Posted: 2/14/2010 12:58:47 PM EDT
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Who does winter/cold camping?
Tell me about it. I am not a cold weather person. |
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been camping up by chena hotsprings here in AK once with a tent, first it isnt terriable, just has it's moments of "WTH did i do this???" seconds HAVE GOOD GEAR!!! DID I MENTION HAVE GOOD GEAR!!! AND IN CASE I FORGOT TO MENTION GOOD GEAR!!! great ground pad and sleeping bag is a must(think .mil therma rest or better 2 of them), second a camp stove that uses either Isobutane or liquid(and cant be deisel either wont burn at that low temp, I use a wisperlite international with kerosene), drink TONS of water the cold takes water out almost as fast as hot day(you dont inhale any moisture when you inhale so all breaths out lose ). the tent is nice to have one if it will get windy but not neessicary. best think to do after you set up your tent while you are cooking dinner, take a canteen and fill it with near boiling water, screw the cap on really tight and dry off, place in sleeping bag where your toes will end up, repeat for butt(where i get cold). eat extra calories when you do eat(2k is "niormal' wintercaming is about 4k unless you walked to your camp site and you might need 6+ then. seriously, .mil rations for cold weather are 6k a day in HUGE white packages with sticks of oatmeal, brown sugar cinamon all held together with butter as a "snack", but they give you 6 of them, each is 450 cals)if you are going in ohio you dont need all 6k but expect to be extra hungry). ground cloth for tent in important else the air in your tent will heat up the snow and oyu will have a wet flor the next day. well that is about al i think about.
Edited (from below) "MSR Whisperlite liquid-fuel-style stoves will run circles around butane and propane canister-style stoves. You will rue the day you leave your Whisperlite behind and are left to melt snow with a canister-fuel stove. True, canister-style stove operate with less fuss, but they are horrible with respect to energy-per-volume. " I just know that canister ones wont run some times in really cold(20 ABOVE for butane, iosbutane mixes can sometime be run at -20 but maybe), I got the wisperlite cuz i know that a half full bottle will last a LONG time... And when I motorcycle camp I have an addional fuel bottle(1 quart on a motorcycle is 15 miles, one less worry). |
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These comments are geared towards light weight camping where you are at least a day away from your car:
A good down sleeping bag will transform the way you think about cold weather camping. I'm a big fan of Western Mountaineering bags; they are top flight, and made in the USA. I have a +20 and a -20. Ground contact drains heat. I like the Thermarest Prolite 3 and 4s. In addition I usually have an 18x24" foam pad that I insert into my pack to help keep pointy object from wearing through my pack; this pad is also used to sit on while cooking; in really cod weather, I'll put this small pad underneath the Thermarest for extra insulation; the difference is quite noticeable. MSR Whisperlite liquid-fuel-style stoves will run circles around butane and propane canister-style stoves. You will rue the day you leave your Whisperlite behind and are left to melt snow with a canister-fuel stove. True, canister-style stove operate with less fuss, but they are horrible with respect to energy-per-volume. No cotton. I'm sure more comments will follow, but this is a good start. |
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Assuming you are doing ligament winter camping and not just sleeping outside in you car or using a camper. I do a lot of winter camping because I enjoy mountaineering and back country skiing like said earlier down is the only way to go along with a good pad to keep you off the ground but if you plan on using a cot than plan on freezing. Along with a good down sleeping bag you will want a 4 season tent if you plan on winter camping and the weather is actually cold with snow and want to go cheap on gear them just plan on being miserable and cold. I have winter camped all over Montana, Colorado and Wyoming in lots of below zero weather and although it not as comfortable as sleeping at home in a bed with the right gear winter camping can be very pleasant and enjoyable
A couple of links to one of my tents and sleeping bags |
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been camping up by chena hotsprings here in AK once with a tent, first it isnt terriable, just has it's moments of "WTH did i do this???" seconds HAVE GOOD GEAR!!! DID I MENTION HAVE GOOD GEAR!!! AND IN CASE I FORGOT TO MENTION GOOD GEAR!!! I only winter backpack. No bugs, no bears, no snakes, and no worry about finding water, although you still have to filter or treat it. I didn't get to go last year, but have a 3 day trip planned in 2 weeks. The last time I went it got down to minus 11 degrees on top of Mt. LeConte. Start by going with someone who has done it before, you trust, and who knows what they are doing. You can die out there if not careful. GEAR, GEAR, GEAR. like was said before. I prefer an inflatable sleeping matress - Thermarest or similar. You will sleep better than a foam pad. Be sure to get a full length one too. Sleeping bag rated for the temperature range in which you will use it. Bivy sack, bag liner also help you stay worm. You MUST have extra clothes, in case you get wet, and also to change into once you get to camp, especially dry socks. We usually take WAY too much food, but better that than not enough. You need a reliable stove or some way to heat food, and water. Some type of light for night times. Flashlight, and also a headlamp so you can use your hands and still see what you are doing. A good, broken pair of boots is also essential as well. CAP |
