Posted: 10/10/2010 7:53:18 AM EDT
| I re did a bathroom and am putting molding around the ceiling and for the life of me I can not cut the trim correctly!!!! I have a miter saw and it has the degrees on it and I can not get it right!!! All the corners are inside! What degree should I set the tilt and angle cuts at? I am getting ready to break shit!!! |
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Inside corners need to be coped. If that means cut the trim at an angel then at another angel I get that I just can't figure outbthe correct setting. I think it is 22 for the cut and 45 for the " cope" it just does not match no matter what I do. I do realize I need to move the saw to tho opposite angel for the second cut. |
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The answer above is correct, to a point. You can use a square and check to see if they are, or close to 90 deg. If so, you can cut the trim to 45deg. ( inside angle) and use caulking to fix mistakes. Trust me, if done correctly, no one will know.
ETA. Also place the trim on the saw deck the same way it will look on the wall. Then do the cut. |
| You did not mention what kind of trim, but here is a video of crown installation. It will help get your mind around what you are doing. Using short scrap practice pieces will help. Tommy |
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Coping is the answer, and you are talking about crown mould correct? You do not want to cut all 4 pieces at 45 degrees on both ends. If you do you will end up with gaps at the corners because the walls are never a true 90 degrees.
On the two short runs, cut the trim square on both ends. Depending on the length, you want the trim to snap into place, I always measure the wall and add in 1/8". Take a square, set it on a piece of trim (just as it is the wall and ceiling) and measure the height and depth of the trim as it sits on the wall. Mark the wall with the height in all 4 corners so you don't nail it up cockeyed. On the longer 2 runs, measure the wall (corner to corner). This will be your long point measurment (remember to add a smidge to make it tight) The cut. Remember the depth measurment you took? Mark that on the miter box table. This is where you will hold the trim, at the same angle it sets on the wall. The top of the trim sets ON THE TABLE while the bottom will be up on the fence. Cut the first long point at 45degrees, slide the trim down and cut the other end at 45 degrees. The long point to long point is the wall length + a smidge for fit. Ready to cope the corners? No?, well I'll tell ya anyway. Set the trim on a bucket or small stepstool, moulding side up. Take your coping saw and you want to follow the contour of the trim on the edge of your miter cut as you back-cut the material. Hold your saw at an angle into the trim. Hard to explain, but remember it has to fit with the profile of the trim already up. After this is done, go to the store and buy 4 more boards and try it again  . Seriously, get a buddy to help you hold it up. Put one end up, bend the trim outward and place the other end in place and push the middle of the board home, nail into the wall cap and studs if it has a gap. Putty, caulk, paint. Now sit back and have a beer.
This is what you are trying to accomplish, you have to picture it as looking at it from underneath as it is nailed on the wall. 
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You did not mention what kind of trim, but here is a video of crown installation. It will help get your mind around what you are doing. Using short scrap practice pieces will help. Tommy That's a good video. I do a couple of things differently. I don't cope the corners. I cut each at a 45deg upside down (and backwards is the usual saying) and 1/8-1/4 long depending on the length of the trim and but them together in the corner using a square piece of scrap and a hammer to line the pieces up tapping from the bottom against the ceiling. I will also use a square butt joint instead of a scarf joint on painted wood. The reason for both is wood moves over time as moisture goes in and out over the seasons. If you cut the trim precisely with a cope and a scarf the joints will be more visible over time. I also sand then Bondo my butt joints so they disappear. On stain grade I still miter inside corners but go to a scarf joint so that as the wood shrinks when the humidity drops the joint doesn't just open up. Another trick is to cut a straight piece of shoe molding (or whatever is light and narrow) at a length which goes most of the way across most of your walls and use that to measure against instead of trying to feed a tape measure that far out and trying to keep it from sagging and trying to get a precise read in a corner. Now you just need to run a couple of miles of the stuff and it will be easy. |
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Also, if you are using a compound miter saw you will get into a heap of trouble. Set the saw tilt at 90 degrees and just use the side to side swinging table for your cuts and do it like I said above. If you are using the engineered trim, kinda like pressboard with a vinyl coating, or oak I suggest drilling pilot holes. If you are using pine, e.g fingergrooved pine, then nail away. Good luck.
