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Posted: 2/8/2017 7:32:51 AM EDT
| So i know people talk shit about Hi point all day and aesthetically yea they aren't the best to look at but almost all reviews for the carbines they put out are pretty positive and for a 300 dollar pistol carbine you kind of cant beat them. I looked at a scorpion evo and even a Beretta cx4 but they are still more pricey then i want to spend but i recently found a company that is about to put out a conversion kit to make the high point into a bull pup design and i got pretty excited, anyways any one have more info on this i found the website for it but still no real specific info on what it will be like and it doesn't come out until sometime this year. I'm not new to Ar's or building them i just was looking for something different and potentially a get home gun to put in my car in case SHTF |
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Still vaporware. Just poorly done computer drawings so far. These computer drawings get more realistic all the time. Attached File 
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I have a collection of PCC's that represent a wide range of prices. I do have two Hi-Point carbines, a 995TS (bought on sale for like $238) and a new .380 carbine just because it looked interesting and I reload .380 cheaply. The High Tower bullpup conversion is on my list of future toys. I have been in communications with them and am on the list to get one. They are expected out later this Spring or Early Summer I believe. The final cost is not out yet as I think they are looking at what the sales volume will be. They are talking about the $200 range. I see this as a fun little range toy of a carbine. Its total cost should come in at something UNDER $500, that is the rifle and the conversion kit.
Make no mistake, the Hi-Point 995 is a low end rifle and has the look and feel of what it is. At the same time they are reliable and shoot pretty straight and have a great life time warranty that actually works. I got my first one back in the 1990s for something like $149 new. It was my first PCC and allowed me to try out the concept before investing in a Beretta CX-4 Storm. That Beretta lead to a long list of other PCC's. That is the progression of the disease. I still keep a 995 or two around, just for old times sake. Also, shooting them reminds me why higher priced firearms cost more but are worth the extra money. The Hi-Point will get the job done for you but style and refinement it does not have. I will have one of those bullpup conversions and you will likely see it here at some future date. Why? Just because its fun and cheap and I don't care what anyone else thinks. Oh, the EVO is a superior piece, make no mistake. But as you know, you pay more. |
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These computer drawings get more realistic all the time. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/49519/BullPup-142785.JPG http://i.imgur.com/8ff2V1e.jpg http://i.imgur.com/xjfn1rZ.jpg I laughed, but to be fair, that is obviously a 3-D printed prototype, and a 12 year old could model and print somthing. The real deal comes when the molds are made... |
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Price will be a big factor as well, if it clocks in at $300 that's a hard sell when that's not far from what another carbine would run you.
But I think they seem to have a good concept here, I like the fact the upper is supposed to separate with just a few pins for cleaning or maintenance. Years ago I had a 995TS and dropped it in the ATI Storm clone stock. Back then I think I paid $225 new for the rifle and $100 for the ATI stock. The stock was very solid and fit well, but on the HP forum it was often discussed that HP claimed the ATI stock would shorten the life of the rifle since it didn't have as much flex as the factory stock. Not sure if that's true. But the factory stock is pretty flimsy, whether by design or just to meet a price point. I don't think it's fair to compare a $300-$350 rifle to an $800-$900 rifle. I've also got a CX4 Storm carbine and an Evo Scorpion, both are much more refined than the HP. But the HP works, and my current 4595TS seems to be quite a bit more accurate than my old 995TS was. And while there's a lot of great carbine choices in 9mm that list gets short when you want to move up to .45acp. |
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Exactly. The HiPoint is a low end rifle, plain and simple. It shoots well and is reliable, end of sentence It is far from refined but when you pay less than $300 for it, who cares? They will give years of service and the factory will fix it if it breaks. It feels heavy and not well balanced. The trigger pull is not precise nor light. It is clearly not "attractive". I mean the 995 (The Gen 1 gun) was used in the Planet of the Apes movie to be their crude firearm. The bolt is zinc alloy, the extractor is stamped steel. I actually admire the designer for being able to take such low end parts and actually making a rifle that works! For me that innovation is a bit of an attraction as part of a collection as it represents what can be done for a very little money. You have to appreciate that carbine for what it is and what it represents. Do not compare it to a lovely EVO or Storm or such, they exist in a different universe. |
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Forgot to add, the pics above are the same as the ones High Tower posted on their Facebook page back in November of last year. That's their last entry on their Facebook page. They were asking for pre-orders, either to raise some $$$ for production or gauge interest.
