Why did we go to Iraq? Where the hell is my cheap gas?
Why are we fighting with one had behind our back? Do we not want to win?
Why do we have Civilian reporters on the ground there? To spread their hate and discontent..

I'm getting the distinct fell that is is so true...

From 1984 At this moment, for example, in 1984 (if it was 1984), Oceania was at war with Eurasia and in alliance with Eastasia. In no public or private utterance was it ever admitted that the three powers had at any time been grouped along different lines. Actually, as Winston well knew, it was only four years since Oceania had been at war with Eastasia and in alliance with Eurasia. But that was merely a piece of furtive knowledge which he happened to possess because his memory was not satisfactorily under control. Officially the change of partners had never happened. Oceania was at war with Eurasia: therefore Oceania had always been at war with Eurasia. The enemy of the moment always represented absolute evil, and it followed that any past or future agreement with him was impossible.

If you can keep the people at a perpetual state of panic. You can just about pass any freedom restricting laws you can think on in the name of the common good..

Discuss....

Quoted: It would follow that you assert that either there is, or there may be, the lack of a threat from Muslim extremist organizations. Do you?

Assume there is, for a minute (Although I think its clear there is).
Is our invovlement in Iraq the best way to handle the situation?

Quick questions:

How many suicide bombers in Iraq have been Iraqi?

How many are extremists drawn from other areas.  

Quoted: Quoted: It would follow that you assert that either there is, or there may be, the lack of a threat from Muslim extremist organizations. Do you? Assume there is, for a minute (Although I think its clear there is). Is our invovlement in Iraq the best way to handle the situation?

HMMMM where were the hijackers from?? Definitely not from Iraq! Who is funding the large terrorist Orgs?

Why didn't we jump in the middle of where the prob is originating? Saudi Arabia?

Oh i forgot we might make the UN very very mad and they might write a letter to us telling us how mad they are at us...

That aside - it has been proven time and time again that the real roots of modern Islamic terrorism lie largely in Saudi Arabia and Iran..........we will never attack Saudi because we are in bed with the Saudi Royalty........it doesnt matter if they harbor terrorists........so long as things are economically okay......

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: It would follow that you assert that either there is, or there may be, the lack of a threat from Muslim extremist organizations. Do you? Assume there is, for a minute (Although I think its clear there is). Is our invovlement in Iraq the best way to handle the situation? I'm not sure, however, I have difficulty coming up with a better plan than establishing a base of operations in Iraq from which we can squeeze Iran and Saudi Arabia as we need to when we need to.

We're not going to be able to squeeze anyone, because financially we're damn near out of steam.

We could have taken that money we spent in Iraq and bolstered our economs at home, pushed for development of energy sources outside of the Middle East and be done with the place.

Or, we could fight terrorism, and not Saddam. Bush wanted to get Saddam, and thats it. In order to do so he sold us this bullshit "War on Terror" and we've bought it hook line and sinker, and now we parade around on how Bush is lookin out for us. Which is of course a load of bullshit, due to more Islamic radicals then ever speaking out against America, more countries then ever not approving of our actions and a border you could drive a tank across and no one would know.

So, on the whole, I think Iraq has been a complete bumblefuck operation thats has gained us nothing, and lost us quite a bit.

Quoted: Quoted: That aside - it has been proven time and time again that the real roots of modern Islamic terrorism lie largely in Saudi Arabia and Iran..........we will never attack Saudi because we are in bed with the Saudi Royalty........it doesnt matter if they harbor terrorists........so long as things are economically okay...... Therein lies the problem: How do you subjugate the SA roots of terrorism without crashing our economy?

See post above. Use that 80 BILLION dollars to find alternatives to SA.

Quoted: Quick questions: How many suicide bombers in Iraq have been Iraqi? How many are extremists drawn from other areas.

Give this man a cookie.

Quoted: Quoted: That aside - it has been proven time and time again that the real roots of modern Islamic terrorism lie largely in Saudi Arabia and Iran..........we will never attack Saudi because we are in bed with the Saudi Royalty........it doesnt matter if they harbor terrorists........so long as things are economically okay...... Therein lies the problem: How do you subjugate the SA roots of terrorism without crashing our economy?

Well, George (but mostly things he couldn't control - mostly) screwed this concept for HIS admin, anyway, probably the next 2. But - SECRETLY develop an alternative to gas-fed cars - probably patents out there that have a TON of ideas on how to accomplish this) - schmoozse the head of one of the U.S. car mfgr's - have them produce a SHITLOAD of `em (probably in violation of patents NOW owned by folks LIKE the Saudis or maybe oil barron types here or abroad - not "up" enough of THAT legal stuff to know what might make that "okay" - ) then make the INITIAL $$ of the vehicle be CHEAP, so most everyone could make the "switch". Then, no more $$$ for the Saudi's. Too bad, so sad,

1984