Computer/Networking guys, quick question.

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Computer/Networking guys, quick question.

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:09:48 PM EDT

I would like to run a network cable to the other side of the house. I have the Cat5e, I have to buy the terminators and crimpers.

On end will plug directly into the router so I need a normal RJ-45, is there any type I could buy that I don't need a special crimper for?

The other end will be in the office so it needs a finished look, I need a female connector in a wall outlet type cover. Again, is there any kind that I could get away with not buying a crimper/punch tool?

BTW, it is a pretty long run through the entire house so I'd rather run the wire without the terminators installed, which means I can't just take the wire somewhere and have someone crimp the ends on.

Any info?

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:11:33 PM EDT

[#1]

The RJ45 jack crimping tool is not expensive.

Also, have you considered running a wireless network?

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:11:44 PM EDT

[#2]

Most wall sockets vary.

but you can do the rj45 with a flathead and a push pin if you have too

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:13:49 PM EDT

[#3]

Quoted:
I would like to run a network cable to the other side of the house. I have the Cat5e, I have to buy the terminators and crimpers.

On end will plug directly into the router so I need a normal RJ-45, is there any type I could buy that I don't need a special crimper for? No, sorry. I've never heard of one. But the tool is not too expensive.

The other end will be in the office so it needs a finished look, I need a female connector in a wall outlet type cover. Again, is there any kind that I could get away with not buying a crimper/punch tool? (I've used the Leviton female connectors that snap into a wall plate. They come with a small plastic punch tool (I think if you buy a whole box). I've used a pocketknife before to punch down.)

BTW, it is a pretty long run through the entire house so I'd rather run the wire without the terminators installed, which means I can't just take the wire somewhere and have someone crimp the ends on.

Any info?

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:14:14 PM EDT

[#4]

Quoted:
The RJ45 jack crimping tool is not expensive.

Also, have you considered running a wireless network?

Yes, it's to far to get a signal (tried a friends router and laptop) and it's a waste of money for my purpose.

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:14:46 PM EDT

[#5]

Quoted:
Most wall sockets vary.

but you can do the rj45 with a flathead and a push pin if you have too

Please elaborate. Where does the push pin enter into this?

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:15:21 PM EDT

[#6]

If you are going to all that trouble you might as well go for the finished look on both ends.

Its a pain in the ass but you can fake the punchdown without a special tool if you have to.

Then you can just go buy some premade cables to go from the wall to the equipment.

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:15:45 PM EDT

[#7]

Quoted:
The RJ45 jack crimping tool is not expensive.

Also, have you considered running a wireless network?

wired is faster not to mention more secure

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:17:41 PM EDT

[#8]

Quoted:
If you are going to all that trouble you might as well go for the finished look on both ends.

Its a pain in the ass but you can fake the punchdown without a special tool if you have to.

Then you can just go buy some premade cables to go from the wall to the equipment.

The one end is going to come out the floor in the spare bedroom closet and go directly into the router. There's an open floorboard in the closet where I ran cable, phone, and central vac through.

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:19:45 PM EDT

[#9]

Here's a couple of items:

1. On the router end - You really shouldn't crimp an RJ-45 directly to anything but stranded core. If you bought a box of Cat 5e, it's likely solid core. If you feel that you MUST crimp the connector directly to the cable (you need to think about using a patch panel), purchase the charcoal colored connectors. The pins won't puncture solid core wire - they "grab" it from the side.

2. For the PC end in the office - Head on down to Home Depot, or Lowes perhaps, and buy the Leviton jack and plate. You won't need a crimping tool. For the connection from the wall to the PC, just buy a patch cable and safe yourself the greif (this coming from a guy who's made *ALOT* of patch cables in his time).

3. If you still want to make your own patch cables, a crimper is like 10 bucks. Just buy one. They're not hard to use. If you buy the Leviton jacks, you won't need to buy a punch down tool, though it does make life a tad easier (don't buy one unless you're going to use it alot - cheap punch down tools SUCK).

I hope that helps. Let me know if you have any other questions.

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:20:46 PM EDT

[#10]

Quoted:
Quoted:
If you are going to all that trouble you might as well go for the finished look on both ends.

Its a pain in the ass but you can fake the punchdown without a special tool if you have to.

