Posted: 8/4/2011 6:00:03 AM EDT
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I decided to tape myself doing a set of squats yesterday. I was pretty disappointed in my self after this specific set. I'm getting weaker. Possible reasons are that I've cut about 13lbs off my body in the last month and a half, and I was trying to go below parallel. Something that at 225 I haven't done. But by all means, let me know what I'm doing wrong. I don't have a partner to tell me anything. If I need a different view, let me know. Thanks  Here's a video from Sunday. Different view. This was my last set of the day. |
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1) You need to add weight, someone of your size should not be worried about BF% or getting too heavy As for the squat itself. You have the bar to high, go to a low bar squat, this will help promote hip drive. Speaking of hip drive, you don't have any. You are leading with your chest, not your hips, ie your ass. As soon as you come out of the hole, your chest comes up, and that takes the slack off your hamstrings killing your ability to move the weight. Also, in the second video it was visible that your knees are collapsing in. My guess is that your feet are pointed forward-get them pointed at a 30% angle and shove your knees out. If you a) move the bar to the low bar position, b)get your knees shoved out, and c) drive up with your ass/hips you will find that your progress will be better, and you'll make better use of the posterior chain. Kudos for having balls to post your form here.  |
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I think your toes are fine pointed forward, maybe a little outward. Yea, moving them out further might make it easier but when you move/walk/run jump do our toes point out? No, unless we have extreme external rotation development of the hip or tibial/femoral junctions, then the strength becomes less functional.
I would get the bar lower on your back, take a wider grip on the bar to help this. What's your lift routine, sets, reps, percent max, and are you going to fatigue? How long have you been lifting on your current plan? |
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Quoted: What does walking have to do with squatting? Getting the knees out is what allows him to get proper depth without lower back rounding, killing hamstring tightness and gets the weight on the knees instead of the hips. I think your toes are fine pointed forward, maybe a little outward. Yea, moving them out further might make it easier but when you move/walk/run jump do our toes point out? No, unless we have extreme external rotation development of the hip or tibial/femoral junctions, then the strength becomes less functional. I would get the bar lower on your back, take a wider grip on the bar to help this. What's your lift routine, sets, reps, percent max, and are you going to fatigue? How long have you been lifting on your current plan? |
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Quoted:
Quoted:
What does walking have to do with squatting? Getting the knees out is what allows him to get proper depth without lower back rounding, killing hamstring tightness and gets the weight on the knees instead of the hips.
I think your toes are fine pointed forward, maybe a little outward. Yea, moving them out further might make it easier but when you move/walk/run jump do our toes point out? No, unless we have extreme external rotation development of the hip or tibial/femoral junctions, then the strength becomes less functional. I would get the bar lower on your back, take a wider grip on the bar to help this. What's your lift routine, sets, reps, percent max, and are you going to fatigue? How long have you been lifting on your current plan? My point is that when we move our feet are pointing forward, the strength and power is going to be appreciated in the running and jumping obviously. Yes he needs to keep his knees out in line, but the reason probably is that the weight is too heavy for his VMO to straighten the knee and glute medius to keep the femur externally rotated - reasons why knees come in with athletes, common with women, and develop knee pain. I'm not sure I follow what you're saying about the last part about hamstrings. |
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Quoted: Why do power lifters then take a wide stance with their feet angled way out? Quoted: Quoted: What does walking have to do with squatting? Getting the knees out is what allows him to get proper depth without lower back rounding, killing hamstring tightness and gets the weight on the knees instead of the hips. I think your toes are fine pointed forward, maybe a little outward. Yea, moving them out further might make it easier but when you move/walk/run jump do our toes point out? No, unless we have extreme external rotation development of the hip or tibial/femoral junctions, then the strength becomes less functional. I would get the bar lower on your back, take a wider grip on the bar to help this. What's your lift routine, sets, reps, percent max, and are you going to fatigue? How long have you been lifting on your current plan? My point is that when we move our feet are pointing forward, the strength and power is going to be appreciated in the running and jumping obviously. Yes he needs to keep his knees out in line, but the reason probably is that the weight is too heavy for his VMO to straighten the knee and glute medius to keep the femur externally rotated - reasons why knees come in with athletes, common with women, and develop knee pain. I'm not sure I follow what you're saying about the last part about hamstrings.  Running mechanics have nothing to do with squatting mechanics. |
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Look at Jim Wendler's squats His stance and foot work looks nothing like how someone would run, but his stance is wide enough and his feet are out enough to get the weight onto his posterior chain, and off of his quads. Here's another vid of Jim. Notice right before he starts he moves his feet out. Mark Rippetoe squatting you can clearly see how his right foot is point out. Notice also how both Jim and Ripp raise out of the hole with their hips, not the chest. |
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Why do power lifters then take a wide stance with their feet angled way out? Quoted:
Quoted:
What does walking have to do with squatting? Getting the knees out is what allows him to get proper depth without lower back rounding, killing hamstring tightness and gets the weight on the knees instead of the hips.
