Posted: 8/19/2012 4:43:13 PM EDT
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Opinions needed. Looking at a first gen night vision monocular. Choices for me seem to be Bushnell Nightwatch, NightOwl, and ATN Night Storm.
Any experience with any of these brands? Recreation use only, end of day hunting/observation etc. Not a pseudo swat or even a survivalist, Let me know. Thanks, Ltcnav |
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Quoted: Opinions needed. Looking at a first gen night vision monocular. Choices for me seem to be Bushnell Nightwatch, NightOwl, and ATN Night Storm. Any experience with any of these brands? Recreation use only, end of day hunting/observation etc. Not a pseudo swat or even a survivalist, Let me know. Thanks, Ltcnav Try here - http://www.ar15.com/forums/f_6/18_Night_Vision.html - the AR15.com Night Vision forum. |
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I've had a Night 2x monoccular a little over a year now.
It does what they say. Not the best by far but I've used it to drive the atv in pre-dawn and let the kids play around the house. It took a little playing to understand the 2 focus rings but once you get it figured it's pretty easy. A little pricey for what you actually get but still fun. |
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Quoted: I own pretty good Gen II. I wouldn't bother until you can save and get GenIII personally. I find my gen II less than useful. Gen I is fairly useless unless you have a strong IR light source - or a night so bright you don't need NV. Gen II is useful, depending. My Zeiss Orion gen II NOD is very good, but it was made for the Bundeswehr (and you know the Germans make good stuff  ). But it's not a 'monocular' you carry around, it's a weapon sight (and a big one).Like everything else NV 'generations' are a spectrum from low-end to high-end. The useful Gen 2 is going to be within a RCH of the cost of Gen 3. Again, the knowledgeable are over in the Night Vision forum. |
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I've had gen-1 and gen-2, and now have gen-3 in addition to a nifty little thermal camera.
I STRONGLY advocate that you save for a bit longer and get a quality gen-3 device from a retailer (Buy new! I almost ended up getting locked up by .mil-c.i.d. b/c they believed the dude I got them off of ebay possibly stole them. Not good for a big-city det.) You'll really appreciate the difference. In hindsight, I'd go with a monocular over the pvs-7's for the weapon mount option. A laser aiming device is also a huge asset. Good luck with wich ever you decide. They're a lot of fun once you practice with them. The limitations are MANY. Know what they are before someone is sending rounds your way. 
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Quoted:
At this point, I would go with PVS-14 tube or nothing. I went with a PVS-14 and love it, but it is not a budget option. I looked at what was available and Gen III was the only option that would serve my purposes (I use it on patrol) so I coughed up the money. |
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Quoted: What did you pay and where did you get it? I patrol evening shift, 2-12, and I would like to have one on QD if it doesn't cost more than my car.Quoted: At this point, I would go with PVS-14 tube or nothing. I went with a PVS-14 and love it, but it is not a budget option. I looked at what was available and Gen III was the only option that would serve my purposes (I use it on patrol) so I coughed up the money. Nevermind.  |
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This is like fast cars, AR's, etc...someone who can afford the best will chime in and say anything less is crap.
Well...they have a point! Gen 1 may be entertaining for a starter piece, but generally sucks. Please hang on for a PVS-7 or better you will not regret it...if you decide to unload it, there's a market. |
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Quoted:
This is like fast cars, AR's, etc...someone who can afford the best will chime in and say anything less is crap. Well...they have a point! Gen 1 may be entertaining for a starter piece, but generally sucks. Please hang on for a PVS-7 or better you will not regret it...if you decide to unload it, there's a market. This has been my experience as well. You can buy a lot of gear for the price of a nice tube, so pick and choose your priorities. Gen 1 is utter crap though. May as well invest in a nice flashlight to see in the dark instead. |
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The night vision section has plenty of pics and you can do some reading and see what you think fits your budget and wants and needs. I will readily admit I own a pvs14 and it is my only nightvision besides an ancient sony camcorder with night vision mode, and that thing is so old it takes the little tapes. Do some reading and pay attention to what folks say about some of the names listed above. As I recall some of that stuff mentioned was considered junk but then maybe that was then and now things are a bit different. |
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This thread might be of use. http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_6_18/329958_.html
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iirc most of the current consumer "entry" brands are actually gen2. i have a couple of night owl sets. one non magnified hand pump model and a 3x battery model. the 3x has better glass but neirther are particulalry good at detecting anything other than shapes and movement past about 75-100yards. for a comparison i can easily see a moving man at 200+ with my pvs 14 in lower light conditions.