Then you can just go buy some premade cables to go from the wall to the equipment.
The one end is going to come out the floor in the spare bedroom closet and go directly into the router. There's an open floorboard in the closet where I ran cable, phone, and central vac through.

Okay how about you get the router end terminated then feed it from the closet end.

Then all you have to worry about is the finished look in the office.

The punchdown block can be done with a wide variety of common household tools. (Dont ask me how I know!)

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:22:20 PM EDT

[#11]

Quoted:
Here's a couple of items:

1. On the router end - You really shouldn't crimp an RJ-45 directly to anything but stranded core. If you bought a box of Cat 5e, it's likely solid core. If you feel that you MUST crimp the connector directly to the cable (you need to think about using a patch panel), purchase the charcoal colored connectors. The pins won't puncture solid core wire - they "grab" it from the side.

2. For the PC end in the office - Head on down to Home Depot, or Lowes perhaps, and buy the Leviton jack and plate. You won't need a crimping tool. For the connection from the wall to the PC, just buy a patch cable and safe yourself the greif (this coming from a guy who's made *ALOT* of patch cables in his time).

3. If you still want to make your own patch cables, a crimper is like 10 bucks. Just buy one. They're not hard to use. If you buy the Leviton jacks, you won't need to buy a punch down tool, though it does make life a tad easier (don't buy one unless you're going to use it alot - cheap punch down tools SUCK).

I hope that helps. Let me know if you have any other questions.

I have plenty of short patch cables. Something I was not aware of was what you said about solid and stranded cable. I guess I will just buy a female terminator for both ends, better choice?

About the Leviton jack and plate from Home Depot, how does it work without a crimper?

BTW, thanks for all the info guys!

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:22:37 PM EDT

[#12]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
If you are going to all that trouble you might as well go for the finished look on both ends.

Its a pain in the ass but you can fake the punchdown without a special tool if you have to.

Then you can just go buy some premade cables to go from the wall to the equipment.
The one end is going to come out the floor in the spare bedroom closet and go directly into the router. There's an open floorboard in the closet where I ran cable, phone, and central vac through.

Okay how about you get the router end terminated then feed it from the closet end.

Then all you have to worry about is the finished look in the office.

The punchdown block can be done with a wide variety of common household tools. (Dont ask me how I know!)

If he buys a cheap Leviton panel, they come with a cheezy plastic thing that makes a half-assed punch down tool in a pinch. It only needs to work once.

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:23:55 PM EDT

[#13]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
If you are going to all that trouble you might as well go for the finished look on both ends.

Its a pain in the ass but you can fake the punchdown without a special tool if you have to.

Then you can just go buy some premade cables to go from the wall to the equipment.
The one end is going to come out the floor in the spare bedroom closet and go directly into the router. There's an open floorboard in the closet where I ran cable, phone, and central vac through.

Okay how about you get the router end terminated then feed it from the closet end.

Then all you have to worry about is the finished look in the office.

The punchdown block can be done with a wide variety of common household tools. (Dont ask me how I know!)

That's a good idea too, but I think I'd be better off following the advice from both of you and just use a female end on both sides, than use a patch cable to connect it.

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:26:04 PM EDT

[#14]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
If you are going to all that trouble you might as well go for the finished look on both ends.

Its a pain in the ass but you can fake the punchdown without a special tool if you have to.

Then you can just go buy some premade cables to go from the wall to the equipment.
The one end is going to come out the floor in the spare bedroom closet and go directly into the router. There's an open floorboard in the closet where I ran cable, phone, and central vac through.

Okay how about you get the router end terminated then feed it from the closet end.

Then all you have to worry about is the finished look in the office.

The punchdown block can be done with a wide variety of common household tools. (Dont ask me how I know!)
That's a good idea too, but I think I'd be better off following the advice from both of you and just use a female end on both sides, than use a patch cable to connect it.

Why, yes you would.

The jacks are color coded (idiot proof) and don't require a punch down tool. Since you already have patch cables, you won't need to bother with buying a crimping tool either, since you won't need to make any cables.

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:26:09 PM EDT

[#15]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Most wall sockets vary.

but you can do the rj45 with a flathead and a push pin if you have too
Please elaborate. Where does the push pin enter into this?

most flatheads arn't thin enough to get the pin thing all the way down.