High Tower seems to have a pretty good rep for accessories on other forums so they're not a fly-by-night operation. But I also wouldn't run out and purchase an HP carbine just yet either. |
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Forgot to add, the pics above are the same as the ones High Tower posted on their Facebook page back in November of last year. That's their last entry on their Facebook page. They were asking for pre-orders, either to raise some $$ for production or gauge interest. High Tower seems to have a pretty good rep for accessories on other forums so they're not a fly-by-night operation. But I also wouldn't run out and purchase an HP carbine just yet either. High Tower didn't do "pre-orders" in the sense of selling anything. They just asked people who wanted these to sign up for a spot. No money was exchanged or asked for. Fact is they refused pre-payments. Of course I am sure they wanted to test the waters to see how interested people really were before spending a lot of money setting up to build these. I will have one when they come out, just for fun. They look nice and will make a nice range toy that should get some attention. |
 Hi-Point™ Carbine Bullpup Stock Teaser (MBS 95) |
| Bump just looking to see if anyone had heard an update on this? |
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[High Tower has been pretty straight forward about this from the beginning. They would not accept deposits. They cautioned people that it would take time as it was a slow process getting the molds finished and the production up. They showed a 3-D printed prototype so we know the drawings and plans were good. I have to think they farm out the production which means that nothing will move quickly. I think the last I read they were talking mid-year.
I have my name on the list for one. When it comes, it comes. I see it as a neat toy, nothing more, nothing less. Now I have to decide on color...ummmm |
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[High Tower has been pretty straight forward about this from the beginning. They would not accept deposits. They cautioned people that it would take time as it was a slow process getting the molds finished and the production up. They showed a 3-D printed prototype so we know the drawings and plans were good. I have to think they farm out the production which means that nothing will move quickly. I think the last I read they were talking mid-year. I have my name on the list for one. When it comes, it comes. I see it as a neat toy, nothing more, nothing less. Now I have to decide on color...ummmm |
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High Tower Armory
Last update was a few weeks back, April 25th I believe. I would guess they will wait until they have more news before posting any more about it. Someone mentioned that any kid could knock out a 3-D printed stock. Not so! They had to design this thing, work out the bugs and then have a clear model made up to do the printing from. Once they have the program to do the printing and know everything works then that can be converted into the molds for making the production stock. Of course there is a lot of money spent before they ever get to sell one so I can see why this takes time and patience. These guys have delivered before, as with the 10/22 bull pup so they know the ropes of how to get this done. I am looking forward to seeing my stock sometime this Summer. What color should I get? Black seems so.....boring...... |
| Another option is the Sub2k. Folds down very short, You can find it in Glock or multi mag versions. Lightweight, and will cost about the same as the bullpup conversion. I had a HP, s2k, and scorpion pistol. I sold the hp, and kept the other two. Magazine capacity was the main issue, and scorpion mags are almost as cheap as hp mags. They are a great gun for the money, but for a little more the S2k is very nice. |
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I had a Sub 9 (the best of the bunch) , a few Sub2k's and now the new Gen 2. I know Subs well, since they came out. I also have owned various HiPoint carbines since they have come out so I have had experience with both over many years.
