Posted: 8/12/2008 2:44:18 AM EDT
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I've lost about 60 pounds over the last 6 months. I'm 6' 5" and 267 lbs. I'm in much better health and thought it's about time to work on something I've never really been able to do - namely, pullups. I found the assisted pullup machine and thought I'd counterbalance some weight off and make it look easy. Uh, no. My first attempt using only 150 pounds of body weight netted me exactly one horrible, horrible pullup. To rep 2 sets of 10, I could only pull 90 pounds of bodyweight. The next day, my upper back so was sore that running on the treadmill was hurting my upper back - that's a first for me. I'm going back this morning because I'm not as sore and it's pissing me off.  Feel free to either make fun of my weak ass or to offer advice. eta: I do overhand, wide grip. I figure this works the back more, which is what I'm going for. Narrow, unnderhand seems like it work work the biceps more and besides, isn't a pull supposed to be overhand anyway? |
Yeah, the palms should be facing away from you when doing pull ups. Palms towards you would be chin ups. You're generally going to be weaker doing pull ups vs. chin ups because pull ups don't use the biceps and pectoral muscles as much as chin ups do. Also you really don't want to have too wide of a grip as this could lead to increased possibility of shoulder or elbow injuries. |
| Not alone. Weigh 235 and set the machine to 160. it was very hard to get through the sets. Went back to 185. Figured I'd just keep at it until I started losing more weight and gain strength then can cut back on counterbalance weight. The idea is to stay motivated so make goals you can reach. I actually log all my workouts for reps and weight so you can see improvements or fine tune your workout to set the goals and attain them. Just keep at it and don't get discouraged. |
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I'll make fun of you later. Let me see if I can help you out some. 1. Keep doing them, it gets easier. Your numbers should go up pretty quickly. 2. Try them on a regular bar as soon as possible. Those machines really don't simulate the real thing. They throw off your timing, you hang differently, they just feel weird when compared to doing a real pull up or chin up. 3. Work the opposite muscles too. That means try supersetting with some overhead barbell or dumbell work. 4. Don't be afraid to do both pull ups and chins. 5. Did I say, don't quit. I'm 5'10" and weigh 215. The last time I tested myself was on my birthday, I did 19. I usually work them into my workout at least 3 times a week and sometimes 4. If you have any questions, ask away. |
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I feel you pain. Im 6'4", 250ish, and I cant do a single pullup or chinup. I suck. I will work on that tho. My goal is 5 deadhang pullups... God knows how much lifting will take to get that. Been weight training a year during my 60+ pound weight loss, so Im not *that* weak. |
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You do know, there are things you can do to help yourself in getting up to the point where you can do one pull up. Hang for time. Do this in front of a mirror. Make sure you keep your shoulders level. Pull up negatives. Jump up and then slowly let yourself down. When you can do about 5 of these, you should be able to do one pull up. I forgot this. In the beginning, try to do chins. They are easier. Keep your hands closer together. For some reason, it is easier to do them with the hands close together. Once you get to the point where you can do a couple of sets of chins then switch between chins and pull ups. Anyway, this worked for me. |
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The simplest but kind of most worthless advice is "The best way to get good at doing pullups...is do more pullups." So now that I got that out of the way, look at the 2 most important muscle groups that make up the overhand pullup. 1) Biceps- Obviously the best way to work these aside from pullups is curls or backhand curls. No problem. 2) Lats- The best way to work lats that I have found aside from overhand pullups is dips. The closer together your hands are in dips, the more tricep it uses and less lat. Further apart, more lat and less tricep. Closer together your hands, usually the easier as well. The most important part about dips to work your lats is drop down as far as you can and at the top of your rep, try and extend it as much as possible with just the lats and all of that core muscle in your shoulders and armpits. Past this, there are a lot of other muscle groups like your forearms and many other core muscles but the lats are probably the hardest. Good luck. |
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Don't be hard on yourself - everybody has to start somewhere. When I got my pullup bar I couldn't do one - now I'm up to 15, I still have some work to do. I try to do at least 100 a week without getting burned out. You may find chinups, done with the palms facing you, easier at first. These will give you basic strength to start working more pullups (palms facing away from you) into your workouts. You could get some good ideas on the web site www.dragondoor.com. They have a number of articles available on bodyweight exercises including "Pullup Training for Women" and "Grease the Groove for Strength." |
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You are not alone. There's a reason you don't see too many people doing them in the gym: they're hard as hell for most, especially for bigger guys. Use the lat pulldown machine until you're able to do a good pullup. BTW there is nothing wrong with doing chin ups, you should alternate between those and pullups. |
Dumb question, but how long as I supposed to hang for?
