Posted: 8/21/2024 8:14:09 PM EDT
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I've been on a 9mm revolver kick for a while. I don't know why, but I just find them interesting. Maybe because of ammo availability. Plus I have a lot of 9mm auto handguns, and a lot of 9mm ammo. There have always been naysayers and folks that say the round is pointless in a snubnose revolver. I decided to do some testing, collect some data and see how they compare to a 357 snubnose as well as compact and semi-compact semi-automatics. So I packed up some various ammo, my S&W Performance Center 986 (2.5" bbl), two Ruger SP-101s with 2.5" barrels (one chambered in 357Mag and the other 9mm), a first gen S&W 9mm Shield (3" bbl), a CZ PCR (3.8" bbl), and at zero dark thirty, headed to the range. I setup my chronograph and a 4" bullseye target at 27 yards. I'm not the best pistol shot, but one thing that I found interesting was I had no trouble keeping my shots in the black with the Shield. The PCR was also easy. Both guns have the very excellent TruGlo TFX sights (tritium night sights combined with fiber optics, and just a really good sight design). The SP-101s were a challenge with any ammo. I knew the snubbies would be difficult, but the ease of accurate shots with the Shield compared to the other guns was a bit of a surprise. I've shot this gun for precision at this distance before (in fact the first time I shot a Shield was a buddy's gun at this very range and this distance), but I don't do it often. The 986 was also pretty much easy mode, in single action, once I got its sights dialed in. I would have though the 986 would have been a clear winner here, but between it, the PCR and the Shield, I actually call the Shield the winner because it's a subcompact punching way above it's class in size. Regarding the chronograph data (review the data below), it seems that the 9mm revolvers don't appear to suffer any appreciable velocity loss compared to the autos. The PCR has slightly higher velocity across the board, but not by a lot. Both 9mm snubies hang right there with the Shield as far as ballistics. So much for 9mm losing a lot of velocity from a snubnose revolver. The +P 9mm doesn't appear to give us anything compared to standard velocity HST and that was across all the guns. I found that surprising. Regarding 357 Mag, the Golden Sabers appear to be pretty much identical to the 9mms, just considerably more expensive. Shooting the two SP-101s back to back with the GS and HSTs, they felt the same too. The GS is a very accurate round though, maybe because it easy to shoot. If you like shooting Golden Sabers in a snubnose, you'd like a 9mm snubnose as well. Same-same. The Buffalo Bore round is advertised as low recoil. LOL. That is a hot round compared to everything else I shot today. I actually bought those for my N frames. They are not fun at all in an SP-101. The Federal 158gr Hydra-Shok was a lot more manageable. That's my carry round in the SP-101 and I'm pretty happy with it. It did well for me today. After getting all the velocity data, I moved back to 10 yards and setup two Big Dawg 18x24 silhouette targets a couple feet apart. I did Mozambique drills on both targets with all five guns. With and without reloads. (with the 5 shot SP-101s I did two chest shots on each then a headshot on the target that looked like it had the worst pair to the high chest area). The revolvers were all shot double action, the PCR decocked with the first round double action. The 986, PCR and Shield made this drill pretty easy. The SP-101s were quite a challenge. With hot Buffalo Bore rounds in the 357 I didn't do well at all. With the Golden Sabers and Hyda-Shoks I had a lot more success (same with the 9mm snubbie). Both SP-101s required a lot of concentration though and maybe a 50/50 success rate on the rapid follow up headshot. So I don't know what my conclusion is. I enjoyed the 986 a lot, but it's kind of bulky for concealed carry. Maybe I can find some defensive use for it, but I really like it nonetheless. The 9mm SP-101 appears to be just as competent as the 357 SP-101, but also has the same drawbacks. The 357 will shoot much more powerful ammo, but that comes at the cost of controllability. With lightly loaded ammo, the 357 doesn't appear to hold any advantage over the 9mm version, and 9mm ammo is more readily available, plus much cheaper. I'll most certainly continue to pocket carry the SP-101s now and then, but I need to stop being lazy and carry that Shield IWB more. I'm a lot more competent with it than the snubbies. All in all, it was a beautiful morning in the mountains and a lot of fun shooting some great guns.  Pic from the range. The 357 SP-101 is not pictured (it was in my pocket as my CCW today) but it is setup identical to the 9mm SP-101 pictured. The S&W Model 15 wasn't part of the testing. I just brough it along to shoot some wadcutters for fun and relaxation.     
