Posted: 3/22/2011 9:22:50 AM EDT
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I just got out of an insurance meeting at work.
Our rates just went up 24% for this year starting next month. The company pays 60% so actual cost to me will be a 9.6% increase wich is about $54 dollars more per month. We got a direct statement from the owner saying that it is because of healthcare legislation passed by Obama. FBO and Obamacare... |
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That's what happens when women take over, well, anything.
BLS: 80% healthcare workers now female. Highest in the country. Second is education/teaching. Obamacare was able to get passed because enough people are pissed off at health-care already. Doctors have dropped the ball, bad. Here in the Gulf, health-care is also starting to be taken over by women and it's experiencing the same probs we are back home, and there ain't no obamacare here. Waste and fraud. You ain't seen nothing yet. |
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Yep. Our company switched carriers altogether. Now we pay more for a shittier plan. Higher co-pays and deductables.
I think nothing good of Obabmacare. However, our insurance costs have been increasing 15 or 20 percent per year for the past several years anyway. The entire system sucks and needs revamped. Not government takeover shit, but something needs done. It is not the free market at work as is. |
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That's what happens when women take over, well, anything. I'm a dude, and I've got no idea what the blue fuck you are talking about. Penis = Winning. Got it. BLS: 80% healthcare workers now female. Highest in the country Huh? Seriously, the vagina makes all the difference in raising health care costs. Herp derp. Second is education/teaching. Females working as teachers....ok, so again, WTF has this to do with raising health care costs? Answer: nothing Obamacare was able to get passed because enough people are pissed off at health-care already. FAIL. It passed by giving incentives to Senators to get their states sweet-heart deals. And the fact that elections have consequences (Dems in control) Doctors have dropped the ball, bad.So now its the Doctors fault....or just the female Doctors fault? Herp Derp strikes again Here in the Gulf, health-care is also starting to be taken over by women and it's experiencing the same probs we are back home, and there ain't no obamacare here. Wow. Just wow. Waste and fraud. Yes there is lots of waste and alot of fraud, but the biggest problem is gov mandates on what plans include. You ain't seen nothing yet. Gotcha, thanks LOL, Wut? Almost wrong on everything. |
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Quoted: I just got out of an insurance meeting at work. Our rates just went up 24% for this year starting next month. The company pays 60% so actual cost to me will be a 9.6% increase wich is about $54 dollars more per month. We got a direct statement from the owner saying that it is because of healthcare legislation passed by Obama. FBO and Obamacare... It might not be Obamacare. My company's premium for health insurance has gone up 20-25% per year for the last several years. This year's increase was no worse than last year's or the year before.  I blame the increases (in part) on the cost-shifting that occurs when people without health insurance or the ability to pay obtain health care treatment. Hospitals build that into their overhead. As more people lost health insurance with job loses (or employers stopped offering health insurance), more costs were shifted to the insured (or rather their insurance companies). I truly hope that as the mandate for employers comes into effect that rates will be restrained since more people will have health insurance. I also expect to be disappointed. The cost of providing health insurance is our third biggest expense, after salaries and payroll taxes. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Lots of fail in this thread. Did anyone's insurance go down during Bush?  Did your company's insurance premiums increase at a rate equal to or below the rate of inflation during any year in which Bush was president? Serious question. George W. Bush was president for eight years. During part of that time, he had Republican majorities in the House and Senate. What steps did he take to control the double digit increase in health insurance premiums during his presidency?  |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Lots of fail in this thread. Did anyone's insurance go down during Bush? Did your company's insurance premiums increase at a rate equal to or below the rate of inflation during any year in which Bush was president? Serious question. George W. Bush was president for eight years. During part of that time, he had Republican majorities in the House and Senate. What steps did he take to control the double digit increase in health insurance premiums during his presidency? http://www.polls.newsvine.com/_vine/images/users/600/allison-linnmsnbc/5668918.jpg Are you making excuses for Obamacare? Serious question. |
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That's what happens when women take over, well, anything. BLS: 80% healthcare workers now female. Highest in the country. Second is education/teaching. How do you figure women are to blame. Just because there are a lot of women in the field of medical care? |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Lots of fail in this thread. Did anyone's insurance go down during Bush? Did your company's insurance premiums increase at a rate equal to or below the rate of inflation during any year in which Bush was president? Serious question. George W. Bush was president for eight years. During part of that time, he had Republican majorities in the House and Senate. What steps did he take to control the double digit increase in health insurance premiums during his presidency? http://www.polls.newsvine.com/_vine/images/users/600/allison-linnmsnbc/5668918.jpg Are you making excuses for Obamacare? Serious question. I'm not sure how you could read his post and come to that conclusion |
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My privately owned health insurance has gone up every year, for the past eight years, by 20-30%. I have had 3 doctor visits in that time––2 for flu symptoms, and 1 for a CT scan after a motorcycle spill. Total payouts less than $5K.