I have a problem because I'm too tall and that makes the pullup bar at the gym way too low. Instead, I go to the indoor basketball court and hang from the basketball frame that holds up the backboard. It's fine for jumping up and hanging from (it's about 9 1/2 feet up) but it's too high for me to jump up straight into the high position in a pullup.
I googled what an overhead barbell press is. Is there a machine for that or a similar exercise? Right now I'm in the cardio/lose weight mode mostly so I haven't been lifting much at all. But if it will help with the pullups/chinups, I'll do it. What do you think the best idea on pullups is? Drop the weight and do 3 sets of 10 or just do one set of as many as I can do, preferably at least 10? |
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Bingo, do lateral pull downs until you can get a higher weight done with sets of 10. This will help you work the required muscles and will help you get to the point where you can do pull ups or do more of them. |
Hah, great thread!
'Lose weight mode' doesn't need to be strictly a cardio thing. You can lose weight with resistance training and diet. And it just might be smarter to do so. I went from a personal best of 0 pullups to the point where I can belt out multiple sets of 15 no problem. All while dropping BF. Agree with the other posters above, Lat pulldowns, hanging, negatives, all important. Grip strength is also important. Put some extra emphasis on deadlifts, barbell rows, etc. |
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This: www.4mcd.usmc.mil/AOP/OSOHyattsville/Armstrong%20Pullup%20Program.htm I got up to about 10-12 pullups following this routine. Also, try doing pullups with added weight. It will make non-added weight pullups seem easy. Weighted pushups help too. |
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I'm making a little progress. I'm doing 100 pounds of bodyweight now. What I ended up doing is doing sets to failure (in honestly, just short of failure because I don't want to slam the weights down if I can't get back up one more time.) I try to do 2 or 3 sets each time I go to the gym. I also am doing the hang for time thing. I can hang for about 30 seconds before my grip gives out. I figure at the rate I'm going, I may be able to do one real pullup on an actual bar in a couple months. That'll be one more than I've ever done, so I don't think it's as pathetic as it initially sounds. I have a big race in January, so I'm going to set January as my goal for doing a real pullup. |
Great news! And remember, although it sounds odd, you won't have to progressively drop the 'assistance' weight down to zero. Once I got to the point that I was only using 40-60 lbs of assistance, I was then able to belt them out freestyle. Also, once you get to the point that you can do 2-4 strict pullups, you'll progress to greater reps very rapidly. At least I did. |
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I think I will start my quest for pullups on Monday in the gym. I tried some chinups last week, and I did 3 with 50 pounds of assistance, so I am close on those. Pullups werent as good. I figure some sets of pullups on the machine, with some pulldowns and pushups will get me on my way. |
I started with close grip, palms facing eachother and progressed from there. As posted before, much of the battle is hand/wrist/forearm strength and the chins will help you ramp up so that when your back is strong enough, your grip will already be solid. |
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Any excersise that works the back muscles, specifically the latissumus Dorsi, will help you get your back stronger and get you in better shape to do more pull-ups. Look here for examples of other possible excersises that will help you. Also don't keep your hands at the same distance everytime when doing pullups. For example, do as many pull-ups as you can with your palms facing outward and your hands at shoulder-width. Then rest for a minute then do as many as you can with your hands farther than shoulder-width. Then do as many as you can with your hands close. Then do chin-ups. Just doing them one way is not as beneficial as doing them a variety of ways. And just becuase you may not be able to do very many or if you get tired doesn't mean you can't keep doing pull-ups. You can do negative or assisted pull-ups. |
What are lateral pull downs? |
