sorts of problems, yet when they try paleo they storm in telling everyone else how well it worked without a hiccup? |
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Quoted: Why is it that when people try keto they have all sorts of problems, yet when they try paleo they storm in telling everyone else how well it worked without a hiccup? Quoted: Quoted: I don't know keto but 30 days of diarrhea is usually a sign that something is wrong. I'm doing a paleo type diet and haven't had any digestive problems at all. Perfect turds that you can set your watch by. If you want I can take a picture for you. No? What are you actually eating? eta Holy crap, lol. You need more variety. I'd probably shoot myself after 30 days of that very limited diet. Why is it that when people try keto they have all sorts of problems, yet when they try paleo they storm in telling everyone else how well it worked without a hiccup? Ehhh I don't know. Maybe because it works? That's the way were supposed to eat? I'm not technically doing paleo, I guess it's just a very low carb diet. I looked at both and figured just cutting the carbs while maintaining a good balance of proteins, fats and fiber might be right for me. Keto looked way too involved for me. I eat what and when I want to. I'm not hungry. No counting carbs or calories, no weighing portions. I probably should do a count but it seems like too much work. Lots of water but no measurements. I do get a lot of physical activity every day. I walk a lot. Minimum 6 miles/day, 7 days/week. April averaged 6.84 miles per day. All of the above combined = good weight loss, increased energy, and perfect turds. |
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Why is it that when people try keto they have all sorts of problems, yet when they try paleo they storm in telling everyone else how well it worked without a hiccup? Quoted:
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I don't know keto but 30 days of diarrhea is usually a sign that something is wrong. I'm doing a paleo type diet and haven't had any digestive problems at all. Perfect turds that you can set your watch by. If you want I can take a picture for you. No? What are you actually eating? eta Holy crap, lol. You need more variety. I'd probably shoot myself after 30 days of that very limited diet. Why is it that when people try keto they have all sorts of problems, yet when they try paleo they storm in telling everyone else how well it worked without a hiccup? OP never said he wasn't losing weight. Maybe the only problem is the (poopthread). ETA: And if he's not actually in ketosis, he may be succeeding with paleo and not knowing it. |
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Why is it that when people try keto they have all sorts of problems, yet when they try paleo they storm in telling everyone else how well it worked without a hiccup? Quoted:
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I don't know keto but 30 days of diarrhea is usually a sign that something is wrong. I'm doing a paleo type diet and haven't had any digestive problems at all. Perfect turds that you can set your watch by. If you want I can take a picture for you. No? What are you actually eating? eta Holy crap, lol. You need more variety. I'd probably shoot myself after 30 days of that very limited diet. Why is it that when people try keto they have all sorts of problems, yet when they try paleo they storm in telling everyone else how well it worked without a hiccup? I had major problems with Keto. I was told I was doing it wrong or that I'm fucked up. But it's possible that some people and Keto don't go well together too. YMMV, and all that. |
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I had similar experience, but I was going low-calorie. I upped my caloric intake from ~1,200 calories daily to over 2,000 (carbs were 20-30 grams a day) and I am good to go now. I think you may want to increase carbs slightly too (30 grams is okay) until your body fully adjusts to processing fat for energy and then you can taper down to the cut range of 15 grams.
Remember that the enzymes and functions that your body uses to digest carbs are still being produced in abundance until your body adjusts, so you are flushing out that stuff along with fats that aren't being fully digested because your body hasn't prioritized the fat as the main energy source. Keto works and is easy because it kills your cravings for junk food and overeating (ironic post is ironic due to username). The adjustment period is tough though. Haters can hate, but they can't argue with the results! |
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Maybe get a blendtec and make a smoothie every so often. A few kale leaves, half an avocado, a carrot, a tomato, rainbow chard, unsweetened flax milk. Quoted:
Maybe get a blendtec and make a smoothie every so often. A few kale leaves, half an avocado, a carrot, a tomato, rainbow chard, unsweetened flax milk. Anytime you take food, throw it in a blender and whir the heck out of it, you’re setting yourself up for a mainline of sugar. (I am assuming there aren’t too many out there blending up a ‘steafisken’ smoothie (that’s a steak-fish-chicken combo in case you we’re wondering) and pounding that beast for breakfast – although, that would be pretty badass…). You’re probably reading this thinking, “What the heck is wrong with my spinach-apple-beet-carrot-parsley and sometimes protein powder concoction?” Well, let’s talk about it. Liquids hit the system much more quickly than solid food (even after you chew it). The rapid transit requires an immediate and marked insulin response to get that sugar out of your blood. Your body doesn’t know the difference between the sugar in a ‘green drink’ and the sugar in a soda. (I’m sorry if this completely ruins your year – it’s the truth). Sure, the juice or smoothie has some vitamins and minerals that the soda most definitely doesn’t, but if you’re looking to get lean – step away from the blender. Your beta-cells will thank you. And yes, when you throw 2 pounds of spinach, 3 carrots, a handful of berries, ½ an apple and a scoop or two of protein powder in the blender and push start, the end result is still a form of sugar (with some protein thrown in for good measure). Next time you’re getting ready to fire up the old juicer or concoct a new smoothie creation, I want you to try eating all of the food you’re planning to pulverize. Could you? Let me rephrase that, could you eat all of it ‘comfortably’… Yeah, that’s kinda what I thought.
