EDIT February 2012

I edited the title to reflect that the OP and intent of the thread was to discuss the very specific unit purchase configuration shown below, because of the Aimpoint T1.

Anyone building one of these? I haven't seen any on the interwebs just yet and very limited discussion.

Few mentions of it in the BCM thread. Seems that this was just a unit level purchase that has been ordered in quite a large quantity?

Here is augees response:



Specs:

Makes for a sharp looking carbine!

Does blue BCG = simunition?

I would imagine the green smoke means that also.  Great looking rifles.

I had a friend that was a Combat Controller. He told me they were using 416s and switched to LWRCs due to bad customer support.

I thought it was strange they used those, but I had no reason to dispute his veracity, and the Air Force kind of does their own thing anyway.

Not sim, UTM.

Is that the new version?

The utm kits we have are black with a blue stripe along and past the thumb detent.


The local PJs have m4a1's  (semi, safe, auto) and besides the above they have a couple guys running EOtechs.

Another thing is that their TangoDown forward grips are the ones made for Surefire switches not the Insight ones that are in the SOPMOD kit.

The PJ's have a history of being able to source their own equipment.  My dad was a career PJ and the individual units where at times allowed to purchase their own gear (tents, packs, sunglasses, etc).  For what they do standard off the rack military issue isn't always effective.  I wouldn't think weapons would qualify, but they do qualify as special forces.

Aaaahh shit Matty, are you starting another "recce" myth creature?  Here we go, everybody is gonna get on this bandwagon, and start the builds.  Augee (mad scientist of everything AR) will be along shortly to correct your ass.  LMAO!!!!!  9080

Seriously though, those look pretty cool.  Would love to know more about them.

I'll go first I guess






 

Ive also seen pictures of Combat Controllers using SCARS

See Avatar.

You do know the Air Force often times begs, borrows and steals anything they can get their hands on....

I have seen alot of PJ's with decked out weapons and others with a plane jane M4.  Just what I have seen.

This is what ours look like. The one in the other picture Looks
Much different

Whats a UTM?

Scored a FH556-212A today & I'll see it tomorrow ( muwhahaha )


And a local class 3/sot will pin it for $50.00   without having to ship it ( hell yeah )



Now all I need are a rail , vltor stock and tube and a Tango down grip ( Again muwhahahaha )

So paint filled projectile?

I see, thanks cowboy..

We've had our kits for 6 years or so. FWIW

I guess you mean special operations.  SF is Army only.

As is th case with any SpecOps unit.

They're probably man-for-man, the fittest organization on the planet.  I'm sure they could give most of the Crossfit Games contestants a run for their money in normal daily activities.

And sometimes they get ridiculous amounts of expensive and specialized crap, even just for towerguard duty.  

AFSOC has some of the most interesting variation in their weapons - how much of this is related to the fact that they "play with others" a lot is hard to say - but I've seen them with a lot of different types of equipment.

I think there's a lot of variety as to what individual STSs (Special Tactics Squadrons) choose to equip with.  The other thing to consider is budget - in general, the Air Force tends to play with bigger ticket items - so they have relatively bigger budgets per man, and AFSOC is a pretty small component.  

NSW doesn't really have to go outside of Crane too much, since the Navy "owns" Crane - what NSW wants, they can just ask for through NSWC-Crane, and it becomes "standard" for SOF.  NSW is also pretty small compared to the rest of the Navy.

The Army has the largest SOF components - plus it has to split their SOF budgets between 75th INF and the Groups, meaning they have to be a lot more frugal about expenditure per soldier, unit funds are tighter, and units are encouraged to "order out of the catalog" (SOPMOD items) as much as possible.  

As for the MSOBs, well, not only are they small, but the Marines are always digging for money, no matter who you are.  

That being said - I've seen a lot of Surefire suppressors and muzzle devices used on various AFSOC M4A1s.  

I think the DD Omega 7.0s have been pretty limited to that one unit (forget which those photos are attributed to).  Furthermore, that particular unit seems to issue:

Tango Down BVG-46 (Surefire pocket) and Battle Grips in FDE, as well as FDE Vltor Clubfoots.  

Someone there is probably an ARFCOMer, too - because optics are T1s and M2/3s in LaRue mounts with Aimpoint 3x magnifiers and twist mounts.  

They seem to be running M600C Scout lights, too.  

I've also seen various AFSOC / STS folks running M68CCOs (Aimpoint CompM4), as well as EOTech 552s.  Their carbines I've seen doument range from indistinguishable from other componets' weapons to "M4A1s" that were actually XM177 lowers with two position vinyl acetate stocks running RX01NSN Reflex sights, to HK416s, and beyond.  

~Augee

Couple more pics...



[img]

Anyone know if these rifles are using the SOCOM profile M4 barrel (M4A1), or the standard gov. profile M4 barrel?

Oh look what I got today from the EE and a steal if I say so myself.



Oh I cant wait for monday to send it down the road from work to get pinned.







Anybody see any older VLTOR FDE stock's for sale anywhere?

I fucking HATE utms. But blue marks sim guns as well.

SOCOM.

Why do you hate UTMs? It's the most stable and reliable training marking ammo I've ever used.

I've dug too many out of my skin. The new Speer round is far better and more reliable.

Mask, goggles, bdu top/bottom and gloves saves you from that

Interesting.. Looks like updated FX ammo.

I wear about 7 layers if the students are shooting UTMs
Last time I was out, for a couple of evolutions, I wore nothing but an underarmor tshirt a few times to piss off some other students.

the speer rounds are 100 times better than any other training round I've ever used. I've fired probably 2k rounds of them, and have yet to have one malfunction. With sim fx, it was hard to make it through one run without em fucking up.

btt

True enough. I hadn't considered AFSOC, so while the rest of the USAF begs, borrows and steals, AFSOC is "special". I actually have to problem with that due to the nature of their jobs.

Because their equipment varies so much and there is no "standard", don't you guys think the idea of building a AFSOC / PJ carbine sounds preposterous? Their rifles look like any arfcomer's rifle on any given sunday anyway.

not really, from those pics, the only real variable is the stocks and optics

DD omega 7.0
SF FH
M951
TD VFG

all taht stuff is pretty much the same

I hope what I'm about to say is on topic.

As a side note, one of my cousins was stationed at Aviano AB in the Security Forces a few years back (in the 2005-2007 timeframe), and she called me to tell me all about their new M4's. It's difficult to remember (and I was less into ARs back then), but as I recall, besides being brand new M4s, they had Aimpoints (M2, I believe), M4 RAS, and, as needed, standard length M203. She said it was all brand new as opposed to the reworked M16s she used at Minot.

on the left



on the bottom

I'm only about half way done with it but I want to keep this thread going.  This is the first gun I've ever put together that's even close to a clone.

Specs:
BCM 16" upper
DD Omega 7
Off brand vertical grip for now
Spikes NiB BCG
BCM Gunfighter Mod 4
Aimpoint ML 3, also have an EOtech I can use
CMMG Lower w/ Standard M4 Stock

Hopefully finish it after Christmas.  Still need a:
EMOD/IMOD stock
Tango Down grip
Sure fire light.

Sighting it in tomorrow morning though as long as the wind is decent.

Alot of these pics appear to show SOCOM Block II M4A1's, with some intermediate 1.5's in there.  I don't have as keen an eye as some for gear, but I've paid a lot of attention to the M4A1 thread in here.

That's a major issue with Mk18s, CQBRs, and others as well. I've seen to many up close to believe that there is a  universal standard. Maybe a set intention, but they're not like A2s, getting cranked out by the thousands, all good little twins of one another. The weapons are still very much a victim of "hey, we're out of X, guess we have to use Y" And that's not taking into account what a unit level armorer does sometimes.

There isn't a "standard" once it gets into the operators hand. There is however a "standard configuration" as it comes from the armorer or from crane.

Building clones means building a rifle AS ISSUED without the addition of "personal touches".

PAC-4C?