Further more I have, or had, a few 9mm AR's, a couple of Marlin Camp Carbines in 9mm, the TNW ASR, the JRC, a Beretta Storm CX-4. The Sub2k gets the lowest amount of use. I love the concept but the execution is less than perfect due to the limitations of the design. I find my TNW ASR a much nicer rifle to shoot than the Sub and its not even my favorite PCC. My JRC is the smoothest of the bunch and the CX-4, other than a less than optimal trigger, if one of my favorites over all. The Sub is loved by many but not by all. Its ergonomics don't work for some, its factory sights are lacking and the trigger is not great. Some of these issues can be resolved with some $$ and work. There are loads of dedicated Sub owners who spend hundreds of dollars on that rifle trying to make it more personalized. I have two Hi Point carbines sitting there waiting for the new conversion stock. One is a 9mm the other a .380. I smiled when I saw they were making a .380 but after shooting one I found it to really be a fun round. I am sure it will go well with that new stock to make a fun range toy. I reload and .380 is pretty easy and affordable and to be honest, just shooting tin cans and 50 yards or less it works fine. No, its never going to be a CZ or a Sig but then you didn't have to pay a ton of money for it either. |
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I have had an Oly 9mm, Kel Tec S2K, CX4, Ruger PC9 and now only have a HiPoint. The other guns were more refined but cost at least 3-4x what the Hipoint cost me. The triggers on the CX4 and S2K were awful. The peep hole S2K sight was crude and I could not shoot it very well.
The main downside to the HP is lack of a decent looking high cap mag. I know redball makes one but Looks like a boomerang. The HTA stock looks good and I will get one when available but the ugly original stock works fine. Compared to the money I have wasted on other guns and stuff for them the HP can't be beat. I was tempted at one time to get a CZ but from what I have seen it does not shoot any better than the HP and I can get three HP carbines for what one CZ will cost me. |
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HTA released pics of one of the molds on their Facebook page the other day. The first production samples are expected in about two weeks give or take, and if that goes well, then they might start shipping in August.
So that's kind of a "It's definitely happening" milestone. Since paying for all the mold machining etc. is the big investment on their part. 
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HTA released pics of one of the molds on their Facebook page the other day. The first production samples are expected in about two weeks give or take, and if that goes well, then they might start shipping in August. So that's kind of a "It's definitely happening" milestone. Since paying for all the mold machining etc. is the big investment on their part. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/93097/19904909-10209690176469868-5096872606305272012-n-252131.jpg My only problem is deciding on a color...ummmmm |
| If this goes well Hipoint carbines could become a hot ticket, and maybe someone will make a hybrid magazine that has double stack at lower end and goes into it's feed lips as a single column. I think maybe this is a way to increase capacity without 3 foot magazines and keep them reliable. I'm still scared about the trigger as no bull pup conversion or bull pup factory rifle I have shot has a nice trigger. I don't want mashed potatoe trigger pull. The Hipoint has enough working against it for lack of magazine capacity. I may get one of these I may not my old carbine will still be rtg regardless. |
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HTA is making the magwell on their bullpup stock with spacers that can be removed to accommodate a double-stack magazine they may come out with in the future.
They're being up front about it being an unsure thing though. The HiPoint receiver still restricts you to single-feed, which isn't a big deal, since all pistol-based PCC's or ones that use Glock mags etc. are double stack to single feed as are many others. The receiver might still require a fair amount of single-feed neck to fit, and there might be no good or easy solutions to get a transition angle in the mag's feed-end as it comes up to the lips that works reliably and doesn't jam or hang up. So HTA's official stance is "They're trying" but aren't making any promises. They did post a video to their Facebook sub-group of a range test of a pre-production sample made with their new molds. You need to be on Facebook and request to join the group to see it though. I checked, and they didn't put a video on YouTube etc. If you join, scroll about halfway down the page to the post from August 7. https://www.facebook.com/groups/1954764861469693/ |
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Good to hear High Tower is thinking ahead, but I'm not betting that someone will spend the $$$ for tooling for a double to single stack mag. Even if they do, it wouldn't be cheap.
Capacity seems to be the biggest complaint I hear about High Points, so High Tower may be betting that HP will open their receivers up for double stack mags down the road. |
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