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Posted: 12/24/2017 5:31:44 PM EDT
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What is "minute-of-man"? Or "combat accurate"?
I've seen this applied to a few scopes that I'm pretty sure are <MOA capable in my hands, even on targets not representing "man". |
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I would personally say about 15X and up. for myself I have 18X or higher on all my long range precision guns. |
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Precision Optics is rather a vague term intended to describe scopes that use exposed easily adjustable knobs to correct for trajectory (up & down) and wind drift (side to side).
The term minute of man is sarchasm meaning the scope is good enough to hit a man with but not that precise. Minute of angle - 1 MOA is 1 inch at 100 yards 2 inches at 200 yards 3 inches at 300 yards etc 10 inches at 1000 yards so a 1/4 moa scope adjustment moves it 1/4 inch at 100 yds or 1/2 inch at 200 yards or 1 inch per click at 300 yards etc Mildot reticles now often have mil based adjustments broken down into 1/10 of a mil that comes out to about 1/3 of an inch at 100 yards Many Mildot scopes with Mil based adjustments are now being made in FFP first focal plane. - when you look through the scope and zoom from 3x very wide to 9x narrower field of view side to side the reticle appears to grow larger but in fact the reticle is always remaining true to what a Mil is. The traditional hunting scopes have been 1/4 moa clicks adjustment and are typically 2nd focal plane the reticle always looks the same no mater what power the scope it at. Also note that how bright the image of a scope appears depends on the power it is set at and the size of the front objective. a 42mm objective at 6x (42/6= 7mm exit eye pupil super bright) (42/10= 4.2 not so bright but probably ok) (42/20=2.1mm exit eye pupil it will look quite grey in low light) For a guy just starting out wanting a resonably priced tactical type "precision optic" I would recommend they look at SWFA's Super Sniper scopes they make them in 6x, 10x, 12x, 16x, 20x I tend to like the 16xMil Quad for a target scope or the 6x Mil Dot for hunting |
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Robert, to me "precision optic" has nothing to do with magnification and everything to do with 2 things: repeatable accurate tracking of windage/elevation adjustment, and quality glass housing a fine reticle.
I've seen "tactical" optics that don't track for crap and have reticles that have such heavy subtension they look like they were drawn with a large Sharpie marker. Someone trying to justify them may call them "minute of man" or "combat accurate" which I think is just an attempt to justify a piece of garbage optic. They would be far better off using irons than an optic like that. DR2373 |
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How so? Quoted:
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USO ST-10, good out to 1k and will outlast your grandchildren. |
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A scope with power, good glass and a fine reticle (crosshair). Works for me.
I've owned a pile of scopes, mostly vintage target stuff but this one's crosshair is the finest I've seen. And it's hard to see with old eyes. I sold it. 
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A scope with power, good glass and a fine reticle (crosshair). Works for me. I've owned a pile of scopes, mostly vintage target stuff but this one's crosshair is the finest I've seen. And it's hard to see with old eyes. I sold it.
https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/153137/Lyman20X009-400486.JPGhttps://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/153137/LymanCH001-400488.JPG Some say "If I can see it, I can hit it.". But if you can't see the reticle... |
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What size target, and group size achieved on target? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=odfw97nM33I |
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When I think precision optic I think target thin reticle, corresponding true tracking target turret, and at least 10x power. I currently have only 1 scope that meets all of these criteria. It is an older Burris 6-24x50mm with Japanese glass, 1/8 MOA reticle and tall 1/8 MOA per click target turrets that repeatedly move 1/8 MOA increments.
Several other scopes meet some, maybe most of these criteria, but not all. Dead-on true tracking at distance is very demanding on scopes manufacturers. 
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What were these used for? Some say "If I can see it, I can hit it.". But if you can't see the reticle... Quoted:
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A scope with power, good glass and a fine reticle (crosshair). Works for me. I've owned a pile of scopes, mostly vintage target stuff but this one's crosshair is the finest I've seen. And it's hard to see with old eyes. I sold it.
https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/153137/Lyman20X009-400486.JPGhttps://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/153137/LymanCH001-400488.JPG Some say "If I can see it, I can hit it.". But if you can't see the reticle... Looked for 20 minutes, can't find a pic with that scope on the 540, so here's one with a different scope because after looking for 20 minutes I'm posting something. 
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What is "minute-of-man"? Or "combat accurate"? I've seen this applied to a few scopes that I'm pretty sure are <MOA capable in my hands, even on targets not representing "man". I do not think there are formal definitions out there, but if I were to take a stab at it, it would go as follows: 1) A "precision" optic is an optic that allows a skilled user utilize a precision rifle to the extent of its capabilities envelope. 2) "minute-of-man" typically means something that allows a skilled user to hit a man size target under field conditions to the extent of the practical range of the rifle and cartridge 3) "combat accurate" has always been sort of a mystery to me, so I think of it as the same as "minute-of-man". Keep in mind that I keep on saying "skilled user", although a skilled user can mean several things. It is entirely possible that two equally skilled users with different natural vision acuity will need different optics to satisfy any of these definitions. That is why I did not say "average user" or anything along those lines. I havn't a foggiest idea of where an average user's skill level is. Lastly, this also, obviously, depends on the specific rifle and cartridge. ILya www.opticsthoughts.com |
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Glass quality has very little to do with an optic being precision or not. I have a 5-25×50 Burris XTR II. Great fearures and mechanics. Some of the worst glass you can imagine. It is definitely a precision optic. To me a precision optic relies on target turrets instead of a BDC. It has repeatable mechanical accuracy. It has high magnification. That's it. Minute of man or combat accuracy means poor accuracy that can only hope to hit a man size target. It is the opposite of a precision optic. |
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