http://robbwolf.com/2013/06/27/smoothie-moves/ |
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I drink around a gallon of water daily. For the first week or so it was a little less. But every day after that I have finished the whole jug. I work out every day. An hour of cardio followed by an hour and a half of weights. I don't know about my sodium intake, I haven't been keeping track. I imagine low since I use uncured bacon and don't add salt to anything. I take a multivitamin, forgot that. What are some good high fiber Keto foods? Swap those. Cardio after weights always. |
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I had major problems with Keto. I was told I was doing it wrong or that I'm fucked up. But it's possible that some people and Keto don't go well together too. YMMV, and all that. Quoted:
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I don't know keto but 30 days of diarrhea is usually a sign that something is wrong. I'm doing a paleo type diet and haven't had any digestive problems at all. Perfect turds that you can set your watch by. If you want I can take a picture for you. No? What are you actually eating? eta Holy crap, lol. You need more variety. I'd probably shoot myself after 30 days of that very limited diet. Why is it that when people try keto they have all sorts of problems, yet when they try paleo they storm in telling everyone else how well it worked without a hiccup? I had major problems with Keto. I was told I was doing it wrong or that I'm fucked up. But it's possible that some people and Keto don't go well together too. YMMV, and all that. The shits never went away for me either with Keto, I only did it for a month. Now other times I didn't exactly do Paleo, but similar with lots of meat, veggies and fairly low carbs (but not Keto low) and I was basically OK. There's a huge difference between being in Ketosis and eating fairly low carb. Unless you have some sort of medical condition, I haven't seen a single study to say being in Ketosis 100% of the time for your entire life is a good thing. |
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Keto I poop every other day and even then it's sold. So let me ask you this. How is your gallbladder? maby you cant handle the fats. IO had my gallbladder removed about 5 years a go and then It was diarrhea and farts were not safe. But keto lets me fart with out fear.  |
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The shits never went away for me either with Keto, I only did it for a month. Now other times I didn't exactly do Paleo, but similar with lots of meat, veggies and fairly low carbs (but not Keto low) and I was basically OK. There's a huge difference between being in Ketosis and eating fairly low carb. Unless you have some sort of medical condition, I haven't seen a single study to say being in Ketosis 100% of the time for your entire life is a good thing. Quoted:
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I don't know keto but 30 days of diarrhea is usually a sign that something is wrong. I'm doing a paleo type diet and haven't had any digestive problems at all. Perfect turds that you can set your watch by. If you want I can take a picture for you. No? What are you actually eating? eta Holy crap, lol. You need more variety. I'd probably shoot myself after 30 days of that very limited diet. Why is it that when people try keto they have all sorts of problems, yet when they try paleo they storm in telling everyone else how well it worked without a hiccup? I had major problems with Keto. I was told I was doing it wrong or that I'm fucked up. But it's possible that some people and Keto don't go well together too. YMMV, and all that. The shits never went away for me either with Keto, I only did it for a month. Now other times I didn't exactly do Paleo, but similar with lots of meat, veggies and fairly low carbs (but not Keto low) and I was basically OK. There's a huge difference between being in Ketosis and eating fairly low carb. Unless you have some sort of medical condition, I haven't seen a single study to say being in Ketosis 100% of the time for your entire life is a good thing. My tummy was fine, I just felt like I was dying. When I was strong enough to get to a doctor after quitting, he figured I'd dropped my BP. 
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My tummy was fine, I just felt like I was dying. When I was strong enough to get to a doctor after quitting, he figured I'd dropped my BP.
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I don't know keto but 30 days of diarrhea is usually a sign that something is wrong. I'm doing a paleo type diet and haven't had any digestive problems at all. Perfect turds that you can set your watch by. If you want I can take a picture for you. No? What are you actually eating? eta Holy crap, lol. You need more variety. I'd probably shoot myself after 30 days of that very limited diet. Why is it that when people try keto they have all sorts of problems, yet when they try paleo they storm in telling everyone else how well it worked without a hiccup? I had major problems with Keto. I was told I was doing it wrong or that I'm fucked up. But it's possible that some people and Keto don't go well together too. YMMV, and all that. The shits never went away for me either with Keto, I only did it for a month. Now other times I didn't exactly do Paleo, but similar with lots of meat, veggies and fairly low carbs (but not Keto low) and I was basically OK. There's a huge difference between being in Ketosis and eating fairly low carb. Unless you have some sort of medical condition, I haven't seen a single study to say being in Ketosis 100% of the time for your entire life is a good thing. My tummy was fine, I just felt like I was dying. When I was strong enough to get to a doctor after quitting, he figured I'd dropped my BP.
