Reliable Full Size SUV (Page 1 of 3)
Posted: Yesterday 12:22:39 PM EDT
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I had originally planned to get a full size SUV in a few years from now for a family hauler, but a newborn and my MIL (doesn't drive) staying with us now 8-10 months a year has made our current family vehicle kind of a clown show when we all need to go somewhere together. It's a Model Y, and it is perfect for 4 (wife and I, just turned 3 year old and a newborn), but two car seats plus an adult in the back row is not practical or safe (can't get seatbelt on). So, our plan for a full size family hauler has moved up. Looking for a reliable used. Would like to stay 30-40k, so that puts me anywhere from 60-100k miles. This will be our third vehicle, so I estimate maybe 6000-7000 miles per year for at least the next couple years, so a little higher mileage doesn't scare me. My commuter is a TDI with 160k and my wife's is the Model Y. We both commute about 50 miles per day. AI is telling me the most reliable options would be 2019/20 Suburban or a 23+ Expedition Max. Also being thrown in is 2022-24 Armada/QX80 for reliability, but the interior cargo doesn't compare. I know this place is smarter than AI, so what should I be looking at? I don't think I would be happy long term going with a mid size SUV like the Traverse. We keep every vehicle till the end or their life, so this is something we'll keep till 200k miles + and the next decade, so if I need to go above the budget I would consider it. Biggest criteria is reliability and space to haul crap. |
"the science" /duh si-ens/ noun: progressive postmodern religious dogma not based in tested hypothesis or facts used to advance an authoritative political ideology
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Originally Posted By HKPDW: Toyota Land Cruiser or Sequoia ETA: whatever you get make sure the "seat" is an actual full size seat not the " mini person" seats like in the mid SUV 3rd row seat style. If you have more kids and need 3 car seats generally speaking minivans will probably be more fuel efficient vs SUVs, unless you go diesel SUV, and those are really expensive,  |
-Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you, Jesus Christ and the American G.I. ~ One died for your soul, the other for your freedom.
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Another vote for 200 series Land Cruiser or Lexus LX570. 2013 +/-. |
Ludwig Boltzmann, who spent much of his life studying statistical mechanics, died in 1906, by his own hand, Paul Bhranfest, carrying on the work, died similarly in 1933, Now it is our turn to study statistical mechanics...
| You can get a brand new Durango (3 row SUV) starting around $40k. Pentastar engine and the ZF 8 speed are a good combo, if you're not looking for something that's torquey. |
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"Dealing with Congress is like trying to have an adult conversation about the credit card with your alcoholic bi-polar Ukranian import wife."
"Dealing with Congress is like trying to have an adult conversation about the credit card with your alcoholic bi-polar Ukranian import wife."
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Originally Posted By gunnut003: Get a minivan. You may not like it, but this is the answer. The full size, BOF SUVs only do two things better than a minivan: towing and off road driving. If you're not doing either of those, a minivan will do the job for half the purchase price, twice the fuel efficiency, and, in some cases, better long term reliability. |
"Sometimes, the grass is greener because it's on a septic system."
"Sporterizing: The art of spending $700 on a $300 gun to make it worth $200." -GTwannabe
"Sporterizing: The art of spending $700 on a $300 gun to make it worth $200." -GTwannabe
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Sequoia with 5.7 I have one and the maneuverability beats the shit out of everything else in its class. The turn radius feels like a mid-size SUV, not like a Tahoe/Suburban. Obviously the reliability is awesome but parking it and moving around parking lots is something you deal with every single day and it is substantially better than all the other full size options. |
Everything posted above is factual. Maybe.
I made my recommendation based on being a teen in the 90s-early 2000s, and being with 7-10+ family members around with minivan available. Then as people started driving separately, noticing how having a full size SUV made group travels a bit more hilarious. . Plus a I have a sister with a 6+2 family who hates minivans.  She has 7 seat Benz GL, 5 seat RAM, and RV. they put more miles on the 43ft RV in a year. |
-Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you, Jesus Christ and the American G.I. ~ One died for your soul, the other for your freedom.
