Posted: 8/4/2013 3:36:16 AM EDT
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JUST spoke to the third aquaintence of mine..two preppers, one not..
who are relocating to Belize. I have 1/2 acre down there, just because and IF Tyranny takes hold here, there needs to be somewhere to go when the FEMA camps are filling up. but, 3 couples in my sphere of influence are making the move, one already there setting up housekeeping. all between 45 and 65 Whats your plan, thoughts, rational, Stand and fight, cut and run, cowards V heros? Chef |
| I'd like to have a BOL outside the US and Belize is nice. I've only been to the tourist areas though. I've been all over rural Guatemala and Honduras though, and I feel like it wouldn't be too hard to be self-sustaining in that area. I'd fully expect moochers and thugs to be the biggest problem. |
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I've looked into the latest ad campaigns. Seems like EXPENSIVE H.O.A.'s and Tourist rip offs
For SERIOUS GTFO, I'd go to New Zealand. I danced with their neighbors under Uncle Ron in the mid-late 80's. I would not want to be the gringo in the neighborhood if the SHTF. (Especially if said SHTF is viewed to have been caused by the "Jankees". Beautiful to visit, as is the entire region, but be prepared to provide for your own justice, and face the crown somewhere down the road. (Somewhat modeled after brit-parliment, with a flare for "Sorry pilgrim....you ain't from around here) Belize and Costa Rica were Nazi havens, and DON'T NEED your money. Plus...the main-land girls are "quite Christian" as opposed to the Caribbean girls, who are quite, dirty-perfection if you find clean one. Did love the land and people though. YMMV |
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Chef, I have one question.
If things got that bad here and you decided it was time to de-ass, how do you plan to leave the country? By air or some other means? If we have a total collapse or some other major serenio don't you expect it to be as bad or maybe worse in some other country? Ok I said one question.....I am still working on my 1st cup |
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Quoted: Chef, I have one question. If things got that bad here and you decided it was time to de-ass, how do you plan to leave the country? By air or some other means? If we have a total collapse or some other major serenio don't you expect it to be as bad or maybe worse in some other country? Ok I said one question.....I am still working on my 1st cup  If we have a total collapse, I think the "power vacuum" will cause turbulence all around the world as the "reset" works its way out. Personally, I still can't think of a better country to be in, but I haven't traveled much internationally (just Canada and Mexico. Never going back to Mexico). IF we go Roman, I think the global "reset" could easily last a decade or more while a global game of king-of-the-hill goes on.
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Quoted:
<snip> I would not want to be the gringo in the neighborhood if the SHTF. (Especially if said SHTF is viewed to have been caused by the "Jankees". <snip> I tend to agree with OneLegPaddy on this. I have similar thoughts, Most likely the reason you would need to get to Belize would probably also mean that a U.S. citizen would be pretty unpopular. |
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I tend to agree with OneLegPaddy on this. I have similar thoughts, Most likely the reason you would need to get to Belize would probably also mean that a U.S. citizen would be pretty unpopular. Quoted:
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<snip> I would not want to be the gringo in the neighborhood if the SHTF. (Especially if said SHTF is viewed to have been caused by the "Jankees". <snip> I tend to agree with OneLegPaddy on this. I have similar thoughts, Most likely the reason you would need to get to Belize would probably also mean that a U.S. citizen would be pretty unpopular. Belize is basically a constitutional Republic and English is the official Language, unlike here. with only 350,000 people,,I think a few dozen North American Expats with Dual citizenship could probably take over in a generation..  I'll be back later
to respond to some others. |
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Belize is basically a constitutional Republic and English is the official Language, unlike here. with only 350,000 people,,I think a few dozen North American Expats with Dual citizenship could probably take over in a generation.. I'll be back later
to respond to some others. Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
<snip> I would not want to be the gringo in the neighborhood if the SHTF. (Especially if said SHTF is viewed to have been caused by the "Jankees". <snip> I tend to agree with OneLegPaddy on this. I have similar thoughts, Most likely the reason you would need to get to Belize would probably also mean that a U.S. citizen would be pretty unpopular. Belize is basically a constitutional Republic and English is the official Language, unlike here. with only 350,000 people,,I think a few dozen North American Expats with Dual citizenship could probably take over in a generation.. I'll be back later
to respond to some others. I am just saying for me, it is not going to happen. I am not arguing for or against it. You asked for opinions. I will live and die in Texas. Mexico is also a Constitutional Republic. Again, just saying. |
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Do you guys think, that if they were really filling up fema camps, the people who would be on 'the list' would be on some kinda no-fly / no-travel staus?
