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Who is making G36 clones? (Page 2 of 3)
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Picked up my S5 Tactical G36 clone yesterday. It looks and feels quality. G36 mags fit little tight as mentioned by other members. Comparing to SL8, texture seems to be about equal. If it shoots as well as it looks it will a winner. Overall quality I would say the difference is like MKE guns vs actual Hk. |
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Originally Posted By ChickenDaddy: Mine shipped today, pretty excited. Also gonna get a Stanag magwell—theres a half dozen on HK parts, what ones did you all try? I tried the HK factory AR magwell on my G36 (SL8 conversion) and quickly removed it. Aside from the LRBHO no longer working reliably, the mag release is in an awkward place for a right handed shooter since it’s only on the left side. I went back to the G36 magwell with HK and Magpul G36 mags. Also much prefer the HK paddle mag release, especially the extended mag release. BTW, of the six I see on HKParts, one is the factory G36 magwell, one is a copy made by GSG9 (which is probably what’s on the S5 clones), and a FDE/RAL copymade by HK Parts. Two are HK factory AR magwell conversions that they charge over $200 for, and one is a used SL8 magwell, which only works with SL8 single stack mags. |
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Mine arrived today. Im surprised these are 2k and wondering how it's worth 2k at the same time! If this platform were popular in the US and had a handful of manufacturers making it I could see them around $1100-$1300. I do like it and thing it's a great addition to a already fun collection. |
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Originally Posted By ClickClickBoom1: Mine arrived today. Im surprised these are 2k and wondering how it's worth 2k at the same time! If this platform were popular in the US and had a handful of manufacturers making it I could see them around $1100-$1300. I do like it and thing it's a great addition to a already fun collection. Did it come with any information about the barrel? |
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Originally Posted By johnhd: Owner of GSG9, which produces a number of US-made HK parts for the G36 and other platforms (most HKParts G36 parts are also from there). Also produced molds for the G36 receivers (Tommybuilt and S5 use their molds). I don't know the full backstory, but a lot of people hate the guy and there have been reports of past shadiness and questionable parts quality. Unfortunately, his company seems to be the only source of G36 parts outside of an HK factory. Tommybuilt also used GSG9 parts for their TG36. So there are very few routes to a G36 in the USA that don't involve GSG9 in some way:
It's a cost-to-benefit thing at the end of the day. I personally would rather buy a $2k clone and hope HK USA releases the real thing down the road. S5 seems to be getting fairly positive feedback, and TB TG36s did as well later in the production run. Originally Posted By johnhd: Originally Posted By ChickenDaddy: Whats the deal with Bailey? Owner of GSG9, which produces a number of US-made HK parts for the G36 and other platforms (most HKParts G36 parts are also from there). Also produced molds for the G36 receivers (Tommybuilt and S5 use their molds). I don't know the full backstory, but a lot of people hate the guy and there have been reports of past shadiness and questionable parts quality. Unfortunately, his company seems to be the only source of G36 parts outside of an HK factory. Tommybuilt also used GSG9 parts for their TG36. So there are very few routes to a G36 in the USA that don't involve GSG9 in some way:
It's a cost-to-benefit thing at the end of the day. I personally would rather buy a $2k clone and hope HK USA releases the real thing down the road. S5 seems to be getting fairly positive feedback, and TB TG36s did as well later in the production run. You need to further back in time. His old company Special Weapons were one of the early companies in the ban years that was trying to sell their receivers and parts for the HK 91 and 94 market. The worst thing it took a lot of efforts to fix their shitty products. Plus, he had the website HK54.com to push his narrow self congratulations to himself for outstanding products. |
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This is low volume product, you are not going to see these for $1300. This is unless HK releases semi G36 for less, which is doubtful. I mean look at SL8, those were selling for $1500 and you need another $3000 to get to be G36. Now if these are not selling S5 Tacticl/Todd Bailey decides to discontinue selling them. HKParts have had GSG parts for probably close to a decade. There really isn’t any thing magical about G36. It is almost 30 years old plastic rifle. It is a nostalgic HK fan boi rifle (including myself). German government has some doubts about the design, not sure if it is warranted or not. Likely not, as in some cases it was used out side its design envelope. Just about any mid level AR15 would be much better for typical shooter. However, S5 clone is G36 we have at home. |
