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Link Posted: 6/28/2020 3:09:58 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/28/2020 3:10:22 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By mdavis:

12” and portly.

I’ll get back to you on the actual weight later today.
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Originally Posted By mdavis:
Originally Posted By chewbacca:
Originally Posted By mdavis:
I really enjoy both my L and M SBRs, but both can be annoying when shooting with the brake and not the suppressor. Gratuitous picture of my M below.

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/142825/XCR-M_SBR-972874.jpg


I like that. What barrel length and what’s the weight?

12” and portly.

I’ll get back to you on the actual weight later today.

@chewbacca The rifle itself is 8.2 lbs empty as I have it configured with an AAC 51T brake, MI BUIS set and Magpul MOE grip. Most of the weight is in the barrel which is basically a HBAR profile. Admittedly, that's probably a good things as far as heat absorption as the keymod handguard leaves very little space between your hand and the barrel. Adding an AAC 762SD suppressor and Aimpoint Pro in an ADM mount gets the total weight to 9.6 lbs unloaded.
Link Posted: 6/28/2020 3:21:30 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/28/2020 3:22:13 PM EDT by The_Beer_Slayer]
Link Posted: 6/28/2020 8:57:40 PM EDT
Fantastic  ergonomic, accurate, highly innovative rifles. Nothing but love here. My dealings with the company has been fantastic.
Link Posted: 6/30/2020 2:53:54 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Melvin_Johnson:



Some guns apparently went to Poland for T&E before that country developed a modular rifle of its own. Czechoslovakia seems to have bought several XCR-M rifles as part of a DMR program.

Who else has tried them? Is anyone using it as a standard rifle or were these various purchases all for evaluation?

https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/18199/PSX_20200628_070620-1480375.jpg
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I am willing to bet large amounts of money that Czechoslovakia never purchased any XCR rifles of any type.
Link Posted: 6/30/2020 2:56:03 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/30/2020 3:20:22 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Melvin_Johnson:


Okay. Just regurgitating info I've seen posted eslewhere. No skin off my back either way.
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I am mostly just pulling your leg.  (Czechoslovakia hasn’t been a country since 1993)
Link Posted: 6/30/2020 3:24:05 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/1/2020 3:18:47 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/1/2020 3:19:15 PM EDT by lew]
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Originally Posted By jdsbusa:
I used to want one. This thread makes me want one again.
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If you don't like fantastically solid rifles, then don't get one. If you can live with a rifle that's going to last longer than your AK's and AR's combined, and shoot really well at the same time, the XCR is for you.
Link Posted: 7/1/2020 4:42:49 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/3/2020 11:34:57 AM EDT
FWIW, the firing pin tip just broke on my XCR-L pistol.  Total rounds fired before the break: 1572 300 Blackout and 1296 .223.  My pistol was out of warrantee, so I simply installed the spare FP I'd bought with my pistol.  I'll be getting another spare FP to keep on hand.  My other XCR-L's have never broken a FP.
Link Posted: 7/3/2020 3:15:55 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/3/2020 3:20:49 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By WholeBunches:
FWIW, the firing pin tip just broke on my XCR-L pistol.  Total rounds fired before the break: 1572 300 Blackout and 1296 .223.  My pistol was out of warrantee, so I simply installed the spare FP I'd bought with my pistol.  I'll be getting another spare FP to keep on hand.  My other XCR-L's have never broken a FP.
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Even though it is out of warranty, call the shop/email Holly and let them know what you had fail and your round count. They may send you a new pin.
Link Posted: 7/6/2020 10:50:06 PM EDT
The Robinson Armament XCR-L rifle: American ingenuity.
Link Posted: 7/7/2020 2:48:18 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By Gr8Santini:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpSvxrVaEVA
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I never gave the XCR a second thought until I just viewed MAC’s review on it. It seems like a very good and simple design.

I’m aware of the initial issues they were having, but it seems like all the bugs have been workes out. Are current production rifles different from the original design in any way?
Link Posted: 7/7/2020 1:45:42 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By urbankaos04:


I never gave the XCR a second thought until I just viewed MAC’s review on it. It seems like a very good and simple design.