Dodn;t do it this way unless you have too Its a in a pinch thing

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:27:06 PM EDT

[#16]

Home depot carries Cat5e keystone jacks & wallplates. The Quick Port Leviton jacks at HD come with a plastic punch down tool, you will just need some small wire cutters to trim the ends. The best option would be to use a surface mount box at the router location and put a keystone jack in it. Then just use a patch cable from the router to the wall box. This method would be cheaper and more reliable in the long run.

Damn I got beaten!!

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:31:07 PM EDT

[#17]

BTW - how long of a run are we talking, out of curiosity?

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:36:02 PM EDT

[#18]

Quoted:
BTW - how long of a run are we talking, out of curiosity?

I'd say about 150', well within the limit. It's not that far of a run, but it's a hard run- in and out thru crawlspaces and walls that were built at different times (2 separate additions).

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:37:18 PM EDT

[#19]

Quoted:
Home depot carries Cat5e keystone jacks & wallplates. The Quick Port Leviton jacks at HD come with a plastic punch down tool, you will just need some small wire cutters to trim the ends. The best option would be to use a surface mount box at the router location and put a keystone jack in it. Then just use a patch cable from the router to the wall box. This method would be cheaper and more reliable in the long run.

Damn I got beaten!!

Just out of curiosity, it's really that bad to terminate this wire with an RJ-45? Is it unreliable because it's solid?

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:38:42 PM EDT

[#20]

Quoted:
Quoted:
BTW - how long of a run are we talking, out of curiosity?
I'd say about 150', well within the limit. It's not that far of a run, but it's a hard run- in and out thru crawlspaces and walls that were built at different times (2 separate additions).

Cool. I'm almost finished with a structured wiring retrofit on my house. Every room in the house terminates to a Chatsworth telecom rack in the basement. It's actually pretty sweet. MAN does it suck doing this after the fact, though. It's much easier when the drywall isn't up yet.

Good luck!

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:40:58 PM EDT

[#21]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
BTW - how long of a run are we talking, out of curiosity?
I'd say about 150', well within the limit. It's not that far of a run, but it's a hard run- in and out thru crawlspaces and walls that were built at different times (2 separate additions).

Cool. I'm almost finished with a structured wiring retrofit on my house. Every room in the house terminates to a Chatsworth telecom rack in the basement. It's actually pretty sweet. MAN does it suck doing this after the fact, though. It's much easier when the drywall isn't up yet.

Good luck!

What are you running, Cat6? Aren't you worried about doing all that work just to have to rip it out in a few years for the next standard?

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:42:35 PM EDT

[#22]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Home depot carries Cat5e keystone jacks & wallplates. The Quick Port Leviton jacks at HD come with a plastic punch down tool, you will just need some small wire cutters to trim the ends. The best option would be to use a surface mount box at the router location and put a keystone jack in it. Then just use a patch cable from the router to the wall box. This method would be cheaper and more reliable in the long run.

Damn I got beaten!!
Just out of curiosity, it's really that bad to terminate this wire with an RJ-45? Is it unreliable because it's solid?

Yes. Solid core wire is not meant to be bent, i.e. don't try and use it as a patch cord. It will fail eventually. In addition, the clear connectors you typically find at the local store will punch straight through the wires. They are meant to be used on stranded core wire, where having a pin shoved straight through the middle isn't a bad thing. There are charcoal colored connectors available (do you have a Graybar in your hometown?) that grab solid-core wire at an angle, so that the wire doesn't get cut. Even so...

...you shouldn't use solid-core wire as a patch cable. It is meant to be terminated into a jack/panel and remain staitionary.

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:45:10 PM EDT

[#23]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Home depot carries Cat5e keystone jacks & wallplates. The Quick Port Leviton jacks at HD come with a plastic punch down tool, you will just need some small wire cutters to trim the ends. The best option would be to use a surface mount box at the router location and put a keystone jack in it. Then just use a patch cable from the router to the wall box. This method would be cheaper and more reliable in the long run.

Damn I got beaten!!
Just out of curiosity, it's really that bad to terminate this wire with an RJ-45? Is it unreliable because it's solid?

