Posted: 5/26/2009 7:40:07 PM EDT
| Just wondering, I have lots of extra lids but what if supply is disrupted for a long time. Can lids be reused if absolutely necessary? What other options of canning are available. |
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Canning is a higher level of food preservation...you have to go to more simple, more primitive levels of food preservation. Smoking, dehydrating, curing would all be viable post SHTF methods of food preservation. higher level? other than the need to have a canner, bottles, lids, etc. all you're really doing is boiling water. |
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Yes but canning is able to preserve food in a way that the other forms struggle with, canned foods are ready to eat.
I don't want to sound like canning is a superior method of food preservation, it is more of a way to preserve food in more of a natural state. Personally I like dehydration more than any other form of preservation but canning and curing have their places too. BTW I do not think you will readily be able to reuse the lids. Even if you get the lid off without bending it you still have the issue that the jar has embedded into the rubber seal and you will have to line that up to ensure a proper seal. That is of course if the rubber's integrity is still intact considering it was exposed to high heat and a lengthy stay on the shelf in most cases. The risks of wasting food or becoming sick due to improvised canning during a SHTF scenario can be ill afforded considering that canning will offer little benefit compared to the other methods when resources are limited. |
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I'm reaching here, I'm not THAT old, but if memory serves, old timers used glass lids with rubber rings and wire compression levers, reusable, and before that, wax or parafin lids for sealing canned food, also reusable with some loss during the cleaning/remelting process.
I'm not sure you need enough lids to last forever, just enough lids to get thru the chaos until local economies settle and some manufacturing is re-established. Canning lids ought to be pretty high priority during any recovery. |
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I'm reaching here, I'm not THAT old, but if memory serves, old timers used glass lids with rubber rings and wire compression levers, reusable, and before that, wax or parafin lids for sealing canned food, also reusable with some loss during the cleaning/remelting process. I'm not sure you need enough lids to last forever, just enough lids to get thru the chaos until local economies settle and some manufacturing is re-established. Canning lids ought to be pretty high priority during any recovery. They still have those jars, I see them all the time at different stores in the kitchen area, the only issue is that they are really expensive, for canning at least. |
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The easiest way is to use a dehydrator, if need be you can just lay it out in the sun but the nutritional value is decreased.
Meat, well that is an entirely different subject that whole books could be written on. You have dehydration, smoking, curing etc with their own theories. Here is a basic instructional guide. Link |
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If you have a limited amount of lids and need to reuse some, try to use the used lids on things that will not be harmed by reprocessing more than once. You will have a higher seal failure ratio, but they can be reused if you are careful when opening them. You will need to tighten the ring a little tighter than you did the first time. I have not tried reusing a lid more than twice yet.
Things most suitable for canning with used lids would be tomato juice, soup, sauce, applesauce, and such. Items that are already of a mush or runny consistency, so that the texture of the food is not changed by the repeated processing because of the lids that did not seal. |
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Someone did a lid reuse test over on TB2K. They had good luck re-useing lids once and then the had to dicard them. There was something about boiling them with I think bakeing soda. YMMV I would highly doubt something that risky would be worthwhile during a SHTF scenario or any other scenario for that matter. You would have the risk of getting sick, potentially lethally for the little ones or the elderly, not to mention the risk of wasting precious food. Are the advantages of canning some food worth the risk when other methods of preservation would suffice? |
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I didn't try to reuse the lids because of a shtf situation. I tried it because I was / am frugal, and I wanted to see if it would work.
As for the food going bad, it you get a seal it almost always holds. If you don't get a seal that is when you reprocess, before the food has a chance to go bad. |
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The best solution is the stock up on lids. They are cheap. Usually around $1.50 or less per dozen.
