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Posted: 1/31/2022 6:28:25 PM EDT
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First AR build from scratch and I have a question. Initially bought a CMC AR-15 6 Position Milspec Enhanced Carbine Buffer Tube Kit for my new AR rifle install but was advised to go VLTOR instead. Thought that just meant the spring and weight and that I could still use the CMC tube but was reading on the back of the spring package that it was a no go. So then I ordered a VLTOR rifle buffer tube with 7 stock positions thinking I could still use my B5 adjustable stock. Now I'm wondering if it will really fit or do I need an actual RIFLE designated stock for it instead. Do I? And if so is this the best adjustable one that I could get? Please advise. https://www.vltor.com/shop/ar/stocks/imod-improved-modular-stock/ Thanks for any direction. Greg |
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Quoted: First AR build from scratch and I have a question. Initially bought a CMMG buffer tube/spring/buffer for my new AR rifle install but was advised to go VLTOR instead. Thought that just meant the spring and weight and that I could still use the CMMG tube but was reading on the back of the spring package that it was a no go. So then I ordered a VLTOR rifle buffer tube with 7 stock positions thinking I could still use my B5 adjustable stock. Now I'm wondering if it will really fit or do I need an actual RIFLE designated stock for it instead. Do I? And if so is this the best adjustable one that I could get? Please advise. https://www.vltor.com/shop/ar/stocks/imod-improved-modular-stock/ Thanks for any direction. Greg Probably should have just gone with what you had. That stock doesn't look beard friendly. |
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I think you’re confused about the term “rifle” in this context. There are 3 different flavors of buffers/tubes: rifle, carbine, and A5. Rifle: the original length from back on the M16. The tube is ~10” long and has no holes for an adjustable stock. It’s just round. The buffer that goes in it is ~6” long. Carbine: Shorter, and made to use with an adjustable stock. Tube is ~7.2” long and the buffer 3.25”. Uses a different spring than “rifle”. A5: a VLTOR proprietary thing, kind of a stretched version of “carbine”. Tube ~8” long, buffer ~4”. Uses a “rifle” spring. Do NOT use a carbine buffer in an A5 tube — you need the special A5 buffer. If you have a 7-position VLTOR tube, that’s probably an A5, but check. My B5 Bravo stock fits okay on my 7-position A5 tube, but won’t quite close all the way to position “1” |
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I think I'm thinking that I need to match the buffer to my rifle length gas block? Correct? Here's the parts I used in case it helps. SOLGW Stripped Upper SOLGW BCG Wilson Combat 18" 556 fluted barrel Sons of Liberty Gas Tube | Length - Rifle Sons of Liberty Gun Works Low Profile Gas Block V2, .750" Bravo Company MFG MCMR M-LOK Compatible Modular Rail, 15 inch, Steel Barrel Nut/Hardware/Sling Mount, Black, BCM-MCMR-15-556-BLK Bravo GFC-MOD-0 BCM Gunfighter Compensator Mod 0 5.56mm Stainless Steel AR-15 Radian Weapons Raptor Ambidextrous Charging Handle for AR15/M16, Black, R0001 SOLGW Stripped Lower Reciever, Loyal 9 BCMGunfighter Enhanced AR-15 Lower Parts Kit, Black - ELPKBLK Geissele Automatics SSA-E 2 Stage Trigger Ambi Safety CMC AR-15 6 Position Milspec Enhanced Carbine Buffer Tube Kit - 81626 B5 SYSTEMS - AR-15 SOPMOD BRAVO STOCK COLLAPSIBLE MIL-SPEC With these on the way to replace the CMMG buffer tube and spring Vltor RE-A5 Vltor RE-A5 Vltor A5/Rifle Spring Vltor A5/Rifle Spring Vltor A5 Buffer Vltor A5 Buffer A5 Buffer weight: A5H2 (5.33OZ) |
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I think I'm thinking that I need to match the buffer to my rifle length gas block? Correct? Buffer and gas systems are independent of one-another. You need to match the srping and buffer to your tube length. You have a few combinations now. You need an A5 tube to use their buffer and spring. You already had a serviceable system before you went all Sherlock, ha. There is a thing called TMI. I would suggest getting the rifle running with the carbine buffer and spring with the regular tube and then tweak from there once you know the gun will run. |
