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Posted: 4/30/2008 8:38:18 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/15/2010 2:27:04 PM EDT by thirsty]
[div style='text-align: center;']NY and NJ Hometown Forum
Informal Guide to New York State Firearms Laws
</center id=center>
* This is an informal guide to NY firearms laws based on my limited understanding of the laws.  At no time does this guide attempt to interpret or define the law, it exists solely as an information resource regarding the oft-confusing laws of firearms ownership in NYS.  This guide is not a substitute for professional legal advice.

Important Links:
NRA-ILA Guide to NY laws
NRA-ILA Guide to NYC laws
New York State Rifle and Pistol Association
http://public.leginfo.state.ny.us/menugetf.cgi?COMMONQUERY=LAWS

Licensing information:
License to purchase handguns
-Yes
License to purchase rifles and shotguns
-No (Yes in NYC)

FAQs

The Assault Weapons Ban

Q: Does New York State have an Assault Weapons Ban (AWB)?
A: Yes.  On top of the state ban, there are some localities in NYS that have additional laws regarding semi-automatic “assault weapons,” such as NYC and Rochester.  You can find info regarding these laws in this informational post.

Q: Why does the NY ban include the date of September 14, 1994 when the NYS ban was signed into law in the year 2000?
A: NYS has an AWB that closely follows the now sunset federal ban that was signed into law by President Clinton and effective on Sept. 14th, 1994.  The NY version was signed into law by Gov. Pataki in 2000, but retained the same dates.  Note there are a few differences in wording between the NYS AWB and federal ban but otherwise they are the same.

Q: What is the importance of the terms “pre-ban” and “post-ban?”
A: The significance of these terms comes to play under the AWB.  Weapons manufactured before the effective date of the AWB (September 14, 1994) are considered “pre-ban” and exempt from the law.  Weapons manufactured on the date or after are considered “post-ban” and have to comply with the law.

Q: What is a “semiautomatic assault weapon” (SAW)?
A: A SAW is a rifle, shotgun, or pistol manufactured after September 14, 1994 with certain “evil” features.  See below for more information regarding the state law as it pertains to rifles, shotguns and pistols.

Rifles
To qualify as a SAW, a rifle must be semiautomatic (otherwise known as auto-loading) and must be able to accept a detachable magazine.  A post-ban rifle that qualifies as a SAW must not have more than one “evil” feature.  These “evil” features are as follows:
  • A pistol grip

  • A flash hider or a threaded barrel that can readily accept a flash hider or suppressor

  • A folding or telescoping stock

  • A bayonet lug

  • A grenade launcher


Shotguns
To qualify as a SAW, a shotgun must be semiautomatic.  As with semi-auto rifles, it must not have more than one “evil” feature.  These “evil” features are as follows:
  • A fixed magazine capacity greater than 5 rounds

  • A folding or telescoping stock

  • A pistol grip

  • The ability to accept a detachable magazine  (Please note that while this is an evil feature of shotguns, it is not one for rifles)


Pistols
In order to qualify as a SAW, a pistol must be semiautomatic and be able to accept a detachable magazine.  It may not have more than one “evil” feature.  These “evil” features are as follows:
  • A threaded barrel capable of accepting a sound suppressor, forward grip, barrel extension, or flash hider

  • A barrel shroud that partially or completely encircles the barrel

  • A magazine that attaches to the pistol outside of the pistol grip

  • A manufactured weight of 50 ounces or greater unloaded



Image courtesy feraldan

The law also states that semi-automatic versions of fully-automatic weapons are illegal, but this is rather ambiguous.  Many of us here in NYS own AR-15 rifles and AK-47 clones.

Furthermore, the AWB states:
1.) Assault weapon means:
  • Any of the weapons, or functioning frames or receivers of such weapons, or copies or duplicates of such weapons, in any caliber, known as:

  • Norinco, Polytech, and Mitchell Avtomat Kalashnikovs (AK-47’s);

  • Action Arms IMI (Israeli Military Industries) Uzi and Galil;

  • Beretta AR-70 (SC-70);

  • Colt AR-15;

  • Fabrique Nationale FAL, LAR, and FNC;

  • SWD M-10, M-11, M 11/9, M-12;

  • Steyr AUG;

  • INTRATEC TEC-9, TEC-DC9 and TEC-22;

  • Revolving cylinder shotguns such as (or similar to) the Street Sweeper or Striker 12

What this list means is post-ban Colt rifles with an “AR-15” roll mark are not legal.  Note: If the rifle is marked “Sporter” instead of “AR-15,” it is legal despite the fact it is the same machine.  Again, pre-bans are exempt.

Q: But my post-ban Bushmaster XM-15 is the same as a Colt AR-15! According to the list, is it illegal?
A: No.  Your post-ban Bushmaster is perfectly legal to own as long as you keep it within the law.

