Posted: 6/13/2012 4:39:15 PM EDT
|
So I am now (sadly and hopefully temporarily) unemployed. While I do the whole job search thing, and go to the gym to keep sane, I am still left with a lot of spare time, so I thought I would try to make good use of it and learn some stuff. As it is, I spend 4 hours in the morning doing job search stuff, go to the gym and then come home to TV boredom. I would rather do something more useful.
One thing that I didnt get to play wth at work was XML. It appears to be more and more common and popular, and some familiarity would be useful on the job hunt. Plus I like learning stuff. Does anyone have a recommendation for a good 'Teach Yourself' book for XML? Or some similar resource? I dont expect to become an expert or anything, but I would like to gain a working familiarity with it. |
|
http://w3schools.com/ ?
Much of it may be 'boring' but it has useful information I've found in the past? I'll try to find some more sites for you. |
|
Um, XML sucks. No reason to learn it unless there's a company that for some reason really uses it allot.
I code daily in several languages and I have avoided XML for years thus far with better solutions. Sometimes it's unavoidable though. I like working in open source software, XML tends to be more enterprise based. |
|
Quoted:
http://w3schools.com/ ? Much of it may be 'boring' but it has useful information I've found in the past? I'll try to find some more sites for you. W3schools aka w3fools....don't learn from this website! They are not associated with the w3c in any shape or form! |
|
as for books I have no idea, as I have only used XML sparingly in one class, a Web dev w/ Java course. I bet Amazon has some cheap used textbooks if you're interested
But this site: http://w3schools.com/xml/default.asp has helped me with SQL, HTML, etc. 
ETA: Well, if a pro says that's a waste, then I'd go with what he said. OP find a good book on web development and learn all about markup languages. |
|
Really not a whole lot to learn regarding XML. It is just data with descriptive tags around the data, and the XML usually has a schema that defines a properly formatted xml. So you would have something like: <TranType>Query</TranType> <DataBaseName>Widgets</DataBaseName> <TableName>WidgetSales</TableName> etc... A tag like this means no data for that tag: <ColumnName/> A schema would define the valid tags names for this xml document, and the order, repeating, etc of the tags. |
|
Quoted:
Really not a whole lot to learn regarding XML. It is just data with descriptive tags around the data, and the XML usually has a schema that defines a properly formatted xml. So you would have something like: <TranType>Query</TranType> <DataBaseName>Widgets</DataBaseName> <TableName>WidgetSales</TableName> etc... A tag like this means no data for that tag: <ColumnName/> A schema would define the valid tags names for this xml document, and the order, repeating, etc of the tags. This. XML is really more of a framework for defining a way to transmit data. By itself it has no real meaning. |
|
Quoted:
Really not a whole lot to learn regarding XML. It is just data with descriptive tags around the data, and the XML usually has a schema that defines a properly formatted xml. So you would have something like: <TranType>Query</TranType> <DataBaseName>Widgets</DataBaseName> <TableName>WidgetSales</TableName> etc... A tag like this means no data for that tag: <ColumnName/> A schema would define the valid tags names for this xml document, and the order, repeating, etc of the tags. OK, so not really all that hideously different than HTML to some extent. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
Really not a whole lot to learn regarding XML. It is just data with descriptive tags around the data, and the XML usually has a schema that defines a properly formatted xml. So you would have something like: <TranType>Query</TranType> <DataBaseName>Widgets</DataBaseName> <TableName>WidgetSales</TableName> etc... A tag like this means no data for that tag: <ColumnName/> A schema would define the valid tags names for this xml document, and the order, repeating, etc of the tags. OK, so not really all that hideously different than HTML to some extent. HTML is XML. |
|
Quoted:
Um, XML sucks. No reason to learn it unless there's a company that for some reason really uses it allot. I code daily in several languages and I have avoided XML for years thus far with better solutions. Sometimes it's unavoidable though. I like working in open source software, XML tends to be more enterprise based. The XML thing was just based on a few days of filling out applications - lots of job listings look for some XML knowledge. In reality I was a SQL database guy and designer; those are also in demand but I think employers are probably looking for folks with a wider knoweldge set, even if in reality most of it is never used. |
|
Quoted: I work on several enterprise java apps, all the transactions are xml format that we use.Quoted: Um, XML sucks. No reason to learn it unless there's a company that for some reason really uses it allot. I code daily in several languages and I have avoided XML for years thus far with better solutions. Sometimes it's unavoidable though. I like working in open source software, XML tends to be more enterprise based. The XML thing was just based on a few days of filling out applications - lots of job listings look for some XML knowledge. In reality I was a SQL database guy and designer; those are also in demand but I think employers are probably looking for folks with a wider knoweldge set, even if in reality most of it is never used. |
|
SOAP rides on XML messages. And SOAP is still the cornerstone of enterprise grade web services.