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Here are a few direct questions:
Given the option of sleeping in the back of an SUV or in a tent, which is better/warmer? I would assume the SUV, because it blocks all the wind, but....? If you decide on SUV, do you do anything special, or just lay out the sleeping bag in back and go to sleep? It is 8 degrees here to night. We have several inches of snow. It I was going to tent camp, should I remove the snow under the tent? What other special thing I would not think about in my spring, summer, fall camping experience, should I do? |
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Quoted: I'd give it a go sleeping in the SUV in your driveway. That way you know what to expect, and if it's too cold or uncomfortable your house is right there so you can go in and warm up instead of discovering that it isn't going to work when you're miles from home.Here are a few direct questions: Given the option of sleeping in the back of an SUV or in a tent, which is better/warmer? I would assume the SUV, because it blocks all the wind, but....? If you decide on SUV, do you do anything special, or just lay out the sleeping bag in back and go to sleep? It is 8 degrees here to night. We have several inches of snow. It I was going to tent camp, should I remove the snow under the tent? What other special thing I would not think about in my spring, summer, fall camping experience, should I do? |
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just got back from camping out in PA this weekend - down to about 10 one night, and 15 the other
slept in this tent - http://west.loadup.com/military/surplus/12747.html and this bag - http://west.loadup.com/military/surplus/13218.html, the patrol and intermediate bag together I was quite comfortable, and while I did hump it in, I was close to the car, so it was car camping to me tent and bag weigh close to 20lbs together, so that is a lot of weight to hike with do not wear cotton as a base layer |
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Who does winter/cold camping? Tell me about it. I am not a cold weather person. 
And gratuitous AR pic 
It's cold... You spend a majority of your time gathering wood, then standing/sitting beside the fire, then eat, then gather wood. But it is fun. Pathfinder |
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Here is a question about winter camping. While learning to survive in cold weather, one of the tricks I learned was to always keep a gatorade bottle in the foot of my sleeping bag. In the middle of the night when you need to go, simply open the bottle releive yourself and screw top back on tightly. Now you have a footwamer. Some of the Brits and Norwegians I have been on exercise with in the military really warned against this.They couldn't provide an answer why though. This is my question-has anyone else ever used this technique/ Would you or wouldn'y you?
Here is what I came up with Pro: Recycle heat by using that stored in urine, avaoid having to get dressed in the middle of the night for the midnight run, get better sleep since you can just roll back over when done, Neutral: I don't see a hygeine issue since urine is sterile Con: If you spill it you now have wet, piss smelling sleeping bag What say the hive mind? |
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Here is a question about winter camping. While learning to survive in cold weather, one of the tricks I learned was to always keep a gatorade bottle in the foot of my sleeping bag. In the middle of the night when you need to go, simply open the bottle releive yourself and screw top back on tightly. Now you have a footwamer. Some of the Brits and Norwegians I have been on exercise with in the military really warned against this.They couldn't provide an answer why though. This is my question-has anyone else ever used this technique/ Would you or wouldn'y you? Here is what I came up with Pro: Recycle heat by using that stored in urine, avaoid having to get dressed in the middle of the night for the midnight run, get better sleep since you can just roll back over when done, Neutral: I don't see a hygeine issue since urine is sterile Con: If you spill it you now have wet, piss smelling sleeping bag What say the hive mind? I keep a gatorade bottle to piss in, but not inside my bag. I put hot water in a nalgene bottle for that. I paid too much for my down bags to risk having them piss soaked. 
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Here are a few direct questions: Given the option of sleeping in the back of an SUV or in a tent, which is better/warmer? I would assume the SUV, because it blocks all the wind, but....? If you decide on SUV, do you do anything special, or just lay out the sleeping bag in back and go to sleep? It is 8 degrees here to night. We have several inches of snow. It I was going to tent camp, should I remove the snow under the tent? What other special thing I would not think about in my spring, summer, fall camping experience, should I do? Sleeping in the SUV not only blocks the wind & cold, but the vehicle is insulated as well. Meaning it will retain your natural body heat like your sleeping bag does. You can turn it on for about 5 or so minutes before bed with the heater on high, crawl in & shut it off... Should keep you warm for a majority (if not all) of the night. When you wake up- turn the key, crawl back in your bag & let it run for 5 or so minutes, shut it off & get dressed. Get out & go on with your day. Pathfinder |
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(1) Murphy's Law dictates that pee-bottles are more prone to leak than a water bottle. Don't keep a pee-bottle in your tent, let alone your sleeping bag.
