[ARCHIVED THREAD] - COPS on Camera (Page 1 of 4)
Posted: 9/16/2010 8:13:32 AM EDT
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I thought this video provided a great little insight into the argument.
(maybe someone could post the video up since i cant figure out how) Cops on Camera |
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I have no issue with anyone recording me. I have an issue with wearing a camera on my uniform for my entire shift. and you know I used to try to wear a helmet cam when i rock climbed and man i can tell you first hand, however cool that shit is (and its fun to see afterwords) they are a pain in the ass to deal with, especially with ropes and shit all over the place dangling on the side of a cliff. So I can completely understand your position....... its just unfortunate how this is becoming such an issue lately that they are now considering it a option to combat such injustices......... however, something tells me that we would have a lot less problems |
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I have no issue with anyone recording me. I have an issue with wearing a camera on my uniform for my entire shift. and you know I used to try to wear a helmet cam when i rock climbed and man i can tell you first hand, however cool that shit is (and its fun to see afterwords) they are a pain in the ass to deal with, especially with ropes and shit all over the place dangling on the side of a cliff. So I can completely understand your position....... its just unfortunate how this is becoming such an issue lately that they are now considering it a option to combat such injustices......... however, something tells me that we would have a lot less problems I'm actually less concerned with the gear itself. I know they are making some pretty high speed, light weight, small stuff these days. I'm more concerned with the officer being judged by what his camera shows when it comes to use of force. Cameras don't capture everything. I also know for a fact it's going to slow down guys OODA loop knowing the camera is there. Besides, do you guys really want video of me peeing behind dumpsters at night? 
If people want cameras on cops to hold them accountable for use of force I don't think that's the answer. Cops that use force correctly : 80% Cops that abuse use of force and need to be weeded out : 2% Cops that don't use enough force or use it improperly (on the softer side) : 18% No science in the above comment. Just personal experience. |
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Considering the impact police actions have on a persons life, and the technology available, I believe that PVRs should be a requirement, especially for dynamic entry teams. This right here- beat cops, etc I think a dash cam does just fine. But for the SWAT teams these should become a requirement. |
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Considering the impact police actions have on a persons life, and the technology available, I believe that PVRs should be a requirement, especially for dynamic entry teams. This right here- beat cops, etc I think a dash cam does just fine. But for the SWAT teams these should become a requirement. I agree one 100%, it should be mandatory for any entry team. |
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Considering the impact police actions have on a persons life, and the technology available, I believe that PVRs should be a requirement, especially for dynamic entry teams. This right here- beat cops, etc I think a dash cam does just fine. But for the SWAT teams these should become a requirement. I agree one 100%, it should be mandatory for any entry team. Yup. I think patrolmen in high crime areas should have them as well. |
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You can have one of the following: 1) Constant oversight of police actions 2) Effective police work. Pick one. Disagree. Our cameras vindicate the cops _far_ more often than they reveal problems. Cameras are great for agencies whose bread and butter are set piece car stops. |
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Yup. I think patrolmen in high crime areas should have them as well. 
But not the bedroom community guys?  Little return on expense and maintenance. In high crime areas the video would be used much more making the investment worthwhile. WTF is so funny? |
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You can have one of the following: 1) Constant oversight of police actions 2) Effective police work. Pick one. Disagree. Our cameras vindicate the cops _far_ more often than they reveal problems. In car cameras are there to record racial profiling data. Admin and the public use them for more than that. |
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Yup. I think patrolmen in high crime areas should have them as well.
But not the bedroom community guys? Little return on expense and maintenance. In high crime areas the video would be used much more making the investment worthwhile. WTF is so funny? Your knowledge of police work. |
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Yup. I think patrolmen in high crime areas should have them as well.
But not the bedroom community guys? Little return on expense and maintenance. In high crime areas the video would be used much more making the investment worthwhile. WTF is so funny? Your knowledge of police work. How many of you super-geniuses am I going to run into today. You're right, no one knows about cop-work 'cept cops, cause your public service is all secretive and shit and there hasn't been a single live action COPS show on for 20 years, and the papers NEVER write about cops, and regular people don't know cops or work with cops, or have ever trained cops........ JEBUS! I get it, you don't like cameras......or people who want more cameras. Whatever.
