Posted: 1/15/2015 7:00:20 PM EDT
| ive always thought that the russian m91 was a good way to start. i know they are collectors items but when big 5 can sell them for 100$ and the new archangel stock plus the 10 round mag... maybe with a scope and bipod with a bull barrel.. might be a decent 800 plus yard rifle... but.. i dont shoot those distances yet .. so not exactly sure what i need. any suggestions? i hear the 308 drops a huge amount but it can be done... when i was younger i thought 30-06 was the snipers round of choice... then i was told.. 50 cal... i just have no idea. |
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Once you bought all that stuff for a worn out mosin, you could have bought a new savage 10 or Remington 700. 308 is fine for 800 yards in my opinion.
If you want something even cheaper, look at the savage axis. |
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Originally Posted By diggum:
ive always thought that the russian m91 was a good way to start. i know they are collectors items but when big 5 can sell them for 100$ and the new archangel stock plus the 10 round mag... maybe with a scope and bipod with a bull barrel.. might be a decent 800 plus yard rifle... but.. i dont shoot those distances yet .. so not exactly sure what i need. any suggestions? i hear the 308 drops a huge amount but it can be done... when i was younger i thought 30-06 was the snipers round of choice... then i was told.. 50 cal... i just have no idea. forget all of that |
Ryan Miller LCPL USMC - Sept 14, 2006. Barwanah, Iraq
Adam P. Kennedy, Sgt USA - April 8, 2007. Diwaniyah, Iraq
Mark R. Cannon, HM3 USN - October 2, 2007. Kunar, Afghanistan
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Adam P. Kennedy, Sgt USA - April 8, 2007. Diwaniyah, Iraq
Mark R. Cannon, HM3 USN - October 2, 2007. Kunar, Afghanistan
11091
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Originally Posted By diggum:
ive always thought that the russian m91 was a good way to start. i know they are collectors items but when big 5 can sell them for 100$ and the new archangel stock plus the 10 round mag... maybe with a scope and bipod with a bull barrel.. might be a decent 800 plus yard rifle... but.. i dont shoot those distances yet .. so not exactly sure what i need. any suggestions? i hear the 308 drops a huge amount but it can be done... when i was younger i thought 30-06 was the snipers round of choice... then i was told.. 50 cal... i just have no idea. The Army M24 is just Remington 700 in 308. The book says its max effective range is 800 meters which is about 880 yards. With training and experience you can do 1000 yards all day long with a 308. It was already stated but you'll spend your money much better by getting a savage or Remington. |
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Originally Posted By diggum:
ive always thought that the russian m91 was a good way to start. i know they are collectors items but when big 5 can sell them for 100$ and the new archangel stock plus the 10 round mag... maybe with a scope and bipod with a bull barrel.. might be a decent 800 plus yard rifle... but.. i dont shoot those distances yet .. so not exactly sure what i need. any suggestions? i hear the 308 drops a huge amount but it can be done... when i was younger i thought 30-06 was the snipers round of choice... then i was told.. 50 cal... i just have no idea. Go to YouTube and watch the Sniper 101 Series. Educate yourself before opening your wallet. |
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Originally Posted By diggum:
ive always thought that the russian m91 was a good way to start. i know they are collectors items but when big 5 can sell them for 100$ and the new archangel stock plus the 10 round mag... maybe with a scope and bipod with a bull barrel.. might be a decent 800 plus yard rifle... but.. i dont shoot those distances yet .. so not exactly sure what i need. any suggestions? i hear the 308 drops a huge amount but it can be done... when i was younger i thought 30-06 was the snipers round of choice... then i was told.. 50 cal... i just have no idea. Mosin Nagants are great surplus rifles and horrible long range target rifles (aside from the purpose-built target versions). Rebarreling is difficult and can lead to a cracked receiver if not done properly. The barrel threads are non-standard. Scope mounting is less-than ideal with the rear sight replacement rails, and proper mounting require drilling and tapping the receiver for a scope mount. The bolt handle will have to be bent or replaced to clear the scope. Save yourself the trouble and considerable expense and buy something more amenable to long range precision. A Remington M700, Savage, or Tikka is a much better starting point. Ruger's new RPR is getting very good reviews. Save up your money for a good scope and quality ammunition/reloading supplies. |
"The sleep of reason produces monsters."- Francisco Goya
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Originally Posted By diggum:
ive always thought that the russian m91 was a good way to start. i know they are collectors items but when big 5 can sell them for 100$ and the new archangel stock plus the 10 round mag... maybe with a scope and bipod with a bull barrel.. might be a decent 800 plus yard rifle... but.. i dont shoot those distances yet .. so not exactly sure what i need. any suggestions? i hear the 308 drops a huge amount but it can be done... when i was younger i thought 30-06 was the snipers round of choice... then i was told.. 50 cal... i just have no idea. You do not know enough to be making any purchases yet. You'll be extremely unhappy with a Mosin for the purpose. The guys are telling you truth but a hard to accept truth. Before you get into precision shooting at all you'll need to do some serious learning. Sniper 101 from TiborasaurusRex is a great place to start. If you can make it through all of the like 90 episodes and still want to do it then at least you've been exposed to the information you need. A decent entry level rifle and optic are going to run you bloody near or more than 1000 bucks. Decide if that's the kind of money you want to dump into this. You won't get it out of it if you decide later to sell your rifle. Don't set yourself up to take a loss if you don't need to. |
| When you're watching Tiborasauras Rex he has a LOT of high end optics and rifles. You don't need to necessarily spend $4k to get into the long range game. Right now I'm at $950 and the Savage has gotten out on target at 1200 yards. The best thing that you can do is get out there and actually shoot at longer ranges and get used to dialing your scope and finding an accurate round for your gun. |
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Originally Posted By diggum:
i hear the 308 drops a huge amount but it can be done... 175 SMK at 2650 fps (M118LR) drops 400-420 inches at 1000 yards 39-42 MoA. SMK goes transonic right near the 1000 yard point. A modern high BC 155 bullet such as Lapua Scenar, Berger 155 Hybrid, 2156 155 SMK, and a few others. In a bolt gun these can be launched at 2950 fps (24" tube) or 3050 in a 30" tube. This takes the above number down to 300" at 1000 yards, ~30 MoA. These things go transonic in the 1200 yard range. Windage is an inch or two worse than 175 SMK at 1000. Properly loaded a 308 can punch paper at 1200 yards, 1300 with a bit of altitude help. On the other hand, 6.5mm or 7mm cartridges have another 200 yards beyond what current bullet technology allows in 308. when i was younger i thought 30-06 was the snipers round of choice... then i was told.. 50 cal... i just have no idea. In Viet Nam, Carlos Hathcock used a 30-06 primarily, many others used 308. Carlos made some very long hits with a 50BMG on a mounting. In the late 1950s, the 308 was found to be a better accuracy cartridge than the 30-06, first by a small amount, and then as shooters and gunsmiths got more and more development time, the 308 continued to get better to the point where few use 30-06 when given a choice on the range. German Salazar, however, liked the 30-06 for most of his shooting, until shoulder surgery took him off the range. |
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Go with a Rem 700 or equivalent Savage because its so common, .308 for the same reason and good factory ammo is available, and a 26" barrel to give the 308 usable long range velocity.
Buy a 20MOA base and a $300 scope that will give you 40MOA of vertical elevation. With that, you can get 1000 yds for what I personally consider to be the best value (right at about $1000). Don't spend money on stock or trigger until later. Sure, you can spend $$$$ on every single component of the gun and there is always more efficient long range calibers than 308 (6, 6.5, 7mm) but my proposal gets you 90% of the way there. Then if you really really like long range and want to spend more money at least then you will be experienced enough to choose your own path. |
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I shoot at 1700 yards with a 300 dollar 1964 Remington 700 in 7MM Rem Mag. I have a Bushnell Tactical Elite 6-24 scope that cost about 900 bucks on a 20 MOA mount. Just got it threaded to run my Templar Tactical ARK 30 on it. Shoots fantastic, especially when the weather is cold like it was Saturday here.
Its all about the scope. Get a magnum caliber and you will never have to replace it. |
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Whatever you do, don't buy a $300 scope. The absolute cheapest I would even consider for a scope is a 3-9 Super Sniper Mil/Mil FFP. These run about $600, have decent glass and track true. $300 scopes are unreliable and frustrating. If you can afford it, pick up a Viper or Nightforce scope for $1500-2000.
Make sure to get some quality rings and a good 20moa base like Seekins. If you cheap out on the optic/mount, you will have nothing but frustration. When it comes to caliber, .308 is a great starter/learner setup. You can push 700 yds with ease. Pushing out to 1100yds will require some skill in 10mph winds to be consistent. The reason to stick with 308 vs 300WM or bigger is ammo price. You will need to practice a lot to get good. |
| SWFA SS fixed scope 10X or 16X. Around $300 and perfect for your long range needs. You don't need to spend $1500-$2000 on an optic for a starting rifle. If you have a custom long range rig then yes you should spend the extra on a high dollar scope but for a starter no. I have experience with them and they are a great value. |