Yes. Solid core wire is not meant to be bent, i.e. don't try and use it as a patch cord. It will fail eventually. In addition, the clear connectors you typically find at the local store will punch straight through the wires. They are meant to be used on stranded core wire, where having a pin shoved straight through the middle isn't a bad thing. There are charcoal colored connectors available (do you have a Graybar in your hometown?) that grab solid-core wire at an angle, so that the wire doesn't get cut. Even so...

...you shouldn't use solid-core wire as a patch cable. It is meant to be terminated into a jack/panel and remain staitionary.

Excellent, ya learn something new everyday.

Thanks for all the help guys!

Posted: 12/26/2005 5:47:48 PM EDT

[#24]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
BTW - how long of a run are we talking, out of curiosity?
I'd say about 150', well within the limit. It's not that far of a run, but it's a hard run- in and out thru crawlspaces and walls that were built at different times (2 separate additions).

Cool. I'm almost finished with a structured wiring retrofit on my house. Every room in the house terminates to a Chatsworth telecom rack in the basement. It's actually pretty sweet. MAN does it suck doing this after the fact, though. It's much easier when the drywall isn't up yet.

Good luck!
What are you running, Cat6? Aren't you worried about doing all that work just to have to rip it out in a few years for the next standard?

Cat 5e. It's good to gigabit speeds, it's cheap, and there really isn't a good reason (other than "oooh, cool") to run anything else. Hell, even gigabit is overkill at home.

Still, if I *had* to pull it out, it's easy as hell. I've already got wire fished through the walls. Just secure the new wire to the old one and start pulling. Git 'er done!

Posted: 12/26/2005 6:01:15 PM EDT

[#25]

I found this on Home Depot's website, I assume it's the one you are talking about:

Use with any QuickPort surface mount box or flush mount wallplate. Patented cutting ledge trims wire as you terminate. Color coded wiring labels for fast, accurate terminations.

Store SKU # 236586
Internet # 302523
Catalog # 100020255

Internet ID 302523
Brand Leviton
Model # 40838-BW
Color/Finish White
Type Keystone Jack
UPC CODE 078477962473

It doesn't say anything about coming with a plastic tool, I guess I don't need one with this type? Or should I be looking for a different model?

Posted: 12/26/2005 6:05:49 PM EDT

[#26]

Quoted:
I found this on Home Depot's website, I assume it's the one you are talking about:
tinypic.com/j7ujup.jpg

Use with any QuickPort surface mount box or flush mount wallplate. Patented cutting ledge trims wire as you terminate. Color coded wiring labels for fast, accurate terminations.

Store SKU # 236586
Internet # 302523
Catalog # 100020255

Internet ID 302523
Brand Leviton
Model # 40838-BW
Color/Finish White
Type Keystone Jack
UPC CODE 078477962473

It doesn't say anything about coming with a plastic tool, I guess I don't need one with this type? Or should I be looking for a different model?

I think that's it. Mine came with a cheap tool, but I own a nice punch down tool so I never used it. I don't have the model number handy. The fact that it says "patented cutting ledge trims wire as you terminate" suggests that a proper punch down tool is not required, as the blade on a real punch trims the wire for you.

Posted: 12/26/2005 6:18:48 PM EDT

[#27]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
BTW - how long of a run are we talking, out of curiosity?
I'd say about 150', well within the limit. It's not that far of a run, but it's a hard run- in and out thru crawlspaces and walls that were built at different times (2 separate additions).

Cool. I'm almost finished with a structured wiring retrofit on my house. Every room in the house terminates to a Chatsworth telecom rack in the basement. It's actually pretty sweet. MAN does it suck doing this after the fact, though. It's much easier when the drywall isn't up yet.

Good luck!

Nice I just finished all of my structured wiring in my house as well. I used a leviton panel and wish I would have gone with someone like ON-Q. But it's done and all working so until I finish the basement it will stay this way. I will try and post picutures of mine later.

Posted: 12/26/2005 6:25:23 PM EDT

[#28]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Home depot carries Cat5e keystone jacks & wallplates. The Quick Port Leviton jacks at HD come with a plastic punch down tool, you will just need some small wire cutters to trim the ends. The best option would be to use a surface mount box at the router location and put a keystone jack in it. Then just use a patch cable from the router to the wall box. This method would be cheaper and more reliable in the long run.