(2) Peeing into a Gatorade bottle? Really? Don't ya think that someone might accidentally pick up that bottle and down a swig before you could stop them? When it's cold, your senses and reflexes are a little off. (3) Hiking with said pee-bottle can be, well, rather disgusting. Disposing of said pee-bottle in lieu of hiking with it can be rather contentious. Misadventures with either (1) or (2) can ruin a long standing friendship. An isolated (1) or (2) might be forgiven, provided you don't later abandon your friend pennyless in a South American desert. |
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all good suggestions. the only thing i would add is that instead of a gatorade or similar bottle i have used one of the pee bottles that you get from a medical supply store- the kind with a screw on top- they have a wider mouth than the gatorade and makes for less chance of a miss in the middle of the night ( they also come with an attachment for women to use). like a previous post i also do not put it in my sleeping bag just to avoid a possible bad event
ETA i have been told they are also available from amazon |
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Damn Waldo, you didn't let speed drive did ya? He drove himself.  . We drove 20 miles on glare ice and it took him a year to tell me he was scared shitless. I know I drove the whole 20 miles in low range with both diffs locked.
He went out that evening and got stuck. It was so bad, I couldn't even stand up to throw him a tow strap without my trek poles. The pics do it no justice at all. There's a truck stuck on the bottom of the hill in the third pic,,, we left him there too. I couldn't take any pics of the really bad hills as I had my hands full. 
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Just to add a few thoughts––my fiancee is a Norwegian army officer and she said she also found it utterly disgusting. I could see where it could get a little messy for her though. My school used to hold Operation Frosted Gold annually (well twice a year if you count the train up when they used us Norwich students as training dummies for the instructors).
I admit that I did use the piss bottle technique on several occasions. Yes, one of my battle buddies in the snow cave did almost have a swig of it once but found the bottle too warm when he grabbed it. Come on guys––I empyied it dailly. At the time, it seemed like it beat getting dressed at 0230, waking up BB in the snow cave with me, crawling over them, finding slit trench (by stumbling into-glad I had on VB boots) covered with fresh snow and piss slurry, stumbling back to snow cave, crawling back over BB, getting undressed and crawling back into sleeping bag. No, I haven't used PB in awhile but have wondered whether it was sound. The guy that taught us this method was on of the 10th GP guys that used to come up from Devens a couple of times a year to give cold weather survival classes to us. The other technique for relieving the other call of nature which we learned was definetly a NO GO, was to simply hang your ass over the little L shaped wall (windblock) just outside the openeing of snowcave and "drop the SEAL team off" right there. One of the NCOs stepped in Joe's little present. Joe had a rather difficult time cleaning shit off of said MSG's snow shoe. Wow, I almost feel like going out in the back yard and making a snow cave, almost. I think the added waight of the tent is worth it come to think of it. |
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I showed pics of doing it right (in a tent).
This is what it looks like doing it wrong (in a shelter). Two of the coldest nights I've ever spent outdoors in my life were in these. They were situated on ridgetops and open to the prevailing wind. I'll take a small tent over just about anything.
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Damn Waldo, you didn't let speed drive did ya? He drove himself. . We drove 20 miles on glare ice and it took him a year to tell me he was scared shitless. I know I drove the whole 20 miles in low range with both diffs locked.
He went out that evening and got stuck. It was so bad, I couldn't even stand up to throw him a tow strap without my trek poles. The pics do it no justice at all. There's a truck stuck on the bottom of the hill in the third pic,,, we left him there too. I couldn't take any pics of the really bad hills as I had my hands full. http://media.ar15.com/media/viewFile.html?i=6553 http://media.ar15.com/media/viewFile.html?i=6557 http://media.ar15.com/media/viewFile.html?i=6561 http://media.ar15.com/media/viewFile.html?i=6554 You need these. I have a pair & LOVE them!!!!! The best part is, you can use them in conjunction with mil issue snowshoes if needed. Still standing upright...lol Pathfinder |
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Pee bottles have their time and place. Sometimes its too hard to climb over people or stuff to go out. If its -30 and windy its no fun going pee in the middle of the day, much less half dressed and half awake at night. If its 40 and pouring buckets outside its also no fun. If you are sleeping on an ice ledge in your harness its tough to stand up and whip it out. Usually it is easier to get up and go out... thats part of the fun of camping. Hell, at home I usually go pee outside just to check the weather and stars and listen to the coyotes.