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Originally Posted By Cypher214: Sequoia with 5.7 I have one and the maneuverability beats the shit out of everything else in its class. The turn radius feels like a mid-size SUV, not like a Tahoe/Suburban. Obviously the reliability is awesome but parking it and moving around parking lots is something you deal with every single day and it is substantially better than all the other full size options. 
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Award: 24/365 Most likely to be an appendix.
"Dealing with Congress is like trying to have an adult conversation about the credit card with your alcoholic bi-polar Ukranian import wife."
"Dealing with Congress is like trying to have an adult conversation about the credit card with your alcoholic bi-polar Ukranian import wife."
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Originally Posted By HKPDW: Toyota Land Cruiser or Sequoia Originally Posted By gunnut003: Get minivan. It's literally designed for ease of use around cities/tighter quarters for larger families. ETA: whatever you get make sure the "seat" is an actual full size seat not the " mini person" seats like in the mid SUV 3rd row seat style. If you have more kids and need 3 car seats generally speaking minivans will probably be more fuel efficient vs SUVs, unless you go diesel SUV, and those are really expensive, |
"the science" /duh si-ens/ noun: progressive postmodern religious dogma not based in tested hypothesis or facts used to advance an authoritative political ideology
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Originally Posted By Dopple: WK2 turning radius is a 1/2 foot shorter. Originally Posted By Dopple: Originally Posted By Cypher214: Sequoia with 5.7 I have one and the maneuverability beats the shit out of everything else in its class. The turn radius feels like a mid-size SUV, not like a Tahoe/Suburban. Obviously the reliability is awesome but parking it and moving around parking lots is something you deal with every single day and it is substantially better than all the other full size options. |
Everything posted above is factual. Maybe.
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Originally Posted By GenYRevolverGuy: You may not like it, but this is the answer. The full size, BOF SUVs only do two things better than a minivan: towing and off road driving. If you're not doing either of those, a minivan will do the job for half the purchase price, twice the fuel efficiency, and, in some cases, better long term reliability. Originally Posted By Middleofthemgmt: We have a 20 Expedition we bought new in April of 21. Transmission had to be replaced at 33k. It's been solid besides that, and was handled under warranty, but that left a pretty bad taste in my mouth. |
"the science" /duh si-ens/ noun: progressive postmodern religious dogma not based in tested hypothesis or facts used to advance an authoritative political ideology
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Originally Posted By Cypher214: You can't make orange juice out of an apple. Originally Posted By Cypher214: Originally Posted By Dopple: Originally Posted By Cypher214: Sequoia with 5.7 I have one and the maneuverability beats the shit out of everything else in its class. The turn radius feels like a mid-size SUV, not like a Tahoe/Suburban. Obviously the reliability is awesome but parking it and moving around parking lots is something you deal with every single day and it is substantially better than all the other full size options. 
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Award: 24/365 Most likely to be an appendix.
"Dealing with Congress is like trying to have an adult conversation about the credit card with your alcoholic bi-polar Ukranian import wife."
"Dealing with Congress is like trying to have an adult conversation about the credit card with your alcoholic bi-polar Ukranian import wife."
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Originally Posted By trapsh00ter99: Ugh....I would still like to keep some dignity! My wife and I vowed we'd never get a minivan, but after driving a loaner when our kids were young, we were convinced. They are 10x easier to get kids and elderly parents in and out. Our minivan phase lasted through them being teenagers before we got back into trucks and SUVs. Seriously, a Honda Odessey is what you seek. |
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Originally Posted By trapsh00ter99: I guess if going just off my thread title those are the winner, but really thinking I want the Suburban/Exp Max cargo area. Ugh....I would still like to keep some dignity! And I think I'll never own a modern diesel again. TDI is fine, but the emissions is a ticking time bomb and I don't have time to do the delete. And the better MPG is largely offset by the more expensive fuel and entry cost. Originally Posted By trapsh00ter99: Originally Posted By HKPDW: Toyota Land Cruiser or Sequoia Originally Posted By gunnut003: Get minivan. It's literally designed for ease of use around cities/tighter quarters for larger families. ETA: whatever you get make sure the "seat" is an actual full size seat not the " mini person" seats like in the mid SUV 3rd row seat style. If you have more kids and need 3 car seats generally speaking minivans will probably be more fuel efficient vs SUVs, unless you go diesel SUV, and those are really expensive, |
Everything posted above is factual. Maybe.