I think your toes are fine pointed forward, maybe a little outward. Yea, moving them out further might make it easier but when you move/walk/run jump do our toes point out? No, unless we have extreme external rotation development of the hip or tibial/femoral junctions, then the strength becomes less functional. I would get the bar lower on your back, take a wider grip on the bar to help this. What's your lift routine, sets, reps, percent max, and are you going to fatigue? How long have you been lifting on your current plan? My point is that when we move our feet are pointing forward, the strength and power is going to be appreciated in the running and jumping obviously. Yes he needs to keep his knees out in line, but the reason probably is that the weight is too heavy for his VMO to straighten the knee and glute medius to keep the femur externally rotated - reasons why knees come in with athletes, common with women, and develop knee pain. I'm not sure I follow what you're saying about the last part about hamstrings. Running mechanics have nothing to do with squatting mechanics.
They do it because it makes the lift easier but that doesn't mean it's functional. Then really what it comes down to is what does the OP have in mind as far as training? |
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Quoted:
Look at Jim Wendler's squats  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sqb6njA8gE
His stance and foot work looks nothing like how someone would run, but his stance is wide enough and his feet are out enough to get the weight onto his posterior chain, and off of his quads. Here's another vid of Jim. Notice right before he starts he moves his feet out. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DhXNgzjlsuE
Mark Rippetoe squatting you can clearly see how his right foot is point out. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FVKEl4Wxoqc
Notice also how both Jim and Ripp raise out of the hole with their hips, not the chest. Keeping your toes straight or slightly out will still put the weight on the posterior chain and still allow you to drive with the hips. As long as you sit back with the weight. Ask me how I know 
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Quoted: 1) You need to add weight, someone of your size should not be worried about BF% or getting too heavy As for the squat itself. You have the bar to high, go to a low bar squat, this will help promote hip drive. Speaking of hip drive, you don't have any. You are leading with your chest, not your hips, ie your ass. As soon as you come out of the hole, your chest comes up, and that takes the slack off your hamstrings killing your ability to move the weight. Also, in the second video it was visible that your knees are collapsing in. My guess is that your feet are pointed forward-get them pointed at a 30% angle and shove your knees out. If you a) move the bar to the low bar position, b)get your knees shoved out, and c) drive up with your ass/hips you will find that your progress will be better, and you'll make better use of the posterior chain. Kudos for having balls to post your form here. All this. don't let those knees collapse! Low bar is much better IMO as well, there was a good video posted here about the setup for a low bar squat...I wonder if anyone remembers that and can repost. That hip drive is hard to learn, but it makes a big difference. Also, it looks like you need to go just a hair lower- the crease of your hip should be at the same level as the top of your knee. You're missing it by just a bit. ETA- Scratch that, I wasn't able to see the second video until now. First vid looks a little borderline, second looks solid as far as depth goes. If you want to come by the 24 area gym at lunchtime sometime let me know and we'll hit some squats. |
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No, but very similar recommendations. The other one went into a little more detail, and recommended a narrower grip, but the bar positioning was the same. It was a woman that did the video too...showed her squatting over 300# in the beginning. |
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Quoted: 1) You need to add weight, someone of your size should not be worried about BF% or getting too heavy As for the squat itself. You have the bar to high, go to a low bar squat, this will help promote hip drive. Speaking of hip drive, you don't have any. You are leading with your chest, not your hips, ie your ass. As soon as you come out of the hole, your chest comes up, and that takes the slack off your hamstrings killing your ability to move the weight. Also, in the second video it was visible that your knees are collapsing in. My guess is that your feet are pointed forward-get them pointed at a 30% angle and shove your knees out. If you a) move the bar to the low bar position, b)get your knees shoved out, and c) drive up with your ass/hips you will find that your progress will be better, and you'll make better use of the posterior chain. Kudos for having balls to post your form here. I want to be heavier but being extremely fit is one of my main goals. I have to run a lot and do hikes. I'm also a cyclist. I'm 5'11" 173 right now and I wouldn't mind being 180 if it's lean. So this hip drive thing is pretty new to me. I'm going to need some help getting that down. Rolando, thanks for the offer. Depending on your schedule, I 'm squatting tomorrow and on Sunday. I can probably make it down to 24 for lunch tomorrow if you're down. Thank you to everyone for the help. |
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Quoted: Hip drive is hard to learn, but once you do, it clicks. Best way to learn it is to have someone behind you pushing on our sacrum, your goal is to push that hand up; drive your ass up. Quoted: 1) You need to add weight, someone of your size should not be worried about BF% or getting too heavy As for the squat itself. You have the bar to high, go to a low bar squat, this will help promote hip drive. Speaking of hip drive, you don't have any. You are leading with your chest, not your hips, ie your ass. As soon as you come out of the hole, your chest comes up, and that takes the slack off your hamstrings killing your ability to move the weight. Also, in the second video it was visible that your knees are collapsing in. My guess is that your feet are pointed forward-get them pointed at a 30% angle and shove your knees out. If you a) move the bar to the low bar position, b)get your knees shoved out, and c) drive up with your ass/hips you will find that your progress will be better, and you'll make better use of the posterior chain. Kudos for having balls to post your form here. I want to be heavier but being extremely fit is one of my main goals. I have to run a lot and do hikes. I'm also a cyclist. I'm 5'11" 173 right now and I wouldn't mind being 180 if it's lean. So this hip drive thing is pretty new to me. I'm going to need some help getting that down. Rolando, thanks for the offer. Depending on your schedule, I 'm squatting tomorrow and on Sunday. I can probably make it down to 24 for lunch tomorrow if you're down. Thank you to everyone for the help. Also keep in mind that your weight doesn't have anything to do with fitness. If you are going to move more weight, you need more muscle. You also need calories to recover, build and fuel them. |
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Quoted: Quoted: 1) You need to add weight, someone of your size should not be worried about BF% or getting too heavy As for the squat itself. You have the bar to high, go to a low bar squat, this will help promote hip drive. Speaking of hip drive, you don't have any. You are leading with your chest, not your hips, ie your ass. As soon as you come out of the hole, your chest comes up, and that takes the slack off your hamstrings killing your ability to move the weight. Also, in the second video it was visible that your knees are collapsing in. My guess is that your feet are pointed forward-get them pointed at a 30% angle and shove your knees out. If you a) move the bar to the low bar position, b)get your knees shoved out, and c) drive up with your ass/hips you will find that your progress will be better, and you'll make better use of the posterior chain. Kudos for having balls to post your form here. I want to be heavier but being extremely fit is one of my main goals. I have to run a lot and do hikes. I'm also a cyclist. I'm 5'11" 173 right now and I wouldn't mind being 180 if it's lean. So this hip drive thing is pretty new to me. I'm going to need some help getting that down. Rolando, thanks for the offer. Depending on your schedule, I 'm squatting tomorrow and on Sunday. I can probably make it down to 24 for lunch tomorrow if you're down. Thank you to everyone for the help. You bet, send me a PM in the morning and we'll coordinate. Tomorrow should be a pretty slow day so it should workout fine. |
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Quoted: You're right. I've seen a few big guys who are really fit. In my head though, I have it that if I am strong but not heavy, I can run / hike up these hills faster than anyone else. Same goes for cycling. I wish I could find a good medium. Hip drive is hard to learn, but once you do, it clicks. Best way to learn it is to have someone behind you pushing on our sacrum, your goal is to push that hand up; drive your ass up. Also keep in mind that your weight doesn't have anything to do with fitness. If you are going to move more weight, you need more muscle. You also need calories to recover, build and fuel them. |
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Quoted: Quoted: You're right. I've seen a few big guys who are really fit. In my head though, I have it that if I am strong but not heavy, I can run / hike up these hills faster than anyone else. Same goes for cycling. I wish I could find a good medium. Hip drive is hard to learn, but once you do, it clicks. Best way to learn it is to have someone behind you pushing on our sacrum, your goal is to push that hand up; drive your ass up. Also keep in mind that your weight doesn't have anything to do with fitness. If you are going to move more weight, you need more muscle. You also need calories to recover, build and fuel them. Yeah it's tough, at 5'9" I typically need to keep my weight at about 175. At 180 right now, that bit of extra weight slows me down a bit. My gym owner is 175 5'9" and deadlifts 515, so you can stay fairly light and still be pretty damn strong if you have your diet and training locked in. |
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^ That would be your lower upper trap or middle trap if you will, not your lower traps. I know keeping your toes straight or slightly out will still engage the posterior chain because I trained as a sprinter/jumper and coached as one. We all have nice posterior chains and functional strength and power. |
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OP. on the first video your knees are moving way too far forward. Your hips are not moving back enough. Concentrate on sticking your hips backwards at the beginning of the squat. Ideally your knees wouldnt move forward at all during the squat. Externally rotating the feet a little is fine
So you think you can squat |
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^ That would be your lower upper trap or middle trap if you will, not your lower traps. I know keeping your toes straight or slightly out will still engage the posterior chain because I trained as a sprinter/jumper and coached as one. We all have nice posterior chains and functional strength and power. haha, he commentates one thing and does another. |
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Quoted: OP. on the first video your knees are moving way too far forward. Your hips are not moving back enough. Concentrate on sticking your hips backwards at the beginning of the squat. Ideally your knees wouldnt move forward at all during the squat. Externally rotating the feet a little is fine So you think you can squat Just got done watching all 5. Very interesting, a few new things in there for me...I may start some of that accessory work too. |
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Any updates, OP? RolandofGilead and I met up a couple weeks ago and he schooled me on squats. I've been doing bench squats to ensure that I go below parallel each time. It's not easy switching up my style either, I had to drop the weight a lot to work on form. I also haven't had much time lately. My battalion is doing 2-3 hikes a month and between resting for those and being on the rifle range, I haven't had much time to squat. I have a hike tomorrow morning but I'll squat again on Sunday and post a video. Thanks for the interest in my thread. |