Posted: 4/1/2009 12:21:13 PM EDT
| What type of configuration sre the recruits qualifying on these days? Standard A2's or ???? |
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Nope A3 is full auto A2 style used by the some Navy personnel and select others. A4 is flat top 3rd burst
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I heard a rumor that they were changing to A3's with ACOG's that was awhile ago and a rumor mind you. A3s have a fixed carry handle , they would be A4s I thought A3 and A4 were flat tops? |
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Recruits qual on table one/two with iron sights on m16a2s, mine was an FN but some of my buddies had colts. At ITB we qual with m16a4s running kac rails/rail covers/vfg, RCOs, and PEQ 15s on table 3/4. In the fleet most units do our yearly quals using RCOs.
-Active 0352 |
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The gentleman in my sig line was carrying an A4 w/Acog in Iraq in 2005. A4s w/ ACOGs have been in use in line units for some time now (I saw AT Bn on the east coast with brand new A4s and ACOGs in Spring of '05). What MCRD is issuing I do not know. If I were to take a guess, (and that's all it is), I'd say recruits are still being issued A2s, and may be given the opportunity to "fam fire" the A4 on the rifle range in addition to qualifying with the A2. It's nothing more than speculation on my part. |
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yeah Im saying not sure, because for the life of me I don't remember if I saw one or not. Somebody on ARFCOM a couple of weeks ago stated that new rifes are being issued with BUISs. Like you, I've never seen one mounted on a rifle, but I have seen a pic here and there. |
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current marine battle rifle Colt M16A4 TA31RCOA4 Surefire 961 XM07 KA M5 rail PEQ-2 Grip pod not sure on buis BUIS: SOME units are getting Matech's..... most I've seen- none... Surefires come down to luck of the draw.... we have quite a few light combos out in the fleet now *edit* boot camp still issues A2s (just confirmed with a kid here just out of boot camp- I'm talking a few months ago) the rest of the info is current as of this past December when I EAS'd from the 03 field |
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I heard a rumor that they were changing to A3's with ACOG's that was awhile ago and a rumor mind you. A3s have a fixed carry handle , they would be A4s I thought A3 and A4 were flat tops? The confusion here is understandable. When flattop uppers started becoming popular many civilian manufacturers called them "A3." That is fine, except, they didn't know about a relatively obscure version of the M16 already in service with the Navy called the M16A3, which was an M16A2 configuration with the ability to fire full auto, vice a 3 round burst. |
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I've seen some pictures of west coast USMC recruits carrying A4 MWS rifles with carry handles.
Personally I think the USMC should stick with the A2 in basic. No carry handles to get lost, no rail panels to get lost. No recruits cutting up hands on the cheese grater rails. "AND ENTRY-LEVEL TRAINING SITES WILL CONTINUE TO CONDUCT TABLES 1 AND 2 WITH IRON SIGHTS AND HAVE SCORES REPORTED INTO MCTFS. PRELIMINARY STUDIES EXAMINING THE PERFORMANCE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN RCOS AND IRON SIGHTS USING ENTRY-LEVEL LIEUTENANTS HAVE SHOWN A FIVE POINT DIFFERENCE IN QUALIFICATION SCORES FAVORING THE RCOS." |
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i can second the losing carrying handles and cover panels
when i was at B co 2/47 on sandhill in jan-mar 08 the entire battalion was issued M16A4s, beat to hell A4s with super shitty triggers, and the damn panels never wanted to stay on. Most people never had problems with carrying handles, but those who did lose them didn't have fun 
but i always wondered why the A4 is listed in the manual as having a 600m area target range vs the A2's 800m ? they're also listed as weighing the same as an A2, when the A4 seemed much more front heavy ( can't imagine why ) than an A2 and then when i got to Ft. Gordon i was issued an A1, patrols got alot more fun after that :D {EDIT} i just looked at FM3-22 and the weights are listed differently, odd, in the little book i had in basic it said 8.7lbs loaded for a2 and a4 |
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i can second the losing carrying handles and cover panels when i was at B co 2/47 on sandhill in jan-mar 08 the entire battalion was issued M16A4s, beat to hell A4s with super shitty triggers, and the damn panels never wanted to stay on. Most people never had problems with carrying handles, but those who did lose them didn't have fun
but i always wondered why the A4 is listed in the manual as having a 600m area target range vs the A2's 800m ? they're also listed as weighing the same as an A2, when the A4 seemed much more front heavy ( can't imagine why ) than an A2 and then when i got to Ft. Gordon i was issued an A1, patrols got alot more fun after that :D {EDIT} i just looked at FM3-22 and the weights are listed differently, odd, in the little book i had in basic it said 8.7lbs loaded for a2 and a4 600m because of the rear sight. The A4 is about 1 pound heavier then the A2. |
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current marine battle rifle Colt M16A4 TA31RCOA4 Surefire 961 XM07 KA M5 rail PEQ-2 Grip pod not sure on buis I've honostly never seen a pic of a Marine with a BUIS. Sometimes the carry handle though. Most take 'em off and sell 'em for beer money. 
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600m because of the rear sight. The A4 is about 1 pound heavier then the A2. Its been a while but how are the sites from the a2 differnt from the a4? Because of the removable carry handle, the rear sight doesn't have as much travel so cannot be raised as high as the fixed carry handle sights, limiting the range. That's the only difference. Which really doesn't matter because when qualifying in the Marine Corps the farthest we shoot is 500 Meters. We set BZO for 300 meters on iron sights for combat and now most rifles have an ACOG anyway. |
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I was just talking to my brother about this last night. he was with 3-1 MT on his 2 deployments to iraq. both times he carried an M4. he told me that he was trying to get M4's for all of his guys in motor T. but most of them still carried the M16A4 set up as described earlier in this topic.
looks like my next AR15 project is going to be a M16A4 wannabe. I already built my brother an M4gery with a 37mm launcher. he had the M203 on his M4. stupid RCO's are too expensive. I finally found the M4 version...now I have to track down a decently priced A4 version. 
one more interesting thing my brother told me. He said that they would sight in their rifles using the detachable carry handles, then take them off, put the RCO on and keep the carry handle in the RCO pouch just in case the optic was damaged and they had to switch back. |
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The gentleman in my sig line was carrying an A4 w/Acog in Iraq in 2005. Nephew said he qualied with iron sights but never used them for anything else. Optics in A-stan but I dont know type. He went in 3 years ago Iron sights are the most reliable but not the most accurate In General I have seen the semi-pros shoot 500 yards prone and wish I could shoot that well |