In regard to the article you linked to, the only way you can work the lats doing pull downs is by sitting up straight and pulling the bar down under your chin. Most people lean back and pull down to their chest. This only works the traps and rhomboids. The lats are slack. Rowing would be a better exercise, along with face pulls. |
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Thanks for this thread on the Gravitron. I read it when it first started and thought that I would give the machine a try, since chinups/pullups were impossible for me to do, despite the fact that I was in pretty decent condition. I started with 80 lbs. of assistance, did three sets of 10 reps chinups and three sets of 10 reps dips, alternating the sets. Every couple of weeks I moved to less After a couple of weeks of the 60/70/80 routine, I was actually able to do a few unassisted chinups. That was about two weeks ago. Now I am doing 5 unassisted chinups, then going to a 50/60/70 assisted routine of 10 reps each set. I also do pull downs to help my upper body strength and fairly light clean and jerks and do pushups every day. I do other routines as well, this is just what I am doing for upper body strength. I must say that being able to do unassisted chinups/pullups has been a big boost for my self esteem and my upper body is looking quite a lot better these days.  FYI I am a 58 year old male, 6' 1", 175 pounds, have lost about 35 pounds since the end of March, and run 3 to 5 hours a week.  Thanks again for the thread! |
Obviously, you have never been through one of these things. First off, you have no power, so all your stuff in the fridge and freezer is thawing out. So you have to do something. YOu have a choice of either eating it or giving it to the dogs. I know my dogs ate great during both Rita and Ike. You ever see a 40lb. mutt go through a whole salmon? Mine all gained weight. Another thing is no places are open. That means gyms too. About the only workout you can do is the chainsaw workout. Keep in mind, it is usually hotter than hell right after one of these storms. So your leg workout is dragging blown over tree parts to a pile, and your upper body workout is cutting the trees up into manageable parts. One more thing we haven't talked about is the water system being compromised. The Houston water system was compromised, and they had a boil order for about a week. Have you ever drank boiled water? Boy, it's great. It's right up there with flat warm coke. So, you have to do what is necessary because there is limited medical care, and they kinda frown on bringing your dumb ass in with just dehydration. So you drink lots of beer. What I am trying to say is all this stuff contributes to weight gain. |
Dude, I lived in North Carolina and Florida through the entire 90's and some of the 2000's....I been through plenty of Hurricanes. We drank beer and chainsaw'd alot....never put on that kind of weight...Ramen noodles heated with propain torches and plenty of boiled water. What ever you need to tell yourself 
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Stay level, keep good form and add bent over rows with the barbell...you will get stronger. I am up to 35lbs now for 4 set's of 10...I can bang out a few 45lbs..but I struggle. I still weigh 180lbs...this is pull ups, not BO rows, btw. |
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you need to work your lats and shoulders There are a ton of people who want to work out their lats and use the wrong exercise. I recommend to all the people who cant do pull ups and people I train with, to do bent over lateral rows. This has to be done correctly otherwise you'll end up working your rear delts / shoulders. Trick is to keep the barbell as close to your legs as possible. Use a supinated grip and pull the bar to your mid stomach. Then the standard lateral pull down and close grip pull down. HEAVY weight for high reps. For shoulders you need to do exercises that focus on isolation of that muscle. To make sure you are going to get proper symmetry do the majority of exercises one handed. Check out http://www.exrx.net/Lists/ExList/ShouldWt.html most of those are pretty good. Then do seated rows and wide grip rows (supinated grip). Try that and I bet you'll not only get your lats and shoulders to swell but increase your ability to do pulls |
What he said, but also work your grip and forearms. Without a decent grip it's hard to hang on the bar. |
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I'd vote for push ups. Start with whatever you can do...if you can do 5 pushups with good form- you can do reverse pyramids...
