Posted: 8/27/2026 8:10:48 PM EDT
|
Does anyone know about how the brain learns muscle memory or remembers tasks or any real information like that rather than just opinion? If I predominantly want to train and become proficient with something like my G19, is it detrimental to also practice with something different like a J frame of a Ruger 22/45? I am making up numbers but say I practiced 500 rounds a month with JUST the G19 compared to 500 rounds a month with the G19 AND 100 rounds a month with a J frame. I can see that the extra trigger time might be beneficial. But I can also see that the different grip angle and different trigger pull might be "confusing" to my brain trying to form muscle memory. Does anyone know? My G19 is my primary focus. But I am enjoying the J frame and dont mind shooting it some. Ammo is expensive and I probably wont shoot it a lot. But It also occurred to me that I could shoot my 22/45 a good bit since ammo is so cheap. But the grip angle is different on the two. |
|
So it is just fine to practice with multiple platforms. Bill Rogers has his students use 22 revolvers in the initial part of training before switching to semi-auto pistols and he is legendary for high standards and training SOF (Navy SEALS, Tier 1). Pistol skills also transfer to carbine, etc For my own training program I mix airsoft, dryfire, .22, and service caliber. It saves money on ammo, speeds training and boosts performance. I even use laser training on certain occasions (basic pistol, indoors). |
per aspera ad astra
|
If you want to understand what works in training, here is some of the evidence: From training hours to operational readiness Things like quality time spent training, spacing, and Interleaving are wise. Promote repetition without repetition. Training should vary conditions of practice so that officers learn to achieve the same outcome goals by adapting their movements to different situations. The objective is not to reproduce identical techniques, but to develop flexible performance that remains effective as conditions change. |
per aspera ad astra
|
I would only opine that a beginning student would be best served by sticking to one platform until the fundamentals are mastered. This would not apply to "cross platforms" (e. g. a Glock, an AR15, and a Rem 870). IOW, stick with the same handgun, carbine, and shotgun until a level of "unconscious competence" is achieved. Introducing a different manual of arms and trigger press, etc., will only serve to complicate the learning curve. |
Best Regards,
TonyF
Training Forum Moderator
"No such thing as tough. There's trained and untrained. Which one are you?" (Denzel Washington -- Man on Fire)
TonyF
Training Forum Moderator
"No such thing as tough. There's trained and untrained. Which one are you?" (Denzel Washington -- Man on Fire)
|
Originally Posted By TonyF: I would only opine that a beginning student would be best served by sticking to one platform until the fundamentals are mastered. This would not apply to "cross platforms" (e. g. a Glock, an AR15, and a Rem 870). IOW, stick with the same handgun, carbine, and shotgun until a level of "unconscious competence" is achieved. Introducing a different manual of arms and trigger press, etc., will only serve to complicate the learning curve. This might or might not apply to me. I have been shooting about 25 years. But i am not too proud to say i might still be considered a beginner by some. I feel like i hace a solid understanding of basic fundimentals but most of my experince is the standard slow fire you see at indoor ranges. Only in the last few months have I started practining drawing from my holster, reloads and multuple targets. So I am 100% a "beginning student" in some regards and thanks for the good advice. I just wanted to clarify my level of shooting (or lack of skill)  
|
| I think the "Fear the man with one gun" saying is more of a rule of thumb. Mastering the platform you use is absolutely beneficial. You should know your primary defensive weapons very well. But I would speculate that all the great masters actually own a lot more than one gun. |
per aspera ad astra
|
Originally Posted By R_S: I think the "Fear the man with one gun" saying is more of a rule of thumb. Mastering the platform you use is absolutely beneficial. You should know your primary defensive weapons very well. But I would speculate that all the great masters actually own a lot more than one gun. All the great masters were once beginners (as were we all). The shortest distance between two points, re: unconscious incompetence and unconscious competence, is and always will be, a straight line. Jockeying between handgun, carbine, and shotgun platforms when first learning the basics is not a straight line. |
Best Regards,
TonyF
Training Forum Moderator
"No such thing as tough. There's trained and untrained. Which one are you?" (Denzel Washington -- Man on Fire)
TonyF
Training Forum Moderator
"No such thing as tough. There's trained and untrained. Which one are you?" (Denzel Washington -- Man on Fire)
|
Thank you guys. I think I am going to take the J frame Model 60 out of the rotation and add in my G17 as a night stand gun. That would standardize my G19 with RMR and G26 as carry guns. Things would be pretty standard across the board. The wife would have access to the G17 when I am gone and she shoots it well enough. She doesnt like the RMR. I could also standardize some holsters and all mags for reloading in the truck and in bags could be standardized G17 and work in all the platforms. If I dont dig this settup after trying it for a bit I can sell of the G17 and pick a plane jane G19. I know it is a small difference but then its even more standardized with two G19 (mine with RMR bedside irons for the wife) and a G26 when I need smaller. On a side note I think in this day and age the steel J frame is stupid on paper. Who in their right mind would carry a 5 shot gun that is slow to reload and weighs the same as the G26. But I have to say the M60 has been fantastic. Its round shape carrys well very well. I intentionally wanted a exposed hammer which I bobbed (perfectly if I do say so). I am comfortable carrying it appendix since when I holster my thumb rides over the hammer and I can feel any movement. The DOA trigger is VERY smooth and recoil is no problem with VZ grips. It is surprisingly fast and accurate at short range. I have owned a lot of 642 and 442s over the years. They do pocket carry better because of weight. But I never shot them well due to heavy triggers and light weight. I wanted to try out a steel frame and other than being heavier it really is so much better. Even though I like it I think this one will just go to the safe as a fun gun. Maybe I will revisit latter. But its a keeper.  
|
|
J-frames have an advantage in that they can reliably be shot while the pistol is still concealed. I've done a decent amount of practice with my 642. Not a fun gun to shoot a lot, but even with that short sight radius you can get decent hits at 15 yards. |
per aspera ad astra
|
I like CZ75 decockers. My main competition gun is a full-sized Sp-01 Tactical with a Holosun 507Comp and my carry gun is the compact PCR with a holosun 507K. I also have P-01 (compact w/ rail) and Sp-01 Phantom (Full-sized polymer frame w/ rail) Different guns for different purposes but exact same manual of arms so time spent on one translates well to the other. The collection also allows me to shoot matches in different divisions. I think your decision to go all Glock is probably the right one. |
|
Originally Posted By R_S: J-frames have an advantage in that they can reliably be shot while the pistol is still concealed. I've done a decent amount of practice with my 642. Not a fun gun to shoot a lot, but even with that short sight radius you can get decent hits at 15 yards. The sights on thise j frames suck. I am sure in low light they are even worse. But i was really supprised with how well they worked on that model 60 in bright light at the outdoor range. My 60 also has a pinned front sight so i could have done a tritium or fiber optic. |
|
Originally Posted By Gotterdammerung: I like CZ75 decockers. My main competition gun is a full-sized Sp-01 Tactical with a Holosun 507Comp and my carry gun is the compact PCR with a holosun 507K. I also have P-01 (compact w/ rail) and Sp-01 Phantom (Full-sized polymer frame w/ rail) Different guns for different purposes but exact same manual of arms so time spent on one translates well to the other. The collection also allows me to shoot matches in different divisions. I think your decision to go all Glock is probably the right one. I used to own a 75. One of the few guns i really wish i hadnt gotten rid of. I really considered a P-01 for appendix carry becouse i feel more comfortable holstering with the exposed hammer over a striker. |