If you really want to cheat, use corner blocks in all four corners. Then it is a simple 90 degree cut on every piece of trim. |
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They have corner angle finders at harbor freight, Home Depot etc. http://www.cut-and-install-crown-molding.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/cnc_diagram_measure.gif That is a handy tool to have, but it won't really help him much because he'needs to cut compound miters when istalling crown mold. My old Makita miter saw had a chart riveted to the front which clearly showed all the correct angles to set on the respective miter and bevel cuts for both the right and left sides of two different kinds of crown mold. And for inside corners AND outside corners for both. It's a pretty complex chart. It's now mostly worn off or I'd post a pic. |
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They have corner angle finders at harbor freight, Home Depot etc. http://www.cut-and-install-crown-molding.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/cnc_diagram_measure.gif That is a handy tool to have, but it won't really help him much because he'needs to cut compound miters when istalling crown mold. My old Makita miter saw had a chart riveted to the front which clearly showed all the correct angles to set on the respective miter and bevel cuts for both the right and left sides of two different kinds of crown mold. And for inside corners AND outside corners for both. It's a pretty complex chart. It's now mostly worn off or I'd post a pic. Don't the mouldings have flat spots that face the wall and ceiling? If so, with a taller subfence you should be able to clamp it to the miter as installed and only cut one angle. |
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They have corner angle finders at harbor freight, Home Depot etc. http://www.cut-and-install-crown-molding.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/cnc_diagram_measure.gif That is a handy tool to have, but it won't really help him much because he'needs to cut compound miters when istalling crown mold. My old Makita miter saw had a chart riveted to the front which clearly showed all the correct angles to set on the respective miter and bevel cuts for both the right and left sides of two different kinds of crown mold. And for inside corners AND outside corners for both. It's a pretty complex chart. It's now mostly worn off or I'd post a pic. Don't the mouldings have flat spots that face the wall and ceiling? If so, with a taller subfence you should be able to clamp it to the miter as installed and only cut one angle. Yes, there are flats on most crown moldings. And some of the bigger new miter saws have tall fences which allow one to do exactly that. I personally haven't used one yet, though. |
| I have installed crown moulding in every room of my house. I cut the ends on my miter saw using only the 45deg cut. and dod not cope any corner. I did cut some ends slightly long.....just enough for a press fit without bowing the trim board in the center. I haven't had any cracks appear and the trim has been up for about 8yrs. Try cutting a test piece. by placing the trim against the fence so the flats are against the fence and saw table and cut a 45deg angle. when you make the cut with the blade angled toward the right the long side of the angle will be facing right. When you try the piece on your ceiling the long side will face left. I had never cut crown before and it took some practice before I figured out the relationship of the ends. If you can cope (I can't) it will be a little easier. |
| I have always painted trim and crown molding because of this. Caulk will hide just about anything, when you are using stained trim, just get corner blocks! Another thing to keep in mind is the fact that no one will really notice small stuff like this. You are always your worst critic... |
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measure your corner angles, they're almost never square.
Cut crown moulding upside down and backwards on a miter saw. use a piece of moulding scrap to test-position the material on the saw so it sits at the proper angle. Mark your saw base with pencil or tape so you can carefully position your material before cutting, to get the best fit. Use nailing blocks particularly if working alone, to aid in positioning your moulding when nailing. And if using MDF mouldings, a little gap is easy to fix with your finger, a bucket of pre-mixed drywall mud, and a damp sponge. In fact the look of the whole install will be improved by backfilling top and bottom and corner gaps with mud, before repainting the whole room. eta some pics I used nailing blocks to aid in mounting the stuff. Was using some heavy 6"W MDF crown, 12' lengths. Really needed soemthing to brace them up so I could hold them up with one hand while weilding a brad nailer with the other. The blocks were screwed to the top sill at a diagonal. 
Here it is, up. I stripped the popcorn ceiling first, as well as using a pad sander on the wall texture above a measured and marked line on the wall. 
Here's the drywall mud worked into the slight gaps. Couple coats of thick paint would do the same thing. 
And a couple finished shots. Painted the crown the same color as the ceiling, several shades lighter than the walls.  
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