I had god awful shits like OP, and it never totally went away in Keto. I also carefully tracked all my intake & exercise. My weight loss was no better so I stopped for a number of reasons, don't really recall all of them. Biggest reasons were no pizza and beer. 
Once I went off Keto to low carb, my energy improved and bowels were normal. As you said we're not all the same and YMMV. |
| I like the diet. It makes me feel like I have a bunch of energy. I am never hungry. I get to eat shit like bacon, and I have lost 16lbs in the month I have been doing this diet and working out. That is compared to an avg of 8-10lbs per month with just eating in moderation and working out. I talked to my father (neurosurgeon with 20yrs exp) and he echoed a lot of the same things you guys did. He wanted me to try two things before switching diets. 1. go a week with high fiber. 2. go a week without eggs. Apparently orange colored squirts is not uncommon for people who have problems with eggs. I went from eating maybe 6 eggs a week to 6-8 eggs every day. I have also cooked everything today in butter Paula Dean style and have heavy cream in my coffee and my math says my fats are off to a good start today. I took fiber one powder this morning and so far haven't shit today, which by now I should have shit 2-3 times. Good indicator hopefully. I also am going after class to buy Ketostixs Can someone tell me what I need the "number" or "color" to be for best weight loss? Cause I have no clue. |
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Low carb is just as effective as keto if you watch your calories like you have been.
Remember, if it wears you down too much mentally (as having the shits for a month straight might) to switch things around a bit. You want something sustainable, not something that don't enjoy. Lots of bodybuilder types when doing a keto cut might drop into it for a week or two, and then break it for a week to maintain a level of sanity. |
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Why is it that when people try keto they have all sorts of problems, yet when they try paleo they storm in telling everyone else how well it worked without a hiccup? Quoted:
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I don't know keto but 30 days of diarrhea is usually a sign that something is wrong. I'm doing a paleo type diet and haven't had any digestive problems at all. Perfect turds that you can set your watch by. If you want I can take a picture for you. No? What are you actually eating? eta Holy crap, lol. You need more variety. I'd probably shoot myself after 30 days of that very limited diet. Why is it that when people try keto they have all sorts of problems, yet when they try paleo they storm in telling everyone else how well it worked without a hiccup? |
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Most people that try Keto and have problems aren't doing Keto. They just think they are. Quoted:
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I don't know keto but 30 days of diarrhea is usually a sign that something is wrong. I'm doing a paleo type diet and haven't had any digestive problems at all. Perfect turds that you can set your watch by. If you want I can take a picture for you. No? What are you actually eating? eta Holy crap, lol. You need more variety. I'd probably shoot myself after 30 days of that very limited diet. Why is it that when people try keto they have all sorts of problems, yet when they try paleo they storm in telling everyone else how well it worked without a hiccup? Can't you get test strips at the drug store to see if you actually are in ketosis? |
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The shits never went away for me either with Keto, I only did it for a month. Now other times I didn't exactly do Paleo, but similar with lots of meat, veggies and fairly low carbs (but not Keto low) and I was basically OK. There's a huge difference between being in Ketosis and eating fairly low carb. Unless you have some sort of medical condition, I haven't seen a single study to say being in Ketosis 100% of the time for your entire life is a good thing. Quoted:
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I don't know keto but 30 days of diarrhea is usually a sign that something is wrong. I'm doing a paleo type diet and haven't had any digestive problems at all. Perfect turds that you can set your watch by. If you want I can take a picture for you. No? What are you actually eating? eta Holy crap, lol. You need more variety. I'd probably shoot myself after 30 days of that very limited diet. Why is it that when people try keto they have all sorts of problems, yet when they try paleo they storm in telling everyone else how well it worked without a hiccup? I had major problems with Keto. I was told I was doing it wrong or that I'm fucked up. But it's possible that some people and Keto don't go well together too. YMMV, and all that. The shits never went away for me either with Keto, I only did it for a month. Now other times I didn't exactly do Paleo, but similar with lots of meat, veggies and fairly low carbs (but not Keto low) and I was basically OK. There's a huge difference between being in Ketosis and eating fairly low carb. Unless you have some sort of medical condition, I haven't seen a single study to say being in Ketosis 100% of the time for your entire life is a good thing. You also haven't seen one that says it's a bad thing. But you have seen at least one entire race of people that lives in Ketosis from birth to death with no issues from it. I ate 63grams of carbohydrates yesterday, Still at 2.6mmol beta hydroxybutyrate today. Keto doesn't have to be super low carb to be keto, and in the end, it's actually about becoming fat adapted moreso than Ketosis. |
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not to turn this into a poop thread, but are your stools yellow in color. If so, there might be something amiss with your gall bladder. That's not uncommon at all, lots of people find gall bladder issues they didn't know they had when they start any HF diet, and yellowish liquid from the intestines seems to be a signal. I had mine removed years ago, I don't have the issue, but it happens to some people. |
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probably need moar fiber.