I suppose you could always use the coyote / immigrant routes in reverse, or get smuggled on a boat or plane. Just thinking about how one would GTFO, if a collapse/pending collapse, complete with round ups. I'd love to take a moto trip down that way. Anybody know about the gun laws in Belize? And maybe the ease at which one could gain citizenship? I've been told by friends 'de el otro lado' that citizenship is only a bribe away. |
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9mm, 38 .22 handguns including semi's
20 gauge shotgun, semi OK. NO SEMI RIFLES..but, again, lobbying in that small a government can find real Hope and change..maybe be the NEW America.. who knows.. if we don't keep the house and gain the senate in 2014, even with Republican'ts we're fucked.. |
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Quoted:
Belize is basically a constitutional Republic and English is the official Language, unlike here. with only 350,000 people,,I think a few dozen North American Expats with Dual citizenship could probably take over in a generation.. I'll be back later
to respond to some others. Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
<snip> I would not want to be the gringo in the neighborhood if the SHTF. (Especially if said SHTF is viewed to have been caused by the "Jankees". <snip> I tend to agree with OneLegPaddy on this. I have similar thoughts, Most likely the reason you would need to get to Belize would probably also mean that a U.S. citizen would be pretty unpopular. Belize is basically a constitutional Republic and English is the official Language, unlike here. with only 350,000 people,,I think a few dozen North American Expats with Dual citizenship could probably take over in a generation.. I'll be back later
to respond to some others. There is no such thing as a US citizen with dual citizenship, as recognized by the US. Other countries recognize their citizens as citizens of their country and US, but not The US. You give it up, it's gone, and you are not likely to get it back any time soon. Especially in a situation as you are preparing for. Their gun laws are not very good. I hope you don't expect to take any with you, as they will be confiscated, if found. Once you are a resident/citizen, you can apply, and may receive a permit to buy a shitty single shot "hunting" style shotgun or pistol. There are plenty of places to drop off the grid here in the states, and still enjoy all of the "freedoms and protections" of being a US citizen. |
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Have you BEEN to Belize?
I'm not talking Ambergris Key...I'm talking places like Placentia and Belize City. Think rough, very rough - crime in and around Belize City is very high (like Africa high). And last time I was there, I kept having to go through military checkpoints with kids way too young to be trusted with the M16 A2's they were carrying - not to mention the little greasy officer with the mirror sunglasses. Think twice....this place has a lot of corruption and "local official control" that could get you a bit more scrutiny that you want once they find out you have way more than they do. If i was to do it, it would be super low-key "i'm just a retired fisherman" kind of thing or with multiple families, build a compound. Not trying to burst anyone's bubble, just injecting some observations from the field. RW |
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Have you BEEN to Belize? I'm not talking Ambergris Key...I'm talking places like Placentia and Belize City. Think rough, very rough - crime in and around Belize City is very high (like Africa high). And last time I was there, I kept having to go through military checkpoints with kids way too young to be trusted with the M16 A2's they were carrying - not to mention the little greasy officer with the mirror sunglasses. Think twice....this place has a lot of corruption and "local official control" that could get you a bit more scrutiny that you want once they find out you have way more than they do. If i was to do it, it would be super low-key "i'm just a retired fisherman" kind of thing or with multiple families, build a compound. Not trying to burst anyone's bubble, just injecting some observations from the field. RW In my VERY limited knowledge of Belize, this is what I've come across too. Dirty, corrupt, and dangerous.......it is a nice piece of land though. |
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I am not able to comment on Belize...I am however closing on property in Panama and planning my move there as we speak.
I will comment on the firearms concerns...all expats I have spoken to have firearms. Some are even registered. When the shit hits the fan, Central America may feel a hiccup but they are far better prepared for it than America ever dreamed of. |
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Another option for liberty, but still under the U.S. flag: http://freestateproject.org/ Probably not as SHTF solution as Belize, but if SHTF here, I just can't imagine Belize would be any safer... Perhaps northern Canada, but it's all speculation. |
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I don't voluntarily vacation in 3rd world countries....I definitely won't consider any of them a safe haven. The biggest issue for SHTF is your ability to get there. There are many shit holes between here and there and it is often difficult enough to navigate under good times. Today they love you because you are perceived as having money. If the SHTF so big that you want to leave the country, I hope you have alot of money for bribes and kickbacks.....it's gonna cost you lots of $$ to stay alive in the 3rd world.
