Van life (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 1/17/2026 9:40:21 PM EDT
|
Not sure if I have any real point to this thread. Just interested in thoughts on the topic. If social media is to be believed, a bungload of mostly formerly middle class people have been reduced to living in campers and vans etc. I’m mostly not talking about teenage influencers. It seems quite a few had legit jobs and just couldn’t afford traditional housing. It seems many believed this was viable. However, many towns have outlawed it one way or another. And many campgrounds have put policies in place like only allowing campers 10yo and newer and no monthly stays. It seems that has driven many of these people into the desert southwest blm land. Not just the old slab city and various hippie/nomad gatherings like schooliepalooza, but lots of communities are forming. To me this feels like the old hobos from 100 years ago riding boxcars across the country. When the shtf happens and all the city dwellers “head for the mountains” are they ultimately going to land in the desert southwest? It seems like they’re heavily dependent on gasoline to get to civilization for water. Doesn’t seem sustainable. |
|
I'll chime in.... " Housing is unaffordable". It's an old old song. It's been played before. I've seen dozens of videos, news reels, and articles whining about housing. Often , it's something like "I wait tables in Key West FL, and I simply can't make local rents" or " I'm working in fast food here in San Diego, CA and have to live in my car...". See a common theme? If rents are high in your area, and you don't make enough to cover rent, MOVE. Period . For more than 100 years, people have arrived at Ellis Island because home, wherever that was, did t work any more. Moving to better opportunities was the answer. It's true today. If the income/ rent equation doesn't balance, you ve got a choice: make more money, or move to cheaper rent. I've encountered tons of people in shitty economics situations, but one of the causes is an unwillingness to relocate. Decisions have consequences.... Of you live in an expensive area like Key West and you're minimum wage worker, you're going to be broke. Period. Stupid decisions ... As to van life: yeah, it's not sustainable.... If it's " go live in a van over there, for six weeks, because I've got a good paying temp gig",it's short term viable. But that's rarely the case. It's usually the case someone is failing at life, and chooses van life because they are lowering the bar on housing. Interesting thing: everyone else in the city or the region somehow pays their rent... In many cases, and I've known a few, it's often something like " I wanna quit my job, but can't pay rent, so I'm quitting and living in my van'. It's not rent that's the issue. |
|
Originally Posted By frozenny: I'll chime in.... " Housing is unaffordable". It's an old old song. It's been played before. I've seen dozens of videos, news reels, and articles whining about housing. Often , it's something like "I wait tables in Key West FL, and I simply can't make local rents" or " I'm working in fast food here in San Diego, CA and have to live in my car...". See a common theme? If rents are high in your area, and you don't make enough to cover rent, MOVE. Period . For more than 100 years, people have arrived at Ellis Island because home, wherever that was, did t work any more. Moving to better opportunities was the answer. It's true today. If the income/ rent equation doesn't balance, you ve got a choice: make more money, or move to cheaper rent. I've encountered tons of people in shitty economics situations, but one of the causes is an unwillingness to relocate. Decisions have consequences.... Of you live in an expensive area like Key West and you're minimum wage worker, you're going to be broke. Period. Stupid decisions ... As to van life: yeah, it's not sustainable.... If it's " go live in a van over there, for six weeks, because I've got a good paying temp gig",it's short term viable. But that's rarely the case. It's usually the case someone is failing at life, and chooses van life because they are lowering the bar on housing. Interesting thing: everyone else in the city or the region somehow pays their rent... In many cases, and I've known a few, it's often something like " I wanna quit my job, but can't pay rent, so I'm quitting and living in my van'. It's not rent that's the issue. From my studying SHTF events around the world, one thing that is consistent no matter where or when or what the SHTF is. The people who adapt to the new normal are the ones who survive the best. Those who don't adapt....either have a very hard time or they don't make it at all. It doesn't apply to all but a lot of the people living the van life....really aren't doing it because they are poor. They like the nomad lifestyle. I can understand it because I like it too....for short periods. I did a vacation early last year where I wandered around the west living out of my Jeep for a few days. The relaxation and freedom was pretty great. Then, I came back to reality and returned home! It's not the long term lifestyle I want but for short periods....it's fun. Just like backpacking but with better food and more comfortable sleeping arrangements! Just like many of the homeless....they are living that lifestyle by choice, not specifically because they are poor. |
"It behooves every man to remember that the work of the critic is of altogether secondary importance, and that, in the end, progress is accomplished by the man who does things."
Theodore Roosevelt
Theodore Roosevelt
|
"When the shtf happens and all the city dwellers “head for the mountains” are they ultimately going to land in the desert southwest?" From a survival, shtf, situation it is not viable for long-term living for most people due to the limited amount of space for food, water, and equipment in your RV or Toyota minivan and reliance on fuel being readily available. Heating, cooling, power, water, food procurement, long term food storage, security, etc. become much more difficult if you only have 60 sq. feet of space on wheels and no outside assistance. For getting to your cabin or BOL if the trip is a few days, then sure, but it is a transient period between getting away from a disaster and to a prepared location or functioning infrastructure and food distribution. As far as living in your RV or car full time, then sure it can be done. My mother lives in her van full time and travels the U.S. and Canada. CheapRVLiving and AdventureVanMan on YouTube have some good videos on living in a car/van. CheapRVLiving is leaning more towards product reviews and showcasing different van lifer's vehicle builds Brian from AdventureVanMan shows pretty low-key van life and a realistic look at living and working seasonal jobs. He has some annual cost of living and income breakdown videos. ForestyForest on YouTube shows modest van living from YouTube income. I like his wood stove setup. Then there are the ones that drop 6 figures on vehicles. Niki Delventhal and Ria of Roaming Reckless are cute. But a $100K+ Sprinter or a Range Rover Defender (lots of money sunk into repairs) + Land Cruiser are out of the reach of people working minimum wage jobs and living in their cars. |
| I have dealt with a lot of homeless people in my job. A lot of the people living out of their vehicles have substance abuse issues and mental issues. Many are anti social nomads. They are enabled by the “do gooders” in the world along with our absurdly generous welfare state. You can get enough food and drugs off the taxpayers and well meaning but stupid people….why settle down and do something with your life? |
"It behooves every man to remember that the work of the critic is of altogether secondary importance, and that, in the end, progress is accomplished by the man who does things."
