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Posted: 3/26/2008 5:33:00 PM EST
[Last Edit: 3/26/2008 5:36:10 PM EST by Blanco_Diablo]
Has anyone else seen the new IO ad in the latest issue of Shotgun News? They're advertising new German-made semi auto MP-44s in 8mmKurz for $4000. Does ANYONE have ANY information on this?? My brother is seriously considering selling his semi-auto MG42 to buy one of these.

ETA: Also, does anyone know if 7.92x33 uses standard 8mm heads or are they different? If they're different, WHERE can I find them? I noticed the Prvi Partisan ammo uses 124 gr FMJBT heads.
Link Posted: 3/26/2008 6:20:38 PM EST
pics please! IO's site has nothing about this.
Link Posted: 3/26/2008 6:32:32 PM EST
[Last Edit: 3/26/2008 6:36:31 PM EST by Blanco_Diablo]

Originally Posted By technocia:
pics please! IO's site has nothing about this.


Seeing as how my scanner-fu is exceptionally weak, here are some pics I just took of the actual ad in SGN

\



ETA: Looked farther into the SGN

Link Posted: 3/26/2008 6:44:06 PM EST
It's probably one of these, though I'm not sure how they'd manage to import it.

Link to Really cool toys
Link Posted: 3/26/2008 6:50:11 PM EST

Originally Posted By Lokjell:
It's probably one of these, though I'm not sure how they'd manage to import it.
www.ssd-weapon.com/images/produkte/bd44/bd44_links.gif
Link to Really cool toys

That's the same exact picture they're using. I assumed it was a BD-44 at first as well. I remember when they first tried to get them imported as a sporting rifle, it didnt work out. I wonder how they're getting them. But apparently they are. Does anyone know of the quality of these rifles? Like I said, my brother is very seriously considering selling his semi auto MG42 and accessories to buy one of these MP44s. And I was considering buying him the first 200 rounds of ammo
Link Posted: 3/26/2008 7:20:21 PM EST
I just don't think I could afford the ammo to even play with something like that. Now if they start to import these, I might be tempted.

Link Posted: 3/26/2008 7:28:59 PM EST
[Last Edit: 3/26/2008 7:37:55 PM EST by Jerad]
It's nice, but they should offer it in a 7.62x39 chambering along w/ the original. I hate rare calibers, and I don't want to add a new caliber to the list... Obviously this isn't a concern to everyone, but it is to me.

ETA that company has some bad ass toys, I'd love to pick up just about one of each of their products
Link Posted: 3/26/2008 7:33:46 PM EST

Originally Posted By Jerad:
It's nice, but they should offer it in a 7.62x39 chambering along w/ the original. I hate rare calibers, and I don't want to add a new caliber to the list... Obviously this isn't a concern to everyone, but it is to me.



Modifying to fire 7.62x39 from AK mags would require cutting out a huge chunk of the mag well and adding a different mag catch. It would be a complete bastardization, more or less.
Link Posted: 3/26/2008 7:53:53 PM EST

Originally Posted By STG77:

Originally Posted By Jerad:
It's nice, but they should offer it in a 7.62x39 chambering along w/ the original. I hate rare calibers, and I don't want to add a new caliber to the list... Obviously this isn't a concern to everyone, but it is to me.



Modifying to fire 7.62x39 from AK mags would require cutting out a huge chunk of the mag well and adding a different mag catch. It would be a complete bastardization, more or less.

Who said anything about AK mags? They could sell custom mags and it'd still be cheaper than buying 8mmKurz
Link Posted: 3/26/2008 8:12:42 PM EST

Originally Posted By Lokjell:
I just don't think I could afford the ammo to even play with something like that. Now if they start to import these, I might be tempted.



Believe it or not, I actually saw a guy trying to sell an FG42 a couple of weeks ago at a funshow in birmingham. It was the model with the other grip style though. Either way, you sure don't see those on every street corner. Pretty cool.
Link Posted: 3/26/2008 9:06:53 PM EST
AIM has ammo not too horribly priced here.
Link Posted: 3/27/2008 2:08:12 AM EST
height=8
Originally Posted By Blanco_Diablo:
height=8
Originally Posted By STG77:
height=8
Originally Posted By Jerad:
It's nice, but they should offer it in a 7.62x39 chambering along w/ the original. I hate rare calibers, and I don't want to add a new caliber to the list... Obviously this isn't a concern to everyone, but it is to me.



