Posted: 7/8/2015 3:56:24 PM EDT
| Lets say one buys some of this then prints out a nice bullet. Reloads it for the proper weight. Would it work? |
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You'd probably have something pretty comparable to a frangible bullet. kinda what I'm thinking.. really close to a sintered bullet. the Tung/Bys mix is really close to the same weight as lead. might be kinda fun making a HP version and shoot it into some gel. |
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why? its powder, powder is legal.. Solid is whats frowned upon. Quoted:
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Probably. Just don't tell anyone here what you're doing. why? its powder, powder is legal.. Solid is whats frowned upon. This. It's technically plastic with tungsten imbued in it. But my question is: Would this create barrel wear? Granted in a situation where you're forced to PRINT a bullet, you wouldn't care much, but with even flecks of tungsten traveling down a barrel, would it create wear, would it be buffered by the plastic? Would it be like a non-Newtonian fluid (Think corn starch in water) and royally fuck up your gun? Interesting thoughts! |
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This. It's technically plastic with tungsten imbued in it. But my question is: Would this create barrel wear? Granted in a situation where you're forced to PRINT a bullet, you wouldn't care much, but with even flecks of tungsten traveling down a barrel, would it create wear, would it be buffered by the plastic? Would it be like a non-Newtonian fluid (Think corn starch in water) and royally fuck up your gun? Interesting thoughts! Quoted:
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Probably. Just don't tell anyone here what you're doing. why? its powder, powder is legal.. Solid is whats frowned upon. This. It's technically plastic with tungsten imbued in it. But my question is: Would this create barrel wear? Granted in a situation where you're forced to PRINT a bullet, you wouldn't care much, but with even flecks of tungsten traveling down a barrel, would it create wear, would it be buffered by the plastic? Would it be like a non-Newtonian fluid (Think corn starch in water) and royally fuck up your gun? Interesting thoughts! might be cool for a fire lapping. I will have on hand tonight Copper/Bronze/Brass filament. ill draw up a bullet and see what happens.. On payday ill order up a roll of the other to try.. |
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This. It's technically plastic with tungsten imbued in it. But my question is: Would this create barrel wear? Granted in a situation where you're forced to PRINT a bullet, you wouldn't care much, but with even flecks of tungsten traveling down a barrel, would it create wear, would it be buffered by the plastic? Would it be like a non-Newtonian fluid (Think corn starch in water) and royally fuck up your gun? Interesting thoughts! Quoted:
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Probably. Just don't tell anyone here what you're doing. why? its powder, powder is legal.. Solid is whats frowned upon. This. It's technically plastic with tungsten imbued in it. But my question is: Would this create barrel wear? Granted in a situation where you're forced to PRINT a bullet, you wouldn't care much, but with even flecks of tungsten traveling down a barrel, would it create wear, would it be buffered by the plastic? Would it be like a non-Newtonian fluid (Think corn starch in water) and royally fuck up your gun? Interesting thoughts! RE: barrel wear: YES. I met Todd Green years ago (on one occasion). Over burgers, he told me about his time as a Sig USA factory rep assigned to LEO support. Specifically, several federal LEO departments had followed orders to switch to NON-LEAD TRAINING AMMO. -the training ammo used SINTERED bullets. LEO training officers had shown Todd Sig barrels with virtually NO rifling left in them - they were almost smooth-bored after just a few thousand rounds of sintered bullets, while normally the barrels would have been in fine condition. This was around 2006 or so. Maybe they have adjusted the sintered mix to prevent that from happening since then. |
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might be cool for a fire lapping. I will have on hand tonight Copper/Bronze/Brass filament. ill draw up a bullet and see what happens.. On payday ill order up a roll of the other to try.. Quoted:
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Probably. Just don't tell anyone here what you're doing. why? its powder, powder is legal.. Solid is whats frowned upon. This. It's technically plastic with tungsten imbued in it. But my question is: Would this create barrel wear? Granted in a situation where you're forced to PRINT a bullet, you wouldn't care much, but with even flecks of tungsten traveling down a barrel, would it create wear, would it be buffered by the plastic? Would it be like a non-Newtonian fluid (Think corn starch in water) and royally fuck up your gun? Interesting thoughts! might be cool for a fire lapping. I will have on hand tonight Copper/Bronze/Brass filament. ill draw up a bullet and see what happens.. On payday ill order up a roll of the other to try.. How much does it shrink when cooling? Can you account for that or are you just taking a calipers to it and then hand sanding them into the correct diameter? |
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Lets say one buys some of this then prints out a nice bullet. Reloads it for the proper weight. Would it work? If you really want something to do with a 3d printer I can give you something to do. An argument can be made (and there is an BATFE letter floating around, for what that is worth) that pin fire cartridge fired firearms are not subject to the NFA '34 or GCA '68. Take a look at the LSAT rifle program and polymer cartridge cases (more specifically how the cartridges are actually fired inside the weapon). Figure out how to incorporate pin fire primers with polymer cartridge cases and a firing mechanism that can fire them. I do not mean for this to be a hijack and I only bring it up because I am a huge fan of your past work. If a silly idea (and it may be) please disregard. 
