Posted: 10/4/2025 8:55:24 AM EDT
|
Rebuilding a lot of our homestead infrastructure from Helene. As we re-work garden areas considering buying some bulk amendments and adding them in. Was thinking a couple dump truck loads of chicken manure and perhaps some wood chips (lighter on the wood chips), then using a disc harrow to work them in. Probably follow with a cover crop like a mix of rye and crimson clover. That particular plot isn't needed immediately, so if the wood chips take a while to decay so be it. This will all be directly applied to a 1/2 acre 'ish area, not composted or anything like that. The soil was lightly limed with dolomitic lime recently. Hasn't been used for growing crops in roughly 5 years. Thoughts?? |
www.jrhenterprises.com
Over 30 Years in business- Thank you for your business!
Quickest ways to contact us-
912.375.1480
[email protected]
Over 30 Years in business- Thank you for your business!
Quickest ways to contact us-
912.375.1480
[email protected]
|
Not a farmer. I started a new plot for garden. Burned brush, leaves, etc to get potash into soil. Then do your litter and wood chips. I’ve found burning on it helps. Just my 2¢. |
"F*ck it I'm done. Nothing to say other than I'm done giving a f*ck." - xerxes2695 - 1-6-2021 - 1849hrs.
“If you live here and your allegiance is to another nation, you are an enemy.” - C10 - 6-7-25 - 1816hrs
“If you live here and your allegiance is to another nation, you are an enemy.” - C10 - 6-7-25 - 1816hrs
|
Burned a huge pile of pines destroyed in the hurricane in this plot early this year, spread most of residual on the rest of the plot. Definitely wouldn't say it was evenly distributed, but spread out. We heat solely with wood, so normal wood ashes goes in the garden areas also, just isn't that big of a quantity. The smaller more used garden area is where most of that goes along with all the rabbit and chicken manure from our animals. This larger area would require outside inputs. |
www.jrhenterprises.com
Over 30 Years in business- Thank you for your business!
Quickest ways to contact us-
912.375.1480
[email protected]
Over 30 Years in business- Thank you for your business!
Quickest ways to contact us-
912.375.1480
[email protected]
|
Get some soil tests done for that particular piece of ground. It'll tell you how much manure you can spread per acre without it hurting anything. ETA: Look for a local Agricultural Extension, co-op, College to get the samples evaluated. Not sure where you're from, but around here there's plenty of places to ask for help on this. |
"You can't hang yourself, if you ain't got enough rope"
Larry Fleet
"There comes a point where we are no longer drawing lines in the sand but are backed against a precipice."
Orracle
Larry Fleet
"There comes a point where we are no longer drawing lines in the sand but are backed against a precipice."
Orracle
|
Originally Posted By IH1026: Get some soil tests done for that particular piece of ground. It'll tell you how much manure you can spread per acre without it hurting anything. ETA: Look for a local Agricultural Extension, co-op, College to get the samples evaluated. Not sure where you're from, but around here there's plenty of places to ask for help on this. It's been a few years since I had a test on that area, but the soil has been largely resting. I usually did any recommended amendments right after I got a test back. Will do again also. |
www.jrhenterprises.com
Over 30 Years in business- Thank you for your business!
Quickest ways to contact us-
912.375.1480
[email protected]
Over 30 Years in business- Thank you for your business!
Quickest ways to contact us-
912.375.1480
[email protected]
Born with a low tolerance for bullshit
Joined:
Feb 2007
Posts:
53275
EE: 0% (0)
KY, USA
|
One question: What is growing there now? Editing: I see you're gonna grow cover crops. The trouble is that chicken manure is very hot and will burn your cover crop, unless the manure is composted. Maybe yours is?  ETA2: So did the storm take the soil down to subsoil? Like did it take ALL the topsoil and/or deposit pebbly crap everywhere? I've seen some footage of the devastation but I haven't walked the damaged land. Saw Justin Rhoades (I'm sure that's spelled wrong) working on rebuilding his, but some got hit worse than he did. Are you on hills? or flatland? |
Nobody ever wakes me at 2 in the morning telling me that my grass is out on the highway.~~Radiopat
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei
Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei
Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe
|
No damage to soil from storm. Wasn't planning on immediately cover cropping. Not sure if/how this will be different than when I apply chicken manure from our chickens literally right next to plants, but I know from doing that for 2 1/2 decades the burning is a little exaggerated. Might be completely different with commercial manure, don't know. But they say the same thing about rabbit manure and ours literally gets side dressed right to plants and never an issue. Pretty much all of our composting is either putting manures right next to plants themselves or putting them on soils and tilling not long after. But there's never been a long (like a year) wait for them to break down. I haven't seen where that's hurt us= but we may just have really piss poor soil also??? |
www.jrhenterprises.com
Over 30 Years in business- Thank you for your business!
Quickest ways to contact us-
912.375.1480
[email protected]
Over 30 Years in business- Thank you for your business!