Modifying to fire 7.62x39 from AK mags would require cutting out a huge chunk of the mag well and adding a different mag catch. It would be a complete bastardization, more or less.

Who said anything about AK mags? They could sell custom mags and it'd still be cheaper than buying 8mmKurz



But oh the ugliness! If any other caliber was to be used, why not .30 carbine or some pistol caliber? 7.62 tokarev would fit in there, sort of.
Link Posted: 3/27/2008 3:49:39 AM EST

Originally Posted By arkel:

Originally Posted By Blanco_Diablo:

Originally Posted By STG77:

Originally Posted By Jerad:
It's nice, but they should offer it in a 7.62x39 chambering along w/ the original. I hate rare calibers, and I don't want to add a new caliber to the list... Obviously this isn't a concern to everyone, but it is to me.



Modifying to fire 7.62x39 from AK mags would require cutting out a huge chunk of the mag well and adding a different mag catch. It would be a complete bastardization, more or less.

Who said anything about AK mags? They could sell custom mags and it'd still be cheaper than buying 8mmKurz



But oh the ugliness! If any other caliber was to be used, why not .30 carbine or some pistol caliber? 7.62 tokarev would fit in there, sort of.

What's your reasoning behind that? They could make mags that fit 7.62x39 that looked pretty much exactly like the 8mmKurz mags.
Link Posted: 3/27/2008 6:42:09 AM EST
I have no interest in buying one, but anyone who wants one soon better order now. I hear they're almost out of their first shipment and the next one wont be in until August or September.
Link Posted: 3/27/2008 7:48:48 AM EST
[Last Edit: 3/28/2008 12:02:35 PM EST by p-dog]
Pretty hard to make this rifle fire 7.62x39.

The 7.92x33 is significantly shorter. Like by 6mm, which is equal to .236".

Remember your basic math: 39 - 33 = 6.

The receiver, magazines, bolt and bolt carrier group would need to be totally redesigned.

Then the MP-44 semiauto would not be authentic to the WW2 version. It would just be a $4,000 rifle in 7.62x39 with no real advantage over a $400 AK.
Link Posted: 3/27/2008 8:46:46 AM EST
[Last Edit: 3/27/2008 12:49:52 PM EST by arbob]
Guess I`ll have to get to Barnes & Noble for a copy of the Shotgun News.



ETA What date is on that Shotgun News? I just picked up the April 7 at B&N and that ad isn`t in it.
Link Posted: 3/27/2008 11:59:55 AM EST
If you are paying $4000 for the rifle, do you care if you can't buy ammo at Wal mart?

Someday, when $4000, to me, is like $400, I would love to own one and would want it in the original caliber.
Link Posted: 3/27/2008 1:45:18 PM EST
I think its worth it for collectors and for re-enactors though. Cool guns - wonder how they are importing them?

I guess I don't understand the re-enactors on either side - it just does not attract me - especially the German ones. And I am married to a German! (the LAST thing my in-laws want to talk about or remember is the war and I can understand that).
Link Posted: 3/28/2008 4:26:19 PM EST

Originally Posted By Blanco_Diablo:
Has anyone else seen the new IO ad in the latest issue of Shotgun News? They're advertising new German-made semi auto MP-44s in 8mmKurz for $4000. Does ANYONE have ANY information on this?? My brother is seriously considering selling his semi-auto MG42 to buy one of these.

ETA: Also, does anyone know if 7.92x33 uses standard 8mm heads or are they different? If they're different, WHERE can I find them? I noticed the Prvi Partisan ammo uses 124 gr FMJBT heads.


Well, SSD makes the whole rifle and sells them here (through Marstar) for $3000. If Inter-Ordnance is charging $4000, and stating they have limited production capacity, I guess they are importing some key, unfinished components from SSD, doing the minimum they have to in the U.S., assembling and selling them. So they are a SSD-IO joint venture, quite possibly with Marstar acting as a broker in the deal somewhere, but that is just speculation.

A number of the BD-44 have been sold up here, but the people who have them don't seem to be shooting them, or at the very least are not talking about it, because I have seen next to zilch in terms of range reports on the usual Canuck forums.

