Posted: 5/31/2020 8:32:29 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Lancelot][Edited]
| Hello All, I've been out of the loop for some years and am looking to get an AR again. This time I would like a plain jane national match rifle. I think it would be a great platform to teach my son how to use iron sights. Whats everyone using these days? I know theres probably alot of good companies today but Im a bit picky and would probably rather have like a RRA or something. Don't see too much about those old companies anymore. I am trying not to spend a bundle. |
|
How old is he and what's his stature? I ask because 10+lb A2s don't match well with smaller kids. |
Distinguished Rifleman #2223
"Technique isn't something that can be taught. It's something you find on your own." - Bunta Fujiwara
"Technique isn't something that can be taught. It's something you find on your own." - Bunta Fujiwara
|
A 10/22 with tech sights is a great introduction to iron sights. It transitions really well to an AR. Adjustable stocks are now common on NM rifles. These can extend as a shooter grows as well as adjust for position shooting. |
Distinguished Pistol, Distinguished Rifle, Distinguished Rimfire Pistol
|
I started my daughter out in highpower with a Bushmaster A2 Upper with match sights, float tube, A2 handguards, and a GI profile 1/7 barrel. Much lighter than a NM heavy barrel. Lower was Rock River, w match trigger. I put a Magpul UBR stock on it. She needed the adjustability, and the UBR locks up solid. It balanced well, too, without adding extra weights. Both the A1 and A2 stocks were too long, and the M4 stock was too light and did not balance the gun. I will say that before starting her in HP, I had her shooting air rifle with the local 4H shooting club. CMP may have a list of affiliated clubs in your area. |
| Sometime ago I watched on Youtube a young teenager shooting a National Match rifle using a lower with the adjustable M4 buttstock. She was small and needed the stock adjusted with a short length of pull so she could shoulder the target rifle properly. If I was building up a National match rifle I would buy a White Oak Armament match upper for $740 and then just add a M4 type lower with a good trigger. The rifle was front heavy, but she seemed to do alright with it. It would be fine to start off with and then add a heaver adjustable stock later as your skill grew. |
|
Originally Posted By RichardM308: I started my daughter out in highpower with a Bushmaster A2 Upper with match sights, float tube, A2 handguards, and a GI profile 1/7 barrel. Much lighter than a NM heavy barrel. Lower was Rock River, w match trigger. I put a Magpul UBR stock on it. She needed the adjustability, and the UBR locks up solid. It balanced well, too, without adding extra weights. Both the A1 and A2 stocks were too long, and the M4 stock was too light and did not balance the gun. I will say that before starting her in HP, I had her shooting air rifle with the local 4H shooting club. CMP may have a list of affiliated clubs in your area. can I ask what age and weight your daughter was when she started with the AR? I'm not going to quote everyones post. Seems I cant multi quote. My boy is going on 8 and 90 pounds at 55" and growing fast..lol. Hes a big boy and may have a bit of time before he can handle it but I'd still like to get something for him to learn the firearm inside and out so when he is ready, He will know. I was thinking of something like a 10/22 and might look into that but will still get the AR. I was just looking at the RRA website, I will check out that WOA upper for 740, that sounds like a deal on with a RRA lower. Thank you all for the replies. |
|
My oldest was at least 90 pounds, and probably around 12-13 years old before she shot in a Highpower match. I also have three boys ages 9, 11, and 13. They are all active in our local 4H shooting club. 4H teaches the fundamentals beginning with "national match" BB guns, and progresses to air rifles and .22 smallbore. It focuses heavily on the fundamentals of marksmanship, and safe handling of firearms, and provides good socialization. Here is a list of existing NJ 4H youth shooting clubs, with points of contact. The Civilian Marksmanship Program also has its New England Games Matches in Vermont in September 2020. The Small Arms Firing School (SAFS) Rifle Marksmanship 101 and M16/EIC match allows junior shooters with parents, but they must be at least 12 years old. The nice thing about SAFS is that CMP provides match AR15s (including M4s for smaller shooters), match ammo, electronic targets, instruction (and a t-shirt) for the low, low price of $50 for adults and $40 for juniors. |
|
He might have a tough time with Service rifle type AR given his size and age. Prone shouldn't be an issue, but anything else will be a bit rough. I have an older RRA DCM that is a tack driver. If you could find one of those that would be a less expensive way to start. If I was building something new, I would likely use a WOA barrel or complete upper. When I shot service rifle WOA and Krieger barrels were pretty well though of. I would personally put together a 22LR AR to ingrain good habits. It is also much less expensive than burning through match ammo on an AR. Then transition to AR but keep the 22LR around for training. You can weight the handguard and buttstock so it feels similar. |
|
Originally Posted By MCM308: I'm not going to quote everyones post. Seems I cant multi quote. My boy is going on 8 and 90 pounds at 55" and growing fast..lol. Hes a big boy and may have a bit of time before he can handle it but I'd still like to get something for him to learn the firearm inside and out so when he is ready, He will know. I was thinking of something like a 10/22 and might look into that but will still get the AR. I was just looking at the RRA website, I will check out that WOA upper for 740, that sounds like a deal on with a RRA lower. Thank you all for the replies.  Iron Sight M4gery | Aug 2019 HP Rifle Match Mine's a frankenbuild, but not much different from an average non-bottomfeeder (no Bear Creek or AR Stoner) 1:7 twist M4 with a freefloat handguard and 2-stage trigger. Gov't profile barrel is enough. Unless you get a dud, a chromelined shall hold 0.5 MOA radius or better for 8-10k rounds. My personal best with it has been 98% at 100yds. If you just have to have Match parts: https://www.rockriverarms.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_ID=77 The accessories recommended are KNS 0.050 post and Armalite 0.050/0.060 aperture (to counter the short length to front sight), H2 buffer and LARB buffer tip (to soften the recoil a smidge and ease case extraction). I'd recommend a detachable carry handle modified for elevation travel if 600 yards is in the cards (may be used ones around still, factory ones are pricy), but most come with a 0.040 aperture which is too small for the more squared up position the carbine forces, and finer threads so a standard screw would have to be obtained with the Armalite aperture. With a standard handle, you can also just give the front sight a revolution "UP" to get within the handle's travel. CMP will also allow a 16" dissipator type upper with the sling fixed at 8" from the magwell, if focal length to front sight is still a concern. Standard 0.070 post for that. For a couple local 5'4" 120lb kids, stock 2 notches out is about right, so probably collapsed for yours. ETA: 7.5-8.5lbs total weight almost guarantees good balance and endurance. |
Distinguished Rifleman #2223
"Technique isn't something that can be taught. It's something you find on your own." - Bunta Fujiwara
"Technique isn't something that can be taught. It's something you find on your own." - Bunta Fujiwara
Distinguished Rifleman, President’s Hundred
Joined:
Oct 2010
Posts:
5875
EE: 100% (1)
USA
|
Originally Posted By MCM308: Hello All, I've been out of the loop for some years and am looking to get an AR again. This time I would like a plain jane national match rifle. I think it would be a great platform to teach my son how to use iron sights. Whats everyone using these days? I know theres probably alot of good companies today but Im a bit picky and would probably rather have like a RRA or something. Don't see too much about those old companies anymore. I am trying not to spend a bundle. The sport is rapidly moving to optics. That means used iron-sight uppers can be had for pennies on the dollar. Join the usrifleteams forum and post in the equipment exchange that you are looking for an iron-sight upper and you’ll likely get a screaming deal on a match-grade upper. |
Fundamentally the marksman aims at himself.
— D.T. Suzuki
— D.T. Suzuki
|
Originally Posted By Snafu12: CMP M1 Carbine match can be good start Great for collectors or if that's what you want to shoot. But a bit pricey if someone just wants to competatively shoot. |
However, it's not the odds that make me carry. It's the stakes. - Jayne_Cobb
|
I'm going to second HighpowerRifleBrony's recommendation on using an M4 style carbine to start with. With a decent barrel and good ammo a carbine set up like HRB spec'ed will post up Master scores or better. I've been playing around with a carbine the past couple of years and got a personal best with mine at a 100 yard match (494 - 17x). You could build a decent carbine for cheap, and your boy could get a lot of experience in before the equipment held him back. |