Right or wrong I'm staying right where I'm at. |
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Quoted: Another option for liberty, but still under the U.S. flag: http://freestateproject.org/ Probably not as SHTF solution as Belize, but if SHTF here, I just can't imagine Belize would be any safer... Perhaps northern Canada, but it's all speculation. |
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Why NH? Shouldn't you choose a bigger state, surrounded by like(ish) minded states? Or is this designed as an east coast haven? Quoted:
Quoted:
Another option for liberty, but still under the U.S. flag: http://freestateproject.org/ Probably not as SHTF solution as Belize, but if SHTF here, I just can't imagine Belize would be any safer... Perhaps northern Canada, but it's all speculation. The idea with the FSP is to take a liberal state and convert it to a conservative state. It's failing miserably from what I can tell. On topic, I really like the IDEA of Belize, but haven't been there myself. My stepdad is moving down there early next year, he was planning on running a fishing charter part time and being mostly retired, but was hired already to consult for the Belizian gov't on a couple of infastructure/power projects. |
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The idea with the FSP is to take a liberal state and convert it to a conservative state. It's failing miserably from what I can tell. On topic, I really like the IDEA of Belize, but haven't been there myself. My stepdad is moving down there early next year, he was planning on running a fishing charter part time and being mostly retired, but was hired already to consult for the Belizian gov't on a couple of infastructure/power projects. Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Another option for liberty, but still under the U.S. flag: http://freestateproject.org/ Probably not as SHTF solution as Belize, but if SHTF here, I just can't imagine Belize would be any safer... Perhaps northern Canada, but it's all speculation. The idea with the FSP is to take a liberal state and convert it to a conservative state. It's failing miserably from what I can tell. On topic, I really like the IDEA of Belize, but haven't been there myself. My stepdad is moving down there early next year, he was planning on running a fishing charter part time and being mostly retired, but was hired already to consult for the Belizian gov't on a couple of infastructure/power projects. It was a lot more than that. In my younger less cynical years, I was following the process by which they chose the state. There was a lot of discussion back and forth, and analysis done. One of the big advantages purported for new Hampshire was the publicity it gets in the party primaries. |
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A great and oft-overlooked area are the Canadian Maritimes and Nova Scotia.
There's a vicious, anti parliamentary air to these folks. My dad has cousins in Labrador who are armed to the teeth, and HATE the frogs. He calls it "Canada's Idaho" I have NO love for the weather, and there's no hot, Spanish chicks, but you can lay low, and make a living fishing and singing sea-shanty's in your wood-fired whorehouse
I'd swap out the prosthetic foot for a peg leg and parrot, and be "in like Flynn"...Eh I'm still of the mind that I can smash NY into submission through my penchant for violence and sheer, good looks. 
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I don't voluntarily vacation in 3rd world countries....I definitely won't consider any of them a safe haven. The biggest issue for SHTF is your ability to get there. There are many shit holes between here and there and it is often difficult enough to navigate under good times. Today they love you because you are perceived as having money. If the SHTF so big that you want to leave the country, I hope you have alot of money for bribes and kickbacks.....it's gonna cost you lots of $$ to stay alive in the 3rd world. Right or wrong I'm staying right where I'm at. It is ridiculous to make the assumption that your neighbors automatically turn on you. Picture this...most everyone around you depends on the government to some extent...or most everyone around you is used to making do and pretty much self reliant. One is the US and the other is central America. Think about this...one country is lied to daily by it's government about it's recovery. The other is experiencing real growth at over 8%. Now put away any xenophobic fears and realize that they are people just like us and are not going to kill you just because you are white. That is more likely to happen here in our cities. It comes down somewhat to population numbers and what that population is used to. Central american towns can operate without material being shipped across the country. They are used to subsistence farming and barter and are very good at adapting to adverse conditions. They are miles ahead of us when it comes to solar and water collection. They have a year round growing season. And lastly, and in a shtf situation this could be important, they are all one ethnic and religious persuasion. Being a gringo is not A big deal, there is not enough of us to be a threat. Now those are just a few good points and there are plenty on the downside too. However if you have never been to one of these countries and truly explored it it is hard to get a real feel good or bad. |
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A great and oft-overlooked area are the Canadian Maritimes and Nova Scotia. There's a vicious, anti parliamentary air to these folks. My dad has cousins in Labrador who are armed to the teeth, and HATE the frogs. He calls it "Canada's Idaho" I have NO love for the weather, and there's no hot, Spanish chicks, but you can lay low, and make a living fishing and singing sea-shanty's in your wood-fired whorehouse
I'd swap out the prosthetic foot for a peg leg and parrot, and be "in like Flynn"...Eh I'm still of the mind that I can smash NY into submission through my penchant for violence and sheer, good looks. You could use the line from your AVATAR......." It's MY ISLAND!!!" Doc |
| Have a close friend that just went down (he's been there before) for a two month 'visit' to see if he wants to move permently. According to him, it's a great place to live, inexpensive with a slow/layed back life style. He'll let me know although where I live, we could weather out a long term SHTF incident/situation. BTW, he comes from a large (for NM) city area (Albuquerque - which is for the most part considered a shot hole). |
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If CONUS came apart ala Mad Max.... the natives in Belize and Mexico will probably devolve into Mad Max human sacrifice Mayans within 1 year - meaning you'd exchange one battlefield for another. Unless you are actually working a farm and have access to the sea for fishing and evac you might be eaten alive.