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Quoted: I think I'm thinking that I need to match the buffer to my rifle length gas block? Correct? I’m guessing the CMMG buffer parts are carbine length. Did you try the gun with those? You have a nice list of parts there. The only thing that catches my eye is the 18” barrel. Does it have a rifle-length gas system? (Distance from forward edge of barrel extension to back of gas block ~12”.) Sometimes an 18” barrel with rifle-length gas can be “under gassed” — not enough oomph to work. You might find that the bolt carrier doesn’t want to lock back after the last round in the magazine. This can be fixed, but it’s something to look out for. |
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I've never had a single issue with a milspec tube and specific buffer needed for a build (carbine, h1, h2 etc) over literally dozens of rifles and AR pistols. I don't understand jerking with the OG tube...it's literally foolproof. I prefer H buffers on carbine 16"/14.5 builds and H2 on 10-12" guns. My cheapos run carbine buffers on 16" carbine gas....Rifle buffers for rifle tubes. What am I missing? |
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Quoted: It might seem like that would be necessary, but it’s not. The length of the gas system and the buffer system needn’t match: you can use an upper with a carbine-length gas setup on a lower with a rifle-length buffer/tube and vice versa. Or in your case, rifle-length gas on an A5 buffer system. Not a problem. I’m guessing the CMMG buffer parts are carbine length. Did you try the gun with those? You have a nice list of parts there. The only thing that catches my eye is the 18” barrel. Does it have a rifle-length gas system? (Distance from forward edge of barrel extension to back of gas block ~12”.) Sometimes an 18” barrel with rifle-length gas can be “under gassed” — not enough oomph to work. You might find that the bolt carrier doesn’t want to lock back after the last round in the magazine. This can be fixed, but it’s something to look out for. Good info. Definitely learned quite a bit on the build itself. Re-read the box and the buffer tube set was really CMC brand. The barrel does have a rifle length gas system, this is it: https://ar15discounts.com/products/wilson-combat-18-5-56-nato-recon-stainless-midlength-fluted-barrel/. Finished the build late yesterday so I haven't had time to take it to the range yet. Just hoping it doesn't blow up in my face really, I'm not the most mechanically inclined person.. And gassing was the next thing I'm worried about, mostly because I just hope the gas block stays in place with just the 2 screws and some red loctite. |
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Honestly, you worry too damned much. Really, if you are as worried as you let on, you should stick with buying factory builds. Red Lock-Tite is never needed although some suspenders and belt type guys use it. The two set screws on the gas block and blue Lock-Tite, APPLIED CORRECTLY, will hold until the cows come home under most all conditions. And even if it didn’t, your rifle is not going to blow up. If you bought a good barrel and BCG, it would be next to impossible to blow up your rifle unless your ammo is really, really bad, and it would blow up any rifle, not just a home build. I hope you did more homework than it seems from your confusion over buffer systems and gas systems. To keep it simple and not addressing adapters/spacers and crap like that, you use a rifle buffer and rifle spring with a rifle receiver extension (buffer tube). You use a CAR buffer and CAR spring with a CAR buffer tube. You use a A5 length buffer and Rifle length spring with an A5 length buffer tube. You don’t mix the above without consequences. If you use a CAR buffer in an A5 or rifle length buffer tube, your rifle will not blow up but the lower may be damaged. Likewise, if you use an A5 buffer in a rifle tube, you may damage your lower from the buffer being too short and the gas key on the BCG being slammed into the boss the receiver extension screws in to. And if you use a rifle buffer in a A5 or CAR buffer tube, or an A5 length buffer in a CAR length buffer tube, you will have malfunctions but no damage to your lower will occur, but nothing is going to blow up. |
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Quoted: The A5 is not as common as carbine or rifle tubes, but it is not proprietary. Any company can manufacture them without paying VLTOR royalty fees. Just skimming through this thread. Vltor A5 system gets you a rifle length spring, with a shorter (proprietary) buffer. It is a great setup though, rifle system reliability in a almost carbine length tube - I think it's like 1/4" longer, so about 308 carbine length. |
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