Posted: 7/18/2002 7:59:14 PM EDT
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I'm doing a little remodeling in our guest bathroom. The shower faucet we currently have (see pic below) has a pull-knob type faucet where you pull the knob out to turn it on and then turn it left or right to adjust the temperature. I dislike these faucets and would prefer two separate hot & cold faucets. On average, what would it cost to have a plumber come out, remove the existing faucet and add the two new ones? [img]http://www.petenelson.com/Photos/Misc/House/Retiling%20Guest%20Bathroom/10%20-%20Pipes.jpg[/img] |
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Oh, and are there any plumbers on the board from NorCal? I may have some work for you. [:D] It was fun tearing down the backerboard, but whoever put the crappy plastic tile up that we had did a piss-poor job in making sure the styrofoam behind the tile was glued down properly. [img]http://www.petenelson.com/Photos/Misc/House/Retiling%20Guest%20Bathroom/06%20-%20More%20bad%20gluing.jpg[/img] |
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Sorry I'm not a plumber, but this thread and the pictures reminded me of the remodeling I did (and still am) to my house recently. Ugh what a nightmare, I'm so glad it's over. You wouldn't believe how these people had lived before we bought the place. [puke] Oh, on the plus side (since I didn't help you worth a damn with your problem) my reply did take your post back to the top... [:D] |
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ok Tool-Man, since youve gone that far, why dont you just do it yourself? hardware stores have knowledgeable people that im sure would be more than happy to assist as long as you buy all your material from them. there are publications around that will give you the info you need. and hell, here's the internet right in front of us! id try to do it myself first. if i do fuck it up, then ill call the plumber. if i cant afford him, well, shit im only out one bathroom. just use the other one. your guests shouldnt be bathing there anyway. send em home. friggin mooching bastards. i bet they open up your medicine cabinets too. and you know how guests are! 99% of them overstay their welcome, drink all your beer, screw up your alphabetized porno DVD collection, eat your Ben & Jerry's, and then have the nerve to go, "hey dude, can i see your gun collection?" [red]"NO ! Go home! It's Monday. Dont you have to go to work or something? AAAAARGGGGGGGGGHHHHHH!!![/red]... [:E] |
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Man you got that baby gutted open! I assume thats 5/8 copper tubbing we are looking at,and first can you sweat a copper joint? If you can you need some sand cloth,flux,silver solder,and a butaine torch! Get your new faucet or tub assmbly,and 3- 5/8 or what ever the size of that copper is male adapters. You will also need a street sign or something alum to put behind the pipes when you cold sweat them as to not burn your house down! You are going to sweat the fitings on the shower and the hot and cold water filler lines. The new shower assembly will come with brass unions that will screw onto these new male adaptures you have just sweated on! Hell you gaught all the real hard work done(just kidding as you know putting it back together again will be the hard part) Edited to say the shower and tub filler will not have unions,the tub filler will just screw in i/2 inch buy whatever lenght nipple you need usally about 4 inc. You will probably have to screw in the shower male adapter and then sweat the shower riser to it,hell at this stage you will probably be a master plumber! Good luck Bob [8D] |
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DVD -- Oh, the rewards of being a homeowner [+]:D] I'm at the end of a 2yr-plus remodel as owner-builder. I'm not a plumber, but I did all the plumbing myself (drain, waste, water and gas) and may be able to give some advise. No warranty or guarantee, expressed or implied! First, I do not recommend using two separate hot and cold fixtures unless they are pressure balanced. Otherwise, you will have a surge of scolding hot water everytime someone flushes the toilet or turns on the cold water faucet. There are balanced shower fixtures that resemble the "old look" with hot/cold water levers, but these are not separate feeds. Second, subscribe to "Fine Homebuilding" magazine. It's a great resource for DIY-ers like us. It looks like you have 3/4" copper, which is great. Sweating copper is easy, but as bobbyjack warns, it's easy to catch those studs on fire. Keep a spray bottle of water with you when you sweat the pipes. Spray the studs [b]before[/b] you put the flame on the fittings, and be ready to spray anything else that you happen to catch fire. Also, again per bobbyjack's recommendation, place a nonflammable barrier behind the area you're working on. In my case, I had some scrap pieces of Hardi-plank that I used for outdoor siding that worked great. When you sweat pipe, heat the [b]fitting[/b], not the pipe. Allow the solder to work it's way into the fitting. Get the yellow Napgas bottle with a "turbo" nozzle, not the standard nozzle that you get in the starter kit they sell at Home Depot. You'll appreciate the extra BTU's when you see how quickly it heats up. Also, get good quality flux. I buy all my solder and flux at a plumbing store, not Home Depot or Lowes. You'll get much better advise at a plumbiung store; it's not always a sure bet that the person working at HD will know what they're talking about. Your framing looks like it's in pretty good shape. What made you decide to tear out your shower? I'm guessing that you didn't like the tile. I've never seen plastic tile or the use of styrofoam in a shower, but I've only built one home [:D] Make sure you add some plastic isolators where the pipe runs along side or through the studs. It'll keep the sound of the pipes from resonating throughout the rest of the house if it touches the studs. You have a real easy job, DVD. You can do it. The tile is another matter. In that case, make sure you lap your felt over the flange of your tub and leave your green board or backer board about 1/2" above the rim. But that it'll be covered in another post. [;)] -- ale |