Depending on how much you are planning on canning and how long you are prepping for. I bet for less than $100 you'd be fine. If it absolutely came down to it, you can try to reuse lids. Before you open a jar with a reused lid make sure it has a good seal still. If there is still a good seal, you'll be fine. |
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Been canning for awhile now. I have re-used lids twice, 3 would probably be stretching it. It might be possible to use parafin to make a lid seal better. Although I do agree with getting more lids. Does that mean you have used them 1 time plus 2 reuses(3 uses total), or is twice the orignal time plus 1 reuse(2 uses total)? |
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Parafin wax can be used for some foods (ie jelly) and can be recycled forever (some is lost when the wax is melted and "dross" or whatever you want to call it is skimmed off.
I know the extension services recomended against used the resealable lids for stuff that must be sealed. Good method for some things like the jelly mentioned, or dehydrated foods. |
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The easiest way is to use a dehydrator, if need be you can just lay it out in the sun but the nutritional value is decreased. Meat, well that is an entirely different subject that whole books could be written on. You have dehydration, smoking, curing etc with their own theories. Here is a basic instructional guide. Link How would one dehydrate a large amount of green beans if the power is out? Then how would you store them? Jars with O2 absorbers? I think it would be easier to find lids than O2 absorbers. Just trying to have a backup plan. |
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The easiest way is to use a dehydrator, if need be you can just lay it out in the sun but the nutritional value is decreased. Meat, well that is an entirely different subject that whole books could be written on. You have dehydration, smoking, curing etc with their own theories. Here is a basic instructional guide. Link How would one dehydrate a large amount of green beans if the power is out? Then how would you store them? Jars with O2 absorbers? I think it would be easier to find lids than O2 absorbers. Just trying to have a backup plan. The old fashioned way, outside in the sun and wind. OR you can smoke em 
You don't need the O2 absorbers, they just add in the long term storage (ie years and years and years). If this is SHTF then your most likely going to store for consumption under 3 years so no O2 absorber is needed. |
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Canning is a higher level of food preservation...you have to go to more simple, more primitive levels of food preservation. Smoking, dehydrating, curing would all be viable post SHTF methods of food preservation. Some foods are just better suited to some methods of preserving(try dehydrating lettuce  ). Having the ability and supplies to can your own food would be another way to keep some more variety in your diet. At a time when our diets would be lacking in variety, having different methods of storing more different food could be useful.
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Canning is a higher level of food preservation...you have to go to more simple, more primitive levels of food preservation. Smoking, dehydrating, curing would all be viable post SHTF methods of food preservation. Some foods are just better suited to some methods of preserving(try dehydrating lettuce ). Having the ability and supplies to can your own food would be another way to keep some more variety in your diet. At a time when our diets would be lacking in variety, having different methods of storing more different food could be useful.
No doubt but first stocking those supplies as you outlined would be the preferred method, not reusing seals against the manufacturers warning to potentially invite a life threatening/food stock threatening infection. I just don't see the benefit of having lettuce on hand is worth the risk of being violently ill when health care may not be available. And yes you can dehydrate certain types of lettuce, the only one I know that may not work well is ice burg. BTW what the hell do you do with canned lettuce? |
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I dont know if we would get enough days with low enough humidity to thoroughly dehydrate tomatoes, green beans, etc. You cannot tell me that in NC. Your forefathers have been doing it for a few centuries now in NC. Think about all the farmers storing and preserving their corn etc. A combination of the heat and wind with dehydrate the food, your not looking for 100% dehydration. Your goal is typically less than 20% moisture to prevent mold. High outdoor humidity may increase the dehydrating time but will not stop it...unless it is raining outside 
I will try to find some specific outdoor dehydrating methods used in the south. |
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I don't can lettuce.
I was just using that as an example that some foods are better suited to some methods of preservation than to others. Some foods work better when canned. Others do well with dehydrating. Others can be stored best in other ways. Cucumbers seem to be best preserved by pickling them. Yes, some foods can be stored using several different methods, and that makes them more flexible when it comes to choosing how to store them. |
| Our post SHTF plan is to dehydrate and root cellar a majority of our food. Canning will be reserved for meat and we will try to reuse lids as long as possible as well as use the older wire bail jars. Also we plan on trying to keep as much of our meat (chickens and rabbits) on the hoof as possible so it goes from the yard to the table without any preservation. I hope to build a real root cellar this fall as we have used our basement the past 2 years with mixed results. |
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The comment on weather was sarcasctic. We had just had rain for 9 straight days! 2 days of cloudy then more rain.
I'm interested in dehydrating. I don't know anyone who has dehydrated green beans. Much less using only mother nature's power. I would definately be interested in learning this. Please provide any tips and info that you have. |
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The comment on weather was sarcasctic. We had just had rain for 9 straight days! 2 days of cloudy then more rain. I'm interested in dehydrating. I don't know anyone who has dehydrated green beans. Much less using only mother nature's power. I would definately be interested in learning this. Please provide any tips and info that you have. Oh green beans are a very good and easy veggie to dehydrate. I use a commercial dehydrator just for ease but I know many of the old school people will still sun dry. With most veggies and fruits you have to blanch the food first. This is done by semi cooking the food. Since boil times vary by too many variables I will describe the step instead. Bring a pot of water to a full rolling boil. Dump in your green beans all at once. This step should take just a few minutes ie less than 5. You know when you cook green beans they will turn that bright green but are not fully cooked yet? That is blanching. Boil them until they first turn bright green then immediately take them out of the water and dump them into cold running water. You are trying to stop all cooking as fast as possible. Blanching will stop all the chemical processes within the veggie preserving the vitamins, flavor and color and stopping the natural ripening/rotting process. Once blanched you just lay them out in the sun in a single layer. Works much better if you lay them on a wire rack and allow them to get a lot of wind or you can hang them. Shouldn't take more than a day or so to completely dehydrate the beans. If you want to build a dehydrator at home you can buy a box fan for about $10 and buy several cotton air filters like the ones for air conditioning or better yet some wire racks. You then put your food on the filters or wire racks and stack them on the fan. The flow of air will dehydrate the food. |
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This is the dehydrator that we are currently building. We are only building one 4x4 now. If it works we will expand it. http://geopathfinder.com/9473.html
As for bulk jars, Walmart is your best bet for new jars and lids. By the time you pay shipping it is a wash as to saving money buying in bulk. Check Ebay as there are $3 off 2 cases of Ball jar coupons around. Also ask around for used jars. They are harder to find now as more people are getting into canning. |
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This is the dehydrator that we are currently building. We are only building one 4x4 now. If it works we will expand it. http://geopathfinder.com/9473.html As for bulk jars, Walmart is your best bet for new jars and lids. By the time you pay shipping it is a wash as to saving money buying in bulk. Check Ebay as there are $3 off 2 cases of Ball jar coupons around. Also ask around for used jars. They are harder to find now as more people are getting into canning. Made it hot. |
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Been canning for awhile now. I have re-used lids twice, 3 would probably be stretching it. It might be possible to use parafin to make a lid seal better. Although I do agree with getting more lids. Does that mean you have used them 1 time plus 2 reuses(3 uses total), or is twice the orignal time plus 1 reuse(2 uses total)? Total of 3. Although I do refridgerate my canned goods after opening them, even the ones high in acid (even though I technically do not have to) |
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What is the storage life of lids? I have been told 2 yrs, and have heard indefinitely from others. Will have to call Kerr or one of the others and see what they say...... There's no "official" recommendation AFAIK. Two to three years is a safe bet if you store them in a place with no extremes of temperature or humidity. The biggest risk, IMO, with old lids isn't immediate seal failure but delayed seal failure. It really sucks to come back six months after canning something and find that a seal has failed. |
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What is the storage life of lids? I have been told 2 yrs, and have heard indefinitely from others. Will have to call Kerr or one of the others and see what they say...... Last year I used some lids that were given to me. The guy quit canning in the early 80s. They all sealed and held fine. I figure I will use all the older ones now when if they fail I can just pop a new one on and reprocess. |