Actually that was me, and Geissele customer service keeps telling me it’s normal for a hard use rifle LOL.  I will never buy shit from geissele again and will post a new thread tomorrow with screenshots of their bullshit.

Edit: I paid shipping to send it to them just for them to tell me they will be sending it back in the same condition.

Had a similar experience with Geissele not wanting to stand behind their trigger that wouldn't reset.  
That and the shenanigans they've pulled over the years, won't see a dime from me.  Lyin' Bendy Ben can keep it.

Only if you lack reading comprehension or perspective  🙄

There’s no need for insults, so I’ll provide you with assistance. I can understand the confusion since he opens stating that Glocks are the most reliable, then says they are the lowest round count to failure big brand pistols they use, and makes it clear they have problems. I’m kind of confused by that too, seeing as he mentions hundreds of thousands of rounds through P226’s, M9’s, USP’s, and even Caniks. Yet Glock is far and away the most breakage prone based on his own provided data.

It would make sense that they get the most rentals, but that doesn’t excuse the short service intervals. I digress though since this topic is about rifles and I’m not a big fan of the whole emotional response thing.

Well, that's a shitter.

It would be interesting to see the round counts on the glocks as compared to the other brands, do the Glock in fact get rented more? Seems like a bad batch of slides & unique to gen4’s.

Either way, the man said if he could have just one it would be a Glock. That speaks volumes imho.

I do think these high round count threads are pretty interesting, but honestly if I can afford to put 75,000 rounds through a Glock I can afford to spend $5-600 to buy a new one when my frame eventually cracks.  

Also, I shoot a fair amount, but it's generally spread over a bunch of guns.  I doubt I put more than 2500 rounds through any one gun in a single year.  At that rate my Glocks (and Sigs and HK's) should last 25-30 years, by which time I'll probably be dead.

Pics?

@Bjd96

This is the thread on the G forum

https://www.ar15.com/forums/Industry/Geissele-super-duty-URG-14-5-MAJOR-CONCERNS/444-300668/

I can almost see how the recoil spring loop on the front of the slide could take an extra beating.  But the sides of that slide are real puzzles.  Those cracks don’t seem to be related to anything mechanical, except the right side rear bit, which is near where the slide interacts with the connector/trigger bar.  It sure looks like a metal treatment issue rather than use and abuse.

Agreed.

They’re breaking in the slide rail channels, and looks to be right at the rear frame rail.

And despite all that and the guy being offended at my joking jab, I’m still building a P80.

The post about round counts for us lowly regular guys holds entirely true. The cost of ammo to wear out a gun exceeds the cost of the gun significantly, even before today’s prices. We of course want the longest lasting product available, but I’m not crying over spilt milk if an AR barrel wears out at 10k rounds instead of 15k. Worst and unlikely scenario is you’re paying $350 for a slide replacement after spending what, $10k on ammo? If you can afford to put that many rounds down range, you can afford to rebuild an entire gun many times over if need be.

Didn't recoil spring loop get beefed up on the Gen5s? Maybe this is why

Maybe I missed it,but how are bone stock colt rifles holding up?

OP, I just read the entire thread.  Thanks for posting all this.

Ron, thank you for all your insight! I stayed up late reading all this. Have 2 quick questions I dunno if you covered.

1) seems like you use mostly DD or LMT BCGs, have you used PSA or Toolcraft? Do you just go with phosphate or other finishes like nitride?

2) seems like shorter than 14.5 barrels have faster bolt and spring issues. Have you tried anything to lower bolt cycling a abuse like adj gas block, heavier buffers or buffer springs etc?

Thx!

Bumps

great post

I’m completely open to being corrected, but I’m more than sure they aren’t jacking with adjustable gas blocks, nor would they be a good idea in this kind of service.

agreed

@HendersonDefense - I have not checked this thread in a while so I apologize if this has already been covered.

I know you had said the range had Benelli M4's and they just ran and ran. Is that still the case and if so:
- what are the round counts on them?
- what type of ammo is run through them?

Also, do you have any Beretta 1301's on the range and if so what feedback can you provide on them?

I decided to check this thread out after talking to someone last week that actually read it and didn't know I was the guy who wrote it.

As for the Benelli M4's.. they have 100's of thousands of rounds them over the last ten years.

With that being said, my son ordered me some of the knock-off Benelli's from Turkey (Panzer Arms) because one of our Benelli barrels had finally failed. My armorers asked if I they could install the Panzer barrel into the Benelli to see if it would work and sure enough it did. We have one Panzer on the line along with one Benelli now. The Panzer clone has had zero issues since going on the line approximately six months ago.

In other news...