Learn XSLT transforms, learn Schema Definition (XSD / WSDL) learn REST (not XML, but the current web services standard it seems ) And there is nothing wrong with using w3schools as a resource / reference. I use that site all the time. WSDL Tutorial Another tutorial on WSDL XSL Schema Definition Tutorial |
|
Quoted:
SOAP rides on XML messages. And SOAP is still the cornerstone of enterprise grade web services. Learn XSLT transforms, learn Schema Definition (XSD / WSDL) learn REST (not XML, but the current web services standard it seems ) And there is nothing wrong with using w3schools as a resource / reference. I use that site all the time. WSDL Tutorial Another tutorial on WSDL XSL Schema Definition Tutorial I've totally abandoned XML Web Services in mobile. JSON is where it is at. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
SOAP rides on XML messages. And SOAP is still the cornerstone of enterprise grade web services. Learn XSLT transforms, learn Schema Definition (XSD / WSDL) learn REST (not XML, but the current web services standard it seems ) And there is nothing wrong with using w3schools as a resource / reference. I use that site all the time. WSDL Tutorial Another tutorial on WSDL XSL Schema Definition Tutorial I've totally abandoned XML Web Services in mobile. JSON is where it is at. Uhh.... Enterprise Web Services (exchanging large amounts of structured data between systems) is a bit different than talking to a browser on a phone. |
|
Quoted:
SOAP rides on XML messages. And SOAP is still the cornerstone of enterprise grade web services. Learn XSLT transforms, learn Schema Definition (XSD / WSDL) learn REST (not XML, but the current web services standard it seems ) And there is nothing wrong with using w3schools as a resource / reference. I use that site all the time. WSDL Tutorial Another tutorial on WSDL XSL Schema Definition Tutorial Quoting this one because it mirrors my own experience with XML, OP. SOAP is very handy at times. Think of it like regex; a solution for few problems, but an excellent solution for those problems. As to the contention that HTML is XML, that's not really true. XHTML is XML, HTML is just HTML. XML is a format specification for designing a document with entirely custom tags. HTML is instead a language specification that has certain format specifications unique to it and also consists largely of a fixed library of predefined tags. Read that line again very carefully. If you start looking at example docs of each, you'll quickly see how they differ. One clear difference in their format specifications is that HTML allows tags to stand alone without being closed, such as: <br> XML on the other hand requires that all tags be closed, and for some reason standalone tags require a space before the closing slash, so the XHTML equivalent of the above is: <br /> And XML itself neither knows nor cares what "br" is or means. XML is just the format specification, so as long as "br" is properly enclosed in a tag and properly nested in an XML-compliant hierarchy in a file with a directive tag which states the XML version and such, it's fine and proper XML. EVEN IF NOTHING ON EARTH COULD POSSIBLY USE IT. And w3schools has nice coverage of basic tutorial-ey stuff. It won't make you a guru, but, combined with self-exercises and demos, it will get you up to speed on the basics. I'll refer you to this thread for tips on how to teach yourself a language or technology: http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_124/1278396_Best_way_to_learn_a_programming_language_C___C____Java__Python__VBA_.html Good luck! |
|
Quoted:
I've totally abandoned XML Web Services in mobile. JSON is where it is at. I would too if I could write both ends. But's that's never the case. Hell if I could control all the shit I get from customers I'd have to start way back before we ever get to XML. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve the problem, use more. LOL. My favorite quote about XML -> AAAAAH, IT BURNS!!!! I had a buddy who once took it upon himself to learn XML, departing on that adventure with the comment, "eXcrutiating Migraine Looming". Interestingly, XML itself is fairly straightforward. Making use of it, on the other hand, is quite nuanced, and requires familiarity with SOAP or equivalent XML-parsing API's in the framework of your choice. If you've ever done any DOM navigation, OP, you'll have a sense of what you're into. "Find all top-level nodes named Fred", "for each Fred, find each sub-node named Charlie", "for each Charlie in each Fred, find attribute Aardvark", etc. Plus type conversion and stuff, and, when sending, character escaping. It's really not rocket science, though there are a lot of ways to screw up and cause exponentially poor performance. |
|
Quoted:
XML is a format specification for designing a document with entirely custom tags. That's a good start. But you don't truly understand XML until you hear someone tell you that the fact that the XML you generated is valid has nothing to do with the fact that it breaks their parser. I heard that one from the #1 real estate site in the world. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
XML is a format specification for designing a document with entirely custom tags. That's a good start. But you don't truly understand XML until you hear someone tell you that the fact that the XML you generated is valid has nothing to do with the fact that it breaks their parser. I heard that one from the #1 real estate site in the world. Hence the addition of "EVEN IF NOTHING ON EARTH COULD POSSIBLY USE IT", lol. I'd give the OP a simile, except none leaps to mind. Maybe teaching a child how to mail envelopes. All the rules about where to put the stamp, how to seal the envelope, how to format the address and where to place it, how to weigh it and determine postage, that'd be like XML. But actually sending a letter to someone requires more; you have to have an address that's correct, and the contents of the envelope have to be something the recipient can read and make use of. There's nothing preventing you from sending a perfectly valid, yet completely empty, XML string to absolutely nobody. It's just a format specification. And, by that example, HTML would be more like filing an income tax return. Yes, it kind of involves mailing something, but even then you might be using a standardized envelope that you just fill out the return address on and stamp. So it's really only very peripherally related to XML. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
XML is a format specification for designing a document with entirely custom tags. That's a good start. But you don't truly understand XML until you hear someone tell you that the fact that the XML you generated is valid has nothing to do with the fact that it breaks their parser. I heard that one from the #1 real estate site in the world. Hence the addition of "EVEN IF NOTHING ON EARTH COULD POSSIBLY USE IT", lol. I'd give the OP a simile, except none leaps to mind. Maybe teaching a child how to mail envelopes. All the rules about where to put the stamp, how to seal the envelope, how to format the address and where to place it, how to weigh it and determine postage, that'd be like XML. But actually sending a letter to someone requires more, you have to have an address that's correct, and the contents of the envelope have to be something the recipient can read and make use of. And, by that example, HTML would be more like filing an income tax return. Yes, it kind of involves mailing something in, but even then you might be using a standardized envelope that you just fill out the return address on and stamp. So it's really only very peripherally related to XML. Yep, I know what you mean. CSB: I heard that after I wrapped a node value containing html in cdata tags. Sorry, no cdata tags because our parser doesn't know what they are. This started when I included data in a node that broke their parser. Then I asked what I can't put in a node, and I'll just filter it out. The answer to that was "we're not really sure" in so many words. |
| Thank you all for your replies, suggestions and links. I do appreciate it. I figure this is probably an excellent time to expand my skills a bit, and give myself something to do. I don't expect to become an experienced XML or Java coder, but having a better understanding of the basics of some other languages can only make me a better solution analyst and add some flexibility. |