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Link Posted: 5/26/2007 9:10:51 PM EST
My early DPMS is different then what  you have picked. It is one of their earlier forged F0031xx range.
Early DPMS

New Dpms and double star ( identical in milling marks )
Link Posted: 6/2/2007 11:45:12 AM EST
Xenophobe,

Great information, I have a question regarding the Lauer lowers.  Any idea when Lauer stopped using LMT lowers and changed to Superior Arms?

Trying to determine if my Lauer is a LMT or Superior lower. It has a 4 significant digit serial #.  I bought it since it was advertised as a LMT product, and the particular dealer still advertises it as such........I think.

My lower has the forward portion of the trigger area flashing removed but retains the flashing immediately behind the trigger itself.  It also has safe and fire stamped on left & right sides of the receiver.

One peculiar thing, the floor depth below the rear take down pin hole is much shallower than my other lower, so much so that an Accuwedge will not fit correctly between the upper receiver pin boss and the lower receiver floor......??

thank you for any information
Link Posted: 6/5/2007 9:05:32 PM EST
Xenophobe,

Thanks for your post and information - very useful and informative!!!

I tried looking up all of the lowers made by MMS:
MMS = Mega, Gunsmoke, Dalphon, POF (forged), Alexander Arms, Stinger, Spike's Tactical(old)

The only company that I could find a complete A2 style of receiver by MMS was Gunsmoke - Gunsmoke receivers.

I couldn't find web sites for Dalphon or Stinger, did I miss them?

If not, it looks like I'll complete my first AR with a Gunsmoke lower.
Link Posted: 6/12/2007 3:50:23 PM EST
Thank you very much for the info. I was almost one of those "What is the best lower for my money." posters. So to sum it up.....all lowers to the average person just out to learn how to built, plink at the range and have fun would be acceptable? I am looking at LAR made lowers from Spike's tactical for my first build. Thanks again!
Link Posted: 6/14/2007 5:51:16 AM EST
[Last Edit: 6/14/2007 5:51:47 AM EST by Kevenater]
Any advantage concerning billet versus forged? as far as looks/finish?
Link Posted: 6/28/2007 11:41:41 AM EST
my bushy lower matches the lar to a tee.
Link Posted: 6/30/2007 10:04:38 AM EST
I just found this thread.  Nice write up!!!
Link Posted: 7/8/2007 2:31:21 PM EST
Xenophobe, do you remember when you added that Spikes Tactical(OLD) were made by MMS?  I'm curious about how many people were lied to by Spikes about their lowers being made by LAR.
Link Posted: 7/10/2007 2:34:37 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/10/2007 2:40:29 AM EST by hawkin]
Now now BR_Addict, From an outside standpoint. Take a deep breath!

First.. Everything on this board may not be 100% correct. He may have contracts with 2 companies and when you asked, LAR may have been producing them but next week someone else. I don't work for Spikes or own a Spikes lower (not yet anyways) just trying to squash some rumors that will now fly because of your 2 posts.
If it bothers you that bad. I'll buy your lower because you were lied to I guess.. whoopie..
Link Posted: 7/11/2007 9:49:11 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/11/2007 9:53:35 PM EST by slamfire1]

Originally Posted By BR_Addict:
Xenophobe, do you remember when you added that Spikes Tactical(OLD) were made by MMS?  I'm curious about how many people were lied to by Spikes about their lowers being made by LAR.



Spike himself rectified this issue. For everyone’s information, Spike’s Tactical has never had MMS manufacture any Spike’s Tactical lowers.  As I explained to BR_Addict, the information in the threads on this forum can be incorrect from time to time.  Spike’s Tactical offered a full refund to BR_Addict if he is not satisfied with his lower receiver.                  
Link Posted: 7/12/2007 10:24:24 PM EST
As an owner of 10 spikes lowers and rifles, i can tell you that the only company that has made his lower is LAR , NOT  MMS as stated before. this is from the very early lowers that had Ted's Gunsmithing Deland, FL rollmarked on the side of the lower near hte selector to the current productions lowers that he is selling. and as stated before the only other company now that is producing more lowers for spike is a company called API and thier lowers are marked by the start of the serial number that says "THUG" and then the serial number. so pretty much know your facts before ya start spouting off false information that you cannot physically prove (do you have purchase orders from MMS with spikes information, will MMS verify that they have "manufactured" Spikes early lowers, i think not. just because they may look similar does not mean they are the same manufacturer. remember what happens when you assume. im willing to financially back my facts... are you??
Link Posted: 8/11/2007 8:37:23 AM EST
I have 5 lowers from Spikes and one Bushmaster.  They are all the same, with the same tool marks, etc.  I bought the first Spikes lower about two years ago, and the last one about 6 months ago.  Their fit and finish is excellent, and they build into a great AR.  I have used a variety of uppers, all bushmaster barrels, and have had a lot of success with them.  