grassfed butter, coconut oil avocado are all great ways to get your fat. i probably wouldn't go with any set amount of grams of anything but a basic 70% fat 20% protein 10% carbs. 10% carbs is around 50 grams of total carbs but if you are getting 38 grams of carbs in fiber form like an average male should you aren't getting many net carbs at all. why just chicken thighs? eat all the meats fatty is good cook them in butter too |
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I like the diet. It makes me feel like I have a bunch of energy. I am never hungry. I get to eat shit like bacon, and I have lost 16lbs in the month I have been doing this diet and working out. That is compared to an avg of 8-10lbs per month with just eating in moderation and working out. I talked to my father (neurosurgeon with 20yrs exp) and he echoed a lot of the same things you guys did. He wanted me to try two things before switching diets. 1. go a week with high fiber. 2. go a week without eggs. Apparently orange colored squirts is not uncommon for people who have problems with eggs. I went from eating maybe 6 eggs a week to 6-8 eggs every day. I have also cooked everything today in butter Paula Dean style and have heavy cream in my coffee and my math says my fats are off to a good start today. I took fiber one powder this morning and so far haven't shit today, which by now I should have shit 2-3 times. Good indicator hopefully. I also am going after class to buy Ketostixs Can someone tell me what I need the "number" or "color" to be for best weight loss? Cause I have no clue. On ketositx, any color change at all is good, and the color is completely irrelevant . They're measuring a different ketone(acetoacetate) than the one that matters(beta hydroxybutyrate), that's only testable in blood. But at the beginning, if you have Acetoacetate in your urine, you'll have some in your blood. After awhile, it can disappear from your urine and if you're only urine testing, most people assume that they're not in ketosis anymore. The opposite is true. It means you've become truly fat adapted, and your body now accepts and enjoys fat as a primary fuel and glucose has become secondary. |
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OP... May I suggest you simply forget about the nonsense you have subscribed to, and get back to basics? A.W.D. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6d/USDA_Food_Pyramid.gif You know the government isn't even pushing that stupid shit anymore? |
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Can't you get test strips at the drug store to see if you actually are in ketosis? Quoted:
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I don't know keto but 30 days of diarrhea is usually a sign that something is wrong. I'm doing a paleo type diet and haven't had any digestive problems at all. Perfect turds that you can set your watch by. If you want I can take a picture for you. No? What are you actually eating? eta Holy crap, lol. You need more variety. I'd probably shoot myself after 30 days of that very limited diet. Why is it that when people try keto they have all sorts of problems, yet when they try paleo they storm in telling everyone else how well it worked without a hiccup? Can't you get test strips at the drug store to see if you actually are in ketosis? Yes. $6.44 for in the diabetes section of Walmart. They're only a general test though. |
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Not to hijack OP, but above someone mentioned limiting carrots. I've seen this mentioned before with no explanation. Why? Are they not a "good" vegetable? They're about %10 carbohydrate by weight. Some won't hurt. But they're easy to over due, and trying to shoot for ketosis hard and fast is harder. |
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You know the government isn't even pushing that stupid shit anymore? Quoted:
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OP... May I suggest you simply forget about the nonsense you have subscribed to, and get back to basics? A.W.D. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6d/USDA_Food_Pyramid.gif You know the government isn't even pushing that stupid shit anymore? They pushing something else now that benefits them financially or otherwise? A.W.D. |
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They're about %10 carbohydrate by weight. Some won't hurt. But they're easy to over due, and trying to shoot for ketosis hard and fast is harder. Quoted:
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Not to hijack OP, but above someone mentioned limiting carrots. I've seen this mentioned before with no explanation. Why? Are they not a "good" vegetable? They're about %10 carbohydrate by weight. Some won't hurt. But they're easy to over due, and trying to shoot for ketosis hard and fast is harder. Ok, thanks |
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They pushing something else now that benefits them financially or otherwise? A.W.D. Quoted:
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OP... May I suggest you simply forget about the nonsense you have subscribed to, and get back to basics? A.W.D. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6d/USDA_Food_Pyramid.gif You know the government isn't even pushing that stupid shit anymore? They pushing something else now that benefits them financially or otherwise? A.W.D. HAHA no! They have a lock on it. Mission accomplished. No need to get the obesity rates all the way to 100% to make money. |