I've had to change my plan twice and now have nothing more than a high deductible ($7,500), catastrophic policy that will pay in the event I get cancer, or something else serious, and need expensive treatment. My goal is to limit my monthly payment and reduce my out of pocket should I need a $75,000 operation. I have paid more than double in premiums (almost triple) to what has been paid out over this time. |
| I travel a lot for work and one thing that I have noticed is that even in areas with extremely depressed economies there seems to be new hospitals/clinic poping up all over. With all that free healthcare comming someone is expecting big business. Obamacare did nothing to address cost, just who is going to pay for it |
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I just got out of an insurance meeting at work. Our rates just went up 24% for this year starting next month. The company pays 60% so actual cost to me will be a 9.6% increase wich is about $54 dollars more per month. We got a direct statement from the owner saying that it is because of healthcare legislation passed by Obama. FBO and Obamacare... It might not be Obamacare. My company's premium for health insurance has gone up 20-25% per year for the last several years. This year's increase was no worse than last year's or the year before.
I blame the increases (in part) on the cost-shifting that occurs when people without health insurance or the ability to pay obtain health care treatment. Hospitals build that into their overhead. As more people lost health insurance with job loses (or employers stopped offering health insurance), more costs were shifted to the insured (or rather their insurance companies). I truly hope that as the mandate for employers comes into effect that rates will be restrained since more people will have health insurance. I also expect to be disappointed. The cost of providing health insurance is our third biggest expense, after salaries and payroll taxes. You have a good point. Though in previous years it has not gone up in such a big percentage. I have been on it for 4 years now and this is the biggest jump and I do realize that other factors can come into play. However, the legislation was given as the primary reason. It could be true and it could be BS. I will never know. Right now we are looking into going to my wifes work plan. It would allow me to work more hours at my 2 PT jobs that pay more and are closer to home and still put in hours at my FT job and not have requirement in total hours worked to maintain benefits. |
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Lots of fail in this thread. Did anyone's insurance go down during Bush?
Unfortunately, Angel is exactly correct. My insurance premiums skyrocketed under Bush, and my coverage went down. I will have to say that it was the opposite during Clinton. |
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I just got out of an insurance meeting at work. Our rates just went up 24% for this year starting next month. The company pays 60% so actual cost to me will be a 9.6% increase wich is about $54 dollars more per month. We got a direct statement from the owner saying that it is because of healthcare legislation passed by Obama. FBO and Obamacare... just wait till it is fully implemented, LOL J- |
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Lots of fail in this thread. Did anyone's insurance go down during Bush?
Unfortunately, Angel is exactly correct. My insurance premiums skyrocketed under Bush, and my coverage went down. I will have to say that it was the opposite during Clinton. Did Bush say he was going to reduce rates? obunghole has said his plan would control health care costs. Of course he is a lying sack of shit demoncrap. |
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Did your company not experience a similar increase last year? Ours had been going up about 8% per year, then last year just after Zero-Care passed the premiums increase 33%, and this year it's another 30%.
