Posted: 8/19/2011 11:04:01 AM EDT
Well, I was 218 and 6' 2" last January. Now I'm 6' 2" and 188.8. You would think I'd be happy, but I'm not. My bodyfat % is still fairly high, I've got slight man boobs and slight love handles. I'd like to get washboard abs, and a well defined muscle tone. I'm not sure how I should go about doing this. Should I cut down to 180 and clean bulk? I stopped cutting about 2 weeks ago, and started weightlifting a week ago. Should I just continue to weightlift? As far as my workout routine goes, I'll do 3-6 sets of 10 reps of bench-pressing and curling, depending on how sore I get.
Thank you brochachos! |
| Just keep up with the weightlifting and eat well (quantity and nutrition)- a good enought weight routine will burn all the calories you want it to and build your tone. Sounds like you aren't looking to be a mass monster so vary your routine and make sure you are covering all the main muscle groups, including your core- front and back. Throw some cardio in, do squats, bench, rows, leg and shoulder presses, weighted sit ups, etc. |
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Just keep up with the weightlifting and eat well (quantity and nutrition)- a good enought weight routine will burn all the calories you want it to and build your tone. Sounds like you aren't looking to be a mass monster so vary your routine and make sure you are covering all the main muscle groups, including your core- front and back. Throw some cardio in, do squats, bench, rows, leg and shoulder presses, weighted sit ups, etc. How much cardio should I be doing? How many sets per exercise? Thanks! |
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Just keep up with the weightlifting and eat well (quantity and nutrition)- a good enought weight routine will burn all the calories you want it to and build your tone. Sounds like you aren't looking to be a mass monster so vary your routine and make sure you are covering all the main muscle groups, including your core- front and back. Throw some cardio in, do squats, bench, rows, leg and shoulder presses, weighted sit ups, etc. How much cardio should I be doing? How many sets per exercise? Thanks! With the toning aspect, I would think as much cardio as you can want practically, but at least 30 min-hr/day depending on your diet. As to weight routine, you should do a moderately high weight with increased reps, 3-5 sets of 10-15 reps with 60-75% of your max weight. So if you can curl 50lbs with some grunt, cut it down to 35lbs or so and work that. If you find you can do 15-20 reps of any exercise easily, bump up your weight. If you can only knock out a handful of reps, or your form goes to shit finishing a set, back off on the weight. Another thing to keep in mind that if you are just starting lifting (overall, not for the day), don't worry abour weight and concentrate on form. This will help protect you from injury and ensure you are working target muscles properly. Lifting a ton of weight doesn't help you much if you are flailing all about doing it. 
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Just bench and curls? Ditch the curls, keep the bench and add squats and deadlifts. Try 5x5 instead of sets of ten. Do cardio too, how much depends on the person experiment to see what you need. Lifting isn't going to get you "toned" without a good diet. Nutrition- cut out all sugar and processed foods to include grains. Eat lots of green veggies and meats. Don't worry about low fat stuff. This is the basics of paleo/primal and I have YET to see this lifestyle not results in dramatic changes in people.
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| ^ What he said as well- especially the diet part. Very solid advice- do not forsake the good carbs and don't worry about fat. Simple foods closer to their natural states (ie, not processed garbarge) will do you much better than most diet plans and give you better overall nutrition. |
Pretty much what Hank and RoG said. 5x5 and a good clean diet will work wonders. It sounds so simple that many people don't think it will work and I was one of them.
Ditch the plans for epic abs for right now. You will probably need to be < 170# to be there. If I were you I would cut down to around 180 then do a clean bulk back up. If you get good abs now the rest of you will look scrawny. |
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So....you just started lifting a week ago....you do only bench and curls....and you want to get "toned".