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Originally Posted By HKPDW: Toyota Land Cruiser or Sequoia… Those are Not full size. The Ford Expi especially the extended version is an amazing vehicle for families who like to travel and with a lot of stuff. They are very reliable and will last as long as you want them too. Their safety especially in a true accident is also at the very top. Note, that I have had several, and I know the TTv6 is a thing. I much prefer the 5.4 V8 for the way I drive, it also keeps my speed under 80, the Ford TTs I have a hard time with speed-they are fun. I like the new full size Jeep Wagoneer or whatever they call it, it too is on my radar as a potential replacement to the Expi, if I ever get rid of it. I tried to like the toyotas, but I dont like them at all. |
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Originally Posted By HKPDW: Toyota Land Cruiser or Sequoia… older Sequoia with the 5.7 sure... |
For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood from His workmanship, so that men are without excuse.
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Originally Posted By RhinelandArms: Those are Not full size. Originally Posted By RhinelandArms: Originally Posted By HKPDW: Toyota Land Cruiser or Sequoia Those are Not full size. The Sequoia is absolutely a full size SUV. |
Everything posted above is factual. Maybe.
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Originally Posted By 9divdoc: older Sequoia with the 5.7 sure... If you want long term reliability this as long as it’s been a decently taken care of one. And it will pull a trailer no problem, but you will pay in gas. Toyota or Honda minivan is a great people hauler and get much better gas mileage Pick you poison |
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Originally Posted By gunnut003: Get minivan. It's literally designed for ease of use around cities/tighter quarters for larger families. ETA: whatever you get make sure the "seat" is an actual full size seat not the " mini person" seats like in the mid SUV 3rd row seat style. If you have more kids and need 3 car seats generally speaking minivans will probably be more fuel efficient vs SUVs, unless you go diesel SUV, and those are really expensive, |
Always blame autocorrect.
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Originally Posted By trapsh00ter99: I guess if going just off my thread title those are the winner, but really thinking I want the Suburban/Exp Max cargo area. Ugh....I would still like to keep some dignity! And I think I'll never own a modern diesel again. TDI is fine, but the emissions is a ticking time bomb and I don't have time to do the delete. And the better MPG is largely offset by the more expensive fuel and entry cost. Originally Posted By trapsh00ter99: Originally Posted By HKPDW: Toyota Land Cruiser or Sequoia Originally Posted By gunnut003: Get minivan. It's literally designed for ease of use around cities/tighter quarters for larger families. ETA: whatever you get make sure the "seat" is an actual full size seat not the " mini person" seats like in the mid SUV 3rd row seat style. If you have more kids and need 3 car seats generally speaking minivans will probably be more fuel efficient vs SUVs, unless you go diesel SUV, and those are really expensive, lol How dignified are you going to feel when your used, no warranty Suburban or Expedition dumps a lifter, cam phaser, or transmission, and the mechanic stomps you in the nuts for $5k+? How about when your 5.7L Sequoia eats 14 MPG and gas is $5 a gallon for the next 2-3+ years until global energy markets stabilize? The Sienna was purpose built for the mission you state, it gets 33 MPG, and you can get one brand new, full warranty, never been farted in for your budget. If I were in your shoes, I might care about that more than I care about how cool I look pulling into the parking lot at Kroger or Texas Roadhouse. I don't know your situation, but I think these things are worth thinking about. |
"Sometimes, the grass is greener because it's on a septic system."
"Sporterizing: The art of spending $700 on a $300 gun to make it worth $200." -GTwannabe
"Sporterizing: The art of spending $700 on a $300 gun to make it worth $200." -GTwannabe
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Originally Posted By trapsh00ter99: Sometime within our ownership of this vehicle, a +/- 17' CC would be a dream. Also, towing a cargo trailer and/or hauling large stuff is possible for my wife's business. This is what I've read, and someone else I personally know has had a similar year Expedition transmission replaced. It seems 23+ is safer? Originally Posted By trapsh00ter99: Originally Posted By GenYRevolverGuy: You may not like it, but this is the answer. The full size, BOF SUVs only do two things better than a minivan: towing and off road driving. If you're not doing either of those, a minivan will do the job for half the purchase price, twice the fuel efficiency, and, in some cases, better long term reliability. Originally Posted By Middleofthemgmt: We have a 20 Expedition we bought new in April of 21. Transmission had to be replaced at 33k. It's been solid besides that, and was handled under warranty, but that left a pretty bad taste in my mouth. They have had a 10-speed since 2018. They redesigned the clutch drum in 2023, and then had a model change in 2025 but it’s the same drivetrain. |
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My wife and I bought a 25 Pilot Sport AWD last year. About $40k out the door brand new. Everyone I know with a Pilot, Ridgeline, or Odyssey loves them and has had good reliability. So far it's been an excellent family vehicle. We probably would have gotten an Odyssey but we needed AWD and the ability to tow a utility trailer. |
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Originally Posted By TheLineIsReady: My wife and I vowed we'd never get a minivan, but after driving a loaner when our kids were young, we were convinced. They are 10x easier to get kids and elderly parents in and out. Our minivan phase lasted through them being teenagers before we got back into trucks and SUVs. Seriously, a Honda Odessey is what you seek. Originally Posted By TheLineIsReady: Originally Posted By trapsh00ter99: Ugh....I would still like to keep some dignity! My wife and I vowed we'd never get a minivan, but after driving a loaner when our kids were young, we were convinced. They are 10x easier to get kids and elderly parents in and out. Our minivan phase lasted through them being teenagers before we got back into trucks and SUVs. Seriously, a Honda Odessey is what you seek. I even have PTSD from a full size extend ram van in the early 90's from a rear tire blow out while I was under the bench with my head by the wheel well. dignity has nothing to do with it, vehicles are depreciating value items, use what's useful. The '89 Plymouth voyager van had cloth seats, but the '95 Dodge Caravan ES and '99 Chrysler Town and Country were loaded with leather and other options. Side note, even with the minivans around, there was still a DUALLY truck around, and bunch of older smaller cars. Each was used for intended purpose. Heck we still have a '88 Toyota pickup truck that gets used weekly because screw trying to load something into a belt high PICKUP truck or SUV. |
-Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you, Jesus Christ and the American G.I. ~ One died for your soul, the other for your freedom.
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Originally Posted By GenYRevolverGuy: lol How dignified are you going to feel when your used, no warranty Suburban or Expedition dumps a lifter, cam phaser, or transmission, and the mechanic stomps you in the nuts for $5k+? How about when your 5.7L Sequoia eats 14 MPG and gas is $5 a gallon for the next 2-3+ years until global energy markets stabilize? The Sienna was purpose built for the mission you state, it gets 33 MPG, and you can get one brand new, full warranty, never been farted in for your budget. If I were in your shoes, I might care about that more than I care about how cool I look pulling into the parking lot at Kroger or Texas Roadhouse. I don't know your situation, but I think these things are worth thinking about. No shit.... The biggest slayer of poon I knew as a young adult was a dude who drove a Dodge Caravan. He was single, no kids... not even a dog. But he deflowered quite a few fair maidens in the back of that thing.... (I'm not recommending the Caravan though... get a Sienna or an Odyssey) |