Couple issues with pee bottles. They need to be very unlike your water bottles! If its really cold out they need to be emptied right off. Otherwise they freeze and the only way to thaw them out will be to carry them inside your jacket for a day and thats not too fun. I never brought mine in to my bag. If you have a tent partner have a rule... ours was always pee to the left, water to the right. That way when you are getting snow for the morning tea you dont have to worry about any extra flavor. ETA: On the subject of melting snow.... always save some of your water to start the melting process the next time around. It goes a lot faster if you can get some hot water and then add the snow to it. I have a plastic flat flask type bottle that I always keep at least half full inside my jacket when its really cold out. |
The best way to winter camp is just do it. You're not going to die. Never took a camp stove/heater, that's why there are woods. One time my buddy and I did make coffee can candles just to warm the tent enough to play crib. Tuck your boots under your sleeping bag, bring boot liners into the bag with you. But most important, go and do it. Some of the pic's posted were very nice. My buddy and I used to mush huskies and camped that way.
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I slept in a SUV over a tent on a cold night once while deer hunting - don't think I'll do that again. Granted, I didn't have the keys - rode out with a buddy, hunted late and didn't want to set up the tent. I FROZE MY ASS OFF! It got into the low 20's - high teens, and the big problem with a SUV is the cold air circulates all around it - at least a ten is against the ground, and at least mine seems to stay warmer than a SUV with the glass windows.
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If you camp in a tent on the ground, dont remove the snow under the tent. It actually insulates you from the cold ground, believe it or not. I would still use a mat on the floor of the SUV if you sleep in there. Some vehicles dont have as much sound deadening and insulation so with the air passing under the vehicle it can radiate heat out of you pretty quickly.
Winter camping is a lot of fun. If you want a quick and easy taste of it, block the heating off inside your bedroom and sleep on the floor tonight with the windows open. Outside isnt much different. I think sleeping on snow is more comfortable than a floor. |
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I’ve got a winter camping story featuring 2 Girls & a Survival story!
Back when I was 19, before I was serious about survival and stuff, I went on a weekend camping trip that was to include my buddy, and these 2 girls we had just recently met. So I got to the location with the 2 girls. My buddy, who was bringing most of our supplies, was going to join us later (he was working late). All I had on me was clothing for 40F weather, a pack of smokes, condoms and a large bottle of Whiskey. We’ll the weather became unexpectedly nasty, as a northern Gail came down further than expected. Temperatures dropped to below freezing and very high speed winds started ripping snow across our site. With no tent or anything, we took shelter in the back of SUV which we had driven up there. We held out for my buddy who had blankets, a tent, stove and food, but he never showed up. (Turns out he couldn’t make it through the storm and stopped at a hotel). This btw, was also before the cell phone, so no calls could be made. I was cutting it close on gas, so I didn’t want to start the car for heat but I eventually tried – too late, the old car was too cold and wouldn’t start. So, I spent the night with 2 girls on top of me. We were intertwined like a bowl of pasta! But it wasn’t quite as much fun as you may think; we were dangerously cold. Ultimately, the storm ended and with the morning sun I started my car and got out. My first and last time sleeping with two girls wasn’t what I had hoped for! |
6, you know I can't go 4wheeling and NOT find a place to get stuck!
That trip to snowshoe on the ice was a memorable one I choose not to ever repeat, LOL. I remember sliding completely down a hill...in 4LO and the tranny in 1st 
Some good info posted already; down bag, thick pad, no cotton, etc... I'll just add that my favorite place to put my tent in the snow is under pine trees; I dig down to the needles and build the snow up around: wind break everywhere :) As far as piss bottles: I never use them personally, I just lean out my tent. There was this one time however, when I thought "everything" was outside the wall of the tent and it wasn't
Thank God for easy return policies 
Speed |
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Quoted: So that's why used tents and sleeping bags are so cheap,6, you know I can't go 4wheeling and NOT find a place to get stuck! That trip to snowshoe on the ice was a memorable one I choose not to ever repeat, LOL. I remember sliding completely down a hill...in 4LO and the tranny in 1st Some good info posted already; down bag, thick pad, no cotton, etc... I'll just add that my favorite place to put my tent in the snow is under pine trees; I dig down to the needles and build the snow up around: wind break everywhere :) As far as piss bottles: I never use them personally, I just lean out my tent. There was this one time however, when I thought "everything" was outside the wall of the tent and it wasn't Thank God for easy return policies Speed with 'no returns' disclaimers at the big sporting goods stores........ |
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You need these. I have a pair & LOVE them!!!!! The best part is, you can use them in conjunction with mil issue snowshoes if needed. Still standing upright...lol Pathfinder I've actually got crampons and snow shoes, but the place we were was 200 miles from where I live and it was a localized ice storm that never really made it out on any of the weather reports. In fact, we didn't really know what it was like until we hit the forest roads. I did have a set of tire chains in the bed but it never got quite bad enough for me to chain up.
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