I’m aware of the initial issues they were having, but it seems like all the bugs have been workes out. Are current production rifles different from the original design in any way?
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Different, not really, consistently evolved and made better, as well as modernized (Keymod and Mlok), YES!
Link Posted: 7/9/2020 3:17:34 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/9/2020 3:19:30 AM EDT by B44T]
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Originally Posted By urbankaos04:


I never gave the XCR a second thought until I just viewed MAC’s review on it. It seems like a very good and simple design.

I’m aware of the initial issues they were having, but it seems like all the bugs have been workes out. Are current production rifles different from the original design in any way?
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Originally Posted By urbankaos04:
Originally Posted By Gr8Santini:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpSvxrVaEVA


I never gave the XCR a second thought until I just viewed MAC’s review on it. It seems like a very good and simple design.

I’m aware of the initial issues they were having, but it seems like all the bugs have been workes out. Are current production rifles different from the original design in any way?


TL;DR crafted like a Swiss Main Battle Tank, shoots as good as the ammo you put through it, runs like a Rolex even when fed crappy commie steel case fodder.


It's ruggedness and simplicity belie it's mechanical design elegance and ingenuity.

For the curious: why some like the XCR-L and lay out the cash to purchase.

Superb ergonomics. Every user operation can be accomplished without breaking the firing grip.
Aluminum upper and lower.
Calibers and conversions in 5.45, 5.56, 6.8, 7.62x39, .300Blk and 6.5 Grendel.
Options on barrel lengths, calibers, twists and heavy light and medium contours from 7.5 inch to 18.5 inch.
Monolithic upper with full length Picatinny rail.
Uppers available in four different lengths.
Factory SBR and pistols.
5 position tool-less gas regulator. Suppressed,1,2,3,4.
User changeable barrel.
Takes all NATO STANAG / AR compatible mags and drums.
Takes all AR compatible grips.
Factory standard 3.5# trigger is on par with Geiselle SSA.
Left side charging handle with forward assist, all other controls are fully ambidextrous.
Collapsible adjustable aluminum folding stock that locks tight, does not flex and does not crumple when used to smash and beak things that need smashing and breaking. It features a polymer cheek piece adjustable for height and angle.
The stock folds to the right and does not interfere with controls, firing or ejection.
The 16" barreled carbine breaks down in 30 seconds or less into three pieces that fit in a 17 inch tool box, brief case or day pack.

To better understand the XCR get some trigger time on one and then take it apart. All the way apart. It's easy.

To completely disassemble one down to the last piece and build it back up you will need the complete armorers tool kit for the XCR which consists of the following items:
a folding hex key set.
a small adjustable wrench.
a small punch or nail.
a hammer ( or rock if you prefer )

No specialty tools required. No jigs. No fixtures. Not even a torque wrench. The complete armorers tool kit fits in a pouch or pocket.

There are no specialty fasteners or rivets used in the XCR. The few screws and pins that are used are common industrial standard hardware available at every NAPA and Home Depot and a hundred hardware retailers on line.

With it taken apart take a good hard critical look at the pieces, their design, their function and their fabrication. There are some very brilliant engineering and design features.

The two stage trigger system is very M1 Garrand like in it's use of the M1's "two hooks" technology as opposed to "square edge and notch" design FCG's most of us are familiar with.  The two hook system is what what gives the M1, M14 and others derived from the design their superior trigger pull characteristics. The XCR factory trigger pull is 3.5 pounds and very crisp.

The XCR's FCG pins are a robust .170 inch diameter, .015 thicker than standard .155 diameter AR FCG pins. If they become lost a pair of long shank short thread number 8 socket head cap screws and lock nuts from Home Depot would suffice until replacement arrive. Alternately one could cut and groove some 5/32 HSS rod. Or better yet stock however many spare parts makes one happy.

The bolt has three massive locking lugs which give more bearing surface and more shear area than needed. It's right lug features an impressive T-slot extractor that can not  slip off the cartridge rim and is prevented from doing so by the barrel extension. When the bolt comes back the case is coming with it. Period.

The bolt is forged with an integral cam lug protruding from the side. This allows for a smaller bolt body diameter than any other designs. This smaller diameter of the XCR's bolt body when coupled with the deep feed lip cuts in the bolt carrier allows the magazines feed lips to sit higher and closer to the bore center line than any other rifle I know of. This gives near straight line feeding. The bolt locking lug at the bottom position reaches deeper into the magazine than 6, 7 or 8 lug designs can. It engages more area of the cartridge case base. This increases reliability in stripping rounds from the magazine. The bolt locking lug cut out in the barrel extension is essentially a feed trough  instead of a feed ramp. Bullet, case neck and shoulder are positively guided to the chamber.

On the recoil stroke the carrier travels rearward a short disatnce before the cam cut in the the carrier begins to rotate the the bolt. This gives time for the carrier to build inertia and time for residual chamber pressure to bleed off to zero or near zero. The result is little to no case grip on the chamber walls before unlocking and extraction occurs.

When the bolt starts rotating, the left locking lug engages a caming ramp in the barrel extension. The caming ramp gives a 23:1 mechanical advantage for slow positive initial extraction like for example, the Mauser model 98.

The slot machined into the top of the carrier that the lug on the bottom of the op rod fits into is slightly longer than the said op rod lug that drops into the slot. In operation, with gas pressure pushing the op rod back, the back end of the lug presses against the aft end of the slot in the carrier pulling it backwards from the tail end. Going in the opposite direction, when the op rod is being pushed forward by spring tension the lug slips forward and now the forward end of the lug is pulling the carrier forward from the front end. This effectively eliminates carrier tilt in both directions.

The XCR's bore center line is very low in relationship to the top of the butt plate. This is a large part of the reason why the XCR produces noticeably less muzzle climb than straight line designs.

The gas piston head shaping, gas block and gas regulator and gas volume have an interesting effect on operating system pressure curves and impulse in the first half inch of op rod travel.

The sum of the design features and operating characteristics of the action doing what it does combine to give a firing sensation best described as so buttery smooth is makes butter wish it were that smooth. It is very MP5 like but on a larger scale.

Link Posted: 7/9/2020 6:33:03 AM EDT
Personally, I'd like to see development of a polymer lower to reduce weight.  It's an unstressed part that can be executed that way without compromising function.  But of course, the cost of fabricating a high precision mold probably makes it cost prohibitive.
Link Posted: 7/12/2020 1:05:04 AM EDT
Durability. Aluminum but stock on aluminum lower is durable enough for but plate smashing things that need to be smashed.
Link Posted: 7/12/2020 2:27:03 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By B44T:
Durability. Aluminum but stock on aluminum lower is durable enough for but plate smashing things that need to be smashed.
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That's a rather low probability occurrence.  More realistically, in a world where ounces = pounds, every ounce counts.

But like I said, it's too cost prohibitive for RA to pursue it.  They'd have to be moving 6 figures of product to justify the investment.
Link Posted: 7/12/2020 9:29:53 AM EDT
Link Posted: 7/12/2020 10:36:08 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:
honestly i have ZERO interest in any rifle with a polymer lower or upper. i will take the extra few ounces for durability and longevity every time. might be ok for a range queen, but i have zero interest in that. i am far from being a tactical operator but i expect any rifle i buy to be up to that need.  jmho
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I'm in complete agreement here. The XCR was never designed to have a polymer lower, and I have no interest in one. Robinson has gone through great pains to build the rifle as rugged as possible...hell their stock is made out of Aluminum! It would be one thing if the gun was designed from the beginning with a polymer lower such as the Scar and the Bren, but I'll leave this one as is.
Link Posted: 7/12/2020 12:21:37 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:  honestly i have ZERO interest in any rifle with a polymer lower or upper. i will take the extra few ounces for durability and longevity every time. might be ok for a range queen, but i have zero interest in that. i am far from being a tactical operator but i expect any rifle i buy to be up to that need.  jmho
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Do you run aluminum followers too?  
Link Posted: 7/12/2020 8:09:24 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/13/2020 1:27:23 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/13/2020 1:29:03 AM EDT by Master_Blaster]
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Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:
honestly i have ZERO interest in any rifle with a polymer lower or upper. i will take the extra few ounces for durability and longevity every time. might be ok for a range queen, but i have zero interest in that. i am far from being a tactical operator but i expect any rifle i buy to be up to that need.  jmho
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Reality disagrees.

