[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Friction welding (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 1/9/2017 8:34:36 PM EDT
 Friction welding API drill pipe for oil exploration |
An attempt from Canukistan
 HSS Flow Drilling and Friction Welding |
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While it may not look like it, nothing actually melts. It's what is referred to as a solid state welding process.
Friction stir is a friction welding variant that is pretty cool too. https://youtu.be/WVxFu5HR98E It is the process NASA uses to build fuel tanks and other cylindrical rocket things. The equipment in the pictures at the link is probably the largest "welding equipment" in the word. https://www.nasa.gov/exploration/systems/sls/multimedia/welding-complete-on-fuel-tank-for-sls-rocket 
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And it's strong as shit. Draw works load limit on a flex 3 rig is 750,000 lbs if I can remember. Pulling on a tight hole I've seen 900,000 lbs (and a new driller after the logs were reviewed) pulling on a 4 mile drill string. 
I was coming in here to ask how strong the bond is afterward. I'm dumb when it comes to this sort of thing, in what applications is this method used? |
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Quoted:
While it may not look like it, nothing actually melts. It's what is referred to as a solid state welding process. Friction stir is a friction welding variant that is pretty cool too. https://youtu.be/WVxFu5HR98E It is the process NASA uses to build fuel tanks and other cylindrical rocket things. The equipment in the pictures at the link is probably the largest "welding equipment" in the word. https://www.nasa.gov/exploration/systems/sls/multimedia/welding-complete-on-fuel-tank-for-sls-rocket https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/thumbnails/image/msfc_2016_xp_sls_p_0003_maf_20160926_sf02_sls_em1_lh2_move_cell_a-80.jpg 
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I was coming in here to ask how strong the bond is afterward. I'm dumb when it comes to this sort of thing, in what applications is this method used? Super fast and efficient attachment of two round parts. In the OPs video its some thick wall tubing to a specially machined end. It can be used to bond solid round stock as well. It would take 50x the time to machine and prep the ends, weld, and clean up those two parts if you used a conventional manual welding process. Also, chances are it wouldn't end up nearly as straight. Simply put, If done properly the bond is as strong as the base metals it's made up of. |
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Quoted:
Super fast and efficient attachment of two round parts. In the OPs video its some thick wall tubing to a specially machined end. It can be used to bond solid round stock as well. It would take 50x the time to machine and prep the ends, weld, and clean up those two parts if you used a conventional manual welding process. Also, chances are it wouldn't end up nearly as straight. Simply put, If done properly the bond is as strong as the base metals it's made up of.
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I used to run a Friction Welder. Used to put 1" long solid end caps on 5/32" wall tube on each end.
The complete assy was turned so that you had 3/8" journals to fit ball bearings on each end and the roller was put in a mold and a 1/2" layer of Silicone rubber was cast on it. - feed rollers for Xerox machines. It don't take that much HP, you get a flywheel up to speed then it goes into neutral right before the parts impact. Big machines have adjustable weights that can be moved between the flywheel hub and outer edge so you can dial up the inertia while still using the same mass. |
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It would be nice to see an inside view of the pipe / weld after the job was finished. Quoted:
It would be nice to see an inside view of the pipe / weld after the job was finished. It looks the same on the inside as the outside with the flashing on it. Quoted:
I want to see some testing done on that. I wonder how it stacks up to conventional welds. Usually it's stronger then the material itself. Parts are generally heat treated so the crystals and grain structure weld heat affected zones do not become a brittle point in the material. Fun fact. You can weld 2 different metals together this way (hardmetals.) I inspect these type of welds. |
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Friction and Friction stir is cool, I've done it unintentionally before. Explosive welding is very cool, they have found ways to permanently bond aluminum to ferrous metals. If they can make it practical it would be huge for automotive applications. |
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Super fast and efficient attachment of two round parts. In the OPs video its some thick wall tubing to a specially machined end. It can be used to bond solid round stock as well. It would take 50x the time to machine and prep the ends, weld, and clean up those two parts if you used a conventional manual welding process. Also, chances are it wouldn't end up nearly as straight. Simply put, If done properly the bond is as strong as the base metals it's made up of. and spin balanced too I would bet. |
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Friction and Friction stir is cool, I've done it unintentionally before. Explosive welding is very cool, they have found ways to permanently bond aluminum to ferrous metals. If they can make it practical it would be huge for automotive applications. There is a company in SW Pa that does explosive cladding. They use an old underground limestone mine near connellsville. Mostly the stuff goes into chemical reactor vessels. A lot of it gets used on ships too. They do a lot of carbon steel/stainlees steel to commercially pure titanium. The titanium would be on the inside. I think they use a layer on ANFO on top of the plate, then set it off. The pattern or flow the explosive wave makes is important to get a good bond. After they set it off, they go in after everthing settles and scoop up the plate (and dirt/rocks) with a big front loader. Then they re-flatten it and maybe grind it before forming it. I think they would have some real problems doing explosive welding on thin sheet like you would want in a car. It would be better to do some sort of hot dip of steel sheet in zinc or aluminum. I think they may use aluminzed steel for gas tanks. It used to be a lead (terne) coating, but I'm sure that's all been made illegal now by the EPA. |
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USC (South Carolina) did a lot or research with a grant from NASA on those techniques. I think they started it about 15-18 years ago. Its been longer ago than that. I remember from college someone telling us about how McDonnell Douglas used friction stir and diffusion bonding on major parts for the AV-8B Harriers. That was about 30 years ago. |
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Damn.