The head of the 7.9x33mm is the same as the head of the 8x57, so you can form cases from one to the other. But, based on your context, I guess you are asking does the the Kurz use the same BULLET as the 8mm? No. The diameter is the same, but all data on the Kurz uses 120-125gr. bullets. The original ball rounds used an 8.1g bullet, which is about 124 grains. 8mm Mauser usually runs much heavier.
Link Posted: 3/28/2008 4:30:29 PM EST


It's nice, but they should offer it in a 7.62x39 chambering along w/ the original.


When Marstar first announced they would be selling the BD-44 in Canada, a lot of people made this kind of comment. Converting this gun to 7.62x39 would produce an abortion of a firearm that would have zero interest to collectors or re-enactors. So you would have a rifle that had the functionality of an AK, but with a $4000 price tag. Just who do you think would buy such a thing?

These guns are for people who have a strong sense of history. Those people have no interest in a 7.62x39 variant.
Link Posted: 3/28/2008 4:40:38 PM EST
In the second ad, it says 'made like the Original'. Did anyone else say to themselves, 'You mean with authentic death camp slave labor?'

Anyway, this would be very cool to have, even if I had to wildcat some loads at my reloading bench. I'm not going to pay $4K for one though. Maybe they'll come way down in price in the next decade. (Yeah, right.)
Link Posted: 3/28/2008 4:41:45 PM EST
4K.... Wow... I'm still tempted..


Link Posted: 3/28/2008 4:53:24 PM EST
When I was at SHOT, I met a guy that was going to make a US made MP-44 later this year!

I'll go through all my SHOT show stuff to see if I can find his info.
Link Posted: 3/28/2008 8:26:01 PM EST
Tagged for your info Sir!
Link Posted: 3/30/2008 9:12:23 AM EST
If I remember correctly Hornady was producing loaded ammo for the 7.92x33mm Kurz
Grafs has it and PRVI for sale
http://www.grafs.com/search?q=7.92x33&SwatButton1=Search&_swat_form_process=search_form&_swat_form_serialized__swat_form_process=v686ck7G3djc0es7LVS9Sg%7Cs%3A11%3A%22search_form%22%3B&_swat_form_hidden_fields=fDk71VXcXJddn45*bdDhwg%7Ca%3A1%3A%7Bi%3A0%3Bs­%3A18%3A%22_swat_form_process%22%3B%7D

I did get a chance to handle two MP44 in Baghdad back in 03 along with 60 rds of East German ammo. Great shooter but the metal handguards get warm quickly. You can also see HK linage in the MP44. It is also quite controllable on full auto, cyclic rate about 500 rpm.





If I was a serious collector, this would be a must have.

CD
Link Posted: 3/30/2008 10:12:22 AM EST
My only real problem is that Interordnance sells them for about 800 dollars MORE than they cost in Canada. I'm ok with the gun and would love to have one, but paying 25% extra for the stroking is unlikely.
Link Posted: 3/30/2008 10:31:37 AM EST

Originally Posted By lonegunman:
My only real problem is that Interordnance sells them for about 800 dollars MORE than they cost in Canada. I'm ok with the gun and would love to have one, but paying 25% extra for the stroking is unlikely.


Hmmm...import fees?
Link Posted: 3/30/2008 12:50:38 PM EST

Originally Posted By Combat_Diver:
If I remember correctly Hornady was producing loaded ammo for the 7.92x33mm Kurz
Grafs has it and PRVI for sale
http://www.grafs.com/search?q=7.92x33&SwatButton1=Search&_swat_form_process=search_form&_swat_form_serialized__swat_form_process=v686ck7G3djc0es7LVS9Sg%7Cs%3A11%3A%22search_form%22%3B&_swat_form_hidden_fields=fDk71VXcXJddn45*bdDhwg%7Ca%3A1%3A%7Bi%3A0%3Bs­%3A18%3A%22_swat_form_process%22%3B%7D

I did get a chance to handle two MP44 in Baghdad back in 03 along with 60 rds of East German ammo. Great shooter but the metal handguards get warm quickly. You can also see HK linage in the MP44. It is also quite controllable on full auto, cyclic rate about 500 rpm.

www.hunt101.com/data/500/9809M98_und_MP44_mit_Patr_Named.jpg
www.hunt101.com/data/500/9809Blacked_out_George_MP44_sighting_down2.JPG
www.hunt101.com/data/500/9809Blacked_out_George_MP44_2.JPG

If I was a serious collector, this would be a must have.

