Posted: 2/8/2015 3:07:37 AM EDT
| I'm loading for my Rem700 SPS tactical. Trying 69 grain HPBTs out. Reloder 15 will be the powder. Alliant's site says 25.5 grains of RL-15 and a Fed 205M primer. I have and use CCI 400 primers. What's the difference? I've never loaded 69 grains before; nor have I used RL-15. The interesting thing is that their recipe sheet RECOMMENDS CCI 400 primers with the same powder and a 62gr FMJ bullet. What gives, and what's the difference? Thanks!!! |
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Quoted:
I'm loading for my Rem700 SPS tactical. Trying 69 grain HPBTs out. Reloder 15 will be the powder. Alliant's site says 25.5 grains of RL-15 and a Fed 205M primer. I have and use CCI 400 primers. What's the difference? I've never loaded 69 grains before; nor have I used RL-15. The interesting thing is that their recipe sheet RECOMMENDS CCI 400 primers with the same powder and a 62gr FMJ bullet. What gives, and what's the difference? Thanks!!! There are differences in primers, some are reputed to be hotter than others. Not gonna report from memory which ones tend hotter, you can google for that if you like. Most important is that once you develop a load, changing primers can sometimes change the fps/accuracy. |
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Quoted: Haven't seen those specific recipe sheets, so I could be wrong . . . but I don't think metallic reloading recipes recommend a primer. They simply report what was used to generate that data. There are differences in primers, some are reputed to be hotter than others. Not gonna report from memory which ones tend hotter, you can google for that if you like. Most important is that once you develop a load, changing primers can sometimes change the fps/accuracy. Quoted: Quoted: I'm loading for my Rem700 SPS tactical. Trying 69 grain HPBTs out. Reloder 15 will be the powder. Alliant's site says 25.5 grains of RL-15 and a Fed 205M primer. I have and use CCI 400 primers. What's the difference? I've never loaded 69 grains before; nor have I used RL-15. The interesting thing is that their recipe sheet RECOMMENDS CCI 400 primers with the same powder and a 62gr FMJ bullet. What gives, and what's the difference? Thanks!!! There are differences in primers, some are reputed to be hotter than others. Not gonna report from memory which ones tend hotter, you can google for that if you like. Most important is that once you develop a load, changing primers can sometimes change the fps/accuracy. Recipe link from powder manufacturers website: http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/powderlist.aspx?page=/reloaders/powderlist.aspx&type=1&powderid=12&cartridge=46 |
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Well, like I said, I could be wrong lol. I use Hodgdon and VihtaVuori powders, and Hornady and Sierra as primary references and had never seen that.
Frankly, I'd use whatever primer I liked/had because I'm not going to start at the max load listed anyhow. Working up from as much as 10% low, I'll find the right charge for the combo I'm using. |
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I wouldn't load that hot. Try 24.0, 24.5 and 25.0 grains of RE-15, run with the load that shoots the best. Fire the lightest load first watching for pressure signs.
I use Remington 7.5's when I can find them, Wolf 5,56m or 223m (magnum) primers or CCI-41"s, BR-4's and even 450's. I won't use Wolf standard 223 primers or CCI-400's. I will use Winchester standard small rifle primers with lighter bullets and moderate loads. Start lower and work up, I won't go over 25.0 grains with 69 grain SMK's seated to 2.250". |
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Quoted: I wouldn't load that hot. Try 24.0, 24.5 and 25.0 grains of RE-15, run with the load that shoots the best. Fire the lightest load first watching for pressure signs. I use Remington 7.5's when I can find them, Wolf 5,56m or 223m (magnum) primers or CCI-41"s, BR-4's and even 450's. I won't use Wolf standard 223 primers or CCI-400's. I will use Winchester standard small rifle primers with lighter bullets and moderate loads. Start lower and work up, I won't go over 25.0 grains with 69 grain SMK's seated to 2.250". |
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Quoted: Note the mfgrs using only a single charge weight are showing you MAX loads - reduce by 10% for min, and work up. Do you have a chrono? |
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Quoted:
I do not have a chrono. How important is that? Like I said, I'm a newer reloader and am currently working on my fundamentals of precision shooting, doing things right and getting the basics down at <200y Quoted:
Quoted:
Note the mfgrs using only a single charge weight are showing you MAX loads - reduce by 10% for min, and work up. Do you have a chrono? If you want precision, get a chrono. Why? You need to know how fast your bullet is going for ballistics and calculating curves. You need to know how consistent your speeds are for standard deviation. You need to know if your speeds are comparable to load data. |
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Quoted:
I'm loading for my Rem700 SPS tactical. Trying 69 grain HPBTs out. Reloder 15 will be the powder. Alliant's site says 25.5 grains of RL-15 and a Fed 205M primer. I have and use CCI 400 primers. What's the difference? I've never loaded 69 grains before; nor have I used RL-15. The interesting thing is that their recipe sheet RECOMMENDS CCI 400 primers with the same powder and a 62gr FMJ bullet. What gives, and what's the difference? Thanks!!! the difference is that most 69 HPBT are match bullets, so they assume you are loading for accuracy and use a primer that is marketed for accuracy (the fed gold medal match ) while the 62g are FMJ military style bullet with a crappy BC and crappy accuracy, but in theory, better terminal ballistics than match bullets so I guess they figure if you're using those bullets, you don't care about accuracy and aren't going to pay the premium for match primers, so the CCI400 will do. i've loaded tens of thousands of blaster ammo with cci400 and it works great. I've loaded tens of thousands of rounds of match ammo with the fed gm and it works great too. i wouldn't pay for match primers when shooting 3gun or plinking, and i wouldn't run cci 400 in a match. so I don't think they're steering you wrong there. that said, the main difference between them should be the consistency of ignition which leads to low variation in your velocity. inside 200 yards, you probably won't be able to tell the difference. fed match primers got stupid expensive and very hard to find during the past 6 years and so many, incl myself, have switched to wolf primers which are relatively cheap and easy to find. this may be a shock if you have any experience with their steel case ammo, but even if fed came back to the same price, i would probably stick with wolf. the roughly 5000 i've shot so far are every bit as good and maybe better reloader 15 is a good powder. varget is probably a bit better for the 69g |
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Quoted: the difference is that most 69 HPBT are match bullets, so they assume you are loading for accuracy and use a primer that is marketed for accuracy (the fed gold medal match ) while the 62g are FMJ military style bullet with a crappy BC and crappy accuracy, but in theory, better terminal ballistics than match bullets so I guess they figure if you're using those bullets, you don't care about accuracy and aren't going to pay the premium for match primers, so the CCI400 will do. i've loaded tens of thousands of blaster ammo with cci400 and it works great. I've loaded tens of thousands of rounds of match ammo with the fed gm and it works great too. i wouldn't pay for match primers when shooting 3gun or plinking, and i wouldn't run cci 400 in a match. so I don't think they're steering you wrong there. that said, the main difference between them should be the consistency of ignition which leads to low variation in your velocity. inside 200 yards, you probably won't be able to tell the difference. fed match primers got stupid expensive and very hard to find during the past 6 years and so many, incl myself, have switched to wolf primers which are relatively cheap and easy to find. this may be a shock if you have any experience with their steel case ammo, but even if fed came back to the same price, i would probably stick with wolf. the roughly 5000 i've shot so far are every bit as good and maybe better reloader 15 is a good powder. varget is probably a bit better for the 69g Quoted: Quoted: I'm loading for my Rem700 SPS tactical. Trying 69 grain HPBTs out. Reloder 15 will be the powder. Alliant's site says 25.5 grains of RL-15 and a Fed 205M primer. I have and use CCI 400 primers. What's the difference? I've never loaded 69 grains before; nor have I used RL-15. The interesting thing is that their recipe sheet RECOMMENDS CCI 400 primers with the same powder and a 62gr FMJ bullet. What gives, and what's the difference? Thanks!!! the difference is that most 69 HPBT are match bullets, so they assume you are loading for accuracy and use a primer that is marketed for accuracy (the fed gold medal match ) while the 62g are FMJ military style bullet with a crappy BC and crappy accuracy, but in theory, better terminal ballistics than match bullets so I guess they figure if you're using those bullets, you don't care about accuracy and aren't going to pay the premium for match primers, so the CCI400 will do. i've loaded tens of thousands of blaster ammo with cci400 and it works great. I've loaded tens of thousands of rounds of match ammo with the fed gm and it works great too. i wouldn't pay for match primers when shooting 3gun or plinking, and i wouldn't run cci 400 in a match. so I don't think they're steering you wrong there. that said, the main difference between them should be the consistency of ignition which leads to low variation in your velocity. inside 200 yards, you probably won't be able to tell the difference. fed match primers got stupid expensive and very hard to find during the past 6 years and so many, incl myself, have switched to wolf primers which are relatively cheap and easy to find. this may be a shock if you have any experience with their steel case ammo, but even if fed came back to the same price, i would probably stick with wolf. the roughly 5000 i've shot so far are every bit as good and maybe better reloader 15 is a good powder. varget is probably a bit better for the 69g |
| the wolf are definitely more consistent than the cci400. however, for a time, some people were complaining that their cups weren't perfectly round and were hanging up in progressive presses. i haven't heard anyone complaining about this for a while though. non-issue if you are using a hand priming tool. that's why i am still running cci400 in my blasting ammo and wolf in my match ammo. next time i order primers, i may switch, depending on the prices. |
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Do not use CCI standard small rifle primers (CCI 400) for any sort of hot 5.56 load.
Standard small rifle primers have THIN CUPS. See Calhoon's article on primer thickness Use MAGNUM small rifle primers for 5.56 ammo. I've used magnum primers on all 5.56 ammo for 20 years. Before that, I had all sorts of pierced-primer problems with any 5.56 load that had any gusto at all. Those CCI 400's (or ANY "standard" small rifle primer) should only be used for true pipsqueak rounds. ...or you can toast some bolt-faces, and crater some firing pins and find out for yourself. |
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Quoted: Do not use CCI standard small rifle primers (CCI 400) for any sort of hot 5.56 load. Standard small rifle primers have THIN CUPS. See Calhoon's article on primer thickness Use MAGNUM small rifle primers for 5.56 ammo. I've used magnum primers on all 5.56 ammo for 20 years. Before that, I had all sorts of pierced-primer problems with any 5.56 load that had any gusto at all. Those CCI 400's (or ANY "standard" small rifle primer) should only be used for true pipsqueak rounds. ...or you can toast some bolt-faces, and crater some firing pins and find out for yourself. |
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don't listen to guys saying you can't run 5.56 loads without magnum primers..its total horse crap. Yes magnum primers are harder and might be better for hot loads but standard primers will work just fine.
In reality magnum primers are made for ball powders (to get a better ignition) and for magnum cartridges to get good ignition on all that power...but still standard primers will do the job just fine on all of them |
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Yeah.
Go ahead and use those primers that are designed for the .218 Bee in your 5.56 loads. Then, after you toast some firing pins and boltfaces with pierced primers, and you get done picking primer brass out of your trigger mechanism, feel free to switch to primers that don't do that. AMHIK YMMV CCI 400. 23.5 grains VV N-135 80 SMK seated to 2.482" ~ 0.010" jump (not jammed into rifling) Fired in Krieger rifle-length barrel Correct headspace dimension of ammo confirmed with RCBS Precision Mic and Forster headspace gages. 
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Quoted: Yeah. Go ahead and use those primers that are designed for the .218 Bee in your 5.56 loads. Then, after you toast some firing pins and boltfaces with pierced primers, and you get done picking primer brass out of your trigger mechanism, feel free to switch to primers that don't do that. AMHIK YMMV CCI 400. 23.5 grains VV N-135 80 SMK seated to 2.482" ~ 0.010" jump (not jammed into rifling) Fired in Krieger rifle-length barrel Correct headspace dimension of ammo confirmed with RCBS Precision Mic and Forster headspace gages. http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/reloading/boltsfront_zps3b5e00f4.jpg http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/reloading/firingpins_zpscd46f0ee.jpg http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/reloading/piercedprimer-CCI400-6.jpg http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/reloading/piercedprimer-CCI400-1.jpg http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/reloading/piercedprimer-CCI400-5.jpg http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/reloading/piercedprimer-CCI400-4.jpg |