Q: I saw a Remington 870 shotgun in Gander Mtn. and it had a capacity of 8 rounds and a collapsing stock.  Isn’t that an assault weapon?
A: No! Under the AWB, it is exempt because it is not a semiautomatic shotgun. It’s a pump action so it can have the whole list of evil features and still be perfectly legal.  The law exempts certain weapons by stating:
  • Assault weapons do not include:

  • Any rifle, shotgun, or pistol that: is manually operated by bolt, pump, slide or lever action; or has been rendered permanently inoperable;

  • An antique firearm as defined under federal law;

  • A semiautomatic rifle that cannot accept a detachable magazine that holds more than 5 rounds of ammo;

  • A semiautomatic shotgun that cannot hold more than 5 rounds of ammo in a fixed or detachable magazine;

  • A rifle, shotgun or pistol, or a replica or a duplicate thereof, specifically exempted from the federal assault weapon ban list as such weapon was manufactured on October 1, 1993.


Q: I have a pre-ban Bushmaster lower receiver.  Do I have to use pre-ban parts to build it into a legal rifle?
A: No! You can buy brand new parts for your rifle; they don’t have to be pre-ban.  Go onto any vendor of manufacturer on the web, and order yourself the most evil upper you like.  As long as you obey other applicable state and federal laws, you can build your dream AR-15 style weapon with a pre-ban receiver.

Q: I have a PWA pre-ban lower and I’m not sure it was a complete rifle before the ban.  Can I build it into a pre-ban rifle?
A: Yes, it is legal to build into a pre-ban rifle.  Note there is no official, written ruling from any authority in NY.  If you are uncomfortable building on such a receiver then you don't have to.  As with anything you should proceed in the manner you’re comfortable with.

Q: I have a post-ban rifle with a barrel threaded at the muzzle, but the muzzle brake is welded on permanently.  The ATF ruled this was legal under the federal ban.  NYS has no ruling regarding this.  Is it legal per the NYS AWB?
A: Again, yes/no/maybe.  Authorities in NYS have not made any rulings on any part of the AWB.  So the simple answer is nobody really knows.  Most people feel if you abide by the BATFE ruling that states the muzzle brake must be welded on with 1100 degree silver solder, you should be good to go.  Others feel that if you have such barrels with welded muzzle brakes, you’re leaving yourself open to prosecution and being the test case for rulings regarding the NYS AWB.  It really depends on what you’re comfortable with.  If you don’t have any post-ban rifles with threaded barrels, you don’t have anything to worry about.  If you do have a post-ban rifle with a threaded barrel and a pinned/welded muzzle brake, you probably still have nothing to worry about as you have the federal rulings on your side, but there is a risk.  It’s up to you how you fit out your post-ban rifles.

Q: Can I install a vertical foregrip (VFG) on my post-ban rifle?
A: Yes.  There are no restrictions regarding VFG’s.

Q: Are high capacity magazines legal?
A:  Newly manufactured large capacity ammunition feeding devices (hi-cap mags) with a capacity of more than 10-rounds are not legal.  However, those made before that magical date of September 14, 1994 are exempt from the law, no matter what their capacity is.  Even 100 round pre-ban Beta magazines are legal, but they cost a small fortune.

Q: Can I use pre-ban magazines in post-ban weapons?
A: This is a very frequently asked question.  It is a common misconception; “a gun-show myth” even, that pre-ban magazines can only be used in pre-ban weapons.  The answer is yes; absolutely you can use pre-ban magazines in any weapon, post-ban or otherwise.  So go ahead, splurge on that pre-ban Beta mag and have fun until your post-ban barrel melts!

Q: Since the federal ban has sunset and new magazines are being made without LEO markings, is it safe to purchase new manufacture magazines as there is no way to prove whether they are pre-ban or not?
A: Do whatever you want; it’s your ass on the line, not anybody else’s.  Frankly, there are plenty of pre-bans out there for the taking, so why risk it? Get some pre-bans, be able to prove their date of manufacture, and have fun without fear of losing your guns or the right to own guns over a stupid and ineffective law.

Q: I see a lot of ads on Gunbroker.com for pre-ban stuff.  Is there really that much stuff out there?
A: No.  There are vendors on Gunbroker who are listing their no-ban wares as pre-ban.  What the ad is stating is the weapon or part is “pre-ban” only in the sense that its configuration is that of a weapon before the ban, even if the weapon or part was made after the ban.  Buyer beware! Make sure you establish pre-ban (pre-September 14, 1994) status before you bid- it’s your ass, not the seller’s!