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Like ALIEADICT said heat the fitting after you have sanded the pipe and the inside of the fitting,put flux on the pipe and the fitting. Heat the middle of the fitting till it is cherry red, then put the uncoiled (about eight inches or so)solder at the mouth of the heated joint and the flux will pull it into the joint! Just put the tip of the solder in the joint and it will run into the joint,I usally start from the bottom to the top,and all around quickly. then pull back. You can get an extra fitting and try this before you go full balistic. Its not hard And I know you can and will like it. Sometimes the real test is if you are having to solder male adapters on both sides of an exesting valve,then you have to use wet clothes to control the heat so as not to unsolder the fitting next to the one you are sodering! While you are soldering these fittings to your respective pipes make sure that faucets hot and cold are open ,downstairs or in say the kitchen so hot gases can have a way to escape,and not botch your solder job. Edited to say you are not going to put eight inches of solder in the joint,but that much or more makes it easier to hold! bob [8D] |
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Quoted: Heat the middle of the fitting till it is cherry red bob [8D] LOL bobbyjack, We are not talking about soldering on a muzzle brake here! [:D] Heating a brass fitting until it is cherry red is a little extreme. 50/50 acid core solder has a much lower melting point than silver solder. I think a better method would be to slowly heat the fitting and keep touching the solder to it until it finally melts and wicks, then take heat away. Anyway, I am sure you can handle it if you decide to try DVDTracker. Four things you need to know to be a plumber: 1. Hot on the left, cold on the right. 2. The boss is a Son of a B*tch. 3. Payday is on Friday. 4. Sh*t don't run uphill. -xm |
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When I have to solder with an open flame, I use a 12x12 square of ceramic tile between the studs. If I'm working on an antenna co-ax fitting or something, I use a 24x24" tile as my work surface. Keeps the walls from burning or the table from being marred, depending on the job at hand. A 12x12 tile ought to be $1-2. And you want a dual fuel propane/MAPP gas torch, preferably self-igniting. For sweating pipes, MAPP gas is preferable; for other uses propane is cheaper. |
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And you want a dual fuel propane/MAPP gas torch, preferably self-igniting. Tinker's right. I ment to say Mapp, not Nap. (It was late last night when I replied to this post). However, for 3/4" copper, the yellow MAPP bottle with a turbo nozzle will do fine. I can probably do it myself, but I'm not quite ready to dive into it. DVD, I'm surprised at you! [>:/] This is an [b][i]easy[/i][/b] job, especially if you're not having to set the tub. Don't give up until you've at least tired to fix it yourself. With the money you'll save, you can buy yourself a new Trijicon TA-31 [sniper] We'll all be here to walk you through it if you decide to take the plunge. -- ale |
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The felt acts as the moisture barrier. Water will seep through the grout lines/cement and cause dry rot. The tile and grout is [b]not[/b] waterproof. By lapping the paper over the lip along the edge of your tub, water that gets behind the tile will still drain inside the tub and not behind the wall. You're a ways away from that project, though. I forgot to mention something in my last post. When you cut copper, be sure to ream the inside of the pipe before you sweat them together. Pipe cutters have a small folding blade along the back rib, which this is used for. You'll probably need a regular size cutter as well as a "peanut" pipe cutter to get into the existing areas near the studs. So does this mean you're going to give it a try after all? -- ale |
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Hi DVD, Yes, I am a Master Plumber, and no, I dont play one on TV ;) So anyhow, you want to put in an old fashioned 8 inch center two handled tub/shower diverter? Why? You really should go with a pressure balanced valve that avoids the hot/cold imbalance when the kitchen sink gets used or some other appliance in the home gets flushed. Much better. Installation? Easy! Silver solder is for other app. than that which you are doing DONT SILVER SOLDER THE 1/2 COPPER LINES PLEASE. This is for super high strength apps and pressures and you will destroy the diverter. NO NO NO. Use regular lead free solder, a good paste flux I like Oatey #5, a Mapp gas torch and a pair of brown cotton gloves. Practice soldering on a few couplings before you do it yourself. Clean inside fittings and outside of pipe, apply flux and heat evenly around joint by holding the torch 1-2 inches away. Keep touching the solder to the pipejoint and it will get sucked right into the joint. Voila! Flick the drips of solder off with your gloved finger and you are done. Whee! How fun to be a plumber eh? While you are at it, if the tub is old, rip it out and put in a new one, remember to size it so it goes thru the bath door first! Dram :) |