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Originally Posted By GenYRevolverGuy: lol How dignified are you going to feel when your used, no warranty Suburban or Expedition dumps a lifter, cam phaser, or transmission, and the mechanic stomps you in the nuts for $5k+? How about when your 5.7L Sequoia eats 14 MPG and gas is $5 a gallon for the next 2-3+ years until global energy markets stabilize? The Sienna was purpose built for the mission you state, it gets 33 MPG, and you can get one brand new, full warranty, never been farted in for your budget. If I were in your shoes, I might care about that more than I care about how cool I look pulling into the parking lot at Kroger or Texas Roadhouse. I don't know your situation, but I think these things are worth thinking about. Originally Posted By GenYRevolverGuy: Originally Posted By trapsh00ter99: Originally Posted By HKPDW: Toyota Land Cruiser or Sequoia Originally Posted By gunnut003: Get minivan. It's literally designed for ease of use around cities/tighter quarters for larger families. ETA: whatever you get make sure the "seat" is an actual full size seat not the " mini person" seats like in the mid SUV 3rd row seat style. If you have more kids and need 3 car seats generally speaking minivans will probably be more fuel efficient vs SUVs, unless you go diesel SUV, and those are really expensive, lol How dignified are you going to feel when your used, no warranty Suburban or Expedition dumps a lifter, cam phaser, or transmission, and the mechanic stomps you in the nuts for $5k+? How about when your 5.7L Sequoia eats 14 MPG and gas is $5 a gallon for the next 2-3+ years until global energy markets stabilize? The Sienna was purpose built for the mission you state, it gets 33 MPG, and you can get one brand new, full warranty, never been farted in for your budget. If I were in your shoes, I might care about that more than I care about how cool I look pulling into the parking lot at Kroger or Texas Roadhouse. I don't know your situation, but I think these things are worth thinking about.  in between diesel trucks that were sold, but not replaced yet. The tranny cost was 2k, and labor was us. It works fine, but leery of towing with it.Also there are 1 single cab, 2 CC 2500, 1 CC dually DIESEL trucks in the front. They suck for city stuff. All these big cars around, I drive a Benz e250 diesel around town, but have to replace the $500-600 DEF pump on it currently, but 44mpg is nice. 2.5 tanks of diesel from north WA to Nogales AZ IS NOICE, especially in a E-class. |
-Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you, Jesus Christ and the American G.I. ~ One died for your soul, the other for your freedom.
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Originally Posted By Cypher214: Sequoia with 5.7 I have one and the maneuverability beats the shit out of everything else in its class. The turn radius feels like a mid-size SUV, not like a Tahoe/Suburban. Obviously the reliability is awesome but parking it and moving around parking lots is something you deal with every single day and it is substantially better than all the other full size options. Target 2018 - 2022? |
"the science" /duh si-ens/ noun: progressive postmodern religious dogma not based in tested hypothesis or facts used to advance an authoritative political ideology
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Originally Posted By LRShooter: I really like Suburbans. We're on our fourth now. Minivans can be pretty nice as well. Pretty easy to get the kids and elderly in an out. If anyone is honest in their response to OPs criteria. -2 small kids in car seats -an adult (possibly elderly) accessing the back row seating -reliable -room to haul stuff The only serious answer is a minivan. Toyota Sienna, Honda Odyssey, or Chrysler Pacifica. You could consider the Kia Carnival as well. The added benefit in the minivan space is the same money will generally net you a newer, lower miles, higher featured vehicle. We went through this decision and ended up with a 2025 Sienna. It is absolutely fantastic! |
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Originally Posted By BB: Another vote for the Sequoia The miles don't scare me, but here in Ohio, 10 salty winters
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"the science" /duh si-ens/ noun: progressive postmodern religious dogma not based in tested hypothesis or facts used to advance an authoritative political ideology
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Originally Posted By ag04blast: If anyone is honest in their response to OPs criteria. -2 small kids in car seats -an adult (possibly elderly) accessing the back row seating -reliable -room to haul stuff The only serious answer is a minivan. Toyota Sienna, Honda Odyssey, or Chrysler Pacifica. You could consider the Kia Carnival as well. The added benefit in the minivan space is the same money will generally net you a newer, lower miles, higher featured vehicle. We went through this decision and ended up with a 2025 Sienna. It is absolutely fantastic! I guess I didn't explain that in the OP, but that's why in the title I have full size SUV, and don't really want to consider something like an Explorer/Traverse/Van. I would love to be able to get away with that class of vehicles, but I don't think it's worth the compromise. |
"the science" /duh si-ens/ noun: progressive postmodern religious dogma not based in tested hypothesis or facts used to advance an authoritative political ideology