Damn I got beaten!!
Just out of curiosity, it's really that bad to terminate this wire with an RJ-45? Is it unreliable because it's solid?

It actually doesn't matter if it's solid or not, I've seen hand-crimped stranded wire "custom patch cables" fail, a lot. You just can't get a good termination with the hand crimping.

Posted: 12/26/2005 6:28:31 PM EDT

[#29]

Quoted:
Quoted:
I found this on Home Depot's website, I assume it's the one you are talking about:
tinypic.com/j7ujup.jpg

Use with any QuickPort surface mount box or flush mount wallplate. Patented cutting ledge trims wire as you terminate. Color coded wiring labels for fast, accurate terminations.

Store SKU # 236586
Internet # 302523
Catalog # 100020255

Internet ID 302523
Brand Leviton
Model # 40838-BW
Color/Finish White
Type Keystone Jack
UPC CODE 078477962473

It doesn't say anything about coming with a plastic tool, I guess I don't need one with this type? Or should I be looking for a different model?

I think that's it. Mine came with a cheap tool, but I own a nice punch down tool so I never used it. I don't have the model number handy. The fact that it says "patented cutting ledge trims wire as you terminate" suggests that a proper punch down tool is not required, as the blade on a real punch trims the wire for you.

Nope, proper tool IS required. The ledge gives the blade on the punchdown tool an anvil to cut the wire against. If you buy the 10-pack it does come with a little cheesy tool, and you can use it and then cut with a knife or a wire cutter. If you don't have the cheesy plastic tool, the thin knifeblade in most leatherman tools will do the job.

Posted: 12/26/2005 6:32:19 PM EDT

[#30]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I found this on Home Depot's website, I assume it's the one you are talking about:
tinypic.com/j7ujup.jpg

Use with any QuickPort surface mount box or flush mount wallplate. Patented cutting ledge trims wire as you terminate. Color coded wiring labels for fast, accurate terminations.

Store SKU # 236586
Internet # 302523
Catalog # 100020255

Internet ID 302523
Brand Leviton
Model # 40838-BW
Color/Finish White
Type Keystone Jack
UPC CODE 078477962473

It doesn't say anything about coming with a plastic tool, I guess I don't need one with this type? Or should I be looking for a different model?

I think that's it. Mine came with a cheap tool, but I own a nice punch down tool so I never used it. I don't have the model number handy. The fact that it says "patented cutting ledge trims wire as you terminate" suggests that a proper punch down tool is not required, as the blade on a real punch trims the wire for you.

Nope, proper tool IS required. The ledge gives the blade on the punchdown tool an anvil to cut the wire against. If you buy the 10-pack it does come with a little cheesy tool, and you can use it and then cut with a knife or a wire cutter. If you don't have the cheesy plastic tool, the thin knifeblade in most leatherman tools will do the job.

Ya, but the "ledge" shouldn't be required for a punch down tool. My Panduit patch panels don't have a ledge, and the punch down tool cuts the wire just fine.

Posted: 12/26/2005 6:44:04 PM EDT

[#31]

I've been doing some reading, it seems as if a lot of people say to just put the wires in and use the cover to push them down all the way. This page is an example, no mention of a punchdown tool: www.9thtee.com/networkingts.htm

FOS?

Posted: 12/26/2005 6:48:42 PM EDT

[#32]

Quoted:
I've been doing some reading, it seems as if a lot of people say to just put the wires in and use the cover to push them down all the way. This page is an example, no mention of a punchdown tool: www.9thtee.com/networkingts.htm

FOS?

I've done that. I don't know if it held up, but it worked when I left.

Posted: 12/27/2005 6:20:41 PM EDT

[#33]

I found everything I need: A flush mount plastic box for the closet, a couple of cover plates, and the female connections which included small punch tools (they better for $5 each!)

Thanks for the help everyone!

Posted: 12/27/2005 6:25:15 PM EDT

[#34]

Quoted:
Most wall sockets vary.

but you can do the rj45 with a flathead and a push pin if you have too

+1

I don't have proper tools. Just strip the main jacket, get enough length of wires, and then push them down into the back of the socket. I use a smale jewelry / glasses type screwdriver for the task, and it works every time.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Computer/Networking guys, quick question.

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