Ok then. First, abs are made in the kitchen. Post your complete diet for an average day and let's see what you're working with there first. Then as said above make sure you get at least 8 hours of QUALITY sleep per night, every night. After you get that down add the basic old school movements to your lifting days. Bench is fine, you need squats, deads and military press. If you have gas left over after that you can worry about curls. |
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To achieve the "washboard abs" part of things... you must start focusing on endurance. Since you are still coming down from weight, building muscle bulk is not your main priority. Toning and burning energy is needed. I recommend workouts that encourage AMRAPs (As Many Rounds As Possible) or xRFT (x-Rounds for Time). Some good programs that I know of are: Rescue Athlete (my torture of choice) SEALFit SOFWODs CrossFit
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Quoted: To achieve the "washboard abs" part of things... you must start focusing on endurance. Since you are still coming down from weight, building muscle bulk is not your main priority. Toning and burning energy is needed. I recommend workouts that encourage AMRAPs (As Many Rounds As Possible) or xRFT (x-Rounds for Time). Some good programs that I know of are: Rescue Athlete (my torture of choice) SEALFit SOFWODs CrossFit Well, you need cardio- but you need strength too so I don't know if I'd describe that as endurance exactly. I'd also recommend against Sealfit, it's WAY too high volume for just about anybody unless you pick and choose workouts, drastically reducing the volume. For a beginner something like the Crossfit brand X workouts are a great place to start (not real familiar with the other programs you mentioned). |
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Quoted: For someone who is inactive in lifting weights, the strength will come almost regardless of the type of workouts they are doing. What I am encouraging him to do is not focus on strength training or bulking which is what we Americans rely so heavily on, especially since he is coming down from weight and is trying to rid of his moobs/love handles.Quoted: To achieve the "washboard abs" part of things... you must start focusing on endurance. Since you are still coming down from weight, building muscle bulk is not your main priority. Toning and burning energy is needed. I recommend workouts that encourage AMRAPs (As Many Rounds As Possible) or xRFT (x-Rounds for Time). Some good programs that I know of are: Rescue Athlete (my torture of choice) SEALFit SOFWODs CrossFit Well, you need cardio- but you need strength too so I don't know if I'd describe that as endurance exactly. I'd also recommend against Sealfit, it's WAY too high volume for just about anybody unless you pick and choose workouts, drastically reducing the volume. For a beginner something like the Crossfit brand X workouts are a great place to start (not real familiar with the other programs you mentioned). Strength-oriented workouts tend to neglect any aspect of cardio. It separates cardio from lifting. In turn, people neglect to do cardio altogether because it is viewed as another entity. I like to consider anything that merges strength with cardio to be in the realm of "endurance" training... which is what AMRAPs and RFTs offer effectively. As far as SEALFit goes, I agree that it's definitely geared toward experienced trainees. I probably shouldn't have mentioned it because it's so specific in its goals. I don't use it unless I want to focus on cals for an upcoming PT test. But CrossFit also has WODs that are too difficult for any newbie without scaling. Actually, any of those that I listed would require scaling for a newbie.
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Quoted: Quoted: For someone who is inactive in lifting weights, the strength will come almost regardless of the type of workouts they are doing. What I am encouraging him to do is not focus on strength training or bulking which is what we Americans rely so heavily on, especially since he is coming down from weight and is trying to rid of his moobs/love handles.Quoted: To achieve the "washboard abs" part of things... you must start focusing on endurance. Since you are still coming down from weight, building muscle bulk is not your main priority. Toning and burning energy is needed. I recommend workouts that encourage AMRAPs (As Many Rounds As Possible) or xRFT (x-Rounds for Time). Some good programs that I know of are: Rescue Athlete (my torture of choice) SEALFit SOFWODs CrossFit Well, you need cardio- but you need strength too so I don't know if I'd describe that as endurance exactly. I'd also recommend against Sealfit, it's WAY too high volume for just about anybody unless you pick and choose workouts, drastically reducing the volume. For a beginner something like the Crossfit brand X workouts are a great place to start (not real familiar with the other programs you mentioned). Strength-oriented workouts tend to neglect any aspect of cardio. It separates cardio from lifting. In turn, people neglect to do cardio altogether because it is viewed as another entity. I like to consider anything that merges strength with cardio to be in the realm of "endurance" training... which is what AMRAPs and RFTs offer effectively. As far as SEALFit goes, I agree that it's definitely geared toward experienced trainees. I probably shouldn't have mentioned it because it's so specific in its goals. I don't use it unless I want to focus on cals for an upcoming PT test. But CrossFit also has WODs that are too difficult for any newbie without scaling. Actually, any of those that I listed would require scaling for a newbie. Agreed then, we just describe it differently. You're right about Crossfit too, that's why I like the brand X- they do all the scaling for you, which is great for a beginner. For example, here's the Sealfit WOD for today. This would break most people, and is WAY too much (I know you're not disagreeing, I'm just showing an example). <Work Capacity: Body Armor: with 20# vest for time do:
Strength:10 – 8 – 6 – 4 – 3 – 3 – 3 Dead Lift Stamina: 5 rounds: 3 x DL @ 90% 3RM, 15 x Box jump, Hip Mobility Drill Durability: plank hold 3 x 2 minutes. Active Stretch or Yoga Notes: equipment – vest, pull-up bar, Oly set, box. |
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So....you just started lifting a week ago....you do only bench and curls....and you want to get "toned". Ok then. First, abs are made in the kitchen. Post your complete diet for an average day and let's see what you're working with there first. Then as said above make sure you get at least 8 hours of QUALITY sleep per night, every night. After you get that down add the basic old school movements to your lifting days. Bench is fine, you need squats, deads and military press. If you have gas left over after that you can worry about curls. Yesterday: Breakfast: -Cup of coffee with 2 packs of Truvia and a dash of skim milk -2 slices of toast with light amounts of butter Lunch: -Glass of Kool-aid, Oh yeah! -Sandwich with turkey, cheese, miracle whip, tomato, and lettuce. Dinner: -Can of soup -Glass of Kool-aid -Piece of apple pie.(Cheat meal for the week) I had a few palm-fulls of nut and fruit mix as light snacks throughout the day. |
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Quoted: Quoted: So....you just started lifting a week ago....you do only bench and curls....and you want to get "toned". Ok then. First, abs are made in the kitchen. Post your complete diet for an average day and let's see what you're working with there first. Then as said above make sure you get at least 8 hours of QUALITY sleep per night, every night. After you get that down add the basic old school movements to your lifting days. Bench is fine, you need squats, deads and military press. If you have gas left over after that you can worry about curls. Yesterday: Breakfast: -Cup of coffee with 2 packs of Truvia and a dash of skim milk -2 slices of toast with light amounts of butter Lunch: -Glass of Kool-aid, Oh yeah! -Sandwich with turkey, cheese, miracle whip, tomato, and lettuce. Dinner: -Can of soup -Glass of Kool-aid -Piece of apple pie.(Cheat meal for the week) I had a few palm-fulls of nut and fruit mix as light snacks throughout the day. So...lots of processed carbs which spike your insulin and trigger your body to hold onto fat and I'd be surprised if you got 50g of protein yesterday. So basically you're not building any muscle, but you're probably building plenty of fat. See my advice above- it WILL work. Try this instead- Eggs/bacon and green veggies for breakfast (broccoli or cabbage is a favorite) Lunch- leftovers/turkey/ etc salad (lettuce, avocado, fruit, whatever you like- make dressing out of olive oil and vinegar Dinner- any kind of meat you like and plenty of green veggies. Notice there is no sugar (kool aid? really?) or bread pasta or processed foods.
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Quoted: Aside from the Kool Aid, his meal plan didn't really disturb me. Way better than most, for sure.Quoted: Quoted: So....you just started lifting a week ago....you do only bench and curls....and you want to get "toned". Ok then. First, abs are made in the kitchen. Post your complete diet for an average day and let's see what you're working with there first. Then as said above make sure you get at least 8 hours of QUALITY sleep per night, every night. After you get that down add the basic old school movements to your lifting days. Bench is fine, you need squats, deads and military press. If you have gas left over after that you can worry about curls. Yesterday: Breakfast: -Cup of coffee with 2 packs of Truvia and a dash of skim milk -2 slices of toast with light amounts of butter Lunch: -Glass of Kool-aid, Oh yeah! -Sandwich with turkey, cheese, miracle whip, tomato, and lettuce. Dinner: -Can of soup -Glass of Kool-aid -Piece of apple pie.(Cheat meal for the week) I had a few palm-fulls of nut and fruit mix as light snacks throughout the day. So...lots of processed carbs which spike your insulin and trigger your body to hold onto fat and I'd be surprised if you got 50g of protein yesterday. So basically you're not building any muscle, but you're probably building plenty of fat. See my advice above- it WILL work. Try this instead- Eggs/bacon and green veggies for breakfast (broccoli or cabbage is a favorite) Lunch- leftovers/turkey/ etc salad (lettuce, avocado, fruit, whatever you like- make dressing out of olive oil and vinegar Dinner- any kind of meat you like and plenty of green veggies. Notice there is no sugar (kool aid? really?) or bread pasta or processed foods. But you suggested 50g of protein... did you mean throughout the day?
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Quoted: Quoted: Aside from the Kool Aid, his meal plan didn't really disturb me. Way better than most, for sure.Quoted: Quoted: So....you just started lifting a week ago....you do only bench and curls....and you want to get "toned". Ok then. First, abs are made in the kitchen. Post your complete diet for an average day and let's see what you're working with there first. Then as said above make sure you get at least 8 hours of QUALITY sleep per night, every night. After you get that down add the basic old school movements to your lifting days. Bench is fine, you need squats, deads and military press. If you have gas left over after that you can worry about curls. Yesterday: Breakfast: -Cup of coffee with 2 packs of Truvia and a dash of skim milk -2 slices of toast with light amounts of butter Lunch: -Glass of Kool-aid, Oh yeah! -Sandwich with turkey, cheese, miracle whip, tomato, and lettuce. Dinner: -Can of soup -Glass of Kool-aid -Piece of apple pie.(Cheat meal for the week) I had a few palm-fulls of nut and fruit mix as light snacks throughout the day. So...lots of processed carbs which spike your insulin and trigger your body to hold onto fat and I'd be surprised if you got 50g of protein yesterday. So basically you're not building any muscle, but you're probably building plenty of fat. See my advice above- it WILL work. Try this instead- Eggs/bacon and green veggies for breakfast (broccoli or cabbage is a favorite) Lunch- leftovers/turkey/ etc salad (lettuce, avocado, fruit, whatever you like- make dressing out of olive oil and vinegar Dinner- any kind of meat you like and plenty of green veggies. Notice there is no sugar (kool aid? really?) or bread pasta or processed foods. But you suggested 50g of protein... did you mean throughout the day? No, I said I'd be surprised if he got 50g of protein in his diet that day. I'd recommend what most recommend and that's about 1g or so per pound of lean body mass. His diet disturbs me because there's hardly any protien or fat and it's mostly processed carbs. I've seen worse, but his is pretty bad. |
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Today was a bit better, meal wise:
Breakfast: -Orange Juice -Bowl of cantaloup Lunch: -two brats -Plate of sauerkraut and grilled veggies -Diet Soda Dinner: -Milk -Salad without dressing -Sandwich with a ton of turkey, a slice of cheese, lettuce, and wholegrain bread. |
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Just remember that there are 2 ways to lower your body fat %
1 Reduce Body Fat 2 Increase Lean mass If you want to increase lean mass I would gradually switch to a German Volume Training type squat workout or a Westside style workout. You'll have to do a little reading to figure them out. Also read up on John Berardi's nutritional articles. you can google chris shuggart's Velocity Diet if you want to lose it quickly but you'll have to apply berardi's stuff when you get off the Vdiet. Last point I want you to think about is this. Do sprinters or marathoners have better physiques? Elite sprinters are usually quite lean and muscular and dont do long distance training. Marathoners on the other hand are lean with very little muscle mass. So why do people that want lean muscle train like marathoners rather than sprinters? |
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Last point I want you to think about is this. Do sprinters or marathoners have better physiques? Elite sprinters are usually quite lean and muscular and dont do long distance training. Marathoners on the other hand are lean with very little muscle mass. So why do people that want lean muscle train like marathoners rather than sprinters? Of course those appearance differences have absolutely nothing to do with the difference in proportion of Type I and Type II fibers between those those two groups that predispose individuals towards elite status in one or the other discipline... |
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Last point I want you to think about is this. Do sprinters or marathoners have better physiques? Elite sprinters are usually quite lean and muscular and dont do long distance training. Marathoners on the other hand are lean with very little muscle mass. So why do people that want lean muscle train like marathoners rather than sprinters? Of course those appearance differences have absolutely nothing to do with the difference in proportion of Type I and Type II fibers between those those two groups that predispose individuals towards elite status in one or the other discipline... You don't need to look at "elite status" athletes to see the difference. You can go to any school track or local club and it will be just as obvious. |
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Build the muscle under the fat. But you gotta get rid of the fat which means cardio. Take your pic but you'll probably wanna focus more on cardio if you want the "look." At his size that "look" isn't what he is most likely after. 188 at 6'2"? I should think he's close. Work the muscles to strengthen and enlarge them but lose that layer of fat... he can't be too far off. Just takes dedication. I'm about to go eat some sugar.
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