[ARCHIVED THREAD] - CNC Question (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 1/2/2015 7:31:09 PM EDT
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I was wondering ...
If I had the correct CNC machines If I had access to a supply of the right metals If I knew how to run the machines ... Could I go out and buy the software to make a 1911, N frame smith or some other all metal gun? Just wondering .... |
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Quoted:
I was wondering ... If I had the correct CNC machines Yes If I had access to a supply of the right metals Yes If I knew how to run the machines ... Yes Could I go out and buy the software to make a 1911, N frame smith or some other all metal gun? NO Just wondering .... Unless it's out of patent, maybe somebody has drawn one and posted the files on the net. Otherwise . . . . hope your GOOD EXCELLENT at measuring and CAD drawing. My son can draw a lot of complex parts, but he's a beginner compared to many. ( actually he is, been doing it for just over 2 years) Knowing how to do the setup is 70-80% of the whole process |
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I have a Hass CNC and the software required to run it. Come on over and we can build a custom 1911 no problem. At $60 per hour we can probably do the measuring, required fixtures, setup, test pieces etc for around $9K. If you want to make 2 the second would probably only cost $4k. When do we start?  |
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I have a Hass CNC and the software required to run it. Come on over and we can build a custom 1911 no problem. At $60 per hour we can probably do the measuring, required fixtures, setup, test pieces etc for around $9K. If you want to make 2 the second would probably only cost $4k. When do we start? Economy of scale, ftw. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Quoted:
I have a Hass CNC and the software required to run it. Come on over and we can build a custom 1911 no problem. At $60 per hour we can probably do the measuring, required fixtures, setup, test pieces etc for around $9K. If you want to make 2 the second would probably only cost $4k. When do we start? This. The time just dedicated to workholding and fixtures alone... 
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I was wondering ... If I had the correct CNC machines If I had access to a supply of the right metals If I knew how to run the machines ... Could I go out and buy the software to make a 1911, N frame smith or some other all metal gun? Just wondering .... That's a little like asking "if I knew how to play a guitar could I do a really bitchin' rendition of my favorite tune?" |
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Its just not that simple, do you really think you can go out and buy Machines and material and then go to office max and buy ''gun making software'' and start producing guns?  Dudes. note I said IF I knew how to run them! I just be a curios kind of guy .... |
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Quoted:
I have a Hass CNC and the software required to run it. Come on over and we can build a custom 1911 no problem. At $60 per hour we can probably do the measuring, required fixtures, setup, test pieces etc for around $9K. If you want to make 2 the second would probably only cost $4k. When do we start? I'll check back with you when things get a bit warmer and I win the lottery ..l |
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Quoted: Dudes. note I said IF I knew how to run them! I just be a curios kind of guy .... Quoted: Quoted: Its just not that simple, do you really think you can go out and buy Machines and material and then go to office max and buy ''gun making software'' and start producing guns? Dudes. note I said IF I knew how to run them! I just be a curios kind of guy .... Yes, you can buy the software to run the machines and can probably find decent cad cam files of the parts. But if you knew what you were doing you would be generating your own part programs for your machines and tooling/fixtures But before doing that you would be doing a large amouth of work figuring out how you wanted to run the parts, and then making the fixtures to hold the parts you want to make |
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Pretty much, yes.
However, I think you mean models not softwear. And I'm not sure there are electronic models of the firearms you mentioned. Then, you have the entire tolerancing issue (even some of the prints floating around aren't correctly toleranced). This is where LOTS of manufacturers get in trouble. Particularly with guns that stack up tolerances a lot like the 1911. They've basically reverse engineered a design. It still needs toleranced in such a way that production models work, and it's not so tightly toleranced that it's too expensive to manufacture. (note I'm talking about tolerance, not clearance. They're different) I will say that it's a long way between buying the stuff and being able to make quality builds. |
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The first step is gaining about 5 years (minimum) experience setting up and cutting metal. It requires the experience to know what tooling is needed and what machines do the job the best. Getting the machines is the second step. The third step is the tooling needed, including hold down fixtures, etc. Some you will have to make. By that time, you should know how to make your own programs, so off the shelf ones are not needed. Too, if there were off the shelf programs, you still don't know what tooling is required by that particular program. For instance, is a particular cut to be made by a 3/4 inch endmill, or a 5/8 one. Without an understanding of the program and offsets, you won't know. Also unknown to you is what is the point of reference for each tool and how is the offset defined.
If you want to make an occasional gun from scratch, you might be better off with conventional machine tools. The tooling is cheaper too. |
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Quoted:
I was wondering ... If I had the correct CNC machines If I had access to a supply of the right metals If I knew how to run the machines ... Could I go out and buy the software to make a 1911, N frame smith or some other all metal gun? Just wondering .... Yeah totally. 4-5 hours tops. You'll be awash in bobtails and single stacks. |
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Been doing machining for awhile. Self taught.
Am I a Machinist? No. Not no, but heck no. Learn something new every time I get on the machines. Learning curve at times, can be expensive. The feeds and speeds thing usually is the hard part. Tooling costs are no fun either. Measurement skills are a pre-requisite. I do that kind of thing for a living. 17 years now. It takes a lot of time and practice to start making good parts. At least, that has been my experience. If you have the money laying around, I say go for it. Still, a lot more unknown variables one will run across when working with metal. You will need to also be good at other skills as well. I can`t knock anyone for wanting to try something new OP. There is a lot more going on behind the scenes to do what you are asking about. |
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Dudes. note I said IF I knew how to run them! I just be a curios kind of guy .... Quoted:
Quoted:
Its just not that simple, do you really think you can go out and buy Machines and material and then go to office max and buy ''gun making software'' and start producing guns? Dudes. note I said IF I knew how to run them! I just be a curios kind of guy .... You could build your own stinger missiles, cell phone cases, fireplace utensils, padlocks, nuts and bolts and washers, pistons, chairs, toilet valves and jet engines. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Quoted: The software you seek is called MasterCAM. CAM = Computer Animated Machining. It isn't cheap. Also, you can draft up whatever you like in it. If you learn how to use it you can mill out pretty much whatever type of gun you like. HSM express would do it, and do it a helluvalot easier than mastercam...and it's free. I'd want a nice wedm to do some of the features on a 1911 frame. BTW CAM = Computer aided manufacturing. |
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Figured I'd chime in on this....