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How many of you super-geniuses am I going to run into today. Hopefully more. Quoted:
You're right, no one knows about cop-work 'cept cops, cause your public service is all secretive and shit and there hasn't been a single live action COPS show on for 20 years, and the papers NEVER write about cops, and regular people don't know cops or work with cops, or have ever trained cops........ Stop watching TV. Go ride out with us. Quoted:
JEBUS! Jesus Quoted:
I get it, you don't like cameras......or people who want more cameras. Whatever.
Cameras are fine. The application and use of them is not always fine. I like everyone. |
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You can have one of the following: 1) Constant oversight of police actions 2) Effective police work. Pick one. Dont take this the wrong way, i have alot of respect for you from the postings you make here. But, why not both? I can see how you/me may not like it, but if he helps a good guy stay clear of trouble why not? If it shows a bad officer being bad, well good kick him off the force and keep the departments name clean. I see this as only help, everyone is held accountable, the citizen and the officer. If the individual is doing his job correctly he should have nothing to worry about. We are creatures of habit, and we dont like change this is what's steaming from this whole video tape everything. |
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How many of you super-geniuses am I going to run into today. Hopefully more. Quoted:
You're right, no one knows about cop-work 'cept cops, cause your public service is all secretive and shit and there hasn't been a single live action COPS show on for 20 years, and the papers NEVER write about cops, and regular people don't know cops or work with cops, or have ever trained cops........ Stop watching TV. Go ride out with us. Quoted:
JEBUS! Jesus Quoted:
I get it, you don't like cameras......or people who want more cameras. Whatever.
Cameras are fine. The application and use of them is not always fine. I like everyone. I don't get why you felt like you need to imply I was ignorant of police work to get that point across. But ok. Cameras in low crime areas are an expense that just doesn't make sense. In high crime areas it would be one more witness. Distracting applications notwithstanding it would be a better investment. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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You can have one of the following: 1) Constant oversight of police actions 2) Effective police work. Pick one. Dont take this the wrong way, i have alot of respect for you from the postings you make here. But, why not both? I can see how you/me may not like it, but if he helps a good guy stay clear of trouble why not? If it shows a bad officer being bad, well good kick him off the force and keep the departments name clean. I see this as only help, everyone is held accountable, the citizen and the officer. If the individual is doing his job correctly he should have nothing to worry about. We are creatures of habit, and we dont like change this is what's steaming from this whole video tape everything. The problem is that people don't want to see what has to be done in order to effectively police some areas. For instance - most departments do not permit their officers to curse at people. However, in certain areas of this country, grabbing a citizen by the shirt and telling them to get the fuck off the corner or go to jail, is the only way to effectively communicate with that element. Also, a videotape of a police officer effectively using force looks very one sided, as it should. However, people will cry "police brutality" if they see that videotape - they have some strange notion of a "fair fight" despite the fact that police work is not a boxing match. The Rodney King incident showed that much of the American public does not want to see what must be done to keep certain areas in check. |
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Cameras in low crime areas are an expense that just doesn't make sense. In high crime areas it would be one more witness. Distracting applications notwithstanding it would be a better investment. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Are you for removing in car video from low crime area squad cars? That would save a ton of money. |
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If that was the only choice to enhance the operatins in high crime areas, sure. I doubt that's necessary though.