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Originally Posted By BB: Another vote for the Sequoia Im looking for the same thing for different reasons. The sequoia is great, but definitely smaller than the Suburban/Expedition Max. By a lot. And the cargo space that it does have is pretty poorly set up. It will be the most reliable of the group however. The Armada is a great value, again smaller than the other two AND gets horrible gas mileage and requires premium. If you plan on driving a lot of miles this is going to add significant cost. The 3rd row is lame too because the captain's seats have a middle counsel in the way and you can't just walk between like the Burban and Ex max. The 2017 to late 2020 Expeditions can phasers are a matter if when, not if. Ford finally fixed them in late 2020. Then you get a shitty transmission. The GMs have the AFM and cam/lifter issues as well, but I'm seeing those as less frequent and you can help avoid the problem with things like the ob2 plug in and a catch can. The Denali and Escalade were mostly okay until the new 6.2 started blowing up over the last couple of years. Again lower mpg and premium required. I am going to end up with a Suburban/Yukon XL from 2018 - 2021 time range in all likelihood. I think you are the perfect candidate for a minivan. If GM/Ford really wanted to make money, they would add a minivan sliding rear door to their full sized SUVs. People would buy it to avoid driving a minivan and still having the ease of a sliding door. They make lots of money on the big SUVs and less on minivans. I am shocked nobody has done this yet. |
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Originally Posted By trapsh00ter99: Looks like enough recommendation for the sequoia it's worth consideration... Target 2018 - 2022? Originally Posted By trapsh00ter99: Originally Posted By Cypher214: Sequoia with 5.7 I have one and the maneuverability beats the shit out of everything else in its class. The turn radius feels like a mid-size SUV, not like a Tahoe/Suburban. Obviously the reliability is awesome but parking it and moving around parking lots is something you deal with every single day and it is substantially better than all the other full size options. Target 2018 - 2022? The Platinum comes with adjustable shocks all around and auto-leveling airbags in the rear which are nice for towing but keep in mind you'll spend wayyyyy more to replace those shocks if you want to keep the adjustability. The Sequoia/Tundra is overbuilt compared to other half-ton platforms and it becomes very obvious when you start working on suspension and steering components. |
Everything posted above is factual. Maybe.
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Originally Posted By trapsh00ter99: "Retaining my dignity" isn't the real reason I don't want a minivan. I want something with towing capabilities. I got rid of my 3/4 ton diesel last year (rusted out, end of life) and the intention was to replace it with a full size SUV. Being that we will keep this vehicle for a decade or more, I don't want to give up that capability. I guess I didn't explain that in the OP, but that's why in the title I have full size SUV, and don't really want to consider something like an Explorer/Traverse/Van. I would love to be able to get away with that class of vehicles, but I don't think it's worth the compromise. Originally Posted By trapsh00ter99: Originally Posted By ag04blast: If anyone is honest in their response to OPs criteria. -2 small kids in car seats -an adult (possibly elderly) accessing the back row seating -reliable -room to haul stuff The only serious answer is a minivan. Toyota Sienna, Honda Odyssey, or Chrysler Pacifica. You could consider the Kia Carnival as well. The added benefit in the minivan space is the same money will generally net you a newer, lower miles, higher featured vehicle. We went through this decision and ended up with a 2025 Sienna. It is absolutely fantastic! I guess I didn't explain that in the OP, but that's why in the title I have full size SUV, and don't really want to consider something like an Explorer/Traverse/Van. I would love to be able to get away with that class of vehicles, but I don't think it's worth the compromise. . sister currently has a crew cab with 3 carseats ETA: towing only up to 7k? |
-Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you, Jesus Christ and the American G.I. ~ One died for your soul, the other for your freedom.
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Originally Posted By MilHouse-556: I'm not even sure there's one manufacturer anymore that makes a brand new reliable full size SUV. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong. You aren't. Its just pick your level of suck for 100k. Suburban/Yukon XL/Escalade/Expedition Max/Wagoneer are all garbage, but all that is available. The next sized down to the Tahoe, Yukon, Expedition, Armada, Sequoia open up a few options but way less room, and only the Armada is priced reasonably. Next step down is Telluride, Pathfinder, Explorer, Arcadia, Highlander, etc which are mostly much cheaper, but not even close to the same amount of room. .....and per usual, in GD someone always recommended a 4 runner even though it has shit for room compared to the others. Yes, it is great off road and reliable as anything ever made, but it is not even in the ballpark to what he is looking for. |