On the other hand if CONUS devolves into tyranny and gulags and re-education camps.... expats living abroad might be living large as waves of desperate Yanquis flee in rickety boats and walk overland past the now mined and armed southern border (suddenly that wall with the moat WILL be built and the NYT will gleefully announce how it was easy to build a 24' wall 2,000 miles long and should have been done ages ago if not for the dastardly GOP that kept it from happening....
So... 50/50. If you relocate with a dozen fellow ex pats and live in a gated or walled compound and marry into the natives, you stand a chance. |
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Unless I really had an understanding of how things work in a place like Belize, and had a solid understanding of how things would go down during different crisis scenarios, it would be hard for me
to evac to a foreign country. You may get there, and not be able to return, if you wanted to. I would humbly suggest the hills of Tennessee, Kentucky, or West Virginia. |
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I've been to Belize 4 times. I have a friend who lives there and we visit. I've also spent 8 of the last 11yr out of the country. If you think somewhere else will weather meltdown better than the USA you're out of your minds. Any problem you can imagine striking the US short of a nuclear blast is bound to be 5x worse in latin america. "British Honduras" included.
Their money is linked by law to the USD at a fixed 2:1. you WILL feel an economic crisis in belize. |
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I've been to Belize 4 times. I have a friend who lives there and we visit. I've also spent 8 of the last 11yr out of the country. If you think somewhere else will weather meltdown better than the USA you're out of your minds. Any problem you can imagine striking the US short of a nuclear blast is bound to be 5x worse in latin america. "British Honduras" included.
Their money is linked by law to the USD at a fixed 2:1. you WILL feel an economic crisis in belize. That is it in a nutshell....outside of an island with high granite cliffs....I will stay in the US....at least I am in South Jersey, it is better than the Northern part of the state and I know the players....the ones causing the problems now will wind up in a landfill. Corrupt politicians and gangbangers rely on civilization....they are not used to people that carry guns, take the restraints off the common man. But leave him with some morals and you will here a lot of....'we are confiscate...bang...'or 'give me your money bitc...bang...' When the collapse comes, those that will adapt fast and those that prey...will learn, but not fast enough. In 3rd world countries, the gangs rule now, the gangs here not so much. |
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For the fucking life if me I don't know why people on here seem to think a country that has to import all of their consumer goods, has a shaky power grid dependent on imported fuel, and tap water that will fucking kill you is a better place than Anytown USA if the world goes to shit. If something bad happens and it's big enough to crush the USA then Latin America is going to be a terrible place to be. Hell, It's only tolerable now because of the strength of the American dollar and the purchasing power we have down there. Right now a trip to Super99 in Panama seems like a bargain when the supply chain is functioning but their shelves will go bare long before shelves in the US do.
Arabs have bought up the former military bases in Panama and built self contained communities. The chinese have all but taken over small business in Belize. If you eat at a restaurant in Belize you are paying the chinese either directly or through a protection racket the mafia runs. Hey, you want to live out your golden years balls deep in arabs and chinaman in a county that's hot as balls with a paper mache infrastructure.... Have at it. |
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For the fucking life if me I don't know why people on here seem to think a country that has to import all of their consumer goods, has a shaky power grid dependent on imported fuel, and tap water that will fucking kill you <snip> 
I thought you were talking about NYC for a minute there.... |