A lot of folks are moving to using an MSA with a high-deductible catastrophic care plan. The overall cost to the employee is a bit lower for the premium + MSA contribution, and at least you keep some of the money in an account you can roll over from year to year. |
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Lots of fail in this thread. Did anyone's insurance go down during Bush? actually mine did. I went from paying 300 amonth to zero amonth (for better coverage) when bush was in office. Since obama has been in office I have gone back up to 2% base pay (which is not much, many others pay way more) this year and the city is saying its gonna be more next year etc. That is if they dont plane on just paying the "fine" and dropping coverage and forceing us to go into the exchange. They have seriously talked about it as it would save them about 100k a year to pay the fines vs paying for coverage. Now does any of this have anything to do with 1) Bush or 2) Obama? not sure but i'm paying more now than I was before and I know that future increases in premium and/or decrease of quality of care will be directly related to the passage of Obama care, per our HR department. J- |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Lots of fail in this thread. Did anyone's insurance go down during Bush? Did your company's insurance premiums increase at a rate equal to or below the rate of inflation during any year in which Bush was president? Serious question. George W. Bush was president for eight years. During part of that time, he had Republican majorities in the House and Senate. What steps did he take to control the double digit increase in health insurance premiums during his presidency? http://www.polls.newsvine.com/_vine/images/users/600/allison-linnmsnbc/5668918.jpg Are you making excuses for Obamacare? Serious question. No. Unless I misinterpreted the smiley, it looks like Storm_Tracker took exception to the statement about rates going up during the Bush years.However, in the interest of intellectual honesty, I was pointing out that insurance rates have been increasing at a rate faster than inflation for a long time. This was a problem when President George W. Bush was President and had a Republican House and Senate for part of that time. What did he do to keep insurance rates in check? I answered your question, now answer mine. BTW, I actually agree that part of the premise behind Obamacare could reduce rates. A problem with insurance rates is that they are impacted by those who do not have insurance and are "free riders". This drives up hospital overhead and increases costs that are passed on to the insured. Assume that everyone had health insurance through their employer (don't worry about why). The number of people going to hospitals and obtaining "free" care because they are unable to pay for insurance would drop. Those people who formerly were free riders would now be paying for the cost of their care. The result should be a decrease in insurance rates. I would prefer to see tax incentives for employers to provide health insurance for employees. I provide health insurance for my employees in part because it is a very small business and I care about my employees as people. They are like family. However, the annual double digit increase in premiums in KILLING me. As fewer employers offer insurance, the size of the pool of uninsured people grows, and so does my freaking insurance premium. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Lots of fail in this thread. Did anyone's insurance go down during Bush? Did your company's insurance premiums increase at a rate equal to or below the rate of inflation during any year in which Bush was president? Serious question. George W. Bush was president for eight years. During part of that time, he had Republican majorities in the House and Senate. What steps did he take to control the double digit increase in health insurance premiums during his presidency? http://www.polls.newsvine.com/_vine/images/users/600/allison-linnmsnbc/5668918.jpg Are you making excuses for Obamacare? Serious question. No. Unless I misinterpreted the smiley, it looks like Storm_Tracker took exception to the statement about rates going up during the Bush years.However, in the interest of intellectual honesty, I was pointing out that insurance rates have been increasing at a rate faster than inflation for a long time. This was a problem when President George W. Bush was President and had a Republican House and Senate for part of that time. What did he do to keep insurance rates in check? I answered your question, now answer mine. BTW, I actually agree that part of the premise behind Obamacare could reduce rates. A problem with insurance rates is that they are impacted by those who do not have insurance and are "free riders". This drives up hospital overhead and increases costs that are passed on to the insured. Assume that everyone had health insurance through their employer (don't worry about why). The number of people going to hospitals and obtaining "free" care because they are unable to pay for insurance would drop. Those people who formerly were free riders would now be paying for the cost of their care. The result should be a decrease in insurance rates. I would prefer to see tax incentives for employers to provide health insurance for employees. I provide health insurance for my employees in part because it is a very small business and I care about my employees as people. They are like family. However, the annual double digit increase in premiums in KILLING me. As fewer employers offer insurance, the size of the pool of uninsured people grows, and so does my freaking insurance premium. I didn't take exception with your statement about rates going up under the Bush years. Yes, my rates went up and I won't deny that. I thought you were justifying rates going up under Obama and since Obamacare, because they went up under Bush. The justification of anything using that type of logic is lost on me and comes off, IMO, as excuse making, especially since the public was told that costs would decrease. Honestly, I don't think it's the Presidents place to be interfering in insurance premium rates or the rate of increase. When the government gets involved in the free market, there are always unintended consequences (yes, I know the government has injected itself in the past, present, and will in the future). However, IIRC, Obama did say that if his healthcare plan was passed and went into effect, that it would lower costs. It hasn't, at least not to my knowledge. In addition, the premise on which Obamacare is based, that is, 'everyone has insurance and pays into the system therefore costs will go down because the hospitals/clinics are not saddled with write-offs', is failing because many groups/states are applying for, and being given, exemption from the rules. I think the biggest problem for Obamacare, for most people, is a simple one, government intrusion into the free market place and we were promised something, and as per usual, we are learning that what we were promised is not what we are getting. The problem is with ideas of grandeur like Obamacare is that, what sounds great in theory almost never comes to pass when its put into practice.
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You're lucky; a lot of the businesses I work with have stopped offering benefits entirely.
When this monstrosity passed, I was sitting with my wife. I turned to her a said “If you think the economy is bad now, wait until this law starts to go into effect.” I have been in the health insurance industry for 14 years. With the passage of Obamadeathcare, my pay was cut by 40%. My company has let over 3000 people go since August of 2010 (the first Obamacare mandates went into effect on 9/23/2010). Less disposable income means we invest far less in our business and retirement, and contribute far less to the local economy as well. Imagine this spread across the entire insurance industry, and you begin to get an idea of the tidal wave that is building. What changed in January was the portion of Obamacare that deals with loss ratios. The old federal mandate stipulated that health insurers had to direct 60% of their revenue to claims payment; the new law changes that to 85%. What this means to insurers is that they have a federally-mandated 25% loss in operating revenue. In an industry that operates at a 7-11% profit margin, that’s quite a hit to take. The only ways to make it up are to “consolidate expenses” (which includes streamlining the work force and drastic pay cuts) and increase premiums. The second factor is especially intersting for the future of private health insurers, as Nazi Pelosi has stated publicly that if insurers raise their rates too much they will not be allowed to offer insurance through the federal insurance exchanges. With all due respect, if anyone still doubts that Obamacare is anything other than a scheme to force private insurers out of business and force everyone in America (except the politicians, of course) onto government heathcare, you are completely insane. It is destroying our economy already, and the most drastic portions of the bill aren’t even in place yet... and that’s the reason they don’t go into effect until two years after the next presidential election. How’s that hope and change working out for everyone? |
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However, in the interest of intellectual honesty, I was pointing out that insurance rates have been increasing at a rate faster than inflation for a long time. This was a problem when President George W. Bush was President and had a Republican House and Senate for part of that time. What did he do to keep insurance rates in check? I answered your question, now answer mine. BTW, I actually agree that part of the premise behind Obamacare could reduce rates. A problem with insurance rates is that they are impacted by those who do not have insurance and are "free riders". This drives up hospital overhead and increases costs that are passed on to the insured. Assume that everyone had health insurance through their employer (don't worry about why). The number of people going to hospitals and obtaining "free" care because they are unable to pay for insurance would drop. Those people who formerly were free riders would now be paying for the cost of their care. The result should be a decrease in insurance rates. I would prefer to see tax incentives for employers to provide health insurance for employees. I provide health insurance for my employees in part because it is a very small business and I care about my employees as people. They are like family. However, the annual double digit increase in premiums in KILLING me. As fewer employers offer insurance, the size of the pool of uninsured people grows, and so does my freaking insurance premium. Insurance rates are a mathematical function. They rise in accordance with the expenses incurred by the insurer, and the primary factor influencing expenses is cost of care. The two main drivers influencing the cost of care have always been technology and defensive medicine/malpractice insurance costs. What Obamacare does is force insurers to: A)provide more services, and; B) take a 25% cut in operating revenue. The resulting premium increases are only part of the damage. Premiums increases must be approved by the BOI of each state, and they will not approve what the companies ask for. The insurance industry is like the petroleum industry: they gross hundreds of billions, but net about 8%. As a result, they have been forced to lay off tens of thousands of people, and cut the wages of those who are able to stay, in order to stay in business. Your comments are well-intentioned but ill-informed. "Free care" isn't a cost that is passed on to the insurer carte blanche, as it is a tax write-off to the hospital that provides it. Likewise, everyone having employee health plans is a statistical impossibility; even if everyone DID have health coverage, people are still going to use the same net amount of care, resulting in higher costs via claims payments, which result in...higher premiums. Moreover, putting the most financially inefficient organization in the history of mankind in charge of dispensing health insurance coverage (which will take place in 2014 if this abortion of a law isn't struck down) will not, by any stretch of the imagination, lower costs to the consumer. If you are an employer, there is already a tax incentive to provide insurance, as well as a reduction in rates by purchasing a group plan. I agree with you that Bush could have done more to keep premiums in check, but the changes would have to come through deruglation and massive tort reform... and neither Bush nor the RINO idiots in office had the balls for it. |
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Quoted: Quoted: However, in the interest of intellectual honesty, I was pointing out that insurance rates have been increasing at a rate faster than inflation for a long time. This was a problem when President George W. Bush was President and had a Republican House and Senate for part of that time. What did he do to keep insurance rates in check? I answered your question, now answer mine. BTW, I actually agree that part of the premise behind Obamacare could reduce rates. A problem with insurance rates is that they are impacted by those who do not have insurance and are "free riders". This drives up hospital overhead and increases costs that are passed on to the insured. Assume that everyone had health insurance through their employer (don't worry about why). The number of people going to hospitals and obtaining "free" care because they are unable to pay for insurance would drop. Those people who formerly were free riders would now be paying for the cost of their care. The result should be a decrease in insurance rates. I would prefer to see tax incentives for employers to provide health insurance for employees. I provide health insurance for my employees in part because it is a very small business and I care about my employees as people. They are like family. However, the annual double digit increase in premiums in KILLING me. As fewer employers offer insurance, the size of the pool of uninsured people grows, and so does my freaking insurance premium. Insurance rates are a mathematical function. They rise in accordance with the expenses incurred by the insurer, and the primary factor influencing expenses is cost of care. The two main drivers influencing the cost of care have always been technology and defensive medicine/malpractice insurance costs. What Obamacare does is force insurers to: A)provide more services, and; B) take a 25% cut in operating revenue. The resulting premium increases are only part of the damage. Premiums increases must be approved by the BOI of each state, and they will not approve what the companies ask for. The insurance industry is like the petroleum industry: they gross hundreds of billions, but net about 8%. As a result, they have been forced to lay off tens of thousands of people, and cut the wages of those who are able to stay, in order to stay in business. Your comments are well-intentioned but ill-informed. "Free care" isn't a cost that is passed on to the insurer carte blanche, as it is a tax write-off to the hospital that provides it. Likewise, everyone having employee health plans is a statistical impossibility; even if everyone DID have health coverage, people are still going to use the same net amount of care, resulting in higher costs via claims payments, which result in...higher premiums. Moreover, putting the most financially inefficient organization in the history of mankind in charge of dispensing health insurance coverage (which will take place in 2014 if this abortion of a law isn't struck down) will not, by any stretch of the imagination, lower costs to the consumer. If you are an employer, there is already a tax incentive to provide insurance, as well as a reduction in rates by purchasing a group plan. I agree with you that Bush could have done more to keep premiums in check, but the changes would have to come through deruglation and massive tort reform... and neither Bush nor the RINO idiots in office had the balls for it. Many hospitals are non-profits, and as such, do not need tax right offs. While I may be wrong, I am pretty confident that a business cannot write off "unpaid services" unless they previously claimed the money owed as income (in other words, if the hospital uses an accrual accounting method and counted the fee as earned when billed instead of when paid). The net result is that even an accrual method, you only get to deduct the unpaid bill if you previously claimed that bill as income. My business provides free professional services to people without the means to pay and I do not get ANY tax benefits. Their is definite cost-shifting from those who cannot pay to those who can. The GAO did a study a number of years ago and found that states that had implemented tort reform did not have statistically lower insurance premiums. I am confident that the increase in health insurance premiums is correlated to the increase in premiums, and not a lack of tort reform. The other factor is that the health care market has many "failures" in terms of operating as a free market. The same is true to a lesser extent for the health insurance market. Even if all governmental regulation went away in both of these markets, their would still exist issues that would prevent the health care market from being a true free market. The reasons why include that human life does not easily translate into dollars. We (as a society) do not want those with life threatening conditions to die because of a lack of ability to pay for health care. I am not saying I know the answers. I acknowledge (as you obviously do) that this is an extremely complex problem and that their are no easy solutions. Whether or not I agree with ObamaCare, I do know that nothing that was done in the last 20 years was worked. If ObamaCare fails to control costs long term (after it is fully implemented), I will not be surprised. However, do nothing was guaranteed to result in continued double digit increases in health insurance premiums. I will give it a chance, even though I have my doubts. |