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Originally Posted By AR18: You need to further back in time. His old company Special Weapons were one of the early companies in the ban years that was trying to sell their receivers and parts for the HK 91 and 94 market. The worst thing it took a lot of efforts to fix their shitty products. Plus, he had the website HK54.com to push his narrow self congratulations to himself for outstanding products. Was Special Weapons Todd Bailey, or his bother Wade? I remember having SW doing my SL8 and USC conversions back in the early 2000’s, during the ban era, when they were about the only options. I didn’t have any problem with my conversions, but I remember he was a bit of a handful to deal with. |
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As bad as Todd was, he was the only game in town. I have MP5 build on his receiver. It works just fine but I can’t mount anything on it as claw mount slots are out of spec. I had one of those SL8 conversions. His plastic HK clone parts are much better today. In same cases they are difficult to tell apart from OEM HK. |
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Originally Posted By unrock: This is low volume product, you are not going to see these for $1300. This is unless HK releases semi G36 for less, which is doubtful. I mean look at SL8, those were selling for $1500 and you need another $3000 to get to be G36. Now if these are not selling S5 Tacticl/Todd Bailey decides to discontinue selling them. HKParts have had GSG parts for probably close to a decade. There really isn’t any thing magical about G36. It is almost 30 years old plastic rifle. It is a nostalgic HK fan boi rifle (including myself). German government has some doubts about the design, not sure if it is warranted or not. Likely not, as in some cases it was used out side its design envelope. Just about any mid level AR15 would be much better for typical shooter. However, S5 clone is G36 we have at home. I completely understand the low volume part of the price equation. That's why I'm surprised it was only $2000 instead of $3500 or so. But at the same time this design produced at a higher volume could be kel-tec SU16 priced. It's a cool guns either way. |
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I’m not sure how many people would actually choose G36 over AR even if it was $1200. Now days $1200 will get you well featured AR. With g36 parts are proprietary, selection isn’t as great and not as easy to work on. I’m a firearm junkie. I have Beretta ARX and IWI Carmel, not that well regarded designs but still very interested conceptually. I have SL8 turned into g36 clone using HPDS rear adapter. I was never a fan of fusing plastic rear end. Not only the cost but also longevity and robustness of “plastic weld”. |
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Originally Posted By unrock: I’m not sure how many people would actually choose G36 over AR even if it was $1200. Now days $1200 will get you well featured AR. With g36 parts are proprietary, selection isn’t as great and not as easy to work on. I’m a firearm junkie. I have Beretta ARX and IWI Carmel, not that well regarded designs but still very interested conceptually. I have SL8 turned into g36 clone using HPDS rear adapter. I was never a fan of fusing plastic rear end. Not only the cost but also longevity and robustness of “plastic weld”. Agreed, But at $1200-$1300 it could compete in the piston 556 market. That's Jakl, Makasi, Carmel, BRN 180, MCX, Perun and so on. |
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Originally Posted By unrock: I’m not sure how many people would actually choose G36 over AR even if it was $1200. Now days $1200 will get you well featured AR. With g36 parts are proprietary, selection isn’t as great and not as easy to work on. I’m a firearm junkie. I have Beretta ARX and IWI Carmel, not that well regarded designs but still very interested conceptually. I have SL8 turned into g36 clone using HPDS rear adapter. I was never a fan of fusing plastic rear end. Not only the cost but also longevity and robustness of “plastic weld”. Because many already have several ARs already. If you want something different, you would. Some could argue - Why pay any amount for more of the same? |
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Originally Posted By willi3d: Was Special Weapons Todd Bailey, or his bother Wade? I remember having SW doing my SL8 and USC conversions back in the early 2000’s, during the ban era, when they were about the only options. I didn’t have any problem with my conversions, but I remember he was a bit of a handful to deal with. Originally Posted By willi3d: Originally Posted By AR18: You need to further back in time. His old company Special Weapons were one of the early companies in the ban years that was trying to sell their receivers and parts for the HK 91 and 94 market. The worst thing it took a lot of efforts to fix their shitty products. Plus, he had the website HK54.com to push his narrow self congratulations to himself for outstanding products. Was Special Weapons Todd Bailey, or his bother Wade? I remember having SW doing my SL8 and USC conversions back in the early 2000’s, during the ban era, when they were about the only options. I didn’t have any problem with my conversions, but I remember he was a bit of a handful to deal with. It was mainly Toady for special weapons. But the huge problem with Toady was his ego. You couldn't complain about his stuff without getting into a flame war with him. His brother came into the picture and tried to be the peace maker and tried to do some help. |