CD



I'll bet that was fun to shoot.

Was that a captured weapon? PLEASE tell me they didn't destroy that beautiful piece of art!!!
Link Posted: 3/30/2008 8:07:46 PM EST
One of the two MP44 went to CAG and the other disappeared when I came back 6 mos. later (along with Saddam's factory Grand Pressance HiPower).
Link Posted: 3/31/2008 5:44:13 AM EST

Originally Posted By timb3:

Originally Posted By Combat_Diver:
If I remember correctly Hornady was producing loaded ammo for the 7.92x33mm Kurz
Grafs has it and PRVI for sale
http://www.grafs.com/search?q=7.92x33&SwatButton1=Search&_swat_form_process=search_form&_swat_form_serialized__swat_form_process=v686ck7G3djc0es7LVS9Sg%7Cs%3A11%3A%22search_form%22%3B&_swat_form_hidden_fields=fDk71VXcXJddn45*bdDhwg%7Ca%3A1%3A%7Bi%3A0%3Bs­%3A18%3A%22_swat_form_process%22%3B%7D


www.hunt101.com/data/500/9809M98_und_MP44_mit_Patr_Named.jpg
www.hunt101.com/data/500/9809Blacked_out_George_MP44_sighting_down2.JPG
www.hunt101.com/data/500/9809Blacked_out_George_MP44_2.JPG

CD



PLEASE tell me they didn't destroy that beautiful piece of art!!!


Sorry - but if that gun is not allready scrap metal in some Iraqi dump, it soon will be. There is no longer any mechanism for soldiers to keep/register/donate "bring-backs" like they could in the good old days.
Link Posted: 3/31/2008 7:49:29 AM EST

Originally Posted By Dawg180:

Originally Posted By lonegunman:
My only real problem is that Interordnance sells them for about 800 dollars MORE than they cost in Canada. I'm ok with the gun and would love to have one, but paying 25% extra for the stroking is unlikely.


Hmmm...import fees?


As someone stated earlier, the added cost is probably due to US parts count to avoid 922(r).
Link Posted: 4/4/2008 11:51:05 AM EST
S has anybody ordered one?
Link Posted: 4/4/2008 12:56:02 PM EST
[Last Edit: 4/4/2008 12:58:34 PM EST by scottryan]
I'm sick and tired of all these people whining about how some gun needs to be bastardized and made in a "common" caliber or else they don't want it.

The same thing happened with the FN PS90 came out. People wanted them in 9mm and 5.56.

It ain't going to happen. The gun cannot accept these calibers so get over it!
Link Posted: 4/5/2008 10:27:43 AM EST
Well, personally, I hope they dont come out with a 7.62x39mm MP44. Less competition for my brother and I in later years...


I've said too much..
Link Posted: 4/18/2008 2:53:29 PM EST
So anybody get one?
Link Posted: 4/18/2008 3:37:04 PM EST
If it was half that price I’d knock you over to buy one, sportsman’s guide got plenty of ammo, but that rifle is to rich for my blood.
Link Posted: 4/18/2008 3:42:24 PM EST
[Last Edit: 4/18/2008 3:47:47 PM EST by SilentType]
I'd have to scrape the money up for one that's for sure.

MP44....classic. The Birth of Assault Rifles and a serious "must have" piece for any collector.

Can you believe they destroy these things in Iraq when they capture them?

Can you believe that instead of allowing surplus MP44s to be sold here in the USA they all went to Syria after the war only to be used against our own troops? Thanks liberals.

I think every US Service member should be allowed to take MP44s they find in Iraq home as a "thank your for your service" gesture.





Link Posted: 4/18/2008 5:18:51 PM EST

Originally Posted By SilentType:

I think every US Service member should be allowed to take MP44s they find in Iraq home as a "thank your for your service" gesture.







Forget about enlistment bonus, I’m sold!

Link Posted: 4/18/2008 10:37:44 PM EST
You know something is horribly wrong when 7.92x33 is cheaper than .308 .
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