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Quoted: Gunsamrevolveraficianado on youtube does a lot of this type of testing. Thanks for posting. I am a bit of a wheelgun fanatic. Quoted: Gunsamrevolveraficianado on youtube does a lot of this type of testing. Thanks for posting. I am a bit of a wheelgun fanatic. Glad you found it interesting!  Quoted: Those 125gr Golden Sabers put up some pityful numbers for a 357 mag Yeah, it seems they are basically just 9mm in a long, rimmed case, with a 0.002 larger diameter bullet and a higher price tag. Though, to be honest, that's exactly what I was looking for when I bought them. Something with recoil in between 38 Special and what you'd expect from 357 Magnum. For a small snubbie, these are very controllable. |
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I have picked up multiple 9mm revolvers over the last year. I find them to be a good training tool and after using them for a while my shooting of semi autos has improved significantly I have a whole of clips for them, but instead I now carry 33 round Glock 9mm mags to use as “loaders” for the revolver and don’t bother with the clips. Occasionally I need to use a rod to push the expended cases out, but most of the time they just fall out. |
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Quoted: Do you think it would be a good idea to send a SW 686+ to TK Customs and have them convert it to 9mm? It is a 4-inch 7 shot. I've wanted a 3" 686 Plus for a while now and I've always wondered what the downside of that would be. They say you can still shoot 38s and 357s without clips. So you'd have a revolver that could shoot 3 calibers. |
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Quoted: Very nice OP. Thanks for this. I'm currently resisting the urge to get a 986. I love 45acp in a revolver so logic would dictate I'd also like 9mm..... I haven't been too confident in S&W's revolver quality lately, but my 986 is perfect. No cosmetic imperfections anywhere, the trigger is great in both SA and DA, it's tight, it's accurate and just feels really great to shoot. If they are all like this and I didn't just get lucky, I highly recommend this gun. I like it so much, the .357 686 got bumped up to the top of my wish list. |
| Thanks for all of the info. the 686 is next on my list as well. Have you shot the Ruger LCR in 9mm? I love that thing and not really sure why, sometimes a certain model just feels right to one person and not the next. Others that have shot mine say that it's too snappy. Ignoring the limited capacity that we are all aware of with revolvers, the LCR is incredibly easy to conceal in any clothes (that I wear) and any position. Like you, I don't know that the 686 will be a carry gun with the weight/size. |
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Quoted: There's that Czech import 9mm revolver that has me interested in picking one up.  https://www.shootingnewsweekly.com/revolvers/revolver-rants-czech-out-apfs-r1-revolvers/  So much so, that I'm buying one. I'll be snagging a 9mm soon enough. |
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Quoted: @03RN, I put the 3" .357 Mag version of the Alfa-Proj through its paces. https://i.ibb.co/BGRsqd1/image.png https://www.shootingnewsweekly.com/revolvers/revolver-rants-czech-out-apfs-r1-revolvers/ https://files.shootingnewsweekly.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/08/28105743/PXL_20240828_1502396992-1536x1174.jpg So much so, that I'm buying one. I'll be snagging a 9mm soon enough. Nice Is it a shorter cylinder or is it long enough for 38 super? |
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Quoted: Nice Is it a shorter cylinder or is it long enough for 38 super? I can reach out directly to Alfa-Proj and get a better answer. |
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Quoted: Thanks for all of the info. the 686 is next on my list as well. Have you shot the Ruger LCR in 9mm? I love that thing and not really sure why, sometimes a certain model just feels right to one person and not the next. Others that have shot mine say that it's too snappy. Ignoring the limited capacity that we are all aware of with revolvers, the LCR is incredibly easy to conceal in any clothes (that I wear) and any position. Like you, I don't know that the 686 will be a carry gun with the weight/size. I haven't tried the LCR in any caliber. I do have a lightweight Taurus 904 and that is a bit snappy. I really like the SP-101 in both 9mm and 357. I think it strikes the balance between realistically controllable and concealable. Anything lighter and/or smaller than that I'll load with 38 Special. The 986/686 snubbie would make a great coat pocket gun though. |
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Quoted: I haven't tried the LCR in any caliber. I do have a lightweight Taurus 904 and that is a bit snappy. I really like the SP-101 in both 9mm and 357. I think it strikes the balance between realistically controllable and concealable. Anything lighter and/or smaller than that I'll load with 38 Special. The 986/686 snubbie would make a great coat pocket gun though. I find the 9mm LCR to be more pleasant to shoot than the .38 Special LCR. Primarily that is because the 9mm is a steel frame and the .38 is alloy. Even so, the 9mm LCR is still lighter than a lot of similar size guns, especially the steel ones. I think it is a great middle ground between weight, power, and recoil. I would love to see Smith revive the 242 as the 242UC and 942UC. There is nothing quite like those hump back DAO L-frames. However, I suspect the tens of copies they would sell is not enough to bring such a project to life. |
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Quoted: I find the 9mm LCR to be more pleasant to shoot than the .38 Special LCR. Primarily that is because the 9mm is a steel frame and the .38 is alloy. Even so, the 9mm LCR is still lighter than a lot of similar size guns, especially the steel ones. I think it is a great middle ground between weight, power, and recoil. I would love to see Smith revive the 242 as the 242UC and 942UC. There is nothing quite like those hump back DAO L-frames. However, I suspect the tens of copies they would sell is not enough to bring such a project to life. Quoted: Quoted: I haven't tried the LCR in any caliber. I do have a lightweight Taurus 904 and that is a bit snappy. I really like the SP-101 in both 9mm and 357. I think it strikes the balance between realistically controllable and concealable. Anything lighter and/or smaller than that I'll load with 38 Special. The 986/686 snubbie would make a great coat pocket gun though. I find the 9mm LCR to be more pleasant to shoot than the .38 Special LCR. Primarily that is because the 9mm is a steel frame and the .38 is alloy. Even so, the 9mm LCR is still lighter than a lot of similar size guns, especially the steel ones. I think it is a great middle ground between weight, power, and recoil. I would love to see Smith revive the 242 as the 242UC and 942UC. There is nothing quite like those hump back DAO L-frames. However, I suspect the tens of copies they would sell is not enough to bring such a project to life. I've shot a couple matches with my 3" LCRx in 9mm I really like the gun and the moon clips are a huge help If there was a slightly larger "K-Frame" LCRx I'd buy it the moment I saw it |
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Quoted: There's that Czech import 9mm revolver that has me interested in picking one up. @03RN, I've had my Alfa 9mm for several months. I kind of picked it up on a whim, but pleasantly surprised. It's not as polished as a S&W, more on the lines of Ruger but still pretty nice with a smooth DA trigger and pretty crisp SA pull. Zero issues with several varieties of 9mm and it will even shoot .380 in a pinch (not nearly as accurate). Accuracy was pretty good, and I was probably the limiting factor. It is on K-frame size and will fit my 686+ holsters. Overall, I like it and satisfied with keeping it in my inventory. I can't say what niche it fills, but for a 9mm revolver it's a good range gun and a suitable gun for when working around the house. Oh, this is my first "(full) moon clip" revolver and while I'm not a speed reloader, they do make reloads pretty damn fast. type Status report message description Access to the specified resource has been forbidden. Apache Tomcat/7.0.68 (Ubuntu) |