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Originally Posted By cherenkov: Because many already have several ARs already. If you want something different, you would. Some could argue - Why pay any amount for more of the same? Sure. Please visit your favorite shop and ask what is selling. I have few that I visit weekly and all the obscure rifles just sit on the shelf while ARs are selling. Most people would choose AR over g36. Only folks like us hardcore enthusiasts are buying something different. |
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Originally Posted By unrock: Sure. Please visit your favorite shop and ask what is selling. I have few that I visit weekly and all the obscure rifles just sit on the shelf while ARs are selling. Most people would choose AR over g36. Only folks like us hardcore enthusiasts are buying something different. Originally Posted By unrock: Originally Posted By cherenkov: Because many already have several ARs already. If you want something different, you would. Some could argue - Why pay any amount for more of the same? Sure. Please visit your favorite shop and ask what is selling. I have few that I visit weekly and all the obscure rifles just sit on the shelf while ARs are selling. Most people would choose AR over g36. Only folks like us hardcore enthusiasts are buying something different. This is exactly true. Aside from perhaps a handful of buyers, anyone who is contemplating a G36 or G36 clone already has several AR rifles. A G36 would certainly not be my choice if I had to make one. I am here like probably many of you; I want a G36 because they are badass, iconic and I am obsessed with anything HK. I want one that is as close to the real deal as possible. It is a want. Not a need. There are plenty of waaaaay better options in an oversaturated market. That has no bearing on my desire to own one. |
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Originally Posted By willi3d: Was Special Weapons Todd Bailey, or his bother Wade? I remember having SW doing my SL8 and USC conversions back in the early 2000’s, during the ban era, when they were about the only options. I didn’t have any problem with my conversions, but I remember he was a bit of a handful to deal with. No, Wade Bailey ran his own shop, Omega. His business skills weren’t awesome but he was a super nice and helpful guy who worked on my Gideon Shadow to get it to run better. I have two of his MP5 clones (a 10mm and an SD, both of which are not easy to build) and they run superbly. Todd Bailey is universally regarded as a problem. But he’s also the reason the clone market went mainstream; he proved the demand was there. |
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Originally Posted By ClickClickBoom1: I completely understand the low volume part of the price equation. That's why I'm surprised it was only $2000 instead of $3500 or so. But at the same time this design produced at a higher volume could be kel-tec SU16 priced. It's a cool guns either way. Well yes, it is/was a standard issue service rifle, economics clearly were there. |
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More pics (arrived today). Some markings on some parts, no info on the exposed barrel, rear sight might be missing a detent Attached File |
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Originally Posted By ChickenDaddy: More pics (arrived today). Some markings on some parts, no info on the exposed barrel, rear sight might be missing a detent https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/118342/IMG_3380_jpeg-3698937.JPG How long is the barrel? Looks like 19-20”. That’d be perfect if that’s the case @ChickenDaddy |
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Thought the barrels were 16". It is fairly light, not featherweight but AR weight, Barrel appears melonited and not the nicest finish on it. I didn't look down the barrel yet. Sights dont sit flat and get knocked up or down easily, not sure if this is normal? They dont lock flat. Appears to have aluminum heat shields in handguard. trigger and flash hider are surplus? trigger cuz its hK purple, flash hider is marked. Fit and finish are nice except that barrel. Stock locks open and closed and is tight and feels solid. Sight rail doesnt flex with hand pressure (that I can detect). Grip feels good, trigger is easy for me to reach and safety is easy to engage and disengage, Pmags dont like to seat on a closed bolt--think I read somewhere this is normal. Attached File Attached File Attached File Attached File Attached File |