Link Posted: 7/13/2020 10:29:12 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/13/2020 10:36:46 AM EDT by The_Beer_Slayer]
Link Posted: 7/13/2020 12:52:18 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Melvin_Johnson:


No issues with the single bolt working loose?
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Nope---Buy a torque wrench, use it, no issues.
Link Posted: 7/13/2020 12:54:21 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By backbencher:
How many AR parts do they take?  In the last pic it looks like standard AR lower parts?

How expensive are replacement bbls?  Anyone else make them or are specs & necessary parts available?
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Pistol Grip and grip screw? Possible A2 flashider--thats about it

Replacement barrels are between 400-650 depending on how many parts you need to convert the rifle.
Link Posted: 7/13/2020 12:56:07 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By AllAlphas:
Good to see they're still offering Keymod...even over MLOK in some cases.  That's gonna be a winning formula for long term success...

I'm on the list for a top feed kit for my M96...but I'm not holding my breath.  
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They like keymod over mlok because Key mod is a thinner/slimmer process for the handguard, allowling the barrel to be removed while keeping the handguard very thin,
They have mlok available as well, it just makes for a wider handguard to allow barrel removal.
Link Posted: 7/13/2020 12:59:22 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Melvin_Johnson:


I guess my complaint with the FAST2 is no sling swivel. The swivel is on the bottom side underneath the hinge. It doesn't really look like a very good spot.

Any experience with the ACR stock adapter from Lucky Irish or Fighting Irish or whatever?

I like the solidity of the ACR stock but don't like the open trench at the back when it is fully extended.

Anyway, I wonder if it might not be a good option for those who might be too happy with the FAST.
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I bought a QD point set off a gent here in the EE, that bolted right up to the back of my FAST 2--problem solved. I hunt with mine--so this was an issue.
Link Posted: 7/13/2020 12:59:53 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By sgwlower:



They like keymod over mlok because Key mod is a thinner/slimmer process for the handguard, allowling the barrel to be removed while keeping the handguard very thin,
They have mlok available as well, it just makes for a wider handguard to allow barrel removal.
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Originally Posted By sgwlower:
Originally Posted By AllAlphas:
Good to see they're still offering Keymod...even over MLOK in some cases.  That's gonna be a winning formula for long term success...

I'm on the list for a top feed kit for my M96...but I'm not holding my breath.  



They like keymod over mlok because Key mod is a thinner/slimmer process for the handguard, allowling the barrel to be removed while keeping the handguard very thin,
They have mlok available as well, it just makes for a wider handguard to allow barrel removal.

Agree. While I prefer MLOK over Keymod, when I held both I could really feel the extra bulk needed for the MLOK rail which made it less comfortable to me. Hence, both my XCR-L and XCR-M use Keymod rails (even though I have very few Keymod accessories).
Link Posted: 7/13/2020 1:01:48 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By mdavis:

Agree. While I prefer MLOK over Keymod, when I held both I could really feel the extra bulk needed for the MLOK rail which made it less comfortable to me. Hence, both my XCR-L and XCR-M use Keymod rails (even though I have very few Keymod accessories).
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Same here, both of mine are keymod for this reason.
Link Posted: 7/13/2020 1:39:17 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By sgwlower:
Pistol Grip and grip screw? Possible A2 flashider--thats about it

Replacement barrels are between 400-650 depending on how many parts you need to convert the rifle.
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In normal times that would buy you a complete AR, lol.
Link Posted: 7/13/2020 4:19:21 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By backbencher:


In normal times that would buy you a complete AR, lol.
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Yep, but have 20 cheap AR's in my safe isn't what I'm looking for.
Link Posted: 7/14/2020 7:46:22 AM EDT
No extensive dry firing, just one pull when leaving the range and one pull after cleaning it. If checking to make sure it is empty prior to putting it up, then another pull.
Link Posted: 7/14/2020 6:06:12 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:
HK had melting issues
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@The_Beer_Slayer  

HK had problems of melting of what, exactly?