Quickest ways to contact us-
912.375.1480
[email protected]
|
Originally Posted By Lowdown3: No damage to soil from storm. Wasn't planning on immediately cover cropping. Not sure if/how this will be different than when I apply chicken manure from our chickens literally right next to plants, but I know from doing that for 2 1/2 decades the burning is a little exaggerated. Might be completely different with commercial manure, don't know. But they say the same thing about rabbit manure and ours literally gets side dressed right to plants and never an issue. Pretty much all of our composting is either putting manures right next to plants themselves or putting them on soils and tilling not long after. But there's never been a long (like a year) wait for them to break down. I haven't seen where that's hurt us= but we may just have really piss poor soil also??? Chicken manure breaks down pretty quick in the soil. A farm near me uses tons of it every spring in their corn field (smells wonderful  ), it is still hot when he discs it in but the corn comes up in it just fine without burning. Tender plants like lettuces or maybe even small plant seedling might not like it on the foliage but in the ground adjacent to it has never been a problem for me either.
|
Life's battles don't always go to the stronger or faster man. In the end, the one who wins is the one who thinks he can! - SCI, NRA
Team Ranstad
Team Ranstad
Born with a low tolerance for bullshit
Joined:
Feb 2007
Posts:
53288
EE: 0% (0)
KY, USA
|
Originally Posted By Lowdown3: No damage to soil from storm. Wasn't planning on immediately cover cropping. Not sure if/how this will be different than when I apply chicken manure from our chickens literally right next to plants, but I know from doing that for 2 1/2 decades the burning is a little exaggerated. Might be completely different with commercial manure, don't know. But they say the same thing about rabbit manure and ours literally gets side dressed right to plants and never an issue. Pretty much all of our composting is either putting manures right next to plants themselves or putting them on soils and tilling not long after. But there's never been a long (like a year) wait for them to break down. I haven't seen where that's hurt us= but we may just have really piss poor soil also??? Don't know your soil of course. My understanding comes from working on experiments in grad school. The chicken manure was the hottest of all we tried. It's been 30 years so don't ask me for a lot of details cuz I don't remember.  However the image of the shriveled, yellow, dying plants made an impression for certain. The thing is, it ALWAYS depends. Depends on a lot of factors. Yes on what the chickens eat, MAYBE. You probably are not putting on enough quantity, on particularly sensitive plants, piling it in pots (our experiments were in pots cuz that's the only way to get complete control of all the factors involved) etc etc. Experiments are only as good as they are. We proved which manure was hottest, and that it can indeed destroy/stunt/otherwise harm desirable plants. IF I remember right, we used peppers but don't hold me to that. I was just the assistant. My graduate advisor was the scientist running it. It's useful for knowing that composted is better and that attention needs to be paid, and maybe figuring out what went wrong if somebody overdoes something. Beyond that, it's information on paper. I may have already said this, but a cover crop is always, ALWAYS the best soil building tool anybody can use. Grasses if they will work, cuz they (generally) grow deeper roots, but any cover crop helps the soil. Worst enemies of soil are water runoff, wind erosion, and the sun baking the bare ground. Its really hard on the soil microbe population and leaves the soil depleted in more ways than I could type in many pages. Yes, our forefathers let ground lie fallow. Now we know some things they didn't. Only in the past handful of years has the importance of covering the soil been revealed. I know from painful, personal experience what happens to a garden/crop plot that's left fallow for many winters straight. The decomposition of the roots of any crop create carbon and increase the organic matter component of the soil. It's powerful soil building. I love the idea of putting down the manure on your plot, then incorporating it in the top few inches. If you've already put down lime, and you think it's broken down, don't go too deep unless you plan to lime again. You want that lime in the root zone for when you do grow. If you don't plan to cover crop this fall, I think I would incorporate the manure, dump the wood chips on top and let them sit there as mulch. Hold in moisture and keep the sun off the soil like a mulch. Then when it's time to plant, turn them in a bit, sow the seed/plant and plan on adding extra N to make up for the microbes eating the wood. Wood chips are okay if we know what we're doing. We just have to plan around it and make up for what they do. My strongest advice is to cover that soil. Always. If you put the manure on now and incorporate it, then add the wood chips and plan to plant, say, in the spring, I would pull a soil test maybe in Feb or March. A few weeks before you plan to plant. Be sure you take ALL of the wood chips out of your soil samples you are sending to the lab. That should give enough time for the manure to break down so the N isn't through the roof on your test. (Although tests generally ignore the N, assuming it's going to leach anyhow). I do agree with the others who say it's important to test if you haven't done that in a few years. |
Nobody ever wakes me at 2 in the morning telling me that my grass is out on the highway.~~Radiopat
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei
Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei
Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe
Born with a low tolerance for bullshit
Joined:
Feb 2007
Posts:
53289
EE: 0% (0)
KY, USA
|
