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Posted: 11/2/2004 6:50:46 AM EST
My co-worker has a step son that just finshed AF basic training. He will start tech school for being an MP next week. In 6 months he has been told he will be in Iraq or Afghanistan doing security for bases, convoys etc...

My questions:

1)What rifle will he likely be issued? M4, M16 A1 or A2, the AF GAU(sp?) without forward assists, etc...?

2)I want to send him some extra gear when he ships out. Could I for example send him an Aimpoint Comp ML2?

Thanks for any input.
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 6:58:28 AM EST
Generally, Air Force Security Forces use the M-16 (I think A2), M-9 pistol, M-60, and 12-gauge (Remington, IIRC). This is what I've seen at stateside bases. I imagine they have more hardware, but this is what I've seen.

Pass on our appreciation for the young man's service.
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 7:00:10 AM EST
The Air Farce is the first service to adopt the M16 in large numbers.

No, that is not a typo.
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 7:01:09 AM EST
Depends on which USAF Security Forces unit he goes to. I would hold off on giving him optics let him feel out the command first. I used to carry a lockback folder on my web belt and my commander would shit when he saw it. It wasn't issue gear.
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 7:03:28 AM EST

Originally Posted By booniedawg:
Depends on which USAF Security Forces unit he goes to. I would hold off on giving him optics let him feel out the command first. I used to carry a lockback folder on my web belt and my commander would shit when he saw it. It wasn't issue gear.



They don't let you carry knives?!! Come on, now, in the Army it is practically required to have a folding knife/multi-tool.
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 7:09:45 AM EST
The AF usually frowns on any weapons mods. Most AF weapons are daily armory issued and stored (pool weapons.) Mission excepted, it is the CO decision to allow mods. YMMV.
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 7:10:52 AM EST
Firleman2000, they are cops, not soldiers. I work with and for a half dozen or so of these guys and a couple told me they were security forces and I quote "The Air Forces Infantry". After comparing notes they no longer maintain they are anything like the Infantry lol....

So yeah, i can see them freaking about a non-issued piece of kit being worn.
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 7:13:28 AM EST

Originally Posted By rifleman2000:

Originally Posted By booniedawg:
Depends on which USAF Security Forces unit he goes to. I would hold off on giving him optics let him feel out the command first. I used to carry a lockback folder on my web belt and my commander would shit when he saw it. It wasn't issue gear.



They don't let you carry knives?!! Come on, now, in the Army it is practically required to have a folding knife/multi-tool.



It really depends on the CO. At my first base (Seymour Johnson AFB), our commander was very mission-oriented; if it helped you get the job done, it was fine by him. At my last yard (Andrews AFB), the attitude was, "if the Air Force wanted you to use it, the Air Force would have issued it to you."
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 7:17:47 AM EST

Originally Posted By TimJ:
Firleman2000, they are cops, not soldiers. I work with and for a half dozen or so of these guys and a couple told me they were security forces and I quote "The Air Forces Infantry". After comparing notes they no longer maintain they are anything like the Infantry lol....

So yeah, i can see them freaking about a non-issued piece of kit being worn.



That's pretty much the way I saw myself also, the main difference being that if an Infantry unit gets into trouble, they generally have an avenue of retreat. When you are working Air Base Ground Defense, there is no place to retreat to. Our motto was, "Hold the line or die."
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 7:18:34 AM EST
I spent 10 years at Andrews..........

If it aint Presidential, it aint shit!

Strictest base I was ever assigned to..........


archer2
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 7:22:04 AM EST

Originally Posted By Nimrod1193:
the main difference being that if an Infantry unit gets into trouble, they generally have an avenue of retreat.



That makes no sense. I am sure there are other differences. Let's see:

Combat patrols
Movement to contact
Raids
Ambush operations
Recon missions
Take and hold
Airborne/AASLT operations
Hasty attack
Deliberate attack
Self sustaining in the field
All male
Carry big knives
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 7:28:09 AM EST
I not going to get into a pissing contest here. My dad was a 28-year veteran of Army Infantry (Airborne.) I am proud of him and what he did. I am also proud of my service as an Air Force Security Policeman (K-9, Air Base Ground Defense.) I'm not here to piss on anybody's military service and I'd appreciate you not pissing on mine. If you don't like that, fuck off.
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 7:30:09 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/2/2004 7:30:53 AM EST by rifleman2000]

Originally Posted By Nimrod1193:
I not going to get into a pissing contest here. My dad was a 28-year veteran of Army Infantry (Airborne.) I am proud of him and what he did. I am also proud of my service as an Air Force Security Policeman (K-9, Air Base Ground Defense.) I'm not here to piss on anybody's military service and I'd appreciate you not pissing on mine. If you don't like that, fuck off.



Nobody's pissing on your military service, so calm down. I just thought I'd point out a few differences from SPs and the infantry besides "having an avenue to retreat."