To make a 1911 you will need CAM that is able to perform 3D toolpaths. HSM Express, while free, is only 2.5D. You need to purchase the full version of HSMWorks, and you need Solidworks. I've been using HSMWorks since long before they were bought out by Autodesk. It's a good package. Expect to lay out $10k for the 3D version, along with the $4k purchase of Solidworks itself. Delcam also has a free 2.5D CAM for Solidworks - which to me sucks compared to HSM, but to each his own....again, to do a 1911, I'd be looking at the ability to do 3D toolpaths with a ball mill for finishing non-planar surfaces. As for a machine - the alloys required to make a 1911 should be made on a boxed way machine IMO...flame me for this if you want. A 4th axis will help immensely. I have an 07/02 FFL started as a hobby to use my CNC equipment I own for my "real" job. I am no machinist either....self taught. Currently have a 4 axis VMC that I've had for about 5 years, and a live tooling turning center I just purchased that I am learning as we speak. As an example - I did a billet AR lower. Yeah, you can download 3D files from the webz....but 99% of those are forgings. The files (if you are lucky enough to get native files) must be manipulated in order to manufacture the piece in a CNC machine rather than in a press. I literally have over a hundred hours in the 3D model alone (and I have been using Solidworks for 15+ years). At the time, I did the lower with out my 4th axis, so I had to design and build fixtures and jigs, soft jaws, etc for re-gripping the part throughout the process....trying to cut a magwell successfully is extremely difficult for a non machinist lol. Same will apply to a 1911 - which is a complete assembly of multiple materials that must fit together and function smoothly....not just one chunk of billet aluminum.... I'd like to try one someday....honestly right now I don't have the time to dedicate to it - I would guess easily 10x more time than what I have into the lower, maybe more.... |
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That's a little like asking "if I knew how to play a guitar could I do a really bitchin' rendition of my favorite tune?" Quoted:
Quoted:
I was wondering ... If I had the correct CNC machines If I had access to a supply of the right metals If I knew how to run the machines ... Could I go out and buy the software to make a 1911, N frame smith or some other all metal gun? Just wondering .... That's a little like asking "if I knew how to play a guitar could I do a really bitchin' rendition of my favorite tune?" More like, if I bought all the wood and stuff and glue and fixtures and a table saw, could I build a guitar from scratch and then write and play a really bitchin' tune? |
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you can but it takes a lot of money and time. My brothers recent purchase. <a href="http://s542.photobucket.com/user/jm0502/media/20140505_121433_zpsfcb2633b.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i542.photobucket.com/albums/gg415/jm0502/20140505_121433_zpsfcb2633b.jpg</a> what I program and run at work using worknc  http://youtu.be/eMM4EhtPYLEGood video. Is that a part for an injection mold or a die? I program/run a FPT Dino with Tebis CADCAM. We build injection molds. |
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Quoted: 1911 prints are easy to find . . . the M16 TDP is also out there on the interwebz Quoted: Quoted: Unless it's out of patent, maybe somebody has drawn one and posted the files on the net. 1911 prints are easy to find . . . the M16 TDP is also out there on the interwebz Why am I just now hearing this?!?! Tell me where now...hurry up...take my money!  |
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Sorry..as to OP's question, the first thing you should do is get Solidworks (student licenses are available, get a demo do what you have to to do to get it, it is industry standard) and become comfortable with it, basic sketching and extrusions etc. From there you can use CAM plug-ins to generate your G-Code. You will have to intervene and debug at every step in the process. That skill takes time to develop. |
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Yeah totally. 4-5 hours tops. You'll be awash in bobtails and single stacks. Quoted:
Quoted:
I was wondering ... If I had the correct CNC machines If I had access to a supply of the right metals If I knew how to run the machines ... Could I go out and buy the software to make a 1911, N frame smith or some other all metal gun? Just wondering .... Yeah totally. 4-5 hours tops. You'll be awash in bobtails and single stacks.
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you can but it takes a lot of money and time. My brothers recent purchase. <a href="http://s542.photobucket.com/user/jm0502/media/20140505_121433_zpsfcb2633b.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i542.photobucket.com/albums/gg415/jm0502/20140505_121433_zpsfcb2633b.jpg</a> what I program and run at work using worknc http://youtu.be/eMM4EhtPYLEIn your video, what is the cost of the cutter bit? |
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I'll tell you, I've been a machinist for 12 years and I certainly do not think I could buy a mill and start churning out gun frames the next day.
I've played with modeling just a little and it's not an easy task. Programming for a mill isn't something I'm even close to ready for. I can program simple stuff in a text editor for lathes but I get lost in threading pretty easily. The guys who make a business out of firearms parts usually didn't start out as just curious to machining. They really know what they are doing with programming a machine and have years of hands on experience with the equipment. |
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That's right ! LOL
Let me see if i can fix it This is the direct link http://vid151.photobucket.com/albums/s134/danster302/Videos/IMGP0123_zps99608b35.mp4 This is the IMG link http://vid151.photobucket.com/albums/s134/danster302/Videos/IMGP0123_zps99608b35.mp4 somebody please fix it . At work and busy |