[ARCHIVED THREAD] - ELk Gun (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 11/23/2008 12:36:48 PM EDT
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Looking to possibly go out west next year for an elk hunt and I want to buy a new gun I was thinking maybe a Browning X Bolt or a Win model 70 in 300WM. What do you guys think? |
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For elk you want a big fast flat bullet with enough power to put it down.
7mm Rem Mag, 300 win mag, are great Elk/etc. choices. There are a lot of other choices, but I like to keep it simple. . . those rounds work, those rounds are easy enough to buy bullets for, those rounds are dependable. etc etc. There are a lot of choices in ammo with those two rounds. As for the rifle, that is a matter of taste. Browning, Winchester 70, Remington 700, Ruger 77 and the Weatherby are all fine fine proven choices. Go to the gun store and handle as many as you can. One or two will stand out to fit you better. Pick a stock, Wood/Synthetic and then a barrel Blue/Stainless/Fluted? And there is your model. Lightweight is easier to pack around all day, but a heavy gun takes the kick out . . . always give or take. Spend the money and get a good scope, you will save yourself headaches down the road if you do. I would highly recommend Leupold for the money, for cheaper glass that still works well look at Nikon. hope this helps. |
| Honestly you dont need a big, fast, flat round. The damn elk doenst know the difference. He's not going to dropp any faster ...oh crap I just got shot by a 300 winmag I better die faster . thinking he wishes he was shot with a 30-06 so he could live.5 second longer Hell be a hunter not a shooter. Hunt to reasonable distances. use a good caliber with a good bullet. Place it where it needs to be and good to go. no questions asked. You put a 165-180 gr nosler partition into the boiler room and its dead. just saying Ive killed Elk with a 308 and 30-06 I only use my magnum when I know that my ranges will exceed 500yds n(wyoming). and I have shot that rifle over 500 times and know its trajectory by heart. I would rather use my 06. and I have never had one get away ever. I hnt them. I get as close as possible and shoot them in the heart or at least double lung em. BOOM down they go. And if you pull a Utah tag youll have a better chance of a BIG elk. hell we got Satalites with their own herds even the Rag horns have their own. The big ones sometimes have 100 cows. I se more big ones than I do spikes. Utah is a spike only state unless you draw open bull then its trophy time. If you draw open bull and take anything smaller than a 360 class bull your a pussy |
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Any big caliber that you can shoot well will do just fine. Your confidence in your rifle will determine your success. I killed my first elk when I was 12 with a .243. Since then I've taken 3 others with my .25-06. Just this last year I decided to use my .308 because I wanted to "break it in". It's all about shot placement, and a good high quality bullet.
But to answer your question, yes a .300 WM will be just fine, and it is a great choice if you anticipate long shots. As far as model, you have to choose that based on how each rifle feels to you and the features that you like. Some will be lightweight, some will have adjustable triggers, some will be wood or synthetic - the choice is yours. Personally, I love Rem 700s and their vast assortment of models and features, and I have recently become a huge fan of CZ, especially their 550 American. A Ruger No. 1 is a solid example of a great single shot that locks up tight and delivers shot consistancy. And I have killed a lot of animals with cheap scopes, but when you're looking at a possible trophy hunt, don't go cheap on glass. Honestly, your scope price should rival your rifle price. |
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Why is everyone so crazy about getting magnums? I agree that a .270 or a 30-06, or anything inbetween is just fine for hunting elk.
Not saying a .270 or any other caliber in that range is not enough gun for elk because many have been killed with it. One experience that my dad had two years ago kind of got me thinking it wasn't enough gun. He was hunting a meadow when a nice 5x5 came threw. Well ,he killed the bull, but it took 4 150gr nosler partitions to do it. 3 shots behind the shoulder and one in the neck. He was on his last bullet in his Win pre 64 before the bull started to stumble and fall. Luckily the bull was in a big meadow and not in the dark timber. He more than likely would of only had one shot. Next year he was hunting with a .300. |
| If the first bullet was behind the shoulder, the bull was going to die very soon......They can go a LONG way/particularly downhill/after being hit in the vitals. UNLESS you break the shoulder, you will not drop em in their tracks , and even then you might not. nothing wrong with putting rounds into an elk after the first shot...you can save yourself some additional steps when packing out |
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Very' true. I've shot many deer in the boiler room with .300wm, 300wsm, 270's and such, many have ran a bit right after they were hit. Most animals won't drop unlless you hit their spine or clip their central nervous system.