Originally Posted By TinSpinner: Chicken manure breaks down pretty quick in the soil. A farm near me uses tons of it every spring in their corn field (smells wonderful ), it is still hot when he discs it in but the corn comes up in it just fine without burning. Tender plants like lettuces or maybe even small plant seedling might not like it on the foliage but in the ground adjacent to it has never been a problem for me either.Are they spraying it as a liquid or spreading it as chunky powder? Lord that stuff stinks so bad. The farmer that has the fields all around us did that for a few years here. It was an awful month when he was spreading litter. The piles were stored about half-a-mile from our house and when the wind came from there it was horrible. What he uses is composted though so they don't have to worry. They can plant directly in it. |
Nobody ever wakes me at 2 in the morning telling me that my grass is out on the highway.~~Radiopat
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei
Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei
Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe
|
Originally Posted By Kitties-with-Sigs: Are they spraying it as a liquid or spreading it as chunky powder? Lord that stuff stinks so bad. The farmer that has the fields all around us did that for a few years here. It was an awful month when he was spreading litter. The piles were stored about half-a-mile from our house and when the wind came from there it was horrible. What he uses is composted though so they don't have to worry. They can plant directly in it. Originally Posted By Kitties-with-Sigs: Originally Posted By TinSpinner: Chicken manure breaks down pretty quick in the soil. A farm near me uses tons of it every spring in their corn field (smells wonderful ), it is still hot when he discs it in but the corn comes up in it just fine without burning. Tender plants like lettuces or maybe even small plant seedling might not like it on the foliage but in the ground adjacent to it has never been a problem for me either.Are they spraying it as a liquid or spreading it as chunky powder? Lord that stuff stinks so bad. The farmer that has the fields all around us did that for a few years here. It was an awful month when he was spreading litter. The piles were stored about half-a-mile from our house and when the wind came from there it was horrible. What he uses is composted though so they don't have to worry. They can plant directly in it. It appears to be partially composted complete with the wood shavings and whatever else was on the floor of the chicken house, maybe a few dead chickens.
|
Life's battles don't always go to the stronger or faster man. In the end, the one who wins is the one who thinks he can! - SCI, NRA
Team Ranstad
Team Ranstad
|
I guess this is a good place to ask. My yard is mostly hard ass clay, we've been slowly trying to rehab it with our pigs and chickens but there are still ton of lumpy areas and bare hard ass areas. a few years ago I put the tines down on the box blade roughly 6" and ran all over the yard trying to bust it all up. I can overseed in the spring and get a halfway decent yard for the season but it's already browning and exposing large areas of just dirt. I have a 45h tractor, I have 'unlimited' woodchips. Is there a peice of equipment I can find that will help me level, break up and 'mix' the soil with woodchips? I'll probably do it in 1/2 acre sections at a time. My chicken litter source is gone, but I can get horse manure. |
Born with a low tolerance for bullshit
Joined:
Feb 2007
Posts:
53298
EE: 0% (0)
KY, USA
|
Originally Posted By TinSpinner: It appears to be partially composted complete with the wood shavings and whatever else was on the floor of the chicken house, maybe a few dead chickens. Yeah, it's SO gross. Our local farmer has quit using it. I'm not sorry. |
Nobody ever wakes me at 2 in the morning telling me that my grass is out on the highway.~~Radiopat
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei
Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei
Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe
|
No dairies around here any more so cow manure is even harder to find. I used to drive 100 miles one way to pick up truck and trailer loads of cow manure, but I just don't have the time for that any more. |
www.jrhenterprises.com
Over 30 Years in business- Thank you for your business!
Quickest ways to contact us-
912.375.1480
[email protected]
Over 30 Years in business- Thank you for your business!
Quickest ways to contact us-
912.375.1480
[email protected]
|
Start by soil test first. Unworked ground around here needs roughly 2 ton of lime per acre. This can take several months to have an effect on your PH. If your PH is off plants will not properly uptake nutrients. You can put all the fert and crap down you want and it will do nothing. Test soil correct PH Correct soil composition and add nutrients Also by taking your samples (yes you need several to map the plot). They can tailor fertilizer to your actual needs. You might apply one that will act quickly to get the numbers right then a second that will be slow release to come it later without having to go back in and top dress. |
| Too much manure can be bad. Unless you wait a year or so. Find out what the chickens were eating. Food treated with glyphosate and you can’t grow tomatoes for three years. Most manure is high in nitrogen which can burn plant roots. |
17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
Born with a low tolerance for bullshit
Joined:
Feb 2007
Posts:
53319
EE: 0% (0)
KY, USA
|
Originally Posted By billth777: I guess this is a good place to ask. My yard is mostly hard ass clay, we've been slowly trying to rehab it with our pigs and chickens but there are still ton of lumpy areas and bare hard ass areas. a few years ago I put the tines down on the box blade roughly 6" and ran all over the yard trying to bust it all up. I can overseed in the spring and get a halfway decent yard for the season but it's already browning and exposing large areas of just dirt. I have a 45h tractor, I have 'unlimited' woodchips. Is there a peice of equipment I can find that will help me level, break up and 'mix' the soil with woodchips? I'll probably do it in 1/2 acre sections at a time. My chicken litter source is gone, but