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Posted: 10/5/2005 11:35:16 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/5/2005 11:56:17 AM EDT by okguy91]
I don't see what the big deal is with that SPR what it can do over a 20'' HBAR?
Link Posted: 10/5/2005 11:38:14 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/5/2005 11:39:04 AM EDT by ironoxbows]

Originally Posted By okguy91:
I don't see want what the big deal is with the SPR. wWhat can isit do over a 20'' HBAR that a 20" HBAR isn't capable of?



It's ok, I speak Oklahoman
Link Posted: 10/5/2005 11:38:48 AM EDT
And what is so great about an HBAR? Lightweight 20" barrels are now like hen's teeth. If I want to carry that weight, I'll just carry my FAL.
Link Posted: 10/5/2005 11:39:49 AM EDT


Wrong forum.

Are you talking barrels or configuration?
Link Posted: 10/5/2005 11:40:29 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/5/2005 11:41:36 AM EDT by garandman]

Originally Posted By okguy91:
I don't see want the big deal is with the SPR what can is do over a 20'' HBAR?



0.68" (and less) groups at 100 yds.



That, and cause jealousy.

Link Posted: 10/5/2005 1:17:35 PM EDT
The SPR is far more accurate and allows easier scope mounting. And it uses a can.
Link Posted: 10/5/2005 5:58:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/5/2005 6:05:55 PM EDT by okguy91]
my Hbar shoots 1/2 moa with cheap and less than 1/2 moa with match grade ammo and is flat top with a scope and flip up sights. But no can MY hbar weights 12 lbs that part sucks
Link Posted: 10/5/2005 8:10:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By okguy91:
my Hbar shoots 1/2 moa with cheap and less than 1/2 moa with match grade ammo and is flat top with a scope and flip up sights. But no can MY hbar weights 12 lbs that part sucks



Let me guess. Three shot groups with the flyer dropper?
Link Posted: 10/5/2005 8:24:56 PM EDT
I thought this title said SHTF vs FUBAR
Link Posted: 10/5/2005 8:25:49 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ironoxbows:

Originally Posted By okguy91:
I don't see want what the big deal is with the SPR. wWhat can isit do over a 20'' HBAR that a 20" HBAR isn't capable of?



It's ok, I speak Oklahoman



Excuse me stewardess, I speak jive.
Link Posted: 10/5/2005 8:31:13 PM EDT
It's not a mater of what one can do better than the other. It's simply a matter of what mission profile the unit that requested the SPR has and what weapon was designed to fit that profile.
Link Posted: 10/5/2005 8:37:56 PM EDT

Originally Posted By okguy91:
my Hbar shoots 1/2 moa with cheap and less than 1/2 moa with match grade ammo and is flat top with a scope and flip up sights. But no can MY hbar weights 12 lbs that part sucks




Sorry, gotta raise the flag




Where's Old Painless?
Link Posted: 10/6/2005 3:05:05 AM EDT
good bye .
Link Posted: 10/6/2005 3:49:21 AM EDT
My SPR type rille shoots .45 groups or less at 100Yrds with Black Hills Blue Box 75GR if I do my part. It weighs in at about 18lbs.
Link Posted: 10/6/2005 3:52:54 AM EDT

Originally Posted By okguy91:
good bye .



Wimp.

One person calls BS and you back out of the thread?

If you make an outrageous claim, you better be prepared to back it up.

Less than 1/2 MOA with a standard HBAR is very hard to believe. I would have to guess that you are most likely using an incorrect method to measure your group sizes.
Link Posted: 10/6/2005 3:59:18 AM EDT

Originally Posted By postpostban:

Originally Posted By okguy91:
my Hbar shoots 1/2 moa with cheap and less than 1/2 moa with match grade ammo and is flat top with a scope and flip up sights. But no can MY hbar weights 12 lbs that part sucks




Sorry, gotta raise the flag




Where's Old Painless?



I have to call BS as well. I have sandbagged rested my HBAR and a 10 shot group with Federal AE yielded a 2.85" group at 90 yards. I am not the best shot in the world, but hell 1/2MOA with cheap ammo, Old_Painless proved that it was damn near impossible.
Link Posted: 10/6/2005 3:59:36 AM EDT

Originally Posted By okguy91:
my Hbar shoots 1/2 moa with cheap





Link Posted: 10/6/2005 4:01:58 AM EDT

Originally Posted By sherm8404:

Originally Posted By ironoxbows:

Originally Posted By okguy91:
I don't see want what the big deal is with the SPR. wWhat can isit do over a 20'' HBAR that a 20" HBAR isn't capable of?



It's ok, I speak Oklahoman



Excuse me stewardess, I speak jive.



My momma didn't raise no dummy, I took her rap, shiiiit (golly)
Link Posted: 10/8/2005 9:29:25 AM EDT
A 2.85" group is what you guys think most hbar's shoot. That is bs my worst car15 can shoot 2 moa at 100 yards. MY 20'' hbar shoots better than the build did for a friend. It is a 24 '' bull barrel fluted. I just don't see what the big deal is with the SPR setup.
Link Posted: 10/8/2005 9:31:52 AM EDT
moto cam ask REX what kind of a shot I am.
Link Posted: 10/8/2005 9:39:02 AM EDT
"HBAR" is a civilian barrel profile, made specifically to reduce the machine work time and cost on barrel production. It has nothing to do with "accuracy". Its only "advantage" is that the mass takes longer to heat up, inversely taking longer to cool down.
Why would you want to carry around a heavy hot piece of steel.?
Link Posted: 10/8/2005 4:27:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/8/2005 4:27:59 PM EDT by Cypher214]

Originally Posted By okguy91:
moto cam ask REX what kind of a shot I am.



It's not about your ability.

We are not saying you aren't capable of firing good groups.

We are saying that a standard 20" HBAR is almost 100% incapable of shooting 1/2 MOA at 100yds. with cheap ammo and less than 1/2 MOA with match ammo.

You are talking precision bolt rifle accuracy.

Like I said in my first post, it could be that you just incorrectly measured your grouping... it's very common among shooters who make outrageous claims.
Link Posted: 10/8/2005 4:41:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/8/2005 4:42:10 PM EDT by garandman]

Originally Posted By okguy91:
A 2.85" group is what you guys think most hbar's shoot. That is bs my worst car15 can shoot 2 moa at 100 yards. MY 20'' hbar shoots better than the build did for a friend. It is a 24 '' bull barrel fluted. I just don't see what the big deal is with the SPR setup.



THere is NO WAY a standard HBAR can routinely shoot sub-MOA with non-match ammo.

Even if you are actually David Tubbs.

Can't be done.

Link Posted: 10/8/2005 4:44:17 PM EDT

Originally Posted By garandman:

Originally Posted By okguy91:
A 2.85" group is what you guys think most hbar's shoot. That is bs my worst car15 can shoot 2 moa at 100 yards. MY 20'' hbar shoots better than the build did for a friend. It is a 24 '' bull barrel fluted. I just don't see what the big deal is with the SPR setup.



THere is NO WAY a standard HBAR can routinely shoot sub-MOA with non-match ammo.

Even if you are actually David Tubbs.

Can't be done.




Maybe he is a genetic clone of David Tubbs.....
Link Posted: 10/8/2005 5:01:07 PM EDT

Originally Posted By J_Smith:

Originally Posted By garandman:

Originally Posted By okguy91:
A 2.85" group is what you guys think most hbar's shoot. That is bs my worst car15 can shoot 2 moa at 100 yards. MY 20'' hbar shoots better than the build did for a friend. It is a 24 '' bull barrel fluted. I just don't see what the big deal is with the SPR setup.



THere is NO WAY a standard HBAR can routinely shoot sub-MOA with non-match ammo.

Even if you are actually David Tubbs.

Can't be done.




Maybe he is a genetic clown of David Tubbs.....



Fixed it for ya.

Link Posted: 10/8/2005 5:32:29 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/8/2005 9:18:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/8/2005 10:07:33 PM EDT by okguy91]
Ok I can cover my shots with a dime at 100 yards with mid priced ammo. I sure you guy will not belive me. Not sure that is 1/2 moa but I am sure that is not 2'' or 3'' moa. Hbar barrrels do not have as much barrel whip as a thin barrels. My worst Car15 shots at 100 yard ar 50 cent size most of my ar15 groupings can be covered with a quarter. I do have 6 ar's. How many of you guys have shot 10 k or more shells at 600 yards -800 yards at steel targets? PS Not 223 shells at that range. MY wife's cousin shoots at a area bench rest club and he is the top ranked shooter there . I was at the range with him and out shoot him with has own rifle at 200 yards on paper. I have a lot of 600 yard and over shots under my belt. I also have 20- 15 eye sight.
Link Posted: 10/8/2005 9:54:48 PM EDT

Originally Posted By postpostban:

Originally Posted By okguy91:
my Hbar shoots 1/2 moa with cheap and less than 1/2 moa with match grade ammo and is flat top with a scope and flip up sights. But no can MY hbar weights 12 lbs that part sucks




Sorry, gotta raise the flag




Where's Old Painless?



I think by "cheap" he meant better commercial ammo (I have personally had a 1" group from an M17s of all guns, with white&red box PMC a while back. I remember getting some British surplus ball that did better -- and did .25" from an aquaintances spacegun AR. Very far from "match" loading)
Link Posted: 10/8/2005 10:10:42 PM EDT
He is right what I am calling cheap ammo is $5 bucks a box of 20.
Link Posted: 10/8/2005 10:14:09 PM EDT
SPR has better wallet-draining ability. It also draws respect from the ultra-tactical shairborne crowd...

But put a scope of both and there isn't a lick of difference in ultimate accuracy.
Link Posted: 10/8/2005 10:15:02 PM EDT

Originally Posted By okguy91:
Ok I can cover my shots with a dime at 100 yards with mid priced ammo. I sure you guy will not belive me. Not sure that is 1/2 moa but I am sure that is not 2'' or 3'' moa. Hbar barrrels do not have as much barrel whip as a thin barrels. My worst Car15 shots at 100 yard ar 50 cent size most of my ar15 groupings can be covered with a quarter. I do have 6 ar's. How many of you guys have shot 10 k or more shells at 600 yards -800 yards at steel targets? PS Not 223 shells at that range. MY wife's cousin shoots at a area bench rest club and he is the top ranked shooter there . I was at the range with him and out shoot him with has own rifle at 200 yards on paper. I have a lot of 600 yard and over shots under my belt. I also have 20- 15 eye sight.




Oh yeah? Well I killed me a bar when I wuz only three.
Link Posted: 10/8/2005 10:21:11 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ironoxbows:

Originally Posted By okguy91:
I don't see want what the big deal is with the SPR. wWhat can isit do over a 20'' HBAR that a 20" HBAR isn't capable of?



It's ok, I speak Oklahoman



You ended the sentence with a proposition, spelling/grammar nazi.
Link Posted: 10/9/2005 12:43:43 PM EDT

Originally Posted By okguy91:
Ok I can cover my shots with a dime at 100 yards with mid priced ammo. .



So the story changes.

was cheap ammo, now is mid-priced.

And you are right. I still don't beleive you. Not with a standard HBAR. No way.

Link Posted: 10/9/2005 12:45:39 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Keith_J:


But put a scope of both and there isn't a lick of difference in ultimate accuracy.



Not sure what "ultimate accuracy is" but free floating the barrel makes prolly about 1/4" - 1/2" in group size difference.

Also, barrel quality of the SPR will be worth 1/4 to 1/2.

Link Posted: 10/9/2005 12:47:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/9/2005 12:49:48 PM EDT by garandman]

Originally Posted By okguy91:
He is right what I am calling cheap ammo is $5 bucks a box of 20.



What manufacturers? PMC, American Eagle, Winchester white box, UMC, what?
Link Posted: 10/9/2005 12:47:36 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jkstexas2001:

Originally Posted By ironoxbows:

Originally Posted By okguy91:
I don't see want what the big deal is with the SPR. wWhat can isit do over a 20'' HBAR that a 20" HBAR isn't capable of?



It's ok, I speak Oklahoman



You ended the sentence with a proposition, spelling/grammar nazi.



Actually, it was a preposition, you spelling/grammar nazi hater.
Link Posted: 10/9/2005 1:03:14 PM EDT

Originally Posted By garandman:

Originally Posted By Keith_J:


But put a scope of both and there isn't a lick of difference in ultimate accuracy.



Not sure what "ultimate accuracy is" but free floating the barrel makes prolly about 1/4" - 1/2" in group size difference.

Also, barrel quality of the SPR will be worth 1/4 to 1/2.




Not really. The ORIGINAL free floating was done to prevent POI shift from sling tension when shooting in prone or sitting.

When shooting standing where you are not using a sling and should be only resting the fore end on your palm, it makes no difference.

I get 1/2 MOA all day long from my Colt HBAR barrel using relatively cheap 55 grain flat base Sierra Pro Hunters and 23 grains of H322. This isn't match ammo but it could easily be used for 200 yard work.
Link Posted: 10/9/2005 3:00:18 PM EDT
american eagle fmj 55 grain ammo . That is cheap ammo to me $5bucks a box. barrel is a unlined wilson 1/9 twist Hbar profile . Barrel allso shoots good groups with 64 gr power points.
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