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RE: barrel wear: YES. I met Todd Green years ago (on one occasion). Over burgers, he told me about his time as a Sig USA factory rep assigned to LEO support. Specifically, several federal LEO departments had followed orders to switch to NON-LEAD TRAINING AMMO. -the training ammo used SINTERED bullets. LEO training officers had shown Todd Sig barrels with virtually NO rifling left in them - they were almost smooth-bored after just a few thousand rounds of sintered bullets, while normally the barrels would have been in fine condition. This was around 2006 or so. Maybe they have adjusted the sintered mix to prevent that from happening since then. Quoted:
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Probably. Just don't tell anyone here what you're doing. why? its powder, powder is legal.. Solid is whats frowned upon. This. It's technically plastic with tungsten imbued in it. But my question is: Would this create barrel wear? Granted in a situation where you're forced to PRINT a bullet, you wouldn't care much, but with even flecks of tungsten traveling down a barrel, would it create wear, would it be buffered by the plastic? Would it be like a non-Newtonian fluid (Think corn starch in water) and royally fuck up your gun? Interesting thoughts! RE: barrel wear: YES. I met Todd Green years ago (on one occasion). Over burgers, he told me about his time as a Sig USA factory rep assigned to LEO support. Specifically, several federal LEO departments had followed orders to switch to NON-LEAD TRAINING AMMO. -the training ammo used SINTERED bullets. LEO training officers had shown Todd Sig barrels with virtually NO rifling left in them - they were almost smooth-bored after just a few thousand rounds of sintered bullets, while normally the barrels would have been in fine condition. This was around 2006 or so. Maybe they have adjusted the sintered mix to prevent that from happening since then. ya MANY warnings on when using powered Tung in custom bullets. It will eat the dies and you want to ALWAYS in case it in a jacket of some sort. Hmm might be cool for a plastic tip for a ULD design.. I could move the CG of the bullet a bit forward of the center to get a longer stable flight. Worst case we can see if I can get a printer core to swage!