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Quoted: Quoted: Heat the middle of the fitting till it is cherry red bob [8D] LOL bobbyjack, We are not talking about soldering on a muzzle brake here! [:D] Heating a brass fitting until it is cherry red is a little extreme. 50/50 acid core solder has a much lower melting point than silver solder. I think a better method would be to slowly heat the fitting and keep touching the solder to it until it finally melts and wicks, then take heat away. Anyway, I am sure you can handle it if you decide to try DVDTracker. Four things you need to know to be a plumber: 1. Hot on the left, cold on the right. 2. The boss is a Son of a B*tch. 3. Payday is on Friday. 4. Sh*t don't run uphill. -xm You forgot "Don't bite your fingernails". |
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My own free advice is don't replace the faucet! I currently have a separate hot and cold in my shower and really dislike it. Plus the stem on the cold water developed a leak which is patched for now but will eventually fail. At this point I would like to replace the separate controls with a really nice combination unit (preferably Moen). GunLvr |
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Quoted: Do you still need the felt if you're using concrete backerboard? DVD -- YES, you absolutly need felt!! Use 15# felt for a bullet-proof moisture barrier. The lighter weight paper will work as well. Water [b]will[/b] seep through concrete, grout, etc. Don't use green board (drywall). If you don't float it with mud, use the Hardi-backer or some other concrete board. The plumbing job is an easy DIY job, from the size of it. The tile work is a lot more difficult, since it's the finished surface you'll be looking at and mistakes will be more obvious. If I were you, do the plumbing yourself and hire a tile guy. Dram -- What do you suppose the styrofoam was doing behind the tile? -- ale |
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Quoted: Hi DVD, Yes, I am a Master Plumber, and no, I dont play one on TV ;) So anyhow, you want to put in an old fashioned 8 inch center two handled tub/shower diverter? Why? You really should go with a pressure balanced valve that avoids the hot/cold imbalance when the kitchen sink gets used or some other appliance in the home gets flushed. Much better. Installation? Easy! Silver solder is for other app. than that which you are doing DONT SILVER SOLDER THE 1/2 COPPER LINES PLEASE. This is for super high strength apps and pressures and you will destroy the diverter. NO NO NO. Use regular lead free solder, a good paste flux I like Oatey #5, a Mapp gas torch and a pair of brown cotton gloves. Practice soldering on a few couplings before you do it yourself. Clean inside fittings and outside of pipe, apply flux and heat evenly around joint by holding the torch 1-2 inches away. Keep touching the solder to the pipejoint and it will get sucked right into the joint. Voila! Flick the drips of solder off with your gloved finger and you are done. Whee! How fun to be a plumber eh? While you are at it, if the tub is old, rip it out and put in a new one, remember to size it so it goes thru the bath door first! Dram :) I just did all the domestic plumbing and also plumbed the boiler and Boilermate in my new house. I tried to use silver solder at first and had no luck at all. Couldn't get it to stick to anything. So I tore it apart and used "no-corrode" flux and solid wire solder. Big difference. Everything went together like a pro. I was pretty proud of it and didn't have to flick too many drips off. I pressure tested the domestic plumbing at 60psi for 7 days and no leaks. I'll test the boiler and boiler mate this weekend. It probably took me 10 times longer than it would a Journeyman plumber, but that's OK. It was fun and I learned alot by doing it myself. |
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[b]Cosmo Castorini:[/b] There are three kinds of pipe. There's aluminum, which is garbage. There's bronze, which is pretty good, unless something goes wrong. And something always goes wrong. Then, there's copper, which is the only pipe I use. It costs money. It costs money because it saves money. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Heat the middle of the fitting till it is cherry red bob [8D] LOL bobbyjack, We are not talking about soldering on a muzzle brake here! [:D] Heating a brass fitting until it is cherry red is a little extreme. 50/50 acid core solder has a much lower melting point than silver solder. I think a better method would be to slowly heat the fitting and keep touching the solder to it until it finally melts and wicks, then take heat away. Anyway, I am sure you can handle it if you decide to try DVDTracker. Four things you need to know to be a plumber: 1. Hot on the left, cold on the right. 2. The boss is a Son of a B*tch. 3. Payday is on Friday. 4. Sh*t don't run uphill. -xm You forgot "Don't bite your fingernails". |