Q: I was looking through the photo galleries in the technical forums, and I saw that some members have rifles with barrels shorter than 16”.  Can I own those here in NY?
A: No.  Full auto weapons, short-barreled rifles (SBR’s; rifles with barrel lengths shorter than 16 inches), short-barreled shotguns (SBS’; shotguns with barrel lengths shorter than 18 inches) and other fun NFA (National Firearms Act) toys are not legal here, with exceptions.  You can get a smooth-bore 12GA. shotgun pistol like the Serbu (considered an AOW; Any Other Weapon) on your pistol permit.  Destructive devices (DD’s) are also AOW’s and not prohibited by NYS laws either. For any NFA stuff, you have to go through your local chief law enforcement officer for a signature on your BATFE paperwork.  With some counties in NY, getting a sign-off on a Form 4 is a pipe dream.

Ammo in NY

Q: I heard from a guy at the gunshow /gunstore /somewhere that it is illegal to own more than (insert quantity limit here) rounds of ammunition at one time.  Is this true?
A: This is also a question that gets asked a lot.  Completely untrue.  There is no limit to how much ammo you can keep and store at any one time.

Q: What about reloading supplies like smokeless powder and primers? Any limits?
A: Again, no.  Really, your limit should be what you can safely store.

Q: Can I purchase pistol ammo for my pistol-caliber carbine without having a pistol permit?
A: Yes.  However some stores will not sell you pistol ammo unless you have a valid pistol permit, even if you explain the ammo is meant for a rifle.

Q: At the gunshow /gunstore/somewhere I heard steel core ammo is armor-piercing and illegal to own and shoot in NY.  Is that true?
A: Yes and No.  If we're talking about pistol ammo, it is not legal to own and shoot both on the federal level and in NY.  From the penal code:
18.  "Armor piercing ammunition" means any ammunition capable of being used in pistols or revolvers containing a projectile or projectile core, or a projectile or projectile core for use in such ammunition,  that  is constructed   entirely  (excluding  the  presence  of  traces  of  other substances) from one or a combination of any of the following:  tungsten alloys, steel, iron, brass, bronze, beryllium copper, or uranium.

A lot of different surplus rifle ammunition out there has steel core bullets, but they are perfectly legal to own and shoot.

Q: Can I order ammo over the internet and have it shipped into NY?
A: Yes, there are no restrictions.

Q: Can I ship ammo?
A: Yes.  Packages must be marked clearly with ORM-D labels and follow all applicable rules for shipping ammunition.

Handguns in New York

Q: How do I get a pistol permit?
A:  It varies by county.  Generally in Upstate (not NYC), you pay $10 at your licensing authority to get your application.  READ THE DIRECTIONS, then fill it out.  You identify four (4) references.  Your county may have its own requirements regarding references.  Generally they cannot be next of kin.  You then schedule an appointment for fingerprinting and to get your mug shot photograph taken.  At that time, you sign the application in the presence of an authority figure and pay the background check fee (a maximum of $99) and submit your application.  Then you wait.  The penal code allows the state a maximum of 6 months to perform the background check and either approve or deny you.  It’s not unheard of to be forced to wait longer in some counties.  If they deny you, they have to provide you a written reason for the denial.

There are three types of licenses; premises, carry with regards to employment, and full carry (otherwise known as unrestricted).  They’re pretty straightforward.  A premises permit allows you to keep the pistol in your home for self-defense, but it technically can’t leave the property.  A carry with regards to employment allows you to carry a weapon while performing the functions of your job.  An unrestricted license has no restrictions on when you can carry.  If you have a CHL, you can carry concealed a loaded pistol on your person whenever you feel like it, with certain exceptions mostly relating to where you can carry.

To get a full carry license, you have to prove a need for one.  In some counties, getting an unrestricted license is a cake-walk; in others it’s next to impossible.  Licensing officers often add restrictions to permits so you can’t have a full carry.  Some counties have designed permits that are essentially carry permits with specific restrictions built in, like Onondaga County’s “Sportsman’s License.”  However, it’s important to note that the penal code makes no such provision for a “Sportsman’s License,” it’s just something a judge or licensing officer made up to make the process for adding restrictions easier.  Rather than specifically spell out such restrictions each time a permit application hits his/her desk, the judge/licensing officer created the class of license with those restrictions built in.

If you have a full carry license, you can’t carry in federal/state/local government buildings including courthouses; you can’t carry near schools and other “gun-free zones.”

Go here for a thread with information regarding specific county requirements.  The list is incomplete, so if you have a permit from a county not listed, help us out and post some info to fill in the blanks.

Q: I heard you can buy black powder handguns without a license.  Is that true?
A: Yes, muzzle loading pistols and cap and ball revolvers can be purchased without a license.  BUT if you buy powder and bullets to shoot those pistols, you are legally required to register those guns on your pistol license.

AR pistols

Q: What is the deal with AR pistols? Are they legal?
A: With AR pistols, there are several things to be aware of as far as legality.  AR pistols are legal in NYS and on the federal level.

Q: What are some of the concerns on the state level?
A: The NYS AWB makes post-ban AR pistols a tricky affair.  Take a look above at the AWB rules for pistols.  An AR-15 pistol has a magazine that attaches outside the grip; there is nothing you can do to change that unless you were to install a fixed magazine.  Therefore it is your one evil feature.  All other features listed have to comply with the law.

Your post-ban AR pistol cannot have a barrel shroud, a threaded muzzle, or weigh more than 50 ounces empty.

Q: But that pretty much rules out any AR pistol on the market!
A: Bushmaster makes a Carbon-15 pistol that fits the law.  Olympic Arms makes a pistol with lightening cuts on the receiver that is also legal.

Q: So I can go out and buy the Carbon-15 like I would a rifle, right?
A: Not so fast.  To buy an AR pistol in NY, you need a pistol permit to put it on, which means you need to be 21 years of age.  Even though you can legally buy an AR rifle after turning 18.

Q: What are the federal considerations to AR pistols?
A: The AR can swap barrel lengths and calibers with a simple upper swap, except you can’t just go and change your AR rifle into a pistol and call it legal.  Once a rifle, always a rifle.  So with that in mind, if you change your AR rifle into a pistol, you just manufactured an SBR illegally.  Likewise, if you buy a used lower, you can’t make it into a pistol unless you’re sure it was always a pistol.  If it was a rifle in its life, even for a nanosecond, turning it into a pistol is manufacturing an SBR.

Q: I want a foregrip on my pistol.  Since some AOW’s are legal in NY, can I file the paperwork to make my AR pistol an AOW?
A: If you have a pre-ban pistol, you probably could.  Post-bans have to contend with the rules of the AWB in NY, which means no threaded barrel, no barrel shroud, and strict weight limits that would easily be violated by adding more stuff onto an already heavy pistol.

Non-resident FAQ’s

Q: I’m moving to NY from [insert state name here].  Can I bring my rifles and pistols?
A: As long as your rifles don’t violate the AWB laws, yes.  Pistols are another story.  In NY, you have to meet certain requirements to obtain a pistol permit, and that takes as long as 6 months, or longer!  You can leave your guns in your previous state of residence while you get your permit here, you can ship them to an FFL in NYS for safe keeping while you get your license, or you can sell them off and start fresh.  You might even be able to get your county’s licensing authority to hold onto them while your permit goes through the system.  DO NOT bring them with you until you’re licensed in NYS!

Q: I’m visiting family and friends in [insert county name here], can I bring my rifles and pistols?
A: Again, rifles and shotguns are ok so long as your rifles and shotguns don’t violate the AWB of NYS.  Don’t bring post-ban large capacity magazines (mags more than 10 rounds) unless they are pre-Sept. 14, 1994 manufacture.  When entering the state, have the weapons locked in a case in the trunk, separate from ammunition (put the guns in the back and the ammo up front, or have some measure of separation between them).  Do not keep the weapons loaded, it is illegal in NY to transport a loaded rifle.  It probably isn't wise to transport loaded magazines either.

Do not bring your pistols to any part of NYS.  NY is very strict about this.  NY doesn’t honor any pistol permits but its own, there is no reciprocity! Save yourself the trouble!

Now for the NYC rules: NYC issues separate permits for all handguns, rifles and shotguns.  If you’re just passing through, then keep the weapons locked in a case in the trunk and don’t stop until you’re clear of the city.  Do not bring weapons into the 5 boroughs of NYC if that is your destination.

Q: Does NY issue non-resident pistol permits?
A: No.  Maybe if you’re rich and/or famous, but otherwise, no.

Other FAQ's:

Q: Is [insert various rifle/pistol/shotgun model] legal in NY?
A:
FS2000 - Yes
PS90 - Yes
SCAR L/H- Yes, when properly modified.  It can be done!
Sig 556 - Yes, a ban state model is available.  With the other models they need to be made compliant by adding a permanent muzzle brake and fixing the stock.  It can be done!
Bushmaster ACR - Yes, a ban state model is available
MSAR - Yes, a ban state model that accepts AR mags is available
Pretty much all makes and models that are not yet compliant can be made to be!

Q: How do I permanently modify a non-compliant model?
A: Since having a non-compliant gun is illegal for a non-LEO, have your newly purchased rifle shipped directly to a manufacturer FFL to do the work.  Many vendors who are also FFL manufacturers or gunsmiths, such as Global Tactical/Denny's Guns, ADCO (and several others), will modify any rifle that can be modified to make them compliant.  They're good at it too.  All you have to do is call them or send them an email requesting more info!

Fighting back!

