[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Expandable batons? (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 10/18/2015 8:34:17 PM EDT
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I've seen the small 12", the aluminum models and then the traditional longer steel models that ASP makes. Then there's friction vs. push button locks.
Any non-LEO's carry them, own them, stow them in vehicles or kits? I was trained with a longer model years back, not sure how much utility there is in the smaller and/or lighter models...but what's your experience been? Thanks -Emt1581 |
| Swing hard and for the joints. I know a fellow who whacked at some guy with a knife (he had a door between them). Anyway, the first blow wasn't hard enough and the guy kept trying to push the door open. Second blow was with all his force and it broke the guy's wrist, forcing the assailant to drop the knife. |
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Straight battons are better but I carry my Streamlight all the time anyway for patrol. If I were looking for an impact weapon to cary in a vehicle it would be a Streamlight or D cell Maglight. Maybe even the big 4 cell one or whatever is the longer. The Streamlights are generally thinner and lighter. The 4 D-Cell maglite I had back in the late 80's early 90's never seemed like it had enough weight to do much. A guy I was in EMS class with said to try loading it up with BB's....never made sense to me other than weighing more. The batons are thin and much quicker in the hand. Just not sure I would trust something short and light. -Emt1581 |
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I have an asp / baton thing. It's heavy (steel) and, IMO, pointless. Gotta say though, for it's size, I would hate to be on the receiving end. Very effective weapon but I just cannot justify carrying it all the time. If I feel threatened, I'd rather pull a gun than a baton.
It's just like this one: 
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I carried a blackjack for twenty years, never needed another impact weapon. Now, at my new PD, I am issued a 22 inch Monadnock Autolock... It sucks, and just takes up space on my belt... It's better to go hands on now Yup, blackjacks might not allow much distance but when used right one thump is all it takes. -Emt1581 |
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Yup, blackjacks might not allow much distance but when used right one thump is all it takes. -Emt1581 Quoted:
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I carried a blackjack for twenty years, never needed another impact weapon. Now, at my new PD, I am issued a 22 inch Monadnock Autolock... It sucks, and just takes up space on my belt... It's better to go hands on now Yup, blackjacks might not allow much distance but when used right one thump is all it takes. -Emt1581 As a civvie in Mami, I liked the asp because it fit easily and concealed in jeans or shorts. It was light. |
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It's a tool. They have very narrow uses so I have one on my belt for the few times I could actually use an impact weapon, I also have a taser, which is also a very narrow application, and pepper spray, which can do what the asp and taser can't but won't do what they can.
I have a gun as a weapon for grave situations when the other three are not appropriate. As a Civi, I wouldn't waste my time or comfort to carry all those tools. I would just carry a gun and avoid every situation I could that did not call for the gun. Because the situations that one of those tools would be useful are better off just being avoided with brains and tact. |
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I keep a blackjack in my vehicle (legal in Texas) just for snicks. I wish my handgun license allowed me to carry a sap* along with a handgun.
* Some people argue the letter of the law allows for that here, and I understand their argument, but I think the language was unintentional, and I don't want to be the test case. |
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Windows and scooting something off a high shelf. That's it. There's a video of a slightly overweight, yet incredibly handsome officer that looks just like me, trying to rescue a lady from a burning crashed vehicle by breaking out the passenger window with his Monadnock Power Safety tipped expandable baton. I think it took the 5'11" tall 235 lb, former high school varsity wrestler three strikes to break the window. They suck for windows. |
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From the replies here it seems a plain old black jack is FAR more preferable to the expandable baton.