also a major drawback of these is the limited mount options. being able to use these helmet mounted is a MAJOR benefit for any real use conditions. |
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Quoted:
iirc most of the current consumer "entry" brands are actually gen2. i have a couple of night owl sets. one non magnified hand pump model and a 3x battery model. the 3x has better glass but neirther are particulalry good at detecting anything other than shapes and movement past about 75-100yards. for a comparison i can easily see a moving man at 200+ with my pvs 14 in lower light conditions. also a major drawback of these is the limited mount options. being able to use these helmet mounted is a MAJOR benefit for any real use conditions. I guess that depends on your view of entry? The sub $300 units i'd consider entry brands are Gen 1. Gen 2 usually starts closer to $800+. IMHO, the best deals in Gen 2 would be a PVS-7, or something like a D-300.The difference between a decent Gen 2 unit and a Gen 1 unit is night and day. |
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PVS-14s are nothing short of amazing. It's the reason they're the unit that everything else is compared against. You can save a little with a lower performing (but still very good tube) from a reputable distributor. IIRC, the past couple Decembers TNVC has had a special run of -14s that were relatively affordably priced.
A new tube has approximately 10,000 hour life, or 3.42 years if you run it for 8 hours a night every single night. That's an approximation; it may be more or less depending on ambient light, illuminators, etc. A battery is good for about 40-60 hours, so if we average out to 50 hours/battery you're looking at 200 batteries across that 10k hour lifespan - may be more or less depending on use, but that's a ballpark. Get the Class I IR laser; I have an OTAL that runs on a single AA battery and it's very bright. Allows you to use the -14 while it's head mounted, so it's a better image + you're not flagging everything in sight. The -14 is also pretty user serviceable; the only part I've really seen go bad was the battery housing, but a lot of that can be avoided if you use good quality lithium battery(ies) and remove them when not in use. It's 4 screws with an allen key to swap out battery housings. It's a lot of cash outlay, but the capability you gain is unequaled. It's a true force multiplier that gives you quite an edge. The NVG forum has a lot of good people who want to genuinely help. Practice a LOT with it; depth perception and navigation are highly perishable skills. Good luck as you prepare to own the night! HTH |
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Quoted:
Quoted:
iirc most of the current consumer "entry" brands are actually gen2. i have a couple of night owl sets. one non magnified hand pump model and a 3x battery model. the 3x has better glass but neirther are particulalry good at detecting anything other than shapes and movement past about 75-100yards. for a comparison i can easily see a moving man at 200+ with my pvs 14 in lower light conditions. also a major drawback of these is the limited mount options. being able to use these helmet mounted is a MAJOR benefit for any real use conditions. I guess that depends on your view of entry? The sub $300 units i'd consider entry brands are Gen 1. Gen 2 usually starts closer to $800+. IMHO, the best deals in Gen 2 would be a PVS-7, or something like a D-300.The difference between a decent Gen 2 unit and a Gen 1 unit is night and day. true gen 1's are the old nam era starlight from what i have read. marketting has now made the consumer grade night owl stuff gen1. that is what i was referring too. |
| I would call Vic or Chip at TNVC and talk to them about what your budget and expectations are, I ended up with a Litton M845 unit from them and love it, basically a Gen 2+ 2.5x scope that has a red dot integrated into the system that has a rheostat . It has its limitations like anything there is always a compromise, anything out to about 175-200 is toast when i turn on the Surefire Vampire its like being at a night ball game, YMMV and all that but call those guys, my next unit will come from them, they will spend as much time on the phone with you to make the right choice...even if you aren't buying from them...they are first class guys and site sponsors and have a huge wealth of experience and info freely given. |