Another comment states the population would be shocked at police actions in high crime areas, I believe america would benefit and become very opposed to the hood rat actions if they were broadcast more often. Garnering more support for police. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Another comment states the population would be shocked at police actions in high crime areas, I believe america would benefit and become very opposed to the hood rat actions if they were broadcast more often. Garnering more support for police. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile I would like to think so but unfortunately the nicer general public doesn't get to see the night in and night out visits to these areas. The fact that we know our "hood rats" by name and date of birth. The fact that we have fought the same guy 5 times in the last month. The fact that he threatened our lives and our family on the way to jail the last time we arrested him. All of that aside, the public doesn't like seeing the above described "hood rat" punched in the face when he pulled away from an officer on a street corner through the lens of a cell phone camera. |
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You can have one of the following: 1) Constant oversight of police actions 2) Effective police work. Pick one. Dont take this the wrong way, i have alot of respect for you from the postings you make here. But, why not both? I can see how you/me may not like it, but if he helps a good guy stay clear of trouble why not? If it shows a bad officer being bad, well good kick him off the force and keep the departments name clean. I see this as only help, everyone is held accountable, the citizen and the officer. If the individual is doing his job correctly he should have nothing to worry about. We are creatures of habit, and we dont like change this is what's steaming from this whole video tape everything. The problem is that people don't want to see what has to be done in order to effectively police some areas. For instance - most departments do not permit their officers to curse at people. However, in certain areas of this country, grabbing a citizen by the shirt and telling them to get the fuck off the corner or go to jail, is the only way to effectively communicate with that element. Also, a videotape of a police officer effectively using force looks very one sided, as it should. However, people will cry "police brutality" if they see that videotape - they have some strange notion of a "fair fight" despite the fact that police work is not a boxing match. The Rodney King incident showed that much of the American public does not want to see what must be done to keep certain areas in check. And i understand, and i dont mind. I know sometimes you have to slap someone to get them pay attention. The only reason i say i am for it, is for times when shit goes south, like the Vegas shooting, the no knock rain in GA that looks like the Officer had a ND. Stuff like that. Rules would have to be made, this tapes are only review once a complaint is made, or severe bodly injure/death occours. Heck if you have to smack a deab beat around to teach him a lesson im all for that. |
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You can have one of the following: 1) Constant oversight of police actions 2) Effective police work. Pick one. http://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n181/nb2214/36_1.jpg |
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Quoted: Quoted: You can have one of the following: 1) Constant oversight of police actions 2) Effective police work. Pick one. 1 Option 1 please. And define exactly who option 2 will be effective for? LE should be just as cognizant of the laws that they are enforcing upon the populace. And held to the same letter of the law. For, like it or not, they are mere citizens of the same country that is governed by laws. So, IMHO, when Officer Smiley is thinking about his own actions, and the consequences as they effect him/her, then you will have more effective police work. |
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I have no issue with anyone recording me. I have an issue with wearing a camera on my uniform for my entire shift. Oh come on don't you want us all to see when you have to take a leak or blow your nose, and if they have sound we can hear you burp and sneeze. 
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Yup. I think patrolmen in high crime areas should have them as well.
But not the bedroom community guys? I get more complaints from our upscale/nicer neighborhoods than I do the ghetto. I make sure my audio/video is running anytime I speak to anyone for that very reason. Another patrolman on my shift bought a PVR for himself and it's actually come in handy a few times. |
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You can have one of the following: 1) Constant oversight of police actions 2) Effective police work. Pick one. You said in another thread that you believed most of your department would quit if they were forced to wear cameras. In a thread before that you said that you would let a suspect go if you didnt have legal grounds to search their vehicle. You said many other officers wouldnt. If I could search, I'd find the thread. |
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Quoted: You can have one of the following: 1) Constant oversight of police actions 2) Effective police work. Pick one. How does the camera interfere with police effectiveness? Are the police being more effective by breaking the law? understandably a person would prefer not to be under constant surveillance, but many of us not in law enforcement already are. And it seems to me that with the culture of police hate and 'my baby din do nuffin" and a lawsuit crazy portion of society the cameras might be more help than hindrance |
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The great thing is the technology is getting really small and really cheap. These Spy Pens are less than $20 delivered. Nobody gives it a second look clipped in your shirt, but when the cop starts doing crazy rights-violating shit or some guy in Wal-Mart has his drunken girlfriend in the shopping basket you can just give the top button a tap and record it all for Youtube posting later.
I carry mine around every day (it's actually a pen that writes) and when I think something interesting is going to happen, I hit the button. So far I haven't had any bad run-ins with JBTs, but if I do you'll see it here. And the best part is stealth. Nobody sees - and reacts badly - to a camera. Hell, I may actually be looking in another direction leading the video subject to believe I'm not even interested in them. But they're still in the field of view. 
So that's all we're talking - $20 for a cheap one, up to maybe $100 for a real nice HD recorder. That's cheap insurance when you're up in front of the judge and it's only your word against the cop's. |
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You can have one of the following: 1) Constant oversight of police actions 2) Effective police work. Pick one. Dont take this the wrong way, i have alot of respect for you from the postings you make here. But, why not both? I can see how you/me may not like it, but if he helps a good guy stay clear of trouble why not? If it shows a bad officer being bad, well good kick him off the force and keep the departments name clean. I see this as only help, everyone is held accountable, the citizen and the officer. If the individual is doing his job correctly he should have nothing to worry about. We are creatures of habit, and we dont like change this is what's steaming from this whole video tape everything. The problem is that people don't want to see what has to be done in order to effectively police some areas. For instance - most departments do not permit their officers to curse at people. However, in certain areas of this country, grabbing a citizen by the shirt and telling them to get the fuck off the corner or go to jail, is the only way to effectively communicate with that element. Also, a videotape of a police officer effectively using force looks very one sided, as it should. However, people will cry "police brutality" if they see that videotape - they have some strange notion of a "fair fight" despite the fact that police work is not a boxing match. The Rodney King incident showed that much of the American public does not want to see what must be done to keep certain areas in check. And i understand, and i dont mind. I know sometimes you have to slap someone to get them pay attention. The only reason i say i am for it, is for times when shit goes south, like the Vegas shooting, the no knock rain in GA that looks like the Officer had a ND. Stuff like that. Rules would have to be made, this tapes are only review once a complaint is made, or severe bodly injure/death occours. Heck if you have to smack a deab beat around to teach him a lesson im all for that. Police are on the street to enforce the law. A deadbeat could be you or me if the officer decided we were. |
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We did this thread a couple of days ago.
Personally it wouldn't bother me except I wouldn't want it rolling the whole shift. I love my digital video system when I'm assigned to a vehicle that has one. The problem is bulk, recording time, batteries and it needs to be mil spec. |
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problem is when it would be helpful to have a camera, the only other witness is dead. Even if we did install camera on all cops, how often would an important piece of video evidence go missing due to a technical error?  My state of art digital video system screws up all the time. My older actual video tape system has it's own mind. |
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Yup. I think patrolmen in high crime areas should have them as well.
But not the bedroom community guys? I get more complaints from our upscale/nicer neighborhoods than I do the ghetto. I make sure my audio/video is running anytime I speak to anyone for that very reason. Another patrolman on my shift bought a PVR for himself and it's actually come in handy a few times. Could be those people may be a little better educated on the law and want to make sure thier rights are not being violated. I applaud them. Roy |
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Not a bad idea considering how things are..... The TBL wouldn't have to "rat" on their own,the camera would do it for them in order to get rid of the undesirables. Suspects and their SO's could no longer lie on the LEO, the whole incident would be on camera. LEO could prove shoots were justified if needed. Officers would be be able to do quality FACTUAL AAR reports using said video as teaching tool.
For the citizens....No more BS rights infringements by LEO. Shooting would have video proof of LEO actions recorded NOT REPORTED (there is a difference). Leo attitude towards the average joe would likely improve (no more officer asshole at the roadside). LEO actions would be on record for examination by lawyers in cases involving officer misconduct. Actual crooks would be caught "red-handed" hopefully decreasing plea deals and increasing prison terms for those that need to be there. Less bullshit for lawyers to pull out of the hat to make a case that cost ALL taxepayers involvled in that area. In short in could cut out all the "he said, she said" BS and leave nothing but the facts.FOR BOTH SIDES....!!!! |
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Look atthe dashcam video of the Duluth, MN. shooting of a 17yr. old who was going after LEO with a bat..... Cop even retreated to get away from the kid, got his windshield smashed, and told the kid to drop it before kid was shot.
Kid pursued LEO, attacking with bat (all caught on tape), smashed windshield and driver's side window and was warned (Clearly) to knock the BS off. LEO in this situation did everything humanly possible to de-escalate the situation until he was out of options. The camera is unbiased....the kid got popped because was in the act of assault and refused to quit .....simple.. = good shoot. |
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I have no issue with anyone recording me. I have an issue with wearing a camera on my uniform for my entire shift. I'd like to know how they plan to power any such camera for an entire shift. My lapel cam only has 2 hours of juice. Solar power..... Green is the way to go. 
Roy |
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I have no issue with anyone recording me. I have an issue with wearing a camera on my uniform for my entire shift. I'd like to know how they plan to power any such camera for an entire shift. My lapel cam only has 2 hours of juice. Contract it out to Aimpoint to make use of ACET tech. If they can make an M2 battery last a few YEARS then getting a camera to run for ashift shouldn't be that big of a leap.
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