| Thank you for the write up and the pictures. I am now following this to see what your impressions are when you get some rounds through it as well as long term usage. The plastic fit and finish looks great. In fact all of it looks really good. Wish we could get info on the barrels. Do you have any actual HK G36 mags for fitment? |
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Actually, is my rear sight peep aperature broken? I also tightened down that top screw and it doesn't seem quite so floppy, but were these sights always kind of easy to move/dislodge from vertical and horizontal? Attached File Attached File |
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I have the S5 G36K clone with proper Hk barrel threads. The plastic feels as good as HK SL8 that I have. The sight rail feels flimsy and twists very easily. Replaced with HK OEM, much, much better. Mags fit tight both OEM and Magpul, although OEM G36 inserts much easier. HK G36 magwell does not pin easily, has to be hammered in. Don’t like the trigger color , almost seems like dark shade of red or purple Don’t like big bulky billboard style reciver markings SL8 action is much smoother, perhaps due to more use and break in period I ran 60 rounds through it with one FTF from Magpul mag, g36 mag worked fine. All and all happy with the pistol enough to file From 1 Pic is not coming through…..I tired for 5min  |
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Originally Posted By unrock: I have the S5 G36K clone with proper Hk barrel threads. The plastic feels as good as HK SL8 that I have. The sight rail feels flimsy and twists very easily. Replaced with HK OEM, much, much better. Mags fit tight both OEM and Magpul, although OEM G36 inserts much easier. HK G36 magwell does not pin easily, has to be hammered in. Don’t like the trigger color , almost seems like dark shade of red or purple Don’t like big bulky billboard style reciver markings SL8 action is much smoother, perhaps due to more use and break in period I ran 60 rounds through it with one FTF from Magpul mag, g36 mag worked fine. All and all happy with the pistol enough to file From 1 Pic is not coming through…..I tired for 5min https://imgur.com/a/ChV46lU pic fixed Attached File |
Stolen Firearm: Colt AR15, Serial # SP342380, 16" carbine. Stolen in California by Kevin Ayres, and taken to Missouri.
Joined:
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EE: 100% (1)
TX, USA
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Originally Posted By AR18: You need to further back in time. His old company Special Weapons were one of the early companies in the ban years that was trying to sell their receivers and parts for the HK 91 and 94 market. The worst thing it took a lot of efforts to fix their shitty products. Plus, he had the website HK54.com to push his narrow self congratulations to himself for outstanding products. Todd Bailey. And to think he used to be involved in the automotive safety retention industry before getting into firearms. |
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Originally Posted By JackassWithARedPatch: I printed my own 9mm facsimile. Even printed a suppressor to go with it. https://i.imgur.com/lNqHMTE.jpeg @JackassWithARedPatch |
"Your enemy is never a villain in his own eyes. Keep this in mind; it may offer a way to make him your friend. If not, you can kill him without hate — and quickly." -Heinlein.
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Some pics of the guts for you all. Barrel lands and grooves are sharp, definitely not polygonal. FCG: Attached File Attached File Attached File |
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Bolt and related guts: Attached File Attached File Attached File Attached File |
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Now that SHOT is over and rumors for the real G36 seem to be "possibly late 2026", which I know means 2027+, it's time to move forward with an S5 build. Like the idea of a pre-built K, but my heart wants the C. Passed on a few rounds of C kit restocks on HKP the last 2 weeks while waiting for HK to give us even the tiniest bit of info at SHOT. Hopefully they still have another restock or two up their sleeves. Might snag a UMP receiver as well and stash for a rainy day. |
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Originally Posted By johnhd: Now that SHOT is over and rumors for the real G36 seem to be "possibly late 2026", which I know means 2027+, it's time to move forward with an S5 build. Like the idea of a pre-built K, but my heart wants the C. Passed on a few rounds of C kit restocks on HKP the last 2 weeks while waiting for HK to give us even the tiniest bit of info at SHOT. Hopefully they still have another restock or two up their sleeves. Might snag a UMP receiver as well and stash for a rainy day. Any word around the price of an HK G36? I feel like it would be at least $3000 to maybe $4000 MSRP? |
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I have Defgunz receivers I built 2 G36 clones. One was a German G36K parts kit and everything went together fine. The mold had a strange hole where it looks like an ejector pin pushed too hard, (didn't notice until after I shot it a bunch and SBR'd it) but by time I got in contact with Defgunz, S5 took over and I just filled it with some black plastic epoxy and it looks fine. 2nd Receiver Didn't have this, and they are sequentially numbered. HK mags in both were tight, and ended up reliefing an area on the receiver so they would drop in and out freely. The barrel socket polymer on the Defgunz receiver is slightly smaller than on the SL8, so the barrel wrench rubs the inside more, but is a non issue. I used a mix of SL8 and GSG9/HKParts initially for the 2nd build. Used GSG9/HKparts bolt, recoil spring endcap, magwell. Bolt worked fine, and after a few hundred rounds, I found a HK bolt so swapped it out. Recoil spring endcap, the pocket for the recoil spring wasn't quite right and would cause a slight misalignment and you could hear the spring rubbing on the bolt carrier abnormally (Still worked). I ended up dremeling the pocket so it can move to its correct location. Mag well fit on the receiver was tight and needed some fitting. The Defguns UMP receiver had no issues and went together perfectly with a semi-auto converted HK parts kit. I do not know if S5 made any more changes to the receivers, but personally I have been overjoyed with mine as it made owning a G36 clone more accessible and I don't have to worry about a fuse job letting go. Far as Quality compared to HK products, Material feel and all that is the same, but it seems some of the polymer stuff may need some minor fitting to work compared to HK parts, but considering all of this stuff is reverse engineered (add in the complexities of polymer molding, shrinkage and all those variables), there is bound to be some abnormalities and I think they have been doing a good job on them. Would have been nice if the TDP was 'leaked' in the 90s like the M4/M16 as I believe the G36 platform would have been a better gun for the market than the AR15. But since it wasn't, its hard to compete with endless AR15 manufactures and variations. |
| I built one of the C pistols for a buddy, they actually seem pretty solid and an easy build. Unfortunately he traded it off before knowing how these shoot. Any of you guys run them enough to know if they’re ammo finicky like the Tommy built ones were, I don’t wanna drop $2k on a “cheaper” g36 clone and then have to feed it premium 5.56 all the time |
Freedom is all in your head
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Originally Posted By patswin3: Any of you guys run them enough to know if they’re ammo finicky like the Tommy built ones were, I don’t wanna drop $2k on a “cheaper” g36 clone and then have to feed it premium 5.56 all the time I always thought this was related to the shorter barrel length of the C, and not something specific to the clones. Edit: Digging up a reply from Tom Bostic back in the day: "The C has a gas port with in an inch off the end of the barrel so it does not have much dwell time and requires quality 5.56 ammo. The K being a 12.5” is easier on suppressors and ammo choices." |
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Originally Posted By johnhd: I always thought this was related to the shorter barrel length of the C, and not something specific to the clones. Edit: Digging up a reply from Tom Bostic back in the day: "The C has a gas port with in an inch off the end of the barrel so it does not have much dwell time and requires quality 5.56 ammo. The K being a 12.5” is easier on suppressors and ammo choices." Originally Posted By johnhd: Originally Posted By patswin3: Any of you guys run them enough to know if they’re ammo finicky like the Tommy built ones were, I don’t wanna drop $2k on a “cheaper” g36 clone and then have to feed it premium 5.56 all the time I always thought this was related to the shorter barrel length of the C, and not something specific to the clones. Edit: Digging up a reply from Tom Bostic back in the day: "The C has a gas port with in an inch off the end of the barrel so it does not have much dwell time and requires quality 5.56 ammo. The K being a 12.5” is easier on suppressors and ammo choices." It doesn’t take expensive ammo, either. Just stuff loaded to 5.56 spec, not 223 pressures. Just about any M855 clone will be hot enough. It’s the 55gr FMJ that’s a PITA to make sure you’re getting M193 spec. If the manufacturer lists a velocity, it should be around 3200 out of a 20” barrel, but some cocksuckers use a 24” bolt action without specifying. Worth looking it up to find out if you’re uncertain. If your range/targets preclude steel core ammo, Magtech 55gr and 62gr lead core FMJ are 5.56 spec, they’re the same cost as any other basic FMJ right now. Federal XM193, IMI, Winchester white box, S&B, etc are all loaded hot enough. PMC bronze, PPU rangemaster, anything Federal marked 223, that stuff is loaded at 223 spec. PMC X-Tac is better than bronze, but still a little lighter than what you’d want. I was a little annoyed after finding out that PPU’s 55gr soft points are 223 spec, it didn’t line up with the Magtech 55gr that I have stocked up. |
Who is making G36 clones? (Page 2 of 3)
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