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If you really want something to do with a 3d printer I can give you something to do. An argument can be made (and there is an BATFE letter floating around, for what that is worth) that pin fire cartridge fired firearms are not subject to the NFA '34 or GCA '68. Take a look at the LSAT rifle program and polymer cartridge cases (more specifically how the cartridges are actually fired inside the weapon). Figure out how to incorporate pin fire primers with polymer cartridge cases and a firing mechanism that can fire them. I do not mean for this to be a hijack and I only bring it up because I am a huge fan of your past work. If a silly idea (and it may be) please disregard. Quoted:
Quoted:
Lets say one buys some of this then prints out a nice bullet. Reloads it for the proper weight. Would it work? If you really want something to do with a 3d printer I can give you something to do. An argument can be made (and there is an BATFE letter floating around, for what that is worth) that pin fire cartridge fired firearms are not subject to the NFA '34 or GCA '68. Take a look at the LSAT rifle program and polymer cartridge cases (more specifically how the cartridges are actually fired inside the weapon). Figure out how to incorporate pin fire primers with polymer cartridge cases and a firing mechanism that can fire them. I do not mean for this to be a hijack and I only bring it up because I am a huge fan of your past work. If a silly idea (and it may be) please disregard. I like! Hmm this requires thought! |
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This. It's technically plastic with tungsten imbued in it. But my question is: Would this create barrel wear? Granted in a situation where you're forced to PRINT a bullet, you wouldn't care much, but with even flecks of tungsten traveling down a barrel, would it create wear, would it be buffered by the plastic? Would it be like a non-Newtonian fluid (Think corn starch in water) and royally fuck up your gun? Interesting thoughts! Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Probably. Just don't tell anyone here what you're doing. why? its powder, powder is legal.. Solid is whats frowned upon. This. It's technically plastic with tungsten imbued in it. But my question is: Would this create barrel wear? Granted in a situation where you're forced to PRINT a bullet, you wouldn't care much, but with even flecks of tungsten traveling down a barrel, would it create wear, would it be buffered by the plastic? Would it be like a non-Newtonian fluid (Think corn starch in water) and royally fuck up your gun? Interesting thoughts! print the bullet undersized then put them in a fixture where you can evenly coat them with plastic...
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RE: barrel wear: YES. I met Todd Green years ago (on one occasion). Over burgers, he told me about his time as a Sig USA factory rep assigned to LEO support. Specifically, several federal LEO departments had followed orders to switch to NON-LEAD TRAINING AMMO. -the training ammo used SINTERED bullets. LEO training officers had shown Todd Sig barrels with virtually NO rifling left in them - they were almost smooth-bored after just a few thousand rounds of sintered bullets, while normally the barrels would have been in fine condition. This was around 2006 or so. Maybe they have adjusted the sintered mix to prevent that from happening since then. Quoted:
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Probably. Just don't tell anyone here what you're doing. why? its powder, powder is legal.. Solid is whats frowned upon. This. It's technically plastic with tungsten imbued in it. But my question is: Would this create barrel wear? Granted in a situation where you're forced to PRINT a bullet, you wouldn't care much, but with even flecks of tungsten traveling down a barrel, would it create wear, would it be buffered by the plastic? Would it be like a non-Newtonian fluid (Think corn starch in water) and royally fuck up your gun? Interesting thoughts! RE: barrel wear: YES. I met Todd Green years ago (on one occasion). Over burgers, he told me about his time as a Sig USA factory rep assigned to LEO support. Specifically, several federal LEO departments had followed orders to switch to NON-LEAD TRAINING AMMO. -the training ammo used SINTERED bullets. LEO training officers had shown Todd Sig barrels with virtually NO rifling left in them - they were almost smooth-bored after just a few thousand rounds of sintered bullets, while normally the barrels would have been in fine condition. This was around 2006 or so. Maybe they have adjusted the sintered mix to prevent that from happening since then. If it was a two or more switchable filament printer, you could print one thin outer layer on the bullet that was all plastic/solid ABS. Also, what's the product's melting/deformation temperature, could they be powder-coated? Liiks like it's printed at roughly 450F. Most powdercoat is cured at around 390 or thereabout, so not much room for error, but maybe it's just within the realm of do-able. |
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If it was a two or more switchable filament printer, you could print one thin outer layer on the bullet that was all plastic/solid ABS. Also, what's the product's melting/deformation temperature, could they be powder-coated? Liiks like it's printed at roughly 450F. Most powdercoat is cured at around 390 or thereabout, so not much room for error, but maybe it's just within the realm of do-able. Quoted:
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Probably. Just don't tell anyone here what you're doing. why? its powder, powder is legal.. Solid is whats frowned upon. This. It's technically plastic with tungsten imbued in it. But my question is: Would this create barrel wear? Granted in a situation where you're forced to PRINT a bullet, you wouldn't care much, but with even flecks of tungsten traveling down a barrel, would it create wear, would it be buffered by the plastic? Would it be like a non-Newtonian fluid (Think corn starch in water) and royally fuck up your gun? Interesting thoughts! RE: barrel wear: YES. I met Todd Green years ago (on one occasion). Over burgers, he told me about his time as a Sig USA factory rep assigned to LEO support. Specifically, several federal LEO departments had followed orders to switch to NON-LEAD TRAINING AMMO. -the training ammo used SINTERED bullets. LEO training officers had shown Todd Sig barrels with virtually NO rifling left in them - they were almost smooth-bored after just a few thousand rounds of sintered bullets, while normally the barrels would have been in fine condition. This was around 2006 or so. Maybe they have adjusted the sintered mix to prevent that from happening since then. If it was a two or more switchable filament printer, you could print one thin outer layer on the bullet that was all plastic/solid ABS. Also, what's the product's melting/deformation temperature, could they be powder-coated? Liiks like it's printed at roughly 450F. Most powdercoat is cured at around 390 or thereabout, so not much room for error, but maybe it's just within the realm of do-able. I wonder how cost effective it would be... |
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print the bullet undersized then put them in a fixture where you can evenly coat them with plastic... Quoted:
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Probably. Just don't tell anyone here what you're doing. why? its powder, powder is legal.. Solid is whats frowned upon. This. It's technically plastic with tungsten imbued in it. But my question is: Would this create barrel wear? Granted in a situation where you're forced to PRINT a bullet, you wouldn't care much, but with even flecks of tungsten traveling down a barrel, would it create wear, would it be buffered by the plastic? Would it be like a non-Newtonian fluid (Think corn starch in water) and royally fuck up your gun? Interesting thoughts! print the bullet undersized then put them in a fixture where you can evenly coat them with plastic... or use my dual head system to print both! 
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I like! Hmm this requires thought! Please let me know if this is inappropriate and I can take it to PM or start another thread. Full disclosure: I am a tax monkey; not a gun smith so if throw out an idea that sounds like I have no idea what I am talking about, well, use your imagination
With that said I have actually given a great deal of thought about this (the legal side and the practical side). I mentioned the LSAT weapon program because the cartridge is actually rotated inside the weapon (if my understanding is correct). On second thought, that may not even be necessary if you started with a belt fed mechanism as the links could be designed/modified to arrange the primers for firing (especially if polymer as you could print the cartridges with the links). |
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Please let me know if this is inappropriate and I can take it to PM or start another thread. Full disclosure: I am a tax monkey; not a gun smith so if throw out an idea that sounds like I have no idea what I am talking about, well, use your imagination
With that said I have actually given a great deal of thought about this (the legal side and the practical side). I mentioned the LSAT weapon program because the cartridge is actually rotated inside the weapon (if my understanding is correct). On second thought, that may not even be necessary if you started with a belt fed mechanism as the links could be designed/modified to arrange the primers for firing (especially if polymer as you could print the cartridges with the links). Quoted:
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I like! Hmm this requires thought! Please let me know if this is inappropriate and I can take it to PM or start another thread. Full disclosure: I am a tax monkey; not a gun smith so if throw out an idea that sounds like I have no idea what I am talking about, well, use your imagination
With that said I have actually given a great deal of thought about this (the legal side and the practical side). I mentioned the LSAT weapon program because the cartridge is actually rotated inside the weapon (if my understanding is correct). On second thought, that may not even be necessary if you started with a belt fed mechanism as the links could be designed/modified to arrange the primers for firing (especially if polymer as you could print the cartridges with the links). No its cool. and I've always worked from serendipitous thought.. have them stacked in a mag with the pin on the right, upon feeding rotate the case to the up position. take the Tround concept and pin primer it. Give it 4 sides for easer stacking. |
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or use my dual head system to print both! Quoted:
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Probably. Just don't tell anyone here what you're doing. why? its powder, powder is legal.. Solid is whats frowned upon. This. It's technically plastic with tungsten imbued in it. But my question is: Would this create barrel wear? Granted in a situation where you're forced to PRINT a bullet, you wouldn't care much, but with even flecks of tungsten traveling down a barrel, would it create wear, would it be buffered by the plastic? Would it be like a non-Newtonian fluid (Think corn starch in water) and royally fuck up your gun? Interesting thoughts! print the bullet undersized then put them in a fixture where you can evenly coat them with plastic... or use my dual head system to print both! why couldn't you have moved here.... the shenanigans would have been epic...
frozen pudding bullets and magical unicorn ballistic testing.... |
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why couldn't you have moved here.... the shenanigans would have been epic...
frozen pudding bullets and magical unicorn ballistic testing.... A funky leg that would not handle travel too well.  At times I wish they would of just cut it off and not saved it..