- My armorers hate the Sig 320/M17 series of pistols because of ALL the small parts. We've had a few go down so we've ordered replacement parts to keep them running.
- Todd Bailey's company that makes the HK-416 clone continues to make AMAZING parts. I can't think of the name of his company right now (home sick).
- Hopefully Tom Bostic's MP7 clone will be out soon because we continue to lose parts to attrition on our MP7's and HK has no plans on sending those parts to the US at this point.
- All of our M4 uppers are either Palmetto State Arms or Del-Ton at this point. They do the same job as the others in our situation and are cheap enough that my staff can just swap an upper for a rifle instead of diagnosing an issue or swapping barrels.
- Tom Bostic's G36 and UMP's run and run without issues. The armorers love them because other than weekly cleaning, they never have to mess with them.
- The MP-40, MP-38 and MP-44 replacement parts from DK Productions Group are AMAZING. The quality is much better than WWII German and we are finally able to keep three MP-44's on the line at all times.


Lastly, Battlefield Vegas has gotten back into the training game but not like before. We've been providing weapons, vehicle and armor familiarization to Army and Air Force SF troops on our dime. We have two boys who are Infantry officers and our opinion is that the more knowledge that SF guys have, the better they can do their job. If they do their job so well, there may come a time that my boys DON'T have to deploy. I know it's a stretch (and makes my wife and I feel better) but we have all the assets that these men and woman need and 95% of the time it sits idle. We do three days of small arms training to include history, current operators, operation, disabling, expedient demilitarization and live-fire. The weapon assortment includes close to 90% of the weapons that one would encounter in Ukraine and the surrounding areas. The fourth day includes history, current  operators, operation, start-up and driving a course with a T-62, T-55 and M113 variants. Over 700 M113's have been donated to Ukraine and Russia has been deploying T-62's in and around Ukraine. We train these personnel in one day on how to be proficient enough with them to be able to get in or out of a situation if need be. The only expense that the Government has is transportation, food and lodging. We've met some amazing people in 2022 and hopefully it will be even bigger for 2022 with our first class starting on 14 JAN.

V/R
Ron

Appreciate the info on the Benelli m4 & the sig 320/m17’s.
The training sounds great. Good on you Ron!



@HendersonDefense

Log out and log back in.

Good on you, sir! I heart this thread.

WOW... thank you VERY MUCH. I know I don't contribute as much as I'd like to and really appreciate that.

V/R
Ron

Thanks for your input Ron.

What gives up on the benelli barrels?

I have an M4 and that thing is a tank.

Understand... that this barrel has been on the line for YEARS and it was a piece of the barrel near the chamber cracked. I know that Benelli makes a quality gun but I never expected them to last this long on the range.

V/R
Ron

I just have a much more appreciation for what you and your team is doing. Thanks Ron!

Awesome.  Glad I picked one up.

Thanks for all the answers in this thread btw, been following it for years.

Makes me love my Nelli that much more! Are you going to get any VHS k2s (Hellions)?

Anyone know if Todd Bailey's company "Titan Defense" has a website? I see HKparts sells the "TD-416" but can't find a website.

TD-416

I know this thread is on AR's but is this problem with the Glock, only with the Gen4?
Any problems with Gen3?

Fast forward 7 years later..... how did the PSA barrels fair? Was just sent to this post and great read. Sorry if you answered it earlier just realized 41 more pages of reading lol.

Post #24, this page.

Yup just realized. Thx for the heads up.

Is there a website for dk productions parts?

Is there a website for dk products?

This is badass. Thank you Ron

I might try to get over there this year to support you guys.

Someone in an AUG FB group said they shot a full auto VHS at battlefield.

Probably too early to say, but I’d definitely like some updates on that gun at some point.

When the slide goes back into battery the barrel snapping up into the ejection port and the mass of the slide make the slide want to rotate forward. The rear frame rails is what stops the slide from flipping off the frame.

On 34s and 35s I have seen them break a rear rail off and have seen/heard of slides cracking like this.


Slides cracking through the ejection port is relatively common. I thought we’d be seeing a LOT of Gen5 slides broken through the ejection port with the removed material + stress riser they put right in the middle of the weakest part of the slide, but I haven’t heard of one yet…

stupid question but wont 'hardened' or a harder steel bolt than Carpenter wear out the chamber?

Very interesting and informative thread! Been a lurker for years and finally joined.

Welcome high round count firearms enthusiast!

bolt doesn't touch the chamber.

I think he meant to say barrel extension

Yeah sorry...  I meant that

I made it today! Knocked out a few more bucket list items including the M134 and MG42 I just missed you walking out the door, I was going to say hi.

To anyone on the fence... GREAT facility, super friendly and super professional people. They deserve our business 100%, I had a blast

ETA: Cashier had never heard of an Ar15.com discount though

I'll make the new girls aware of the Arfcom discount but......


an update on the Turkish "FauxNelli M4". We have been running them more often in a new package that cashiers can use for adding onto their sales. The Turkish shotguns are running just as good as the Benelli, especially when considering they are getting more use than ever before. Fit, finish and function is on par with our factory Benelli so no complaints from me.

V/R
Ron