Q: These laws suck! How can we change them?
A: You can start by joining the New York State Rifle and Pistol Association (NYSRPA).  Donate.  Write your reps in support of the 2nd Amendment.  Be courteous and polite, but be firm as well.  Support the candidates endorsed by the NYSRPA.  Join the NRA as well.  They spend lots of money here in NY; this state is a battleground and for the sake of the Northeast US we can’t lose!

NYSRPA Membership application

Donate to the NYSRPA-PAC (Political Action Committee)!

In light of the recent blitz of AWB questions, I typed this up borrowing what I could from past discussions.  This is a work in progress.  If something isn't right or unclear, or if you have some suggestions, post them here!

Thanks!
-thirsty  
Link Posted: 4/30/2008 11:39:42 AM EDT
GOOD WORK! Now if the "if, and, or, but" crowd will just read the information supplied instead of asking redundant questions we'll all be much happier. (well except for a few that thrive on misery)
This should be tacked to the top....won't be long before there are more "stickies" than posts.
Link Posted: 4/30/2008 12:24:43 PM EDT

Originally Posted By fp1201:
This should be tacked to the top....
agreed! Excellent post!
Link Posted: 4/30/2008 3:38:48 PM EDT
Nice job Thirsty.....I smell a sticky with this thread.  Very informative and well laid out.
Link Posted: 4/30/2008 3:43:02 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/30/2008 3:57:20 PM EDT
nice!
Link Posted: 4/30/2008 4:25:43 PM EDT
I never knew that we could theoretically own Destructive Devices in NY.  I always assumed that was prohibited like SBRs and such.
Link Posted: 4/30/2008 4:27:51 PM EDT
Thanks fellas!

I figured it would be easier to understand if all this info came in a plain English FAQ format.  We already have links to the actual AWB text tacked at the top, so I don't know what help this will be.  But here it is.
Link Posted: 4/30/2008 5:28:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/30/2008 5:29:26 PM EDT by palmer]
Excellent post Thirsty!!


One thing I'd like to add ;



Link Posted: 4/30/2008 8:48:32 PM EDT
This is an excellent post.  I've had questions myself, and I've seen bunches of misinformed posts on other gun related forums.  This is going to be valuable to quote in those cases.
THD
Link Posted: 5/2/2008 9:45:38 AM EDT
Updated to add the recent ammo questions.
Link Posted: 5/2/2008 11:50:37 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/2/2008 11:52:24 AM EDT by 762DM]
Check out the NY Gun Laws book from Loose Leaf Press. Excellent source of information.

BTW had a meeting about employment in Melbourne Fl. 46 weeks.
Link Posted: 5/2/2008 12:15:21 PM EDT
Great job Thirsty. Youve definetly invested some time in this.

I have a suggestion. Being as this is ar15.com and there has been a modicum amount of interest & questions on AR Pistols over the years, could you dedicate a section to  that topic?

Its one of the "grayest" areas as you have the confluence of the NYS AWB and the Sullivan laws.
Link Posted: 5/2/2008 12:39:40 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/2/2008 1:24:20 PM EDT by thirsty]

Originally Posted By Adirondack47:
Great job Thirsty. Youve definetly invested some time in this.

I have a suggestion. Being as this is ar15.com and there has been a modicum amount of interest & questions on AR Pistols over the years, could you dedicate a section to  that topic?

Its one of the "grayest" areas as you have the confluence of the NYS AWB and the Sullivan laws.

I'm working on it now!  I saw the question regarding pistols and AOW's and I began to punch up a few answers.  This stuff can be confusing as hell.

Done! Let me know if everything is correct.
Link Posted: 5/2/2008 1:32:56 PM EDT
very good so far, thanks for the post, excellent resource
Link Posted: 5/13/2008 10:40:46 AM EDT
Bump.  I'm going to add some new stuff that was recently posted.
Link Posted: 5/13/2008 4:19:56 PM EDT
Awesome job.

Can my pre/post ban graphic be part of the fun?

Link Posted: 5/13/2008 4:29:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By feraldan:
Awesome job.

Can my pre/post ban graphic be part of the fun?

i175.photobucket.com/albums/w149/feraldan/AWB.jpg

Done!
Link Posted: 5/14/2008 8:54:24 AM EDT
A little piece of ARFCOM immortality.

Some other suggestions:

- FAQ for shipping items to or from NYS. Especially for the sellers/dealers who always pop in here.

- FAQ for whether or not certain ammunition is banned. That gets brought up every now and then.
Link Posted: 5/15/2008 7:52:49 PM EDT
*bump*
Link Posted: 5/15/2008 8:14:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/15/2008 8:14:53 PM EDT by PK90]
Excellent work.  Where are the MODS?  WE NEED A TACK FOR THIS THREAD!!!!