Theodore Roosevelt
Theodore Roosevelt
|
Originally Posted By ColtRifle: It doesn't apply to all but a lot of the people living the van life....really aren't doing it because they are poor. They like the nomad lifestyle. I can understand it because I like it too....for short periods. I did a vacation early last year where I wandered around the west living out of my Jeep for a few days. The relaxation and freedom was pretty great. Then, I came back to reality and returned home! It's not the long term lifestyle I want but for short periods....it's fun. Just like backpacking but with better food and more comfortable sleeping arrangements! Just like many of the homeless....they are living that lifestyle by choice, not specifically because they are poor. Yep. I was deep into overlanding for almost a decade. Have many friends who full time drove around the world year after year living out of everything from Land Cruiser to unimogs. It’s honestly a very appealing lifestyle and I enjoyed every minute of the time I spent which was unfortunately constrained by my employment. So I’m very familiar with the van life stuff too. But I wanted to get opinions in the context of the survival forum. Not the vacation crowd in GD. My reality check hit during Covid when Colorado and some other states closed highways and imposed restrictions that would suck if you’re stuck in a vehicle. Plus some friends were in Morocco when they closed their borders and they had to stay there for 6 months when they only planned a few weeks. Much as the lifestyle is appealing, it seems extremely dependent on society. You can’t grow or store enough food to live on in a vehicle. You can’t make your own gas. You prob could handle water if you go where the water is but that’s also where the people are. But there are a lot of advantages too. You can move somewhere safer. You can move to where the jobs are if any. Or where the food is, if any. But as I mentioned in the OP, with places trying to restrict it today, that’s likely to get much worse post shtf. I’m just wondering given the array of types of shtf, when would van life be viable, or could you make it be viable? Where would you go if you had a good build (comfy, solar, water, shower, heat, stuff to cook with, a fridge) but obviously limited storage. The best builds I’ve seen were limited to about 2 weeks of comfort before needing resupply. How long could you stay out wherever you go? |
|
Originally Posted By taliv: Yep. I was deep into overlanding for almost a decade. Have many friends who full time drove around the world year after year living out of everything from Land Cruiser to unimogs. It’s honestly a very appealing lifestyle and I enjoyed every minute of the time I spent which was unfortunately constrained by my employment. So I’m very familiar with the van life stuff too. But I wanted to get opinions in the context of the survival forum. Not the vacation crowd in GD. My reality check hit during Covid when Colorado and some other states closed highways and imposed restrictions that would suck if you’re stuck in a vehicle. Plus some friends were in Morocco when they closed their borders and they had to stay there for 6 months when they only planned a few weeks. Much as the lifestyle is appealing, it seems extremely dependent on society. You can’t grow or store enough food to live on in a vehicle. You can’t make your own gas. You prob could handle water if you go where the water is but that’s also where the people are. But there are a lot of advantages too. You can move somewhere safer. You can move to where the jobs are if any. Or where the food is, if any. But as I mentioned in the OP, with places trying to restrict it today, that’s likely to get much worse post shtf. I’m just wondering given the array of types of shtf, when would van life be viable, or could you make it be viable? Where would you go if you had a good build (comfy, solar, water, shower, heat, stuff to cook with, a fridge) but obviously limited storage. The best builds I’ve seen were limited to about 2 weeks of comfort before needing resupply. How long could you stay out wherever you go? Originally Posted By taliv: Originally Posted By ColtRifle: It doesn't apply to all but a lot of the people living the van life....really aren't doing it because they are poor. They like the nomad lifestyle. I can understand it because I like it too....for short periods. I did a vacation early last year where I wandered around the west living out of my Jeep for a few days. The relaxation and freedom was pretty great. Then, I came back to reality and returned home! It's not the long term lifestyle I want but for short periods....it's fun. Just like backpacking but with better food and more comfortable sleeping arrangements! Just like many of the homeless....they are living that lifestyle by choice, not specifically because they are poor. Yep. I was deep into overlanding for almost a decade. Have many friends who full time drove around the world year after year living out of everything from Land Cruiser to unimogs. It’s honestly a very appealing lifestyle and I enjoyed every minute of the time I spent which was unfortunately constrained by my employment. So I’m very familiar with the van life stuff too. But I wanted to get opinions in the context of the survival forum. Not the vacation crowd in GD. My reality check hit during Covid when Colorado and some other states closed highways and imposed restrictions that would suck if you’re stuck in a vehicle. Plus some friends were in Morocco when they closed their borders and they had to stay there for 6 months when they only planned a few weeks. Much as the lifestyle is appealing, it seems extremely dependent on society. You can’t grow or store enough food to live on in a vehicle. You can’t make your own gas. You prob could handle water if you go where the water is but that’s also where the people are. But there are a lot of advantages too. You can move somewhere safer. You can move to where the jobs are if any. Or where the food is, if any. But as I mentioned in the OP, with places trying to restrict it today, that’s likely to get much worse post shtf. I’m just wondering given the array of types of shtf, when would van life be viable, or could you make it be viable? Where would you go if you had a good build (comfy, solar, water, shower, heat, stuff to cook with, a fridge) but obviously limited storage. The best builds I’ve seen were limited to about 2 weeks of comfort before needing resupply. How long could you stay out wherever you go? Biggest limitations are gas, water, black tank, and propane (heat). If you're camping in the wilderness, those aren't really issues, you can stay put for a long time if you hunt and have a filtered water source. |
I sell firearms produced by the finest child labor in the world, be it Filipino, Muslim, Mormon, Arizonan, or Texan.
|
Originally Posted By taliv: Yep. I was deep into overlanding for almost a decade. Have many friends who full time drove around the world year after year living out of everything from Land Cruiser to unimogs. It’s honestly a very appealing lifestyle and I enjoyed every minute of the time I spent which was unfortunately constrained by my employment. So I’m very familiar with the van life stuff too. But I wanted to get opinions in the context of the survival forum. Not the vacation crowd in GD. My reality check hit during Covid when Colorado and some other states closed highways and imposed restrictions that would suck if you’re stuck in a vehicle. Plus some friends were in Morocco when they closed their borders and they had to stay there for 6 months when they only planned a few weeks. Much as the lifestyle is appealing, it seems extremely dependent on society. You can’t grow or store enough food to live on in a vehicle. You can’t make your own gas. You prob could handle water if you go where the water is but that’s also where the people are. But there are a lot of advantages too. You can move somewhere safer. You can move to where the jobs are if any. Or where the food is, if any. But as I mentioned in the OP, with places trying to restrict it today, that’s likely to get much worse post shtf. I’m just wondering given the array of types of shtf, when would van life be viable, or could you make it be viable? Where would you go if you had a good build (comfy, solar, water, shower, heat, stuff to cook with, a fridge) but obviously limited storage. The best builds I’ve seen were limited to about 2 weeks of comfort before needing resupply. How long could you stay out wherever you go? I don’t think it’s a viable long term plan for smart people. The typical loser van life person (as opposed to the traveling, adventurous van life person) lives on social welfare and handouts…and maybe an occasional short term dead end job. Real survival takes community. You will need the skills of others. Others will need your skills (hence the reason to build skills). For example: I can fix things. My wife needs the services of a doctor. I fix the doctor’s car in exchange for him fixing my wife. There was a poster around here one time (can’t remember his name) who grew up in Russia or the Soviet Union (can’t remember the time frame). He said everyone developed a skill or skill set that enabled them to participate in the underground economy. He had some interesting insight on life in Russia. Wish he was still posting. The person with the degree in women’s studies will have to resort to the oldest profession if he/she doesn’t have any real skills. That’s why I believe firmly you should develop skills. I told my 16 yr old grandson to consider getting a job in HVAC. He doesn’t have to do it forever (but he’s not a good student in school so college is probably out). However, if he does it, he’ll learn plumbing, electrical, and HVAC skills. Even if he doesn’t keep at it, he’ll have a valuable skill set for life. |
"It behooves every man to remember that the work of the critic is of altogether secondary importance, and that, in the end, progress is accomplished by the man who does things."
Theodore Roosevelt
Theodore Roosevelt
|
FWIW I actually was into adv bikes since covid and was really eager to just live off a bike while doing all the BDRs. And then just ride around. Kinda like the people who spend 6 months hiking the AT or PCT. But they have food resupply every few days. Both are even more dependent on society. So how do you replace that if society goes away. I can’t think of a way to really be self sufficient. |
|
Originally Posted By taliv: FWIW I actually was into adv bikes since covid and was really eager to just live off a bike while doing all the BDRs. And then just ride around. Kinda like the people who spend 6 months hiking the AT or PCT. But they have food resupply every few days. Both are even more dependent on society. So how do you replace that if society goes away. I can’t think of a way to really be self sufficient. Practically speaking, there really isn’t a way to be 100% self sufficient. Most people who claim to be….really aren’t. And if you are one of the very few people who figure out how, your existence will be miserable and probably short lived. Community is a good thing. Meeting and talking to like minded people is a good thing. Humans need socialization with other humans. No one can know everything so it makes sense to tap the brains of those with more knowledge than you. Trade your brain power (skills) for theirs. |
"It behooves every man to remember that the work of the critic is of altogether secondary importance, and that, in the end, progress is accomplished by the man who does things."
Theodore Roosevelt
Theodore Roosevelt
|
I've dealt with many homeless people throughout my career. Most live on the streets and live with their mental illness or addiction. They get enabled by the dogooders that give them handouts. People living in cars has moved up to the whole vanlife mindset. Usually people living in their cars were more recently homeless and trying to get by. Now it seems to be a wannabe lifestyle choice. Mostly made up of people that want to make money on Youtube and not deal with the cost of living. There was a woman staying in the campground I was at during hunting season. She had the spot I like. Appeared that she was living out of car. She would disappear during the day and come back in the late afternoon and appeared to have some kind of job uniform on. I doubt she was in that situation by choice. The vanlife people can be lowkey and not an issue. But I'm sure they could cause issues too. Some businesses welcome them. Cracker barrel was letting them stay in their parking lot overnight and Walmart is usually pretty welcoming. I could definitely see traveling the US for a few weeks a year like that but I want a house to come back too at some point. |
|
Buying a house is absolutely not affordable for young adults starting life. Anyone that says otherwise is out of touch with reality. Anyone priced a new single wide lately? Thank God we bought our house and property over a decade ago because we would have a hard time affording it if we had to do it all over again right now even though we make a good bit more now than we did back then. While van life might look cool on YouTube after all the edits fuck that. I have a decent 20' camper without slide outs and while it's fun for a trip or adventure it would really suck if we had to fit everything, we wanted to keep in it and say that's what we live in from now on. Life in the camper would come to a freezing end in the winter once there was no more propane available. Even worse when the truck runs out of gas for relocation purposes. |
Originally Posted By ar-jedi:
SO MUCH WIN IN ONE POST IT COULD CRASH ARFCOM !!!