And the best thing, I've got them all for around $100 ea, plus the background check and sales tax.  Can't beat that!

Mark
Link Posted: 8/27/2007 7:28:59 PM EST
how do Shark lowers compare?
Link Posted: 9/5/2007 10:17:29 PM EST
Nice write up! Could you also include photos & a write up on the following?

-KT-15

-KT 10

-KT Modular lower

-Tannery Shack forged

-Tannery Shack cast

-DPMS stainless steel

-Bushmaster polymer

-Cav Arms polymer

Thanks and great work so far.

Link Posted: 9/14/2007 10:50:18 AM EST

Originally Posted By xenophobe:


The forgings that CMT and LMT use are also from different manufacturers. The ribbed A2 strength on the reciever extension lug is thinner on the LMT, while the CMT is almost the full width. Mega appears to use the same forgings as LMT. All of the manufacturers seem to have some variation of mag well bevels, and those aren't primarily useful in identification.

From left to right, Mega, Stag/CMT, LAR, LMT and Barrett,

img177.imageshack.us/img177/2847/73704265co7.jpg



This is incorrect.  These different forging styles are period specific (time) and don't have anything to do with a specific manufacturer.
Link Posted: 9/24/2007 1:35:15 PM EST
I just ordered a lower from Gunsmoke and the guy taking the order said that their lowers "are made by Lauer, who also makes them for Bushmaster." So what gives?
Link Posted: 9/27/2007 3:59:21 PM EST
What about Sabre Defense, do they machine their own?
Link Posted: 9/27/2007 5:16:51 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/27/2007 5:17:14 PM EST by Ofreenbean]

Originally Posted By GreenWolf70:
I just ordered a lower from Gunsmoke and the guy taking the order said that their lowers "are made by Lauer, who also makes them for Bushmaster." So what gives?


Could he have said "L-A-R"?
Link Posted: 10/3/2007 9:51:17 AM EST
Superior Arms claims they make their own on their website?  They are different than other lowers having that trigger adjust thing a ma jig.  ???
Link Posted: 10/13/2007 5:49:21 PM EST

Originally Posted By GreenWolf70:
I just ordered a lower from Gunsmoke and the guy taking the order said that their lowers "are made by Lauer, who also makes them for Bushmaster." So what gives?


I know for a fact that; Gunsmoke Lowers are LAR, they were Mega for a period of time, now LAR, LAR makes the Lauer Lower so no diff., also as stated all "L" serial number prefix Bushmaster lowers are LAR.
Link Posted: 10/17/2007 5:08:06 PM EST

Originally Posted By 3GUNPLAY:
What about Sabre Defense, do they machine their own?

I'd like to know too.  I'd buy one to go with my Sabre Defense barrel, but those dot peen characters look horrible.  I have not seen another manufacturer that has dot peen characters.
Link Posted: 10/18/2007 3:40:43 PM EST
I noticed you left out armalite. They are the only manufacturer I know of that forge, machine and broach there own lowers and forge and machine there own uppers hence the AR markings on the uppers. I have wondered if they supply anybody else with there lowers.
Link Posted: 10/24/2007 4:19:45 PM EST
also stag/cmt bolts are marked CM, the carriers are not marked
Link Posted: 10/26/2007 5:49:33 PM EST
How are the Stag Arms lowers? I'm interested in getting one for a SPR/ SAM-R type project but i'm not sure what lower to go with. I have heard good things about Stag. And also where is a good place to order the lower receiver. I saw Del-ton and they seem fairly priced.
Link Posted: 11/7/2007 2:40:10 AM EST

Originally Posted By Bret:

Originally Posted By 3GUNPLAY:
What about Sabre Defense, do they machine their own?

I'd like to know too.  I'd buy one to go with my Sabre Defense barrel, but those dot peen characters look horrible.  I have not seen another manufacturer that has dot peen characters.


I have a Sabre lower and it is probably the best made of my 5. It has some distinct differences in machining/forging compared to my DS Arms(LMT) and CMMG(LAR) lowers.

The only issue I had with it while building was some sand blasting media compacted into the buffer spring retainer hole and bolt catch plunger hole. It was easily cleaned out with a needle and q-tip.

I rather like the dot matrix markings on mine. They are not deep, and not even noticeable if you are not holding the rifle in your hands. The markings on mine are pretty clean and well done, perhaps they have become more crude lately.
Link Posted: 11/13/2007 11:35:00 AM EST
I've read and heard that essential arms has made at one time or another lower recievers for a good portion of the companies listed on this post. Any thoughts on essential arms?
Link Posted: 11/17/2007 3:35:45 PM EST
Anyone know who makes the Anvil Arms lower?  Free Laser custom logo sounds [attractive.  
Link Posted: 11/17/2007 3:39:16 PM EST
Anyone know who makes the Anvil Arms lower?  Free Laser custom logo sounds [attractive.  
Link Posted: 11/30/2007 4:23:05 AM EST
How about Superior Arms lowers?  How do they stack up?

Kiser is selling 10 lowers for $800.

Also, a question:  The manufacturer of a lower is required to engrave their info.  How can one company make the lowers for another?
Link Posted: 11/30/2007 11:02:42 AM EST
Yes, I would really like to see how the Superior Arms quality compared to others ... please.... Thank you
Link Posted: 12/1/2007 10:15:37 PM EST
OK the CMT-made lowers don't take an RDIAS, but the LAR-made ones do.  But what about the LMT-made lowers?
Link Posted: 12/8/2007 12:48:56 PM EST

Originally Posted By suprmatch:
I've read and heard that essential arms has made at one time or another lower recievers for a good portion of the companies listed on this post. Any thoughts on essential arms?


I don't know if Essential Arms has made any lowers for any other company recently.  Prior to the 1994 AWB they used to make cast receivers (J-15)  and then they sold that tooling to DPMS and got out of the lower business until after the AWB expired in 2004.  After the AWB they started making cast lowers again (J-15-2)  but they have since stopped making cast lowers and are currently making forged lowers.(J-15-F).  I have 6 of the J-15-F lowers and they seem to be of excellent quality, just as good as the Bushmaster lower I have.  If I was going to buy any more lowers I'd probably go with Essential Arms again as they were good to deal with and I can't see any reason to pay more plus my dealer's FFL is already on file with them.
Link Posted: 12/16/2007 12:48:59 PM EST

Originally Posted By GreenWolf70:
Anyone know who makes the Anvil Arms lower?  Free Laser custom logo sounds [attractive.  


I recently ask Jon from Anvil Arms this very question but he told me via email that Anvil Arms does not release this information.  He further stated that, "Each manufacturer provides their own set of specs.  The machine shop does not make them all the same."

I have heard good things about the Anvil Arms lowers and their engraving.  Jon was very helpful in his email and that's the kind of customer service I like, so I will definately be sending them some of my business.  Besides, how can you beat that deal on lowers with free laser engraving!!  


Link Posted: 12/18/2007 12:23:59 PM EST
This thread indicates that Lauer lowers are again made by LMT.

Lauer lowers.
Link Posted: 1/3/2008 4:34:22 AM EST
I've been in Knights plant and watched their machining....they cut their own lowers.


Link Posted: 1/5/2008 6:28:12 PM EST
Someone asked if DPMS makes their own lowers. I dont think that it was answered, since I am also wanting to know. Could someone tell me if they make their own or not.
Link Posted: 1/12/2008 5:28:52 PM EST
HK lowers and uppers are made from Forgings.. Been on a tour of the factory in Germany, and seen the raw forgings... They are made by another, non firearm company.
Link Posted: 1/12/2008 7:56:21 PM EST
awesome post!  thanks for the info & photos.. great attention to detail.
Link Posted: 1/17/2008 2:43:22 PM EST
Does KAC still make lowers? Can they be bought stripped? From where?
Link Posted: 1/17/2008 2:51:22 PM EST
It looks like Armalite lower receivers need to be added to the list and Eagle Arms lower receivers will be a thing of the past.
Armalite Recievers
See the last post of this discussion.
Link Posted: 1/28/2008 9:53:08 PM EST
says on first page dpms  is under the lar section with a question mark.
gunsmoke told me face to face at the tamps gunshow in dec he is using lar
at the moment and was waiting on the mega lowers. bought 2 lar rec from him.
awsome deal.
too much brand whoring. who cares who makes it. pick the logo u like and build away.
i wasted 2 months once waiting to get a rock river because they were "the best"available.
and i can tell u that was the worst build I've ever had. i have used stinger, mega,bushy. rra
and now working on gunsmokes lar and except for the rra all went together and functioned flawlessly. turned out the rra had misaligned pivot pin holes. but those things happen to all manufacturers from time to time. but some will never realize that their lower is "generic"
and except for small subtleties the same as everybody else's regardless if you paid 25% more than the other guy because yours is big name brand.
not trying to po anybody just had to get that off my chest after some gun guru at the local show this weekend had to tell me how superior his bushy lower that he wanted 185$ for was to my new lar. hmm imagine how depressed i was to realize i paid less than that for 2 rec out the door in dec. i'll have to go see a therapist for sure.
Link Posted: 1/29/2008 8:17:02 PM EST
height=8
Originally Posted By 0_Windage:
Xenophobe,

Great information, I have a question regarding the Lauer lowers.  Any idea when Lauer stopped using LMT lowers and changed to Superior Arms?

Trying to determine if my Lauer is a LMT or Superior lower. It has a 4 significant digit serial #.  I bought it since it was advertised as a LMT product, and the particular dealer still advertises it as such........I think.

My lower has the forward portion of the trigger area flashing removed but retains the flashing immediately behind the trigger itself.  It also has safe and fire stamped on left & right sides of the receiver.

One peculiar thing, the floor depth below the rear take down pin hole is much shallower than my other lower, so much so that an Accuwedge will not fit correctly between the upper receiver pin boss and the lower receiver floor......??

Dunno, but for what it's worth my KAC (oops, LMT) lower won't fit an accuwedge either. Fortunately I was able to rectify the issue w/a new RRA upper. An extreeme case of "get a bigger hammer". Mix and match `til ya get a tight onehank
Link Posted: 2/3/2008 12:53:41 PM EST
Anvil Arms:

DUW






















Wes
Link Posted: 2/3/2008 1:03:33 PM EST
Superior Arms:


















Wes
Link Posted: 2/5/2008 4:33:28 AM EST
Does anyone know the best way of filling engravings on the receiver ("coloring them in")?  I assume it is some kind of enamel, but given the porous finish on many receivers, just wondering if there is a 'tried and true' approach that works.  

Thanks!


Non sibi sed patriae
Link Posted: 2/5/2008 6:14:30 AM EST

Originally Posted By 2tall:
Does anyone know the best way of filling engravings on the receiver ("coloring them in")?  I assume it is some kind of enamel, but given the porous finish on many receivers, just wondering if there is a 'tried and true' approach that works.  

Thanks!


Non sibi sed patriae


I used Automotive touch up paint on the above Superior Arms pics.  Worked well, but you can't thin it with stanard oaint thinner.  You can remove any over spill with a careful rub of brake fluid on the paint you want to remove & then blow off with air compressor.

Wes
Link Posted: 2/5/2008 6:18:46 AM EST

Originally Posted By 2tall:
Does anyone know the best way of filling engravings on the receiver ("coloring them in")?  I assume it is some kind of enamel, but given the porous finish on many receivers, just wondering if there is a 'tried and true' approach that works.  

Thanks!
Non sibi sed patriae


For a "How-to-white-letter-firearms" tutorial ----> CLICK HERE

Moderation is key. This practice can be overdone.

welcome aboard, 2tall.
Link Posted: 2/5/2008 6:30:20 AM EST
Thanks everybody - great pointers to get me started.  Great community . . . . happy to be aboard!

Non sibi sed patriae
Link Posted: 2/5/2008 2:42:17 PM EST
The info on this post is great.  Unless I missed it, I haven't seen any information on LWRC lowers?   Who makes them?  Good quality?  I know they are not easy to get, but if I buy a LWRC upper, I'd like one of their lowers.

Jeff
Link Posted: 2/12/2008 5:06:25 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/12/2008 5:08:14 PM EST by phoenix27]
This is a great resource but probably needs some updating. I just got off the phone with the CMMG (which stands for central missouri machine gun) folks earlier today to comment on my wonderful new lower that I purchased from AIM and asked them the obvious question, specifically, "So who really makes your lower, LAR?" To which Carson from the sales dept. replied, "Nope, we make 'em ourselves, machining them from Alcoa milspec aluminum blocks. We do send them out for anodization."

Someone probably needs to change that info in the comparison matrix. Carson also mentioned that Colt and FN also make their own lowers.  

Interesting stuff.
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