What's the reduction on that gear train? Quoted:
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Speaking of neat shit for offshore service, these are for the jack legs of a shallow water platform. Damn.
What's the reduction on that gear train? The thing in gray is the test stand. On the far end of that rack are, IIRC, (8) 8" bore cylinders in tandem. They used the cylinders to monitor the pressure developed by the gear setup. Neat shit, designed and built in USA. |
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In the butt welds case, doesn't it leave a trench? Is the advantage that no welding materials are present in the welded joint? The advantage is that process is fast as fuck. Depositing enough metal to fill a vee'd butt weld in tubes that diameter and wall thickness is a pretty slow process even with automatic processes. |
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While it may not look like it, nothing actually melts. It's what is referred to as a solid state welding process. Friction stir is a friction welding variant that is pretty cool too. https://youtu.be/WVxFu5HR98E It is the process NASA uses to build fuel tanks and other cylindrical rocket things. The equipment in the pictures at the link is probably the largest "welding equipment" in the word. https://www.nasa.gov/exploration/systems/sls/multimedia/welding-complete-on-fuel-tank-for-sls-rocket https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/thumbnails/image/msfc_2016_xp_sls_p_0003_maf_20160926_sf02_sls_em1_lh2_move_cell_a-80.jpg NASA builds smokers?!?! I gotta find their web store |
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Its been longer ago than that. I remember from college someone telling us about how McDonnell Douglas used friction stir and diffusion bonding on major parts for the AV-8B Harriers. That was about 30 years ago. Quoted:
Quoted:
USC (South Carolina) did a lot or research with a grant from NASA on those techniques. I think they started it about 15-18 years ago. Its been longer ago than that. I remember from college someone telling us about how McDonnell Douglas used friction stir and diffusion bonding on major parts for the AV-8B Harriers. That was about 30 years ago. I was talking about the NASA grant at USC. I had no idea this technique has been around this long. Research done here was a friction "stir" welding. A device would friction stir two panels together. Never got to see it in action, but an old friend was the head machinist doing all the work. |
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Well, I got that, I meant like... which industries and specific applications of the process One application is the construction of the turbo in your typical turbocharger. The "fan" part of the turbo is joined to the stem that protrudes beneath it via friction weld. |
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There is a company in SW Pa that does explosive cladding. They use an old underground limestone mine near connellsville. Mostly the stuff goes into chemical reactor vessels. A lot of it gets used on ships too. They do a lot of carbon steel/stainlees steel to commercially pure titanium. The titanium would be on the inside. I think they use a layer on ANFO on top of the plate, then set it off. The pattern or flow the explosive wave makes is important to get a good bond. After they set it off, they go in after everthing settles and scoop up the plate (and dirt/rocks) with a big front loader. Then they re-flatten it and maybe grind it before forming it. I think they would have some real problems doing explosive welding on thin sheet like you would want in a car. It would be better to do some sort of hot dip of steel sheet in zinc or aluminum. I think they may use aluminzed steel for gas tanks. It used to be a lead (terne) coating, but I'm sure that's all been made illegal now by the EPA. Quoted:
Quoted:
Friction and Friction stir is cool, I've done it unintentionally before. Explosive welding is very cool, they have found ways to permanently bond aluminum to ferrous metals. If they can make it practical it would be huge for automotive applications. There is a company in SW Pa that does explosive cladding. They use an old underground limestone mine near connellsville. Mostly the stuff goes into chemical reactor vessels. A lot of it gets used on ships too. They do a lot of carbon steel/stainlees steel to commercially pure titanium. The titanium would be on the inside. I think they use a layer on ANFO on top of the plate, then set it off. The pattern or flow the explosive wave makes is important to get a good bond. After they set it off, they go in after everthing settles and scoop up the plate (and dirt/rocks) with a big front loader. Then they re-flatten it and maybe grind it before forming it. I think they would have some real problems doing explosive welding on thin sheet like you would want in a car. It would be better to do some sort of hot dip of steel sheet in zinc or aluminum. I think they may use aluminzed steel for gas tanks. It used to be a lead (terne) coating, but I'm sure that's all been made illegal now by the EPA. Your summary is mostly accurate. The most common end uses for clad metal are pressure vessels and tube sheets for condensers/heat exchangers. Nickel alloys, stainless steels or titanium clad to Carbon steel is the majority of that business. They also provide a number of transition joints. Steel/aluminum structural transitions for the shipbuilding industry have been produced for a long time. Thin metal can be explosion clad (welded) as well. Materials as thin as 1mm have been used. There is also a process called roll bonding that uses heat and pressure from rollers to bond thin cladders to a base metal. Explosion welding's advantage over roll bond is our ability to bond dissimilar metals (steel/titanium for example) and thick cladders. The company was featured on the Welding edition of Modern Marvels. https://youtu.be/2u51tJdRDK0  Explosion Welding.mp4 |
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I was talking about the NASA grant at USC. I had no idea this technique has been around this long. Research done here was a friction "stir" welding. A device would friction stir two panels together. Never got to see it in action, but an old friend was the head machinist doing all the work. |
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Well, I got that, I meant like... which industries and specific applications of the process If you have flown in a jet in the past 20 or more years you have had friction welded shafts in the jet engine on the plane, more than likely. First time I saw it being done back in the late 80s i was like why didn't I think of that? Very good weld and efficient process. We would weld thin tube shaft sections onto a disk or hub that would be inside a jet engine. We used some other freaky welding techniques but I can't tell you about that. 
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