Only advantage I see at this point when comparing the two is that the baton allows for distance where the blackjack is essentially brass knuckles length. -Emt1581 |
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I've thought about picking one up to carry when walking my dog- I live in a quiet neighborhood but for some reason there have been a lot of loose dogs lately. I would probably wind up never carrying it though and have been buying other toys instead. This. Since I am a civi now, the asp stays in a drawer near the front door. I had an occasion where I and my 12 pound attack dog were rushed by a bad dog. I had three main tools. G21, hands or feet. I gave the offender a couple of swift rib kicks and it retreated. Luckily it was just a 35 pound aggressor. I like the asp because it is a tool that might save me some bite marks. Funny, I had another situation with the breed of peace. It had my dog and wife treed, I heard the commotion and came out of the garage with a 2x4.....that works as well, just not as convenient. |
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The Streamlights are generally thinner and lighter. The 4 D-Cell maglite I had back in the late 80's early 90's never seemed like it had enough weight to do much. A guy I was in EMS class with said to try loading it up with BB's....never made sense to me other than weighing more. The batons are thin and much quicker in the hand. Just not sure I would trust something short and light. -Emt1581 Quoted:
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Straight battons are better but I carry my Streamlight all the time anyway for patrol. If I were looking for an impact weapon to cary in a vehicle it would be a Streamlight or D cell Maglight. Maybe even the big 4 cell one or whatever is the longer. The Streamlights are generally thinner and lighter. The 4 D-Cell maglite I had back in the late 80's early 90's never seemed like it had enough weight to do much. A guy I was in EMS class with said to try loading it up with BB's....never made sense to me other than weighing more. The batons are thin and much quicker in the hand. Just not sure I would trust something short and light. -Emt1581 Maglite made 7 cell models and still makes 6 cell models. |
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Okay...but for their circumference and light weight....still no thanks. Hell, I'd MUCH prefer a good old steel pipe to a maglite weapon-wise. -Emt1581 Quoted:
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Maglite made 7 cell models and still makes 6 cell models. Okay...but for their circumference and light weight....still no thanks. Hell, I'd MUCH prefer a good old steel pipe to a maglite weapon-wise. -Emt1581 
2D Maglite - 23 ounces with batteries 3D Maglite - 30 ounces with batteries 4D Maglite - 36 ounces with batteries 5D Maglite - 43 ounces with batteries 6D Maglite - 50 ounces with batteries |
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I have a 12 inch one I use for taking the dog out. A couple nasty run ins with strays in our last neighborhood and plenty of coyotes in this one. Maybe I'm paranoid but I don't want to shoot a dog for being a dog. That's a pain in the ass to boot. I like it well enough, ASP P-12. Kinda wish I went with the P16 I'll admit to throwing it in a pocket a time or two, think J-frame, when I run out. Totally cool in AZ and I like the flexibility it gives. |
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Get a large steel hex nut that just fits over the shaft of a maglite, drill three holes in side of nut, thread holes, add set screws, slide it on and tighten the screws. Add a wrist strap to the end cap. Your 3-4 cell maglite is now a real striking tool. If anyone asks you why the nut is there tell them it's to keep it from rolling away.  |
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I'm a security officer who carries one on his belt.
We are taught to aim for certain "legal" impact points: mid-arm, mid-thigh, NOT the joints. (This is hard to do sometimes: attacking BGs are very mobile, you know.) Check your local and state laws; many places forbid them for all but LEO, or LEO and registered/trained security officers; many places have no restrictions at all. BUT if you are caught with one you are pretty well screwed unless the LEO lets you off. eta I'd rather resort to OC spray. |
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2D Maglite - 23 ounces with batteries 3D Maglite - 30 ounces with batteries 4D Maglite - 36 ounces with batteries 5D Maglite - 43 ounces with batteries 6D Maglite - 50 ounces with batteries Quoted:
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Maglite made 7 cell models and still makes 6 cell models. Okay...but for their circumference and light weight....still no thanks. Hell, I'd MUCH prefer a good old steel pipe to a maglite weapon-wise. -Emt1581
2D Maglite - 23 ounces with batteries 3D Maglite - 30 ounces with batteries 4D Maglite - 36 ounces with batteries 5D Maglite - 43 ounces with batteries 6D Maglite - 50 ounces with batteries Okay, I'll rephrase it...weight distribution rather than light weight. Put a D-cell battery in a sock...then put a 2" piece of rebar in a sock...which would you rather get nailed by? And I'm not sure where those weight measurements came from but is anyone seriously suggesting carrying around a 60oz+..... flashlight? -Emt1581 |
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I'm not sure where those weight measurements came from Straight from the manufacturer's web site (just click the specifications tab). http://maglite.com/shop/flashlights/full-size-flashlights/maglite-2-cell-d-flashlight.html http://maglite.com/shop/flashlights/full-size-flashlights/maglite-3-cell-d-flashlight.html http://maglite.com/shop/flashlights/full-size-flashlights/maglite-4-cell-d-flashlight.html http://maglite.com/shop/flashlights/full-size-flashlights/maglite-5-cell-d-flashlight.html http://maglite.com/shop/flashlights/full-size-flashlights/maglite-6-cell-d-flashlight.html |
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One night I got dispatched to a domestic dispute. When I got there I was met in the driveway by a 19-20 yr old woman carrying an infant. She said her boyfriend had smacked her around knocked her and the baby to the floor. I told her that he had to go to jail whereupon she hollered at "Mikey" and said that he was going to jail. This boy came off the front porch and said I ain't gonna go and raised his fist. Following policy I sprayed him with Freeze+P and he laughed. I knew then I had trouble and called for backup (Sheriff only allowed one car at that time) then he and I proceeded to dance around his yard with me knocking the hell out of him with my 21" ASP every chance I got. Finally backup arrived and we were able to finally take him down without anyone dying. But I changed to a 26" after that and had no other problems with impact weapons.