If your looking for a dedicated elk gun I would just choose more gun than a .270 or .06. Elk are tough sob's. To the OP's topic: I think either one would be good choices. I would just pic the one that feels better to you. |
| Ive shot a really nice 27" wide Muley with a 7mm stw with 140gr failsafes traveling a chroned 3600 fps. I shot him 3 times in sweet spot and he still walked 75 yds and didnt drop till I put # 4 in his neck. when I opened hm up ..no heart no lungs but he stll managed to walk 75 yds. yet the next year on the same hill I get his little brother with my 308 with 150 failsafes and drop him with 1 shot. didnt even take a single step just dropped. both kills were at about 300 yds sometimes it takes alot sometimes less the big one would have died I just wanted him dead faster. I think thats pretty much it. The hop eof no matter what you are shooting at you just want it to drop but no matter what you shoot within reason you'll still have those animals that are tough as nails. theyl still die just have to give them an extra few seconds even though it seems like minutes when its a big one. when I shot my big one. My dad and friends said I cranked out those firsat 3 rounds in less than 10 seconds but it seemed like forever to me expecting that buck to drop after I puled the trigger and it didnt so I shot it again and again till I didnt have a shot then when he reapeared a few seconds later hit him in the neck so again and good rifle of 270...30-06 will do just fine just use the right bullet and shoot it at a reasonable distance and it doesnt hrt to be profecient with your rifle. but a manum can be a bit painfull during some range sessions |
| .300 magnum is likely the most frequently recommended elk cartridge here in the Pac NW. Mine has a muzzle brake which makes it a little more comfortable to shoot, but loud. I plan to loan a .30-06 to my son-in-law so he can hunt with me this next fall. He just left serving with the Marines, and in trying to raise a young family an elk rifle is not in his budget yet. An '06 will do fine for elk, and they are fairly comfortable to shoot without the muzzle brake. |
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Hawken 50 Cal Muzzleoader
Modern rifle=s 300 Ultra Mag. Yes you can kill them with smaller calibers as others have said. Disadvantages, Ammo is expensive. Gun is heavier than some, kicks harder than alot. (Limb Saver Butt Pad helps A LOT). Advantages=s a good DRT gun, big enough for large animals, still can use for deer and hogs, flat enough shooting for long range Antelope hunting, and so on. |
My best friend last year in New Mexico. Winchester Model 70 in .270 win. with Winchester 150gr supremes. Lasered out at 186 yards. DRT Three of us are going this year with two tags!!!!!! Ooh Rah! Oh yeah, I will be shooting Remy 700 in .270. 130gr Hornady Light Magnums. I'm gonna need a bigger freezer!!!!!!!!! |
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375 H&H! A 270 g Speer BT or a Nosler 260 g part. bullet at ~2800 fps has the same trajectory as a 180 gr 30-06 and will break both shoulders of an elk. With big animals it is all about penetration. That is why solids are used for dangerous game.
However with hat being said. All of the other calibers mentions will work... so what ever cal you use will work if you make a good hit. The caliber/magnums do not make up for crappy shots. 320pf |
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.30-06 in 180gr. will be plenty ... Don't be fooled by the "gotta have a magnum" crowd. Right, don't be fooled either by (1) the "gotta have a magnum" crowd; or by (2) "no magnum is ever better than a .243 on even the biggest game at the longest range" crowd. I'm going brown bear hunting in September with my fairly new .340 Wby. Before that, my main hunting rifle was a Rem 700 in 300 Win Mag. The first time, l shot my 300 WM, back in 1987, I did not shoot it nearly as well as milder calibers. After some practice, the recoil of the 300 WM stopped even registering with me. Once again, recently, I was all worked up about the recoil of the new 340 Wby before I shot it. Used a shoulder pad, and it was no big deal, and am getting better groups with it than I consistently have shot with any rifle ever. I don't "gotta have" my .340, but now that I do have it, and shoot it well, I see no downside to using to hunt an 800-lb animal at sometimes extended ranges. At 400 yds, my Cor-Bon 225 TTSX loads produces over 2,800 fpe at 400 yards. At 400 yds, a 270 puts out 1,400 fpe, and is more affected by wind and gravity. If I was on a ten-day elk hunt and, on the last day, I saw a nice bull elk at 400 yds, I would want to take the shot, and I would take it if I had time to set up properly if I had my .340 Wby. But I personally would not take that shot with a .270. Some others might be able to make that shot with a .270, but I would not be confident to cleanly kill a 800-lb elk with a .270 at 400 yds. For people who live in elk country or get to hunt elk a lot, it probably doesn't matter much, because they are going to get a lot of shots at elk each year/decade. I don't get to go that often. I want every possible advantage I can have within reason. |
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Any reasonable hunting rifle... such as a 270 or larger that you can shoot good and carry for hours. And that stands up to weather, and is reliable. THen worry about bullet selection. I use a 7mm with a 150 Swift Sirrocco bonded bullet, Nosler partition, nosler bonded core etc are other good choices. Then worry about bullet placement. If you have a good constructed bullett and place it well, you will have a dead elk. Of all the elk I have killed the fastest kill and the largest elk were the same, I shot it with a Ruger 1 7x57.
If you are just buying and can choose anything, be honest with yourself about recoil, If you can shoot it a 300 mag is great, Same with a 7mm mag of some type. Dont forget the recoil is not just for a shot or two It is for practice and shooting from odd positions etc. I have hunted and shot eld for 30+ years and seen lots of new elk hunters miss, not be able to find the elk in the scope fast enough or flinch from the new 338 super mag that they cant shoot. If you have limited money and want success spend it on a gym membership, a quality range finder and quality binoculars like leica or swarovski. An elk in snow across the canyon looks pretty close sometimes and knowing how far can make the difference between a wild shot and being able to work closer and take an elk. Killing elk is actually pretty easy, Finding them is hard and packing them out is hard. |
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270 on up. Whatever it is shoot it a lot. I use a 7mag, but the important thing is whatever it is shoot the gun a lot. Not just a sight in before the season starts. As crazy as it sounds I like to shoot prairie dogs with my main hunting rifle. In my opinion that is the best practice. Varied ranges,and lots of opportunity for practice. Range estimation, and practice in the 350-500 yard range is were the practice pays off. I also really like the bushnell 6500 series scopes for optics.
my .02 |
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.30-06 in 180gr. will be plenty ... Don't be fooled by the "gotta have a magnum" crowd. If you can't shoot a magnum maybe you could get your wife or girlfriend to shoot it for you. 
 Yeah, I can't imagine wanting to have a little exta power when hunting an 800lb animal that you don't want to track for hours in rugged mountains.
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Like I posted earlier, I killed my first elk with a .243 when I was 12. Since then I have killed two more elk with a .25-06 and another with my .308. While I was growing up, I watched my Dad bring down lots of big game with his Savage .250-3000 and his .30-06. With the modern advancements in powder and bullets, there is no need to not carry enough gun, but the point that some people are trying to make here is that you don't need a magnum to kill big game.
As far as I'm concerned, the OP made a good selection in rifle and caliber with his original question. |
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.30-06 in 180gr. will be plenty ... Don't be fooled by the "gotta have a magnum" crowd. If you can't shoot a magnum maybe you could get your wife or girlfriend to shoot it for you.
I'll be sure to pass that little gem on to the guides I know who absolutely cringe when they see all the macho men from out of state show up with their big burly magnums - who can't shoot them worth a flip ... ...even when they're not: tired, oxygen deprived, muscle fatigued, with their adrenaline on high. |
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.30-06 in 180gr. will be plenty ... Don't be fooled by the "gotta have a magnum" crowd. If you can't shoot a magnum maybe you could get your wife or girlfriend to shoot it for you.
Yeah, I can't imagine wanting to have a little exta power when hunting an 800lb animal that you don't want to track for hours in rugged mountains.
Your comments indicate that you are thoroughly clueless ... All the "extra power" in the world won't compensate for a poorly placed shot on an 800lb animal. Furthermore, it's the guys shooting guns that they aren't capable of shooting well that are frequently the cause of situations like having "to track for hours in rugged mountains". |
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It's easy to separate the wheat from the chaff in these kinds of threads ... Here's an example of some wheat: Quoted:
Any reasonable hunting rifle... such as a 270 or larger that you can shoot good and carry for hours. And that stands up to weather, and is reliable. THen worry about bullet selection. I use a 7mm with a 150 Swift Sirrocco bonded bullet, Nosler partition, nosler bonded core etc are other good choices. Then worry about bullet placement. If you have a good constructed bullett and place it well, you will have a dead elk. Of all the elk I have killed the fastest kill and the largest elk were the same, I shot it with a Ruger 1 7x57. If you are just buying and can choose anything, be honest with yourself about recoil, If you can shoot it a 300 mag is great, Same with a 7mm mag of some type. Dont forget the recoil is not just for a shot or two It is for practice and shooting from odd positions etc. I have hunted and shot eld for 30+ years and seen lots of new elk hunters miss, not be able to find the elk in the scope fast enough or flinch from the new 338 super mag that they cant shoot. If you have limited money and want success spend it on a gym membership, a quality range finder and quality binoculars like leica or swarovski. An elk in snow across the canyon looks pretty close sometimes and knowing how far can make the difference between a wild shot and being able to work closer and take an elk. Killing elk is actually pretty easy, Finding them is hard and packing them out is hard. And the chaff, OTOH, is equally easy to identify ... |
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.30-06 in 180gr. will be plenty ... Don't be fooled by the "gotta have a magnum" crowd. If you can't shoot a magnum maybe you could get your wife or girlfriend to shoot it for you.
Yeah, I can't imagine wanting to have a little exta power when hunting an 800lb animal that you don't want to track for hours in rugged mountains.
Your comments indicate that you are thoroughly clueless ... All the "extra power" in the world won't compensate for a poorly placed shot on an 800lb animal. Furthermore, it's the guys shooting guns that they aren't capable of shooting well that are frequently the cause of situations like having "to track for hours in rugged mountains". I'm just exactly as clueless as Col. Craig Boddington. Nice company for me. He "cluelessly" thinks 270 is too small for elk (but of course agrees that a 270 has and will kill many elk, but limits your options and increases your chance of failure when hunting elk). But he shouldn't know, unlike you, he's only done this: "75 African safaris, including hunting in: Kenya, Zimbabwe, Namibia, South Africa, Zambia, Botswana, Tanzania, Mozambique, Ethiopia, Central African Republic, Chad, Cameroon. ––Only living American journalist who has hunted Africa's Big Five of elephant, rhino, lion, leopard, and buffalo. ––Only living journalist who has hunted Africa's nine principal spiral-horned antelopes, consisting of: greater kudu, lesser kudu, bushbuck, nyala, mountain nyala, common eland, giant eland, sitatunga, and bongo. Only living person known to have taken all of these species twice. ––Only journalist to hold Ovis/Grand Slam Club’s World Slam of Wild Sheep and Capra World Slam of wild goats, and “Triple Slam” incl. North American Grand Slam. ––Collected more than 100 species of African big game, more than 200 species worldwide; including numerous Rowland Ward and Safari Club record book entries. ––20 European hunts, including hunting in: England, Scotland, Greece, Finland, Hungary, Spain, Austria, Switzerland, Czech Republic, Romania. ––Additionally has hunted in Azerbaijan, China, Mongolia, Siberia, Turkmenistan, Tajikistan, Turkey, Argentina, Australia, New Caledonia, and New Zealand. ––Big-game hunting experience on all six continents." http://www.craigboddington.com/bio.htm |
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.30-06 in 180gr. will be plenty ... Don't be fooled by the "gotta have a magnum" crowd. If you can't shoot a magnum maybe you could get your wife or girlfriend to shoot it for you.
Yeah, I can't imagine wanting to have a little exta power when hunting an 800lb animal that you don't want to track for hours in rugged mountains.
Your comments indicate that you are thoroughly clueless ... All the "extra power" in the world won't compensate for a poorly placed shot on an 800lb animal. Furthermore, it's the guys shooting guns that they aren't capable of shooting well that are frequently the cause of situations like having "to track for hours in rugged mountains". Like I said if you can't shoot a magnum maybe you can get your wife or girlfriend to shoot it for you. 
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.30-06 in 180gr. will be plenty ... Don't be fooled by the "gotta have a magnum" crowd. If you can't shoot a magnum maybe you could get your wife or girlfriend to shoot it for you.
Yeah, I can't imagine wanting to have a little exta power when hunting an 800lb animal that you don't want to track for hours in rugged mountains.
Your comments indicate that you are thoroughly clueless ... All the "extra power" in the world won't compensate for a poorly placed shot on an 800lb animal. Furthermore, it's the guys shooting guns that they aren't capable of shooting well that are frequently the cause of situations like having "to track for hours in rugged mountains". I'm just exactly as clueless as Col. Craig Boddington. Nice company for me. <snip> http://www.craigboddington.com/bio.htm Given the fact that you don't actually "keep company" with Craig Boddington ... ... but like to cite references to his "bio", doesn't actually make you any less clueless about elk hunting than you clearly are. |
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.30-06 in 180gr. will be plenty ... Don't be fooled by the "gotta have a magnum" crowd. If you can't shoot a magnum maybe you could get your wife or girlfriend to shoot it for you.
Yeah, I can't imagine wanting to have a little exta power when hunting an 800lb animal that you don't want to track for hours in rugged mountains.
Your comments indicate that you are thoroughly clueless ... All the "extra power" in the world won't compensate for a poorly placed shot on an 800lb animal. Furthermore, it's the guys shooting guns that they aren't capable of shooting well that are frequently the cause of situations like having "to track for hours in rugged mountains". I'm just exactly as clueless as Col. Craig Boddington. Nice company for me. <snip> http://www.craigboddington.com/bio.htm Given the fact that you don't actually "keep company" with Craig Boddington ... ... but like to cite references to his "bio", doesn't actually make you any less clueless about elk hunting than you clearly are. So, you're whole goal is to make personal attacks to make you feel less inadequate? You say nothing about Boddington and those who believe that there is an advantage to cartridges like the 300Wwin Mag and others. You just make it "clear" that I don't know much. It doesn't matter whether I share the same views with guys like Boddington. Whether or not i have had them over for dinner is more important to you. You're a powerful persuader. And no doubt a pleaure to be around. |
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Hey Winn..................
I think you are wasting you time with this guy. After all,he is from the east coast and has read all about hunting elk and has read all about some guy that has hunted in africa and some other places. Obviously he knows more than someone who lives where the elk are 
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