Sheesh, man, I love the Air Force.
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 7:33:39 AM EST
Air Force Security police are a pretty tough kickass bunch now. Given what they have to guard, they are prepared to take on and overcome some fairly elite outfits. They are a far cry from the AP's (pronounced apes) of years gone by. When I was in the AF, all the AP's had to do was keep the gate and watch the drunks. Yes, on SAC bases they had to be tough when guarding the 52's. But, today is a different world.
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 7:35:28 AM EST

Originally Posted By rjroberts:
Air Force Security police are a pretty tough kickass bunch now. Given what they have to guard, they are prepared to take on and overcome some fairly elite outfits. They are a far cry from the AP's (pronounced apes) of years gone by. When I was in the AF, all the AP's had to do was keep the gate and watch the drunks. Yes, on SAC bases they had to be tough when guarding the 52's. But, today is a different world.



Are they also responsible for guarding nuke sites? Or is that a seperate bunch? Haha, I am sure they train hard, back in the day they would be fighting Spetsnaz.
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 7:47:14 AM EST
In Korea they have mortor flights and they drive around in APCs. At least they did when i was at Kunsan. I have also seen M16s w/m205s.
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 8:56:20 AM EST

Originally Posted By WooDy_the_infidel:
In Korea they have mortor flights and they drive around in APCs. At least they did when i was at Kunsan. I have also seen M16s w/m203s.

Link Posted: 11/2/2004 9:01:04 AM EST

Originally Posted By rifleman2000:

Nobody's pissing on your military service, so calm down. I just thought I'd point out a few differences from SPs and the infantry besides "having an avenue to retreat."

Sheesh, man, I love the Air Force.



Sorry if I was a bit touchy about the subject. Airmen seem to get a lot of "you're not in the real military" comments on this board. In fact, in Air Base Ground Defense School, Security Police (now Security Forces) receive training in the full range of infantry small-unit tactics. The school used to be at Ft. Dix (I'm not sure if it is still there.) There is even an Airborne Security Forces unit. In April 2003, Security Forces personnel with the 86th Contingency Response Group jumped into Northern Iraq with the 173rd Airborne Brigade in order to set up and secure airfields.

Again, I apologize for being snappish. Election Day is getting me a little stressed.
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 9:05:36 AM EST

Originally Posted By WooDy_the_infidel:
In Korea they have mortor flights and they drive around in APCs. At least they did when i was at Kunsan. I have also seen M16s w/m205s.



I was with the 8th Security Police Squadron at Kunsan AB from '85 - '86. Our unit was equipped with M-16s, M-203s, M-60s, M-2s, Mk-19s, 81mm mortars and Stinger missiles. The ROKAF unit attached to the base manned the 20mm Vulcans.
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 9:09:53 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/2/2004 9:12:39 AM EST by Nimrod1193]

Originally Posted By rifleman2000:

Are they also responsible for guarding nuke sites? Or is that a seperate bunch? Haha, I am sure they train hard, back in the day they would be fighting Spetsnaz.



When I was at Kunsan AB, we were at or near the top of North Korea's hit list if the balloon ever went up. That was because we had three squadrons of F-16s with tactical nuclear bombs, and we could've turned it into a very short war.
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 9:11:39 AM EST

Originally Posted By Nimrod1193:

Originally Posted By rifleman2000:

Are they also responsible for guarding nuke sites? Or is that a seperate bunch? Haha, I am sure they train hard, back in the day they would be fighting Spetsnaz.



When I was at Kunsan AB, we were at or near the top of North Koreas hit list if the ballon ever went up. That was because we had three squadrons of F-16s with tactical nuclear bombs, and we could've turned it into a very short war.



How did you deal with possible infiltrators? Were you there when that sub landed those N Korean commandos in S Korea?
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 9:18:29 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/2/2004 9:19:33 AM EST by booniedawg]
They let you carry knives,BUT, it's the commanders descision. I went on to another USAF career field where it was definately encouraged.
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 9:20:20 AM EST

Originally Posted By rifleman2000:
How did you deal with possible infiltrators? Were you there when that sub landed those N Korean commandos in S Korea?



I believe that incident was in 1996, long after I had left. I was a K-9 handler there; we covered the entire base perimeter, with extra coverage at night. Our coastline was covered by the 20mm Vulcans. We had a small fishing vessel get too close to our beach once (it had been abandoned for some reason.) After giving warnings in Korean and English, the Vulcans cut it in half.
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 9:22:17 AM EST

Originally Posted By rifleman2000:

Originally Posted By Nimrod1193:
the main difference being that if an Infantry unit gets into trouble, they generally have an avenue of retreat.



That makes no sense. I am sure there are other differences. Let's see:

Combat patrols
Movement to contact
Raids
Ambush operations
Recon missions
Take and hold
Airborne/AASLT operations
Hasty attack
Deliberate attack
Self sustaining in the field
All male
Carry big knives




They do all that too, look up the 820th.
Link Posted: 11/2/2004 9:47:38 AM EST

Originally Posted By rifleman2000:

Originally Posted By WooDy_the_infidel:
In Korea they have mortor flights and they drive around in APCs. At least they did when i was at Kunsan. I have also seen M16s w/m203s.




whoops. yeah those. lol
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