Posted: 6/3/2008 6:40:52 PM EDT
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I've heard many people talking about getting bikes now for a lot of reasons, but it seems many of them hop onto a new bike without the basics. Ideally, everyone takes the MSF course before getting on a bike. Realistically, that isn't the case. In the past week, two guys have died in my area by not making a curve. It could have been for a variety of reasons, but I know alot of people don't have the understanding of how the steering works at speed. It's kind of a hard concept to grasp if you've never done it. The video helps a lot. I'm sure the vid has been posted before, but it doen't hurt to show it again. How to countersteer And another one that proves you don't steer with your body. No bs bike |
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I'm glad that there's so many resources out there now to teach this stuff. I rode my new KLR650 about 25 miles Monday for the first time since the early 90's, when I had a pretty bad spill after hitting a dog on my Honda CB650 after riding 2 years or so. Back then, I don't know if there was such a thing as the MSF Course... if there was, no one told me about it. I didn't know about countersteering or any other "this is how you are supposed to do it" techniques. I probably did countersteer back then, but I thought I was "leaning into the curve." I used the rear brake a lot. I made all kinds of mistakes up until the crash. Now with all the forums, MSF course, etc., there's so much easily-obtained information out there about how to ride properly... it's great. Even after not riding for 15 years or so, I find I still have bad habits but I'm breaking them. Realizing how to countersteer, and knowing what I was doing when I did it, was amazing. I could steer the bike with one finger if I wanted to! Taking the MSF Course in two weeks... I'm not doing much except for short, local rides until then. |
What gets me, is that people need to be taught this... When I started riding I just "did it". I had nor needed any instruction. It is the natural way to steer a bike, you can't ride one without doing it. Hell, you have to know it to ride a bicycle.... Yet people hurt or kill themselves every year because they don't know how to do something they've been doing from day 1 
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I think the problem is that although it's intuitive, when the SHTF, your brain goes into overdrive and you start THINKING about what to do. And that's what gets you into trouble. You need to understand how things work so your conscious understanding of what you're doing aligns with the natural way to do things. |
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A lot of it comes from breaking down what is happing and understanding how the bike reacts to it. Taking KirkP's advice I got the Code book, and a lot of what he talks about in there makes sense when you actually stop to analyize what is happening. It has made me realize some of my faults and I am working to correct them. |
Add to that equation the fact that motorcycles are faster and heavier than bicycles. It's an apples and oranges thing. You can get over your head on a motorcycle in about 2 seconds. Hard to do that on a 10 speed. 
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No. Ask a kid in your neighborhood how to ride a bike. They'll probably say "uhh" and then say that you lean. Say you're turning left. People lean to the left, unconsciously putting more weight on the left bar. This makes them turn left. If you haven't, it's not too hard to meet Harley guys (Ok, I'm picking on a brand, so what) who will swear to the "lean to turn" thing and say that you'll "get killed" using the front brake. |
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I read TOTR and swore up and down that it was a misprint on the countersteering, but it aint. I freaked out when I pushed on the left bar and went left. Been doing it all along, just never thought of it. I grew up riding dirt though. The main thing is to remember where you look, you will go. That goes for ditches, cars, or through the curve. I had to learn to not look 50 to 100 feet ahead of the bike, especially in tight curves. Look through the curve. Also remember a panic response is to chop off the throttle, and or lock the rear brake. Both major no no's on the street. I may barely breath on my rear brake a few times in several hundred miles through the mountains. A few weeks back I made one entire pass through Deal's Gap, from overlook to CROT, without touching the brakes once. And I wasn't dragging ass either. But again I made 7 passes through and back that day. |
If you ask around, it is generally suprising how many people think you just lean and don't do anything to the bars. Sportbike, dirtbike, and cruiser guys. Around here, very few take the MSF course, so they have little exposure to such things. I know most people who ride know this, but I've also read and heard a lot of people ask what it is. Even guys in this forum. So if it helps anyone, I'm happy. |
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the countersteering initiates the lean and that's what makes for the change in direction. when you countersteer, you kick the wheels out from under you a bit and that causes a lean, then the wheels turn a bit into the turn to account for that lean. when you lean, your center of gravity is no longer over the contact patch so you have to have an opposing side force acting on the tire to keep you from falling over. I could draw a diagram but I'm too lazy right now :p |
I gotcha covered. 
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What is this Code book of which you speak? |
My point is, they still know what or how to do it, even if they can't explain it. Knowing what to do in an emergency is more important and to why you are doing what you are doing. I do agree though, that it is good for one to get a basic idea of the mechanics behind it all. |
Oh yeah, I agree with you there. They can ride a bike. But I think that motorcyclists who fail to comprehend counter-steering DON'T know what to do in a panic situation, even if they can get from bar to bar OK. Take this classic video as an example. They were fine cruising along until they actually had to turn sharply. Then they target-fixated and locked their rear brakes - when all they needed to do was counter-steer. Edit to say: when I say they need to "comprehend" counter-steering, I don't mean that they need to understand or know kinematics relating to gyroscopes - simply that they need to know "push right go right." |
"They're gonna beat our asses."  Deals Gap is fucking ghey, there's a shitload of much better roads in California. Why in the fuck would nayone want to ride that piece of shit road with a bunch of speed freak truck drivers on it. www.youtube.com/watch?v=OvrcqeIPYOg&feature=related |
you dont have time to think out there, if you think youre dead. |
It's not intuitive far from that in my first hard right to left curve I went off the road,scared the crap out of me! I rode very humble for a while I don't know but I learned to countersteer after that! This was on the way to Minco Oklahoma where I learned about brakes on dirt and gravel roads! And I say again if there had been a MSC offered in 1968 I should have taken it! Bob |