4 push ups 3 PU's 2PU's 1PU this lets you do more toatl exercises then just doing your 5 and being spent. also I'd do barbell rows and military presses. Good luck!! |
| I currently can't do pull ups/chin ups. I'm 6'1" about 240# so I'm a bit overweight. Right now I'm doing lat pulldowns, row exercises and misc other arm workouts. My biggest problem is a stabbing pain in my ribs where I had two chest tubes 10 months ago. Doctor says to just take it easy and not to push it too much. This to a guy who refused most help bc I wanted to be independent and recover like, now. |
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You only did one set? I usually come back about 5 minutes later and hit it again. Swing your arms around, go get a drink of water, smile, then hit it again. Oh, and congratulations. Yea, just a couple of them. I still have a ways to go for better form. But a shitty kipping pullup is WAY better than none at all. |
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I know the feeling.
Exactly 1 year ago I could barely to 1 pull up... I also fell through the bars when trying my first dip a year back. I started on the assist machine and about 3 months later I started doing them unassisted. At that point I started adding weight. I cannot do a whole bunch of pull-ups by any means but I am able to crank out about 9 or 10 one time. What I am really happy about is that I can pull ups with added weight. I can now do pull ups with up to 85lbs in tow and dip with 100lbs of weight added on. I am 6'3 260lbs Lift 5 days a week. Started a cardio routine about 4 months back. |
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You only did one set? I usually come back about 5 minutes later and hit it again. Swing your arms around, go get a drink of water, smile, then hit it again. Oh, and congratulations. Yea, just a couple of them. I still have a ways to go for better form. But a shitty kipping pullup is WAY better than none at all. Keep doing them. Try to do at least 3 sets 3 times a week. For the first couple of weeks, you will be sore, but you probably already know that. Your numbers should start going up pretty quick. Do pull-ups and chin-ups, they work different muscles, but they also work some of the same muscles. Be prepared for your shirts to start fitting different, and women giving you a second look.
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You only did one set? I usually come back about 5 minutes later and hit it again. Swing your arms around, go get a drink of water, smile, then hit it again. Oh, and congratulations. Yea, just a couple of them. I still have a ways to go for better form. But a shitty kipping pullup is WAY better than none at all. Keep doing them. Try to do at least 3 sets 3 times a week. For the first couple of weeks, you will be sore, but you probably already know that. Your numbers should start going up pretty quick. Do pull-ups and chin-ups, they work different muscles, but they also work some of the same muscles. Be prepared for your shirts to start fitting different, and women giving you a second look.
Haha. I lift 5 days a week, so I am always sore. I have been doing pullups on a gravitron, face pulls, lat pulldowns, and a bunch of pushups. That seems to have really helped me along. I do some chinups, but not a ton. I can do a few unassisted chinups as well, but pullups were my real goal. |
| JUST KEEP DOING THEM!!!! Your upper body, arms, shoulders will explode! Trust me here I do them at the end of my full lifting routine. I did today after increasing my bench and curl weight. All to fail, 15 wide grip pull-ups, 17 narrow grip pull-ups, and 16 chin-ups, about two minutes rest between sets. just keep working at it! |
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Do what you can. Set the counterbalance weight to whatever level it takes for you to be able to do 10 pullups. At the same counterbalance setting, do two more sets. You should get 8 and 6, roughly.
Do the same thing every time you go to do pullups. And adjust the counterbalance weight level to keep your first set between 8 and 12 reps. If you get to 12 reps, add more weight next time. If you can't do 8, drop one plate. The 8-12 rule is what I have used to very good effect, given how relatively rarely I've been working out to this point. (I'm on a new workout program now that puts me in the gym for 5 days a week, with an option to do a little on Saturday, too.) CJ |
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Do what you can. Set the counterbalance weight to whatever level it takes for you to be able to do 10 pullups. At the same counterbalance setting, do two more sets. You should get 8 and 6, roughly. Do the same thing every time you go to do pullups. And adjust the counterbalance weight level to keep your first set between 8 and 12 reps. If you get to 12 reps, add more weight next time. If you can't do 8, drop one plate. CJ That is good advice, but with the Gravitron, you remove plates to make the workout more difficult. |