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No its cool. and I've always worked from serendipitous thought.. have them stacked in a mag with the pin on the right, upon feeding rotate the case to the up position. take the Tround concept and pin primer it. Give it 4 sides for easer stacking. Everything old is new again. 
Imagine what you can do with Solidworks/CAD and a 3d printer that would be much, much harder with a brass cartridge. What about, instead of a PIN, you have a primer BAND that followed the full outer circumference of the cartridge (thus making alignment moot). This would require a new form of primer but I have a few ideas that could make it work (at least theoretically; who knows if it is even practical). |
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I like! Hmm this requires thought! Quoted:
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Lets say one buys some of this then prints out a nice bullet. Reloads it for the proper weight. Would it work? If you really want something to do with a 3d printer I can give you something to do. An argument can be made (and there is an BATFE letter floating around, for what that is worth) that pin fire cartridge fired firearms are not subject to the NFA '34 or GCA '68. Take a look at the LSAT rifle program and polymer cartridge cases (more specifically how the cartridges are actually fired inside the weapon). Figure out how to incorporate pin fire primers with polymer cartridge cases and a firing mechanism that can fire them. I do not mean for this to be a hijack and I only bring it up because I am a huge fan of your past work. If a silly idea (and it may be) please disregard. I like! Hmm this requires thought! The ATF ruled the Daisy Heddon VL was a firearm, and it was nothing more than a .22 bullet with propellent glued to it, no case or primer. |
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The ATF ruled the Daisy Heddon VL was a firearm, and it was nothing more than a .22 bullet with propellent glued to it, no case or primer. Quoted:
The ATF ruled the Daisy Heddon VL was a firearm, and it was nothing more than a .22 bullet with propellent glued to it, no case or primer. I do not like that decision but I can understand where they came from when they made it: 18 USC 921 (a)(3): (3) The term “firearm” means
(A) any weapon (including a starter gun) which will or is designed to or may readily be converted to expel a projectile by the action of an explosive; (B) the frame or receiver of any such weapon; (C) any firearm muffler or firearm silencer; or (D) any destructive device. ]Such term does not include an antique firearm. The only thing we may be able to hang our hat on is 18 USC 921 a(3)(D) and 18 USC 921 a(16)(B)(i). 18 USC 921 (a)(3)(D): (3) The term “firearm” means...
(D) any destructive device. Such term does not include an antique firearm. 18 USC 921 (a)(16) (16) The term “antique firearm” means—
(A) any firearm (including any firearm with a matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap, or similar type of ignition system) manufactured in or before 1898; or (B) any replica of any firearm described in subparagraph (A) if such replica— (i) is not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition, or (ii) uses rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition which is no longer manufactured in the United States and which is not readily available in the ordinary channels of commercial trade; or (C) any muzzle loading rifle, muzzle loading shotgun, or muzzle loading pistol, which is designed to use black powder, or a black powder substitute, and which cannot use fixed ammunition. For purposes of this subparagraph, the term “antique firearm” shall not include any weapon which incorporates a firearm frame or receiver, any firearm which is converted into a muzzle loading weapon, or any muzzle loading weapon which can be readily converted to fire fixed ammunition by replacing the barrel, bolt, breechblock, or any combination thereof. Of course were you to develop a belt fed pin fired weapon that fired multiple shots per single pull of the trigger, I could not imagine the BATFE going any route other than declaring it a Title II Firearm. Even in the determination letter issued by the BATFE (for what little that is worth) they used the following language: In response to your initial question, Pin-fire weapons and ammunition, in their original configuration, regardless of age, are exempted from regulation under both the GCA and NFA. However, we caution that altering or modifying these weapons, their ignition systems, or ammunition may remove them from antique status. https://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=1225499 Still, the idea is fascinating. |