As for polymer receivers, I don't mind polymer if a rifle was to be designed with that in mind. However, I carry my XCR all over this state's damnable terrain and have never wished for the receivers to have been made of a material other than aluminum. Even my Pic rail version is not too heavy to carry all day.
Link Posted: 7/14/2020 6:33:22 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/14/2020 7:30:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/15/2020 7:51:59 AM EDT by Rigian]
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Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:
g36 had issues heat
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Everyone says that but no one has ever been able to prove it. From what I understand the heat issue story originated with a few German military units claiming it had heat issues but they later admitted they just wanted a new gun. I don’t see any proof of it.  (No offense)
Link Posted: 7/14/2020 10:07:13 PM EDT
InRange did an interesting test of the G36 polymer trunion.  I think they could've tested it further, but it's their ammo.
Link Posted: 7/15/2020 2:52:46 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/15/2020 2:56:24 AM EDT by Master_Blaster]
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Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:
HK had melting issues, time and again we see poly receivers cracking or breaking.

sure might be ok in some instances but i have zero interest in them for a rifle that cost over 1k and i hope to be able to pass on to my kids down the road. it's also a bit different to consider an issue rifle can just be turned in for replacement or repair if/when i breaks. i don't have that luxury. i'd prefer it be made of long life components from the start. the list of successful military issue rifles using only polymer receivers is pretty small outside specific use cases. i suspect there is a reason for that.
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Beretta has no such problems with the ARX, which has a combat track record of reliability & durability; CZ Bren series uses a poly lower.  Op ed characterization doesn't match the facts, & the fact is that fiber reinforced polymer works quite well, regardless of RA not using it.
Link Posted: 7/15/2020 9:07:37 AM EDT
Only issue I’ve had with the xcr was on my current sbr, the hammer spring retaining pin got bent. Had their spare parts kit already so no big deal, and if I didn’t, I’m sure Ace Hardware would’ve had something that would’ve worked.
For those looking to get into one, watch GB, I’ve seen many 1st and 2nd gen pop up there for as cheap as $1k, then swap out whatever parts you want to upgrade or change.
I’ve got the 5.56 & 7.62x39 kit for mine, the x39 runs awesome with the old USA frankenmags and most asc mags
Attachment Attached File
Link Posted: 7/15/2020 9:12:24 AM EDT
Link Posted: 7/15/2020 10:39:12 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:



then you feel free to buy them. i have zero interest in them.
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Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:
Originally Posted By Master_Blaster:


Beretta has no such problems with the ARX, which has a combat track record of reliability & durability; CZ Bren series uses a poly lower.  Op ed characterization doesn't match the facts, & the fact is that fiber reinforced polymer works quite well, regardless of RA not using it.



then you feel free to buy them. i have zero interest in them.

Just get both. All I need is a TommyBuilt T36 clone and I will have the trifecta.
Link Posted: 7/15/2020 11:24:05 AM EDT
Link Posted: 7/15/2020 12:29:14 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Melvin_Johnson:



Nice.  

What's your take on the XCR vs the ACR?  Also, where's the SCAR?
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Honestly they’re about equal to me, both run great, no issues. The xcr obviously has more aluminum vs polymer so xcr feels slightly more solid. I’d love to upgrade the xcr upper to mlok but cost vs weight savings isn’t great, so not a priority. Also something to consider now is no more acr’s, while the xcr at least over the last few years have plenty of parts and caliber kits available.
I had a scar 17 for a while, the 16 just didn’t seem worth the cost, at least for me.
Link Posted: 7/15/2020 1:34:23 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/15/2020 7:45:23 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By backbencher:
InRange did an interesting test of the G36 polymer trunion.  I think they could've tested it further, but it's their ammo.
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One of InRange's recent videos seems to indicate that the G36's dual optic could have been at-fault, specifically how it is mounted. The trunnion issues seems to be dead-in-the-water. German troops using the optics rail don't seem to be complaining.
Link Posted: 7/15/2020 9:19:31 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/15/2020 9:20:04 PM EDT by sgwlower]
@the_beer_slayer

Yes, do the upgrades.
Link Posted: 7/17/2020 3:15:08 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/17/2020 4:45:05 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:


what real benefits are the gen2 over the gen1 carriers and receiver mods?
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From my understanding the bolts were made lighter, went through some changes for reliability, and the firing pins changed to avoid breaking. I believe thier were also changes in the case deflector as well. They also made a change in the take down portion of the guide rod, which tightens the receivers up.

Other thing is to have them generally inspect the rifle and upgrade anything else they see.

They are quick, I wouldn't expect them to have the gun any longer than a couple of weeks at the most.
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