SO MUCH WIN IN ONE POST IT COULD CRASH ARFCOM !!!
|
Originally Posted By thederrick106: Buying a house is absolutely not affordable for young adults starting life. Anyone that says otherwise is out of touch with reality. Anyone priced a new single wide lately? Thank God we bought our house and property over a decade ago because we would have a hard time affording it if we had to do it all over again right now even though we make a good bit more now than we did back then. While van life might look cool on YouTube after all the edits fuck that. I have a decent 20' camper without slide outs and while it's fun for a trip or adventure it would really suck if we had to fit everything, we wanted to keep in it and say that's what we live in from now on. Life in the camper would come to a freezing end in the winter once there was no more propane available. Even worse when the truck runs out of gas for relocation purposes. There's a reason the retirees drive north or south w/ the seasons in their RVs. Most RVs don't cope well w/ snow. |
I sell firearms produced by the finest child labor in the world, be it Filipino, Muslim, Mormon, Arizonan, or Texan.
|
Originally Posted By backbencher: There's a reason the retirees drive north or south w/ the seasons in their RVs. Most RVs don't cope well w/ snow. I am aware. I live in a place where tomorrows low temp is 5 degrees. Not going to drive south from the far north if the gas/ fuel supply is compromised, hence RV life would not be great without plenty of gas/ fuel/ propane. |
Originally Posted By ar-jedi:
SO MUCH WIN IN ONE POST IT COULD CRASH ARFCOM !!!
SO MUCH WIN IN ONE POST IT COULD CRASH ARFCOM !!!
|
Originally Posted By jagdkommando: I will keep my house and probably spend summers in a Ford E350 van up in the UP as soon as I retire. I will be parked 100 feet from beach that's over 100 miles long and most people never go there. Care to share what beach? Looking for some new spots up there.  |
|
Originally Posted By taliv: Yep. I was deep into overlanding for almost a decade. Have many friends who full time drove around the world year after year living out of everything from Land Cruiser to unimogs. It’s honestly a very appealing lifestyle and I enjoyed every minute of the time I spent which was unfortunately constrained by my employment. So I’m very familiar with the van life stuff too. But I wanted to get opinions in the context of the survival forum. Not the vacation crowd in GD. My reality check hit during Covid when Colorado and some other states closed highways and imposed restrictions that would suck if you’re stuck in a vehicle. Plus some friends were in Morocco when they closed their borders and they had to stay there for 6 months when they only planned a few weeks. Much as the lifestyle is appealing, it seems extremely dependent on society. You can’t grow or store enough food to live on in a vehicle. You can’t make your own gas. You prob could handle water if you go where the water is but that’s also where the people are. But there are a lot of advantages too. You can move somewhere safer. You can move to where the jobs are if any. Or where the food is, if any. But as I mentioned in the OP, with places trying to restrict it today, that’s likely to get much worse post shtf. I’m just wondering given the array of types of shtf, when would van life be viable, or could you make it be viable? Where would you go if you had a good build (comfy, solar, water, shower, heat, stuff to cook with, a fridge) but obviously limited storage. The best builds I’ve seen were limited to about 2 weeks of comfort before needing resupply. How long could you stay out wherever you go? The only thing I can think of with this kind of plan where it could be worthwhile is partial vacay partial alternate bug out locations. I.e, you have a couple acres in AR, couple acres in the mountains of TN, couple acres out in TX, etc. and each has some stocks (can't carry much of what you'll need) as well as protected "parking" for something mobile, etc. I.e, several small places where you could spend a few weeks at here or there for vacays now, as well as having alternate BO locations. We all like to think our BO location is rock solid, we will never need to leave, etc. and many of us have invested decades of our life in these. However it's possible to need to leave. I remember early Feb of 2020, a guy called for a pick up in person for some NV. I meet up with him and he had a nice little setup in one of those smaller (not land yacht) size Mercedes vans. Said his wife had respiratory problems and was concerned about things and was going to another location for reasons. He was about a month ahead of the start of the big "rush" then for that kind of gear. Actually come to think of it, I've met quite a few folks buying NV that had nice "overlanding" type set ups.. |
www.jrhenterprises.com
In business since 1992- Over 30 Years in business- Thank you for your business!
Quickest ways to contact us-
912.375.1480
[email protected]
In business since 1992- Over 30 Years in business- Thank you for your business!
Quickest ways to contact us-
912.375.1480
[email protected]
|
In my area we have lots of campgrounds and some are really nice and others are like why would anyone camp there. the not so nice ones have full time campers there year round. People even put skirts on their campers since they are almost permanent The nice ones with mountain views cost more and have nicer campers short term. It's pretty common out here |
have gun will travel
Well you seen much combat? ......... I've seen a little on TV.
We are jolly green giants, walking the Earth with guns.
Lifetime NRA member SADLY
now GOA and ASA member!!!!!
Well you seen much combat? ......... I've seen a little on TV.
We are jolly green giants, walking the Earth with guns.
Lifetime NRA member SADLY
now GOA and ASA member!!!!!
|
Originally Posted By thederrick106: I am aware. I live in a place where tomorrows low temp is 5 degrees. Not going to drive south from the far north if the gas/ fuel supply is compromised, hence RV life would not be great without plenty of gas/ fuel/ propane. Originally Posted By thederrick106: Originally Posted By backbencher: There's a reason the retirees drive north or south w/ the seasons in their RVs. Most RVs don't cope well w/ snow. I am aware. I live in a place where tomorrows low temp is 5 degrees. Not going to drive south from the far north if the gas/ fuel supply is compromised, hence RV life would not be great without plenty of gas/ fuel/ propane. Well, it wouldn't be air conditioned. In the south, if you camp and don't have propane, you can cook on a fire outside & stay warm @ night w/ blankets. You have a big steel/fiberglass tent w/ indoor plumbing. Summers will suck for those not used to southern heat in SHTF. |
I sell firearms produced by the finest child labor in the world, be it Filipino, Muslim, Mormon, Arizonan, or Texan.
|
Originally Posted By ColtRifle: I have dealt with a lot of homeless people in my job. A lot of the people living out of their vehicles have substance abuse issues and mental issues. Many are anti social nomads. They are enabled by the “do gooders” in the world along with our absurdly generous welfare state. You can get enough food and drugs off the taxpayers and well meaning but stupid people….why settle down and do something with your life? I don’t doubt that, but there is a difference between a methhead sleeping in her Saturn in a walmart parking lot, someone trying to cobble van life together with what little money they had after losing their house, and someone who lives fill time in an RV…. Hell, I know a guy on another forum who lives in an RV by choice in retirement and says not only does he love the travel and ability to avoid winter but that it’s much cheaper than owning a house he no longer has an interest in maintaining. As for the OP, I think Vanlife sounds romantic to people with escape fantasies of sorts-the same thing that resonated with the Tiny Home crowd 5-10 years ago. |
Never make another person a priority when they merely see you as an option...
"Some People Are Like Slinkies. They're Not Really Good For Anything, But They Bring a Smile To Your Face When Pushed Down The Stairs."
"Some People Are Like Slinkies. They're Not Really Good For Anything, But They Bring a Smile To Your Face When Pushed Down The Stairs."
|
Originally Posted By thederrick106: Buying a house is absolutely not affordable for young adults starting life. Anyone that says otherwise is out of touch with reality. Anyone priced a new single wide lately? Thank God we bought our house and property over a decade ago because we would have a hard time affording it if we had to do it all over again right now even though we make a good bit more now than we did back then. While van life might look cool on YouTube after all the edits fuck that. I have a decent 20' camper without slide outs and while it's fun for a trip or adventure it would really suck if we had to fit everything, we wanted to keep in it and say that's what we live in from now on. Life in the camper would come to a freezing end in the winter once there was no more propane available. Even worse when the truck runs out of gas for relocation purposes. I have a solar off-grid cabin on rural property as my future retirement home. What I came to find out was that it takes about 800 square feet of main floor and two stand up sleeping lofts to not feel like you are sleeping in a pine box. Any living arrangement has to have the ability to source water-I got the property in 2007, cabin went up in 2013, water came in 2022 or so. Up until that point I had a place I could go, but I didn’t have a place to Be….. You need enough space to be able to store extra clothes, food, things you need-you don’t get that in a Van, and not really even in an RV. You can’t stretch out your footprint out of a vehicle if you need to, and you have little privacy or security becuase you are always waiting for someone to come along and tell you to move along… I get the escape fantasy as that was a lot of why I went ahead with my rural cabin but Vanlife and RV living is a short term solution to get you to something better IMO. |
Never make another person a priority when they merely see you as an option...
"Some People Are Like Slinkies. They're Not Really Good For Anything, But They Bring a Smile To Your Face When Pushed Down The Stairs."
"Some People Are Like Slinkies. They're Not Really Good For Anything, But They Bring a Smile To Your Face When Pushed Down The Stairs."
|
Originally Posted By TheOtherDave: I don’t doubt that, but there is a difference between a methhead sleeping in her Saturn in a walmart parking lot, someone trying to cobble van life together with what little money they had after losing their house, and someone who lives fill time in an RV…. Hell, I know a guy on another forum who lives in an RV by choice in retirement and says not only does he love the travel and ability to avoid winter but that it’s much cheaper than owning a house he no longer has an interest in maintaining. As for the OP, I think Vanlife sounds romantic to people with escape fantasies of sorts-the same thing that resonated with the Tiny Home crowd 5-10 years ago. Among the van people, a portion are living a lifestyle. I actually know a few personally. They aren’t homeless per se…..nomads is a more appropriate term. I’m kind of jealous of the carefree lifestyle they are living. The vast majority of people living out of their cars are drug addicts and/or mentally messed up. Stay away from those people. They are all thieves and scumbags. Zero useful contribution to society. I have no use for them and will not help them in any way. The third group are people who aren’t mentally ill or addicts but due to a stroke of bad luck (and usually a healthy dose of poor financial management) they have been forced into their situation. I have a shred of sympathy for them but they have to want to change their situation. This is the easiest group to help usually and if they are worth anything, they don’t stay homeless long. This group is also the smallest group. So, most of the people living out of their vehicles have no value to society. And once again, good financial management skills are a prep. Probably the most valuable prep. |
"It behooves every man to remember that the work of the critic is of altogether secondary importance, and that, in the end, progress is accomplished by the man who does things."
Theodore Roosevelt
Theodore Roosevelt
Joined:
Jan 2026
Posts:
1
EE: 0% (0)
USA
|
I came here looking for info on a Baofeng, and saw this thread. Since I know quite a bit about this topic, I thought I would chime in. Vanlife isn't where it's at, imo. It's cool on the surface, though only 2 steps above homeless. Things could be worse, but it isn't as cheap as it seems. Just the fuel you spend looking for a place to park can add up. It takes considerable time and attention to live, as cooking and preparing to go to work, study, etc. all take more effort than in a room/apartment/house. Also, not sure how it works when you need automotive work, expect you have to find elsewhere to stay. If you can find a place to set up with power and water, it is easier. It is easier for people who have 1) jobs that require few tools or clothes (these take a lot of space) or 2) an income stream that doesn't require them to be working 5 days/wk. (more time to take care of the things necessary to live, like laundry, getting groceries, etc.) A van would be easier to rent a spot in a buddies driveway with, but may be more difficult to live in an RV park. RV life is one step up from that, or 3, depending on your area and income. An RV or Travel Trailer smaller than 24' is tight. Clothes take up space, things you need for work or play take space, etc. It can be literally 2x the space of a van, but still very tight. The upsides of a small RV is that it is mobile, so much easier to move for work, seasonal comfort, etc. Also, many can be towed with a 1/2 ton vehicle or less, so people with trucks may find them useful with a vehicle they already own. A larger RV feels much like an apartment. Full size shower, bathroom, bed, etc. These are often parked somewhere for a season, or years, as a second or third home. In the southwest, they are extremely common, though that lifestyle is going the way of the dodo. I have known several guys who traveled the country in rigs like this following high paying union and Davis Bacon jobs. |
Joined:
Jan 2026
Posts:
2
EE: 0% (0)
USA
|
I would wager most RVs cannot stay out more than 2 days without hookups or a genny (battery limited). With some preparation, a week of dry camping is pretty doable, but that would put you in pretty rare company. I think most people with some foresight and discipline, as well as some focused preparation, could do a month without too much effort. (enough solar or genset fuel, propane, water, groceries, and a plan for dumping tanks as necessary) None of these numbers are terribly different than a house. Most people can't do more than a couple days, a week is doable with prep, etc. The big difference is that an RV can go places, while a house cannot. An RV could do better than many homes when there are no working utilities, if it was designed for that. |
|
Saw this in general discussion... Vans are cool, very convenient and very usable.. Comes with onan generator, Solar, black, grey tanks, 18 gallon water... Dry camping or full hookup... Piss or shit in the woods, bathrooms in parks... Went to a van from a 5th wheel toyhauler... |
|
Originally Posted By Mannlicher: it sounds like poverty to me, and I don't want anything to do with it. I certainly love camping, and do a lot of that, but just the thought of living in a tiny tin box..............nope. It made my CHU in Iraq feel positively spacious.  Icy weekends like this make me miss my B, I could be in south Texas right now, hanging out on the border, getting ready to walk across the river to my dental plan... |
I sell firearms produced by the finest child labor in the world, be it Filipino, Muslim, Mormon, Arizonan, or Texan.
|
Originally Posted By ColtRifle: I don’t think it’s a viable long term plan for smart people. The typical loser van life person (as opposed to the traveling, adventurous van life person) lives on social welfare and handouts…and maybe an occasional short term dead end job. Real survival takes community. You will need the skills of others. Others will need your skills (hence the reason to build skills). For example: I can fix things. My wife needs the services of a doctor. I fix the doctor’s car in exchange for him fixing my wife. There was a poster around here one time (can’t remember his name) who grew up in Russia or the Soviet Union (can’t remember the time frame). He said everyone developed a skill or skill set that enabled them to participate in the underground economy. He had some interesting insight on life in Russia. Wish he was still posting. The person with the degree in women’s studies will have to resort to the oldest profession if he/she doesn’t have any real skills. That’s why I believe firmly you should develop skills. I told my 16 yr old grandson to consider getting a job in HVAC. He doesn’t have to do it forever (but he’s not a good student in school so college is probably out). However, if he does it, he’ll learn plumbing, electrical, and HVAC skills. Even if he doesn’t keep at it, he’ll have a valuable skill set for life. It’s easy to paint Vanlife people like losers, the thing is that even if you discount the fact that society is more ‘mobile’ now yet functional than ever before, there are other things at play. I get it-everyone who does it differently than you(figuratively speaking, not pointing fingers) is an idiot, a ne’er do well, a fool waiting his just desserts… I have to ask, how is it any worse to be a vanlifer who never builds anything for himself compared to a housewife who runs the cards up, divorces her money pot, and then gets the house and not enough to keep it? They both end up in the same place in life, just like the young man who failed to launch in life and never amounts to more than a retail worker. They both end up the same place everyone else does: In the ground with no reward for that they toiled. What made me want to reply directly to your post is that, as a society, we are desperate for an escape from our relality. A 30 something with rent he can barely afford on an apartment he will never own after going to school and doing the ‘Right things’ per his parents is just as desparate to get out as someone who has a mortgage they can’t afford on a house that will never be paid off. I work with mechanical engineering interns and grads and the amount of weight these young men have on their necks is crushing-and employment isn’t guaranteed after graduation. As a quarter-century participant (though, no longer cool kid) of the Survival Forum, I ask myself what separates me from a greasy Vanlifer…. After graduating from “hobby survivalist to lifestyle prepper, then on to rural off grid tenable cabin on land, the only difference between me and the Hipster is on-demand hot water and electricity and that I enjoyed economic conditions in my prime earning years that allowed me to buy and build when I did. I still wanted to escape, I still do want to escape-it just has to wait until retirement. What got me there was decades of towing the boat in society for others. More welfare paid on a single Sunday worked than a it takes to pay a Rat to procreate on a couch for a week and a half. Corporate greed tacking on fees and charges. Taxes. Paying for the military security of countries that hate me against sworn enemies that really never amounted to much anyway. The American citizen has been asked to carry the weight of the world on their shoulders for so long now that putting those shackles on as a young adults is starting to result in visceral refusal. I understand that. Because of those 50, 60, 70+ hour work weeks, I am now far older than my age suggests and am in fact recovering from surgery last week, hoping to have full use of my shoulder when I need it to cut wood to stay warm. Ask yourself: What would you do if you were young, had time to experiment with your life, and were being handed the shit-sandwich a young man has today? Sure-get a skilled trade. Suffer less. Save everything you earn. It just doesn’t always work out that way on paper in life and not everyone gets the same deal you might have. |
Never make another person a priority when they merely see you as an option...
"Some People Are Like Slinkies. They're Not Really Good For Anything, But They Bring a Smile To Your Face When Pushed Down The Stairs."
"Some People Are Like Slinkies. They're Not Really Good For Anything, But They Bring a Smile To Your Face When Pushed Down The Stairs."
|
Originally Posted By taliv: FWIW I actually was into adv bikes since covid and was really eager to just live off a bike while doing all the BDRs. And then just ride around. Kinda like the people who spend 6 months hiking the AT or PCT. But they have food resupply every few days. Both are even more dependent on society. So how do you replace that if society goes away. I can’t think of a way to really be self sufficient. There is no way unless you want to subsistence farm to your grave. A rural off grid property with enough savings at retirement to cover the taxes is as good as it gets. You will need medicine. You will need health care. You will need to go places. You will need food. You will need repair parts. You will need social interaction. You will need many more things than you ever thought you did. The lone wolf starves to death. |
Never make another person a priority when they merely see you as an option...
"Some People Are Like Slinkies. They're Not Really Good For Anything, But They Bring a Smile To Your Face When Pushed Down The Stairs."
"Some People Are Like Slinkies. They're Not Really Good For Anything, But They Bring a Smile To Your Face When Pushed Down The Stairs."
| 10 years ago I followed the blog of a young guy whose first job out of college was in Silicon Valley, with it's huge housing costs. He bought an old box van and lived in the back of it. Insulated with 2" foam and heated off a 100 lb propane tank, just a place for a bed and his bicycle. Showered at the gym everyday and kept it parked at his employers for three years with weekly trips to refill the propane tank and keep the battery charged to remain mobile. Ate at restaurants for all meals, but a lot of new college grads end up doing that with more standard housing. After three years he moved to a new job at a tech startup in South Carolina with enough money to purchase a house there for cash. |
|
Originally Posted By engineer61: 10 years ago I followed the blog of a young guy whose first job out of college was in Silicon Valley, with it's huge housing costs. He bought an old box van and lived in the back of it. Insulated with 2" foam and heated off a 100 lb propane tank, just a place for a bed and his bicycle. Showered at the gym everyday and kept it parked at his employers for three years with weekly trips to refill the propane tank and keep the battery charged to remain mobile. Ate at restaurants for all meals, but a lot of new college grads end up doing that with more standard housing. After three years he moved to a new job at a tech startup in South Carolina with enough money to purchase a house there for cash. Very common in the Bay Area for new Googlers to live 10 to a house and save for their first crib. They eat on campus and there is a special google bus to take them around town. Lots of consternation with the locals over that shit too.. |
Never make another person a priority when they merely see you as an option...
"Some People Are Like Slinkies. They're Not Really Good For Anything, But They Bring a Smile To Your Face When Pushed Down The Stairs."
"Some People Are Like Slinkies. They're Not Really Good For Anything, But They Bring a Smile To Your Face When Pushed Down The Stairs."
|
Originally Posted By TheOtherDave: It’s easy to paint Vanlife people like losers, the thing is that even if you discount the fact that society is more ‘mobile’ now yet functional than ever before, there are other things at play. I get it-everyone who does it differently than you(figuratively speaking, not pointing fingers) is an idiot, a ne’er do well, a fool waiting his just desserts… I have to ask, how is it any worse to be a vanlifer who never builds anything for himself compared to a housewife who runs the cards up, divorces her money pot, and then gets the house and not enough to keep it? They both end up in the same place in life, just like the young man who failed to launch in life and never amounts to more than a retail worker. They both end up the same place everyone else does: In the ground with no reward for that they toiled. What made me want to reply directly to your post is that, as a society, we are desperate for an escape from our relality. A 30 something with rent he can barely afford on an apartment he will never own after going to school and doing the ‘Right things’ per his parents is just as desparate to get out as someone who has a mortgage they can’t afford on a house that will never be paid off. I work with mechanical engineering interns and grads and the amount of weight these young men have on their necks is crushing-and employment isn’t guaranteed after graduation. As a quarter-century participant (though, no longer cool kid) of the Survival Forum, I ask myself what separates me from a greasy Vanlifer…. After graduating from “hobby survivalist to lifestyle prepper, then on to rural off grid tenable cabin on land, the only difference between me and the Hipster is on-demand hot water and electricity and that I enjoyed economic conditions in my prime earning years that allowed me to buy and build when I did. I still wanted to escape, I still do want to escape-it just has to wait until retirement. What got me there was decades of towing the boat in society for others. More welfare paid on a single Sunday worked than a it takes to pay a Rat to procreate on a couch for a week and a half. Corporate greed tacking on fees and charges. Taxes. Paying for the military security of countries that hate me against sworn enemies that really never amounted to much anyway. The American citizen has been asked to carry the weight of the world on their shoulders for so long now that putting those shackles on as a young adults is starting to result in visceral refusal. I understand that. Because of those 50, 60, 70+ hour work weeks, I am now far older than my age suggests and am in fact recovering from surgery last week, hoping to have full use of my shoulder when I need it to cut wood to stay warm. Ask yourself: What would you do if you were young, had time to experiment with your life, and were being handed the shit-sandwich a young man has today? Sure-get a skilled trade. Suffer less. Save everything you earn. It just doesn’t always work out that way on paper in life and not everyone gets the same deal you might have. I'm not sure if I'm following this post but I'll take a stab at it........... As mentioned.....there are the homeless van lifers. They are garbage humans. Waste of life. No reason to waste a second on those people. They are leaches on society. The second group of people are the adventurers. They aren't taking advantage of the kindness of strangers. They are just living their lives traveling. I like those people. They have interesting stories and go to interesting places. Sometimes on vacation, I am one of those people (for short periods of time). Everyone likes to claim they had it rougher than the other group. Well, every generation in America has had unique struggles. But, every generation has had the opportunity to make their life better. It may look different for one person in one era than a person in today's era. But, every person had opportunity. The big question is, did they take advantage of the opportunities or go find opportunities or did they sit on their dead ass and complain that nothing is "fair"? There are PLENTY of opportunities today. People years ago had living challenges....people today have living challenges. Big deal. Kids today aren't special, people 50 years ago weren't special, and you and I aren't special. We all make decisions and then live with the consequences of those decisions. If we are smart, we'll learn as much as we can before making decisions. Reading books, articles, forums, going to schooling and training, etc and then critically analyzing that information will help us make smarter decisions (most of the time). Or, we can wing everything we do and hope for the best. The problem with that plan is, hope is not a course of action. We can spend all our time complaining, or we can accept that some things are just the way they are and learn to work within the system we have, not the system we wish we had. |
"It behooves every man to remember that the work of the critic is of altogether secondary importance, and that, in the end, progress is accomplished by the man who does things."
Theodore Roosevelt
Theodore Roosevelt
|
Originally Posted By ColtRifle: I'm not sure if I'm following this post but I'll take a stab at it........... As mentioned.....there are the homeless van lifers. They are garbage humans. Waste of life. No reason to waste a second on those people. They are leaches on society. The second group of people are the adventurers. They aren't taking advantage of the kindness of strangers. They are just living their lives traveling. I like those people. They have interesting stories and go to interesting places. Sometimes on vacation, I am one of those people (for short periods of time). Everyone likes to claim they had it rougher than the other group. Well, every generation in America has had unique struggles. But, every generation has had the opportunity to make their life better. It may look different for one person in one era than a person in today's era. But, every person had opportunity. The big question is, did they take advantage of the opportunities or go find opportunities or did they sit on their dead ass and complain that nothing is "fair"? There are PLENTY of opportunities today. People years ago had living challenges....people today have living challenges. Big deal. Kids today aren't special, people 50 years ago weren't special, and you and I aren't special. We all make decisions and then live with the consequences of those decisions. If we are smart, we'll learn as much as we can before making decisions. Reading books, articles, forums, going to schooling and training, etc and then critically analyzing that information will help us make smarter decisions (most of the time). Or, we can wing everything we do and hope for the best. The problem with that plan is, hope is not a course of action. We can spend all our time complaining, or we can accept that some things are just the way they are and learn to work within the system we have, not the system we wish we had. Sorry, having a hard time finding common ground with you on this. As Americans, we get equal opportunity but no equal outcomes based on how we work with what we have or find in life. If someone chooses to get by on a minimum in life, it might not be what you and I choose to do but it might be right for them. Not everyone has the same drive, intelligence, or skills as you and I might. Who gets farther ahead? The guy who goes to college, has a long career sacrificing for a day in the future, meets his retirement date, and dies on the following Tuesday never having had time to take that fishing trip, *or* the van hippy that got to sleep in every day until his parents kicked the bucket and left him their house at 77 years old? I’m just not seeing the animus for people who choose an alternative lifestyle like Vanlife fad…. I’m 53 and have been around a fair bit in this world even outside of the USA and I can not remember a single time seeing someone living out of a van causing other people problems to a point I could even recognize that individual as a liability in society let alone make a total generalization about them as a class of people. There are opportunities out there today, this is still America and there is work for those who want it-I just don’t see where you, me, or anyone else earned a license to view those who choose a different path than you did so dimly. The other problem with your neat categorization of people is that they can and often do change their ways… One of the most professional and intelligent people I know is a program manager for a company building OEM scale dynamometers and typically works on Formula 1 test cells these days. He lateralled over in his career in automotive program management where he had input on a lot of the cars you have likely owned. But, as a young man in his 20’s? Total dope head who’s dream of unicycling across the USA started in Florida and ended in the bottom of a dry pool trying to escape the mosquitoes.. He has since raised a family, started another, and is a member of his church security team. I get that it’s comfortable to rant about things you disagree with or that you think are the root of all evil, but as someone who lives in suburban Detroit I’m just not seeing how van hippies who maybe don’t have all of their lifestyle mapped out yet is the ruination of the Union. |
Never make another person a priority when they merely see you as an option...
"Some People Are Like Slinkies. They're Not Really Good For Anything, But They Bring a Smile To Your Face When Pushed Down The Stairs."
"Some People Are Like Slinkies. They're Not Really Good For Anything, But They Bring a Smile To Your Face When Pushed Down The Stairs."
|
Wife and I always talk about selling the farm in north Idaho and getting a really nice Mercedes van/camper and hauling a bass boat across the west. Stopping at lakes in every state, fishing for a week, then moving south following the weather then back up to Idaho in the summer. Staying in hotels when possible. Taking in the tourist traps. The main thing stopping us is the cost. Damn those vehicles are expensive. We know a couple who did it for a few years. Upscale people and definitely well off. They didn't frequent the desert hippy camps but said they had a blast. But again they said it is not cheap to do. Not every person who wants to wander the country in a van is following the Grateful Dead. Some just hate people and love nature. |
Dont call it a comeback, Been here for years.
|
Originally Posted By TheOtherDave: Sorry, having a hard time finding common ground with you on this. As Americans, we get equal opportunity but no equal outcomes based on how we work with what we have or find in life. If someone chooses to get by on a minimum in life, it might not be what you and I choose to do but it might be right for them. Not everyone has the same drive, intelligence, or skills as you and I might. Who gets farther ahead? The guy who goes to college, has a long career sacrificing for a day in the future, meets his retirement date, and dies on the following Tuesday never having had time to take that fishing trip, *or* the van hippy that got to sleep in every day until his parents kicked the bucket and left him their house at 77 years old? I’m just not seeing the animus for people who choose an alternative lifestyle like Vanlife fad…. I’m 53 and have been around a fair bit in this world even outside of the USA and I can not remember a single time seeing someone living out of a van causing other people problems to a point I could even recognize that individual as a liability in society let alone make a total generalization about them as a class of people. There are opportunities out there today, this is still America and there is work for those who want it-I just don’t see where you, me, or anyone else earned a license to view those who choose a different path than you did so dimly. The other problem with your neat categorization of people is that they can and often do change their ways… One of the most professional and intelligent people I know is a program manager for a company building OEM scale dynamometers and typically works on Formula 1 test cells these days. He lateralled over in his career in automotive program management where he had input on a lot of the cars you have likely owned. But, as a young man in his 20’s? Total dope head who’s dream of unicycling across the USA started in Florida and ended in the bottom of a dry pool trying to escape the mosquitoes.. He has since raised a family, started another, and is a member of his church security team. I get that it’s comfortable to rant about things you disagree with or that you think are the root of all evil, but as someone who lives in suburban Detroit I’m just not seeing how van hippies who maybe don’t have all of their lifestyle mapped out yet is the ruination of the Union. You are missing what I'm saying. I don't care what decisions anyone makes with their life. But, if you choose to do nothing with your life, don't expect me to feel bad for you when you look at me enjoying the fruits of my labor and tell me "must be nice". My answer is.... "It is nice. You could have done it too. But, you didn't. We are both living with the results of our decisions. You lived your life the way you wanted to...and I lived mine the way I wanted to." If you can live your life the way you want to and have sufficient money to do what you want...more power to you. But, don't expect me to feel bad for you if it doesn't work out. There are some tried and true ways of succeeding in life. Getting and sticking with a career. Living frugally. Saving and investing. Those are proven to lead to financial security/success. If you choose to not do those things....well good luck. |
"It behooves every man to remember that the work of the critic is of altogether secondary importance, and that, in the end, progress is accomplished by the man who does things."
Theodore Roosevelt
Theodore Roosevelt
|
Originally Posted By Redoubt99: Wife and I always talk about selling the farm in north Idaho and getting a really nice Mercedes van/camper and hauling a bass boat across the west. Stopping at lakes in every state, fishing for a week, then moving south following the weather then back up to Idaho in the summer. Staying in hotels when possible. Taking in the tourist traps. The main thing stopping us is the cost. Damn those vehicles are expensive. We know a couple who did it for a few years. Upscale people and definitely well off. They didn't frequent the desert hippy camps but said they had a blast. But again they said it is not cheap to do. Not every person who wants to wander the country in a van is following the Grateful Dead. Some just hate people and love nature. I know a guy that lives full time out of an RV. Sold his house in retirement and says it’s cheaper to drive around the south going to model airplane events than having a home. |
Never make another person a priority when they merely see you as an option...
"Some People Are Like Slinkies. They're Not Really Good For Anything, But They Bring a Smile To Your Face When Pushed Down The Stairs."
"Some People Are Like Slinkies. They're Not Really Good For Anything, But They Bring a Smile To Your Face When Pushed Down The Stairs."
|
Working in the heavy industrial construction industry I know many people who live in campers that they tow from job to job. They rent a spot on an RV park with hookups near the job site. They are being productive and contributing to society. When I did a project in California a few years ago I saw many people living out of squalid vans or automobiles. They tended to park in front of some unfortunate persons home in a suburban neighborhood. They dumped shit in the street or shit in the homeowners yards, made noise all night, were generally drunk or high, left trash behind, and due to California's laws, couldn't be rousted by the cops until they had remained in their parking spot on the street for more than 3 days (or some similar arbitrary time, maybe it was a week). They were a pestilence contributing nothing to society. I spent a winter in Illinois on a project in a 5th wheel a few years ago, living in a campground. I choose to use the per diem I received to paid for my 5th wheel instead of using it to rent an apartment. At the campground where I stayed, there was a retired couple barely scraping by in a dilapidated 5th wheel. They represent the trying to live in a camper because they couldn't afford a house segment of nomadic life. Despite those of us with jobs helping them out occasionally, it appeared to be a tough life. I felt sorry for them. It was evident that as their health deteriorated, their situation was only going to get worse. |
|
Originally Posted By Redoubt99: Wife and I always talk about selling the farm in north Idaho and getting a really nice Mercedes van/camper and hauling a bass boat across the west. Stopping at lakes in every state, fishing for a week, then moving south following the weather then back up to Idaho in the summer. Staying in hotels when possible. Taking in the tourist traps. The main thing stopping us is the cost. Damn those vehicles are expensive. We know a couple who did it for a few years. Upscale people and definitely well off. They didn't frequent the desert hippy camps but said they had a blast. But again they said it is not cheap to do. Not every person who wants to wander the country in a van is following the Grateful Dead. Some just hate people and love nature. My older cousin and his wife are currently doing their see the country RV trip. They’ve done the eastern seaboard, then up the Mississippi, and worked their way across to Washington state, Oregon, Cali, and Arizona as of last week. State and National parks for most of their stops. I think it’s awesome. He did his first several years retired helping his mom out. |
The only hyphenated names I like are cartridge names......30-06, 30-40, 38-55 etc.
|
Originally Posted By 545days: Working in the heavy industrial construction industry I know many people who live in campers that they tow from job to job. They rent a spot on an RV park with hookups near the job site. They are being productive and contributing to society. When I did a project in California a few years ago I saw many people living out of squalid vans or automobiles. They tended to park in front of some unfortunate persons home in a suburban neighborhood. They dumped shit in the street or shit in the homeowners yards, made noise all night, were generally drunk or high, left trash behind, and due to California's laws, couldn't be rousted by the cops until they had remained in their parking spot on the street for more than 3 days (or some similar arbitrary time, maybe it was a week). They were a pestilence contributing nothing to society. I spent a winter in Illinois on a project in a 5th wheel a few years ago, living in a campground. I choose to use the per diem I received to paid for my 5th wheel instead of using it to rent an apartment. At the campground where I stayed, there was a retired couple barely scraping by in a dilapidated 5th wheel. They represent the trying to live in a camper because they couldn't afford a house segment of nomadic life. Despite those of us with jobs helping them out occasionally, it appeared to be a tough life. I felt sorry for them. It was evident that as their health deteriorated, their situation was only going to get worse. A relative of mine has a piece of property near a large steel mill. He’s developing it into a camper “park”. He’ll have full hookups for campers. He will market it to the transient workers at the steel mill. Normal campers won’t want to camp there (kind of a shitty place near a shitty steel mill). But, temp workers at the mill need a place to stay in their camper. And, they have good paying jobs meaning they have money to pay their lot rent. Genius plan I think. |
"It behooves every man to remember that the work of the critic is of altogether secondary importance, and that, in the end, progress is accomplished by the man who does things."
Theodore Roosevelt
Theodore Roosevelt
|
Originally Posted By ColtRifle: I don’t think it’s a viable long term plan for smart people. The typical loser van life person (as opposed to the traveling, adventurous van life person) lives on social welfare and handouts…and maybe an occasional short term dead end job. Real survival takes community. You will need the skills of others. Others will need your skills (hence the reason to build skills). For example: I can fix things. My wife needs the services of a doctor. I fix the doctor’s car in exchange for him fixing my wife. There was a poster around here one time (can’t remember his name) who grew up in Russia or the Soviet Union (can’t remember the time frame). He said everyone developed a skill or skill set that enabled them to participate in the underground economy. He had some interesting insight on life in Russia. Wish he was still posting. The person with the degree in women’s studies will have to resort to the oldest profession if he/she doesn’t have any real skills. That’s why I believe firmly you should develop skills. I told my 16 yr old grandson to consider getting a job in HVAC. He doesn’t have to do it forever (but he’s not a good student in school so college is probably out). However, if he does it, he’ll learn plumbing, electrical, and HVAC skills. Even if he doesn’t keep at it, he’ll have a valuable skill set for life. I have 4 (of my 6) boys out of school. They have all dropped out of school at 15 and start working full time for the family business until they are about 20. They do some home study after 15, but it is not formalized. More self education on what they are interested in. At 18, they take their GED (really super simple to pass), and at least so far at least get their CDL. The older two (age 23 & 21) own and operate a tractor trailer engine rebuilding & inspection business, and they are weeks out with work. The newly married 19 year old (who married a great young lady), is managing part of our business and running equipment for local people. Just after he turned 18, he was permitted to take a track loader to Georgia (from PA) and stay for a week and a half volunteering for hurricane clean up. He was able to do that because he had been running that machine since he was 8 or 9 on the farm & I trusted him. Funny story, when he got there they stuck an older man in the machine and gave him a shovel unless there was something difficult like a tree on a roof - than he could run the machine. What I am trying to say is college may be necessary for some occupations, but a good work ethic will tend to success in all occupations. Any experiences he can get can benefit him later in life either by teaching him skills, or if nothing else, helping him find out what he does not want to do for an occupation. |
It's true no matter who you are, the worst thing you can do for someone is give them something for nothing. - 3rdpig
Do not handicap your children by making their lives easy. - Heinlein
Do not handicap your children by making their lives easy. - Heinlein
|
Originally Posted By thederrick106: Buying a house is absolutely not affordable for young adults starting life. Anyone that says otherwise is out of touch with reality. Anyone priced a new single wide lately? Thank God we bought our house and property over a decade ago because we would have a hard time affording it if we had to do it all over again right now even though we make a good bit more now than we did back then. While van life might look cool on YouTube after all the edits fuck that. I have a decent 20' camper without slide outs and while it's fun for a trip or adventure it would really suck if we had to fit everything, we wanted to keep in it and say that's what we live in from now on. Life in the camper would come to a freezing end in the winter once there was no more propane available. Even worse when the truck runs out of gas for relocation purposes. A house just down the road from us just sold two months ago for $ 135,000. Move in ready. Dated to be sure, but very livable. Plenty of decent jobs just a half an hour away. A young couple who are getting married in a few months bought it. It is in town. There are neighbors nearby. The lot is on the smaller side. But, it is an affordable house. Not fancy, but livable. Affordable housing may not be available everywhere, but there are still some homes available - you just have to move to where they are. This young couple was not from this immediate area, they are moving in. |
It's true no matter who you are, the worst thing you can do for someone is give them something for nothing. - 3rdpig
Do not handicap your children by making their lives easy. - Heinlein
Do not handicap your children by making their lives easy. - Heinlein
|
Originally Posted By lumper: A house just down the road from us just sold two months ago for $ 135,000. Move in ready. Dated to be sure, but very livable. Plenty of decent jobs just a half an hour away. A young couple who are getting married in a few months bought it. It is in town. There are neighbors nearby. The lot is on the smaller side. But, it is an affordable house. Not fancy, but livable. Affordable housing may not be available everywhere, but there are still some homes available - you just have to move to where they are. This young couple was not from this immediate area, they are moving in. $135k for a house seems soo cheap these days….. My nephew bought his first house this year, a 600 square foot house with issues in Caldwell, Idaho (far outer suburb of Boise area) in a very lower working class neighborhood for $194k….. He’s a kid working an HVAC job with a live in girlfriend….. The barriers to a comfortable middle class life are soo damned high now, I almost feel guilty for having it better than he did. |
Never make another person a priority when they merely see you as an option...
"Some People Are Like Slinkies. They're Not Really Good For Anything, But They Bring a Smile To Your Face When Pushed Down The Stairs."
"Some People Are Like Slinkies. They're Not Really Good For Anything, But They Bring a Smile To Your Face When Pushed Down The Stairs."
|
Originally Posted By lumper: I have 4 (of my 6) boys out of school. They have all dropped out of school at 15 and start working full time for the family business until they are about 20. They do some home study after 15, but it is not formalized. More self education on what they are interested in. At 18, they take their GED (really super simple to pass), and at least so far at least get their CDL. The older two (age 23 & 21) own and operate a tractor trailer engine rebuilding & inspection business, and they are weeks out with work. The newly married 19 year old (who married a great young lady), is managing part of our business and running equipment for local people. Just after he turned 18, he was permitted to take a track loader to Georgia (from PA) and stay for a week and a half volunteering for hurricane clean up. He was able to do that because he had been running that machine since he was 8 or 9 on the farm & I trusted him. Funny story, when he got there they stuck an older man in the machine and gave him a shovel unless there was something difficult like a tree on a roof - than he could run the machine. What I am trying to say is college may be necessary for some occupations, but a good work ethic will tend to success in all occupations. Any experiences he can get can benefit him later in life either by teaching him skills, or if nothing else, helping him find out what he does not want to do for an occupation. The only time I’ll recommend college to anyone is if they want a specific job that a degree is needed and offers good long term job prospects. Engineer, doctor, nurse, maybe teacher, etc. Don’t know what career you want? Do NOT go to college. Going to college to “figure out” what you want to do is incredibly stupid. Figure out what you want to do with your life and then determine if college is needed for your desired career path. My son in law is a bank vice president. Writes multi million dollar loans. Started as a teller in a different bank and worked on the side at McDonalds for extra income. Doesn’t have any college. Makes a shitload of money now and has no college debt. They are on their third house. Started small and worked up to a $600k house with inground pool. |
"It behooves every man to remember that the work of the critic is of altogether secondary importance, and that, in the end, progress is accomplished by the man who does things."
Theodore Roosevelt
Theodore Roosevelt
|
Originally Posted By TheOtherDave: $135k for a house seems soo cheap these days….. My nephew bought his first house this year, a 600 square foot house with issues in Caldwell, Idaho (far outer suburb of Boise area) in a very lower working class neighborhood for $194k….. He’s a kid working an HVAC job with a live in girlfriend….. The barriers to a comfortable middle class life are soo damned high now, I almost feel guilty for having it better than he did. High demand housing areas (like the Boise area) will always be expensive to buy in. There are plenty of livable places with decent jobs in the US with decent prices on housing. You just have to be willing to live there (not every place can be a highly desired area). You also have to be willing to live in a smaller and cheaper house. I bought my first house in 2003. It was a 950 sq ft 2BR/1BA house built in the 1950s. It needed remodeling work but was solid. It was perfect for me. I built sweat equity in that house and sold it for a profit about 5 years later (when I built a new house). I could do the same thing today if I was starting out. The problem is, young kids think their first house needs to be the same level of house their parents live in….after a lifetime of work. |
"It behooves every man to remember that the work of the critic is of altogether secondary importance, and that, in the end, progress is accomplished by the man who does things."
Theodore Roosevelt
Theodore Roosevelt
|
I agree, total political propaganda. I wish I could have paid $12,00 for my house like my dad did too, but with even more overtime than you can imagine my parents highest pay year was $40K both working. I paid five times more than that and was making double their income. I paid this house off with a 6% mortgage. I'm told "Oh man you had is easy." I reply, "Yeah, which branch of the service did you serve, what was your war, which college did you go to. and how many states have you lived in." My house now is five times what I paid for it. Life is survival and if you don't plan for it and work for it, you don't win. There is no free stuff. There's only consequences. You plan on the minimum, that's what you get. As for van life. and boondocking. I have a truck camper. Solar and generator, It's good for a week with all amenities of home. It's a great way to see the country and for that matter to travel with pets. Most the people you see in BLMs are like me. Adventure, not how we live all the time. I don't like campgrounds. Humble beginnings in life, to me it's like slumming at a trailer park. Now if you want to talk about people with good jobs, it's not vans. It's boats. It's very popular on the west coast. The cost is significantly lower than a house out there and quite honestly it's a good life too. A boater myself, I know many. I have a buddy on San Francisco bay, him and his wife is in a 35' Carver he actually bought in FL. He has a great place to park his car, puts his garage stuff in a self storage, and has a great restaurant and bar right there. Around here, it's house boats, kinda a trailer on water. When I was a kid on the Ohio River, it was boats too. That's where the alcoholics lived. Now they just sleep on the streets waiting for their free stuff. See the problem? |
"We prepare so we don't have to go to the Superdome!"
|
Originally Posted By lumper: A house just down the road from us just sold two months ago for $ 135,000. Move in ready. Dated to be sure, but very livable. Plenty of decent jobs just a half an hour away. A young couple who are getting married in a few months bought it. It is in town. There are neighbors nearby. The lot is on the smaller side. But, it is an affordable house. Not fancy, but livable. Affordable housing may not be available everywhere, but there are still some homes available - you just have to move to where they are. This young couple was not from this immediate area, they are moving in. Originally Posted By lumper: Originally Posted By thederrick106: Buying a house is absolutely not affordable for young adults starting life. Anyone that says otherwise is out of touch with reality. Anyone priced a new single wide lately? Thank God we bought our house and property over a decade ago because we would have a hard time affording it if we had to do it all over again right now even though we make a good bit more now than we did back then. While van life might look cool on YouTube after all the edits fuck that. I have a decent 20' camper without slide outs and while it's fun for a trip or adventure it would really suck if we had to fit everything, we wanted to keep in it and say that's what we live in from now on. Life in the camper would come to a freezing end in the winter once there was no more propane available. Even worse when the truck runs out of gas for relocation purposes. A house just down the road from us just sold two months ago for $ 135,000. Move in ready. Dated to be sure, but very livable. Plenty of decent jobs just a half an hour away. A young couple who are getting married in a few months bought it. It is in town. There are neighbors nearby. The lot is on the smaller side. But, it is an affordable house. Not fancy, but livable. Affordable housing may not be available everywhere, but there are still some homes available - you just have to move to where they are. This young couple was not from this immediate area, they are moving in. I am sure it's very location/ area dependent. Northern NY area which is pretty rural not far south of Canada and that price you listed won't even get you property let alone a decent double wide here. Maybe a well-used up single wide that needs a new roof in a trailer park? It's quite sad.  Back in the mid 2000s my wife and I first home was an almost new double wide on more than a dozen acres. No neighbors. Price was not much more than 100K. Same thing today is beyond double that. Most average wages are not double what they were in the mid 2000s... Sure, they are a lot more but not more than double. Oh well, not much any of us can do but keep on keeping on and be thankful we have what we have. |
Originally Posted By ar-jedi:
SO MUCH WIN IN ONE POST IT COULD CRASH ARFCOM !!!
SO MUCH WIN IN ONE POST IT COULD CRASH ARFCOM !!!
|
Getting my rural acreage and having the Amish put up a cabin for me was one of the smartest decisions I ever made. I had a well put in, did my own solar, about to put in septic-all cash on the barrel. I’m not a smart man when it comes to money but this along with being either debt free or kept to a minimum means that no matter what-SHTF, economic collapse before retirement etc. means that no matter what I have a place to Be. I started in 2007, I get chills thinking about how much it would cost today. |
Never make another person a priority when they merely see you as an option...
"Some People Are Like Slinkies. They're Not Really Good For Anything, But They Bring a Smile To Your Face When Pushed Down The Stairs."
"Some People Are Like Slinkies. They're Not Really Good For Anything, But They Bring a Smile To Your Face When Pushed Down The Stairs."
|
Originally Posted By TheOtherDave: Getting my rural acreage and having the Amish put up a cabin for me was one of the smartest decisions I ever made. I had a well put in, did my own solar, about to put in septic-all cash on the barrel. I’m not a smart man when it comes to money but this along with being either debt free or kept to a minimum means that no matter what-SHTF, economic collapse before retirement etc. means that no matter what I have a place to Be. I started in 2007, I get chills thinking about how much it would cost today. I don't know if you recall, but my brother did the exact same thing. It turned out amazingly well. He bought insulated fake logs and the Amish put it on for free, insulated the heck out of the inside. Finished off the inside with bead board which he put a shiny clear coat on it. Ordered and put in a through wall heat pump like in a hotel room. He just had an eye for detail and other than the shell did it all himself. He just had an eye for detail and did what he could when he could afford it on a retirement income. Biggest expense he had was the septic system. A northern state it was one of those my cousin things and despite only a loft one bedroom, they made him put in a system for an entire family. It took him about three years but wow what a result. He sold it for about twice what he had financially in it including the five acres, move to TN, bought a 3 bdr two garage, and that's worth $270K now. Finished he had $55k in it. There's a retired couple living in the cabin now. His goal was to make it so he could sell it as a house not an outbuilding which was a big deal in that over regulated area. That was a PITA. |
"We prepare so we don't have to go to the Superdome!"