Better yet, can the NY/NJ Mods take a lesson from slidestop?  Check out the format in the PA Hometown forum.  All important threads listed on one page >

IMPORTANT THREADS/Gun Shows,Ranges,FFLs,Gun Shops, Legislative Info & *MORE* Updated 4/11/08
Link Posted: 5/16/2008 6:25:46 AM EDT
Link Posted: 5/16/2008 7:07:20 AM EDT

Originally Posted By mag162:
You mean like this page at the very top of the NY/NJ hometown forum?
Noboby reads the tacked threads they figure its easier to start a new thread. I will tack thirsty's thread cause he did an excellant job putting it together. But please dont compare us to those in the Pa forums .

Yes.  That lame tack.  But not yours I know.  Why not throw all the others into that one?
Link Posted: 5/16/2008 8:25:06 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/16/2008 8:40:51 AM EDT by thirsty]
Thank you for the tack.

I have an update with the suggestions feraldan made in the works.  I'll have ammo covered, as well as shipping in and out of NYS.  Also, I'm going to put in answers to questions every newb seems to ask about the legality of certain guns like the PS90, FS2000, AUG, etc.

ETA:
Q: At the same gunshow /gunstore/somewhere I heard steel core ammo is armor-piercing and illegal to own and shoot in NY. Is that true?
A: Yes and No. If we're talking about pistol ammo, it is not legal to own and shoot both on the federal level and in NY. A lot of different surplus rifle ammunition out there has steel core bullets, but they are perfectly legal to own and shoot.

Can anyone help out on this? I'm not sure if I have it right, exactly.  Are there additional restrictions in NY concerning pistol ammo? I'm thinking the only restrictions on ammo come from the BATFE.
Link Posted: 5/18/2008 11:57:16 AM EDT
great post
someone should post something like this on the wall of every gun shop in NYS.
Link Posted: 5/19/2008 8:48:24 PM EDT
What happened with the unpin?
Link Posted: 5/20/2008 6:50:38 AM EDT
Looks like thirsty is going to have to bump this thread once a month.  A link to this thread is in the Legal Resources - Permit Issues, State AWB, etc. pinned thread.
Link Posted: 5/20/2008 7:08:15 AM EDT
Let's pin this thread Mods!
Link Posted: 5/20/2008 7:31:17 AM EDT
Hey Thirsty, can we put some clarification at the top of the post as a reference for people hesitant to sell to NYers? That way we can have something to direct people to when they don't want to sell that $150 preban colt lower to you because you are in NY. Just something that says that it is legal to sell preban firearms, mags, etc would proably be sufficient. What do you guys think?
Link Posted: 5/20/2008 8:28:28 AM EDT

Originally Posted By raysheen:
Hey Thirsty, can we put some clarification at the top of the post as a reference for people hesitant to sell to NYers?

Can do.  I'll put it on my list of things to add/update.
Link Posted: 5/20/2008 11:00:38 AM EDT
WOW!!!  Now you got 2 links in the same thread > Legal Resources - Permit Issues, State AWB, etc.

NYS Gun Law Resource and FAQ AND thirsty's AWB informational thread

You must be special.  
Link Posted: 5/21/2008 1:27:09 AM EDT
bump to the top for noobs
Link Posted: 5/21/2008 8:26:56 AM EDT

Originally Posted By PK90:
WOW!!!  Now you got 2 links in the same thread > Legal Resources - Permit Issues, State AWB, etc.

NYS Gun Law Resource and FAQ AND thirsty's AWB informational thread

You must be special.  

Oh yeah, I'm special ed.
Link Posted: 6/4/2008 1:59:43 PM EDT
Edited.  Added NY definition of armor piercing ammunition and clarified the PWA lower stuff.
Link Posted: 6/5/2008 8:59:11 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/5/2008 8:59:46 AM EDT by rkbar15]

Originally Posted By thirsty:
Edited.  Added NY definition of armor piercing ammunition and clarified the PWA lower stuff.


Would you take what I posted in the other thread out of the FAQ PWA issue. It really has nothing to do with it as it is not codified in NY law. 762DM gave you his opinion of the NY definition of a preban.

I also changed it slightly.


This is just general info concerning the Federal AWB. The Federal AWB expired on 09-13-2004 and is only listed for historical purposes.

ATF Opinion on definition of an exempt assault weapon commonly referred to as a preban:

The ATF was of the opinion that a rifle must have been lawfully possessed by a person, distributor, manufacturer, dealer etc. on or prior to 09-13-1994 as either:

1. An assembled rifle with at least two characteristics (flash suppressor, collapsible stock, pistol grip etc.) to qualify as a assault weapon. OR

2. An unassembled rifle kit with ALL the components required to build a functioning rifle with at least two characteristics (flash suppressor, collapsible stock, pistol grip etc.) to qualify as a assault weapon. The rifle kit could have consisted of a stripped lower as long as you possessed ALL the components required to build a functioning rifle on or prior to 09-13-1994, OR

3. One of the 19 named assault weapons in any configuration.


Link Posted: 6/5/2008 8:42:04 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/5/2008 8:59:35 PM EDT by UncleBrady]
You may want to include these firearm mailing topics from the ATF website...

(nonlicensee = someone who does not have a FFL license, i.e. most of us)


May a nonlicensee ship a firearm through the U.S. Postal Service?

A nonlicensee may not transfer a firearm to a non-licensed resident of another State. A nonlicensee may mail a shotgun or rifle to a resident of his or her own State or to a licensee in any State. The Postal Service recommends that long guns be sent by registered mail and that no marking of any kind which would indicate the nature of the contents be placed on the outside of any parcel containing firearms. Handguns are not mailable. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun.

[18 U.S.C. 1715, 922(a)(3), 922(a)(5) and 922 (a)(2)(A)]

May a nonlicensee ship a firearm by common or contract carrier?

A nonlicensee may ship a firearm by a common or contract carrier to a resident of his or her own State or to a licensee in any State. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun. In addition, Federal law requires that the carrier be notified that the shipment contains a firearm and prohibits common or contract carriers from requiring or causing any label to be placed on any package indicating that it contains a firearm.

[18 U.S.C. 922(a)(2)(A), 922(a) (3), 922(a)(5) and 922(e), 27 CFR 478.31 and 478.30]

May a nonlicensee ship firearms interstate for his or her use in hunting or other lawful activity?

Yes. A person may ship a firearm to himself or herself in care of another person in the State where he or she intends to hunt or engage in any other lawful activity. The package should be addressed to the owner. Persons other than the owner should not open the package and take possession of the firearm.



---------
or
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In simpler question form:

Can I mail a firearm via USPS to someone?

Yes, you may mail a rifle or shotgun via USPS to ANYONE in the SAME state but ONLY a FFL holder in DIFFERENT state.  You can NOT mail a handgun through USPS.  You can mail a rifle or shotgun via USPS to YOURSELF in a different state if you're going there for hunting or other lawful purposes; it should be addressed to yourself and no one else should open it.   The Postal Service recommends that long guns be sent by registered mail and that no marking of any kind which would indicate the nature of the contents be placed on the outside of any parcel containing firearms.


Then how about shipping handguns or using UPS or Fed-Ex?

You can ship a rifle, shotgun, or handgun via UPS or Fed-Ex to ANYONE in the SAME state but ONLY a FFL holder in DIFFERENT state.  You MUST declare to UPS or Fed-Ex that your package contains a firearm, but federal law prohibits them from marking your package in any way to show that it contains a firearm.  You can ship a rifle, shotgun, or handgun via UPS or Fed-Ex to YOURSELF in a different state if you're going there for hunting or other lawful purposes.

Link Posted: 6/11/2008 5:29:18 PM EDT

Originally Posted By thirsty:
NYS Penal Code, Article 265; Firearms and Other Dangerous Weapons



This site has not been updated with 2007 changes to the PL. You could get yourself jammed up using it as a reference.

Use the NYS wesite for up-to-date laws in NY.

http://public.leginfo.state.ny.us/menugetf.cgi?COMMONQUERY=LAWS (leave cold)
Link Posted: 6/11/2008 5:51:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/11/2008 5:52:24 PM EDT by rkbar15]

Originally Posted By UncleBrady:
May a nonlicensee ship a firearm by common or contract carrier?

A nonlicensee may ship a firearm by a common or contract carrier to a resident of his or her own State or to a licensee in any State. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun. In addition, Federal law requires that the carrier be notified that the shipment contains a firearm and prohibits common or contract carriers from requiring or causing any label to be placed on any package indicating that it contains a firearm.

[18 U.S.C. 922(a)(2)(A), 922(a) (3), 922(a)(5) and 922(e), 27 CFR 478.31 and 478.30]


The FAQ is not correct in all respects. You are not required to notify the carrier that the shipment contains a firearm unless you are shipping the firearm to an unlicensed person.

http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/ts_search.pl?title=18&sec=922

United States Code
TITLE 18 - CRIMES AND CRIMINAL PROCEDURE
PART I - CRIMES
CHAPTER 44 - FIREARMS

Section 922. Unlawful acts

     (a) It shall be unlawful -

       (1) for any person -

.........................................

(e) It shall be unlawful for any person knowingly to deliver or
   cause to be delivered to any common or contract carrier for
   transportation or shipment in interstate or foreign commerce, to
   persons other than licensed importers, licensed manufacturers,
   licensed dealers, or licensed collectors, any package or other
   container in which there is any firearm or ammunition without
   written notice to the carrier that such firearm or ammunition is
   being transported or shipped;
Link Posted: 6/11/2008 6:27:59 PM EDT

Originally Posted By rkbar15:

Originally Posted By thirsty:
NYS Penal Code, Article 265; Firearms and Other Dangerous Weapons



This site has not been updated with 2007 changes to the PL. You could get yourself jammed up using it as a reference.

Use the NYS wesite for up-to-date laws in NY.

http://public.leginfo.state.ny.us/menugetf.cgi?COMMONQUERY=LAWS (leave cold)

Thanks!

I've been using the site you posted recently while writing updates, but I didn't realize the link I have posted in the FAQ is out of date.  Fixed!
Link Posted: 6/14/2008 1:46:04 AM EDT
Can preban mags be shipped to NYC?
Link Posted: 7/1/2008 11:21:13 PM EDT
Pre-Ban mags can be shipped to NY State..Not NYC....but will every retailer ship to us?
NO!
Midway had a sale recently on 1980's Euro AK mags...they even stated the date of manufacture in their advertisement, but their policy is to not ship any mag over 10 rounds to NY State,or other ban states, Period!! They are not interested in the minutia of the laws in NY, NJ, CT, Ill, CA, etc..
So while it is legal to ship TRUE pre-ban mags to NY, few dealers will...some have shipped TRUE pre-bans to me, but the EE or gunshows is the way to go..Inho
Most guys on the EE know that it is legal...happy hunting!
Link Posted: 7/2/2008 8:11:17 AM EDT
17 round (or less) preban pistol mags that don't extend below the grip frame are not illegal to possess in NYC for a registered pistol that uses them.
Link Posted: 10/14/2008 11:23:53 AM EDT
Geetings !
Can I a "NJian" buy a rifle (Garand) FTF from a NY'er ? Or does ih have to go thru an FFL ?
Link Posted: 10/14/2008 3:00:31 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Medic-1:
Geetings !
Can I a "NJian" buy a rifle (Garand) FTF from a NY'er ? Or does ih have to go thru an FFL ?



FTF transactions are only legal (with some exceptions) between residents of the same state AND state law does not prohibit  such FTF transactions.

Your options are:

Have the rifle shipped to a NJ FFL for transfer to you.

The two of you meet in person at either a NY or NJ FFL and the FFL will transfer the rifle to you.
Link Posted: 12/9/2008 8:46:22 AM EDT
Hi, newbie here.  Is there information like this for NJ?  I am trying to assess if I can own any type of AR in NJ.
Link Posted: 12/9/2008 10:04:39 AM EDT
Great work. Hopefully it will reduce many reoccurring question posts. For some strange reason I myself thought vertical fore grips were one of the evil features and never thought of adding one to my Bushy.
Link Posted: 1/3/2009 2:02:35 AM EDT
Question: does the California Bullet Button make an AR pattern rifle or similar a fixed magazine gun by NY state standards?
Link Posted: 2/1/2009 9:25:33 AM EDT
NY has no official standards.
Link Posted: 7/1/2009 12:55:16 PM EDT
Alright BUMP because these laws are BS.  I'm a non-primary NY resident.

So let me get this straight...if you have a rifle manufactured prior to 1994, it can have all the goodies on it? (Flash supressor/threaded barrel, ability to accept high cap mags, bayonet lug, pistol grip, folding stock)

So, hypothetically, (I'm sure this has been brought up before, I just haven't read it), since the lower is basically the only part of the weapon that has to be registered and has the serial number on it, couldn't you take a newly-manufactured weapon, slap a pre-ban lower on it, and it would be grandfathered in?  Forgive my noobness, I'm probably totally wrong
Link Posted: 7/3/2009 8:17:56 PM EDT



Originally Posted By david05111:


Alright BUMP because these laws are BS.  I'm a non-primary NY resident.



So let me get this straight...if you have a rifle manufactured prior to 1994, it can have all the goodies on it? (Flash supressor/threaded barrel, ability to accept high cap mags, bayonet lug, pistol grip, folding stock)



So, hypothetically, (I'm sure this has been brought up before, I just haven't read it), since the lower is basically the only part of the weapon that has to be registered and has the serial number on it, couldn't you take a newly-manufactured weapon, slap a pre-ban lower on it, and it would be grandfathered in?  Forgive my noobness, I'm probably totally wrong


Yes.  Except the ability to accept detachable magazines is not an "evil" feature.  And all rifles can use pre-ban high-capacity magazines regardless of whether the rifles/pistols are pre- or post-ban.  



Rifles/lowers are not registered.  If you change lowers, you have an entirely different rifle.  A pre-ban lower builds into a pre-ban rifle.





 
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