Po-po |
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Source? -Emt1581 Quoted:
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They're a no go in PA. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Source? -Emt1581 PA Title 18, Section 908 - Prohibited offensive weapons |
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I've seen the small 12", the aluminum models and then the traditional longer steel models that ASP makes. Then there's friction vs. push button locks. Any non-LEO's carry them, own them, stow them in vehicles or kits? I was trained with a longer model years back, not sure how much utility there is in the smaller and/or lighter models...but what's your experience been? Thanks -Emt1581 The painter at work carries an ASP baton back and forth to work and back as he lives just a half mile from where we work. He has shown it to me before. They are pretty neat and I would consider one myself. Main use would be loose dogs as it should get the job done without you resorting to the use of your firearm. |
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They're a no go in PA. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Source? -Emt1581 PA Title 18, Section 908 - Prohibited offensive weapons The closest that comes is a blackjack, which while not defined in state law, is usually comprised of a spring-like handle or shaft with a weighted end. The ASP is a baton, which is not mentioned in the state law as a prohibited weapon. There may be caselaw that lumps batons in with blackjacks, but I don't think a plain reading of the state law alone does. That said, I had one, and if that's all I had I wouldn't be comfortable betting my life on it. I'd rather just carry a gun. |
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PA Title 18, Section 908 - Prohibited offensive weapons The closest that comes is a blackjack, which while not defined in state law, is usually comprised of a spring-like handle or shaft with a weighted end. The ASP is a baton, which is not mentioned in the state law as a prohibited weapon. There may be caselaw that lumps batons in with blackjacks, but I don't think a plain reading of the state law alone does. That said, I had one, and if that's all I had I wouldn't be comfortable betting my life on it. I'd rather just carry a gun. What I find interesting is that blackjacks are outlawed....who the fuck even carries them anymore?? And having worked with thugs for the last 15 years I can't say I ever met one that even knew what a blackjack was. As for the batons, similar...they might know what they are but pipes, knives and guns are a little more idiot proof. I think on duty tonight I'll ask one of the cops about the legality. But in the end, I do think a blackjack would be more effective. Thanks -Emt1581 |
I carried one when I worked security. It just sits in a box now. I'd rather use pepper spray or a gun if I have to engage someone. However it was real handy for poking at bums pretending to sleep so that I wouldn't get hit when they flipped over and started swinging  |
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There's a video of a slightly overweight, yet incredibly handsome officer that looks just like me, trying to rescue a lady from a burning crashed vehicle by breaking out the passenger window with his Monadnock Power Safety tipped expandable baton. I think it took the 5'11" tall 235 lb, former high school varsity wrestler three strikes to break the window. They suck for windows. Quoted:
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Windows and scooting something off a high shelf. That's it. There's a video of a slightly overweight, yet incredibly handsome officer that looks just like me, trying to rescue a lady from a burning crashed vehicle by breaking out the passenger window with his Monadnock Power Safety tipped expandable baton. I think it took the 5'11" tall 235 lb, former high school varsity wrestler three strikes to break the window. They suck for windows. That's because Windows flex if you hit them in the center. You have to hit them in the corners. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |