Posted: 5/14/2026 4:02:57 PM EDT
[Last Edit: johnh57][Edited]
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I've been watching various 'tube videos on top dressing lawns to deal with ruts. I have ruts - mostly from 30 years of following mostly the same mowing pattern. Top dressing sounds ideal - but. I think we have about 30k sf of actual lawn. I can probably get masons sand (dry is doubtful), but dry and screened topsoil sounds next to impossible. The volumes seem unmanageable for a guy with no equipment bigger than a wheelbarrow. One video suggested figuring 1/2" over total square feet - that's about 60 tons of dry sand. As I understand it - basically, scalp lawn, thatch lawn (that ought to be fun), maybe aerate lawn, spread and level sand, topsoil or sand and topsoil, fertilize, maybe seed. Ruts are a pain trying to mow the lawn -but good lord the work required to do top dressing seems nearly impossible. I don't think I've ever heard of anyone doing this around here. |
| I did that last year. 6 yards of topsoil, compost and a little sand. Shoveled and spread with my little John Deere pull behind cart. I built a 5 foot drag to level. Then overseeded. Turned out really nice, but it was a ton of work. I think it depends on your soil. I have slightly sandy soil here, so I did mostly topsoil and compost. A lot of people use sand or sand topsoil mix. It will look horrible for a couple of weeks and you will wonder what they hell you did, then it starts to look great. |
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if your calculations are coming up with that kind of volume to top dress you might want to consider something like renting a skid steer with a tiller and just going to town in the fall then re seeding it. idk about where you live but a skid steer with a tiller is like $400 a day here 60 tons is 3 tri axle loads plus don't you need to mix the sand 50/50 with soil? It would take you an eternity to move 6 truck loads of material with a shovel and a wheel barrow |
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Have you done this yet? I might suggest a component of compost if you can find any in bulk that you trust. Topdressing with compost is a thing we do for sports fields that really REALLY helps the soil. The thing I would NOT do is use ONLY sand because you can end up with layers of sand and thatch and that's a bad problem to have. Yes golf courses do it but they manage their turf differently, intensively, and most regular folks don't want to take that on. |
Nobody ever wakes me at 2 in the morning telling me that my grass is out on the highway.~~Radiopat
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei
Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei
Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe
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No, I have not done anything yet. I think i'm going to need something close to 60 tons of 'whatever'. I'm not inclined to using 100% sand, but I can see using some sand. But that adds another layer of difficulty - mixing the stuff into a final product. I think I'll end up having to: rent a thatcher for a couple days. Rent a skid steer and a leveling platform (if available for rent locally), for a week. Have dry topsoil delivered 10 yards at a time, place it, spread it, order another 10 yards. Its a big project and I'm not sure its worth dealing with. |
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Originally Posted By johnh57: No, I have not done anything yet. I think i'm going to need something close to 60 tons of 'whatever'. I'm not inclined to using 100% sand, but I can see using some sand. But that adds another layer of difficulty - mixing the stuff into a final product. I think I'll end up having to: rent a thatcher for a couple days. Rent a skid steer and a leveling platform (if available for rent locally), for a week. Have dry topsoil delivered 10 yards at a time, place it, spread it, order another 10 yards. Its a big project and I'm not sure its worth dealing with. Playing devil's advocate just a bit. Do you KNOW that you have ACTUAL thatch? I don't know if I still have my demo photos for how to tell if it's actually thatch you're looking at. I will look. You may know and forgive me if I'm telling you stuff you already know about. Most people who don't do this for a living don't know and I kind of go there but that may not be right for you.  I realize you may want to take that step anyway to get the soil/sand/compost/whatever to lie as close to the present ground as possible, AND maybe to thin out the grass you have. I tend to be more inclined to aeration because most people have compacted soil, so either way you have a lot of stuff to deal with for certain. |
Nobody ever wakes me at 2 in the morning telling me that my grass is out on the highway.~~Radiopat
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei
Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei
Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe
| When I did my last lawn, 1/2 acre of Bermuda I did the following. Called local places and found a company who mixed sand, topsoil, peat, etc a top dressing mixture. I rented a skid steer. Dropped buckets all over lawn, back dragged them in. Ran a section of expanded metal screed as a leveler. I did aerate first a couple weeks before. Neighbor thought I ruined my nice lawn. Water a few times a week and fertilizer kicked in. No longer own that home, but lawn still looks good. |
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Originally Posted By Kitties-with-Sigs: Playing devil's advocate just a bit. Do you KNOW that you have ACTUAL thatch? I don't know if I still have my demo photos for how to tell if it's actually thatch you're looking at. I will look. You may know and forgive me if I'm telling you stuff you already know about. Most people who don't do this for a living don't know and I kind of go there but that may not be right for you. I realize you may want to take that step anyway to get the soil/sand/compost/whatever to lie as close to the present ground as possible, AND maybe to thin out the grass you have. I tend to be more inclined to aeration because most people have compacted soil, so either way you have a lot of stuff to deal with for certain. I don't feed it often, and we quit using weed control after most of our dogs died of one form of cancer or another and the 3 or 4 applications a year got to be rather pricey. I spot spray some of the weeds when I notice them (black medic, Canadian thistle being the worst offenders). Have dandelions of course and some clover. A few patches of a rougher grass that I think is quackgrass. |
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Originally Posted By Badlatitude: if your calculations are coming up with that kind of volume to top dress you might want to consider something like renting a skid steer with a tiller and just going to town in the fall then re seeding it. idk about where you live but a skid steer with a tiller is like $400 a day here 60 tons is 3 tri axle loads plus don't you need to mix the sand 50/50 with soil? It would take you an eternity to move 6 truck loads of material with a shovel and a wheel barrow This. Consider power raking, then seed and fertilizer. |
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Originally Posted By johnh57: No, I dont know if there is enough thatch to worry about - from what I've read though you really want the top dressing to get down to existing soil level. Our lawn is usually cut at 3-1/2" and is mostly fescue, rye (i think), maybe some blue in it. We've been here since 1993 - and it has never been thatched. Its been aerated once or twice if I recall correctly (i remember doing it once for sure, i think i did it another time but i'm not positive). It's mowed with a zero turn mower with a mulching kit on it. I don't feed it often, and we quit using weed control after most of our dogs died of one form of cancer or another and the 3 or 4 applications a year got to be rather pricey. I spot spray some of the weeds when I notice them (black medic, Canadian thistle being the worst offenders). Have dandelions of course and some clover. A few patches of a rougher grass that I think is quackgrass. Editing to say: This got long and that's sort of normal for me but I may have gotten confusing because moving fast. Please say so if it doesn't make sense. For my customers, any heavy equipment was a last resort for me. (I consider the skid steer heavy. I don't consider the ride-on aerator heavy, if that helps you get how I think.) I take this position because compaction is one of the worst enemies of any soil if what you want to do is grow stuff, grass included. Deep roots and good percolation depend on having pathways through the soil. (I'm not talking about sand here. I can't speak much to soil management is heavy sand areas. I know the basics but I don't have the years of experience to back it up.) * You do want the top dressing to be against the soil. You do NOT want layers. My greatest successes in reseeding and healing things like ruts or bare patches were: 1-mowing low (not scalping into the crown of the grass. That's for Bermuda. You are growing cool-season grasses from what I understood re-reading your thread. You don't scalp cool season grasses as a rule.) 2-dethatching and dethatching hard. Make several passes til your grass looks like garbage. THEN AERATE. PUNCH MORE HOLES THAN YOU'VE EVER THOUGHT YOU COULD PUNCH. Length, width, diagonal at least two ways. Punch holes. EDITED TO ADD: I would rent a stand-on aerator for this. It will make you dance in little circles (did I say that already?) 3-rolling on a light layer of compost and this means filling any holes with a soil/compost mix. That's what I would do with your ruts. If you feel like you need to add sand, that's fine too. I never did that but I never had a need to do that. I bought a roller (spreader) from one of the DIY youtube grass guys before the rollers were readily available in the industry. I loaded the roller and rolled on the compost. The soil I spread with a homemade drag I had welded together and I pulled it behind my zero turn. MOSTLY I used compost because it's so damn good for the soil and the grass. 4-Reseed with my desired grass. NOTE: If you're not going to reseed, you need to be very careful with your dethatching. Chopping up the grass and opening the soil to the elements will bring WEEDS and a LOT OF WEEDS. Did I say weeds? In case I didn't, this will bring WEEDS.  5-If you're going to reseed, this is not a summer project. *I have to go back and look at where you are cuz my brain is getting smoother as the years go by* NOTE: I would not put compost down before I put down seed. So I'm going at two different things here. Soil yes. Compost? no. 6-Use a liquid feed with humic acid in it. Non toxic. Will turn your dogs brown if they roll in it but it will do amazing things for your soil. Feed the soil. The soil will feed your grass. 7-Water. Water. Water till the seed comes up or until your grass takes off. It's work, but not as much work as it sounds like if you don't spread soil and sand over the whole yard. Still, I no longer do this for people because I'm to the point where the heavier work in my industry is too much on a daily basis. My customers had the best lawns in their neighborhoods and I had a waiting list for others because of this process and because of magic juice I sprayed on shallow soils, compacted places, and bare spots where nobody else could get thick grass to grow. I'll tell you the magic juice if you want to know. I'll put it in an IM so I am not perceived to be representing any company. 8-Quit mowing in the same ruts.  Change the mowing direction every time you mow. 9-Mow high so your grass has a chance. 10-You may already know this, but in case other people don't, when you run the trimmer, don't trim the grass any shorter THERE than the rest of the grass. Cuz ugly and cuz weeds. There should be a little "stack"--a little wall of grass beside your sidewalk, unless it's a lot higher than the ground in your lawn. You didn't ask about most of that but I can't shut up about this particular subject. Y'all are shocked, I'm sure.  I'll probably think of something else and be editing this post for the next three hours. ETA: I kinda feel like you need to put the soil/sand only in the ruts. Dethatch now and maybe top dress with a little compost but why do you think you need to do the whole yard? If you're going to reseed, aerate and seed in the fall. |
Nobody ever wakes me at 2 in the morning telling me that my grass is out on the highway.~~Radiopat
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei
Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei
Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe
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Originally Posted By johnh57: Thank you kitties! A lot of information there to unpack and understand. Yah I might have had a glass of wine at that point. Just holler about what makes no sense. |
Nobody ever wakes me at 2 in the morning telling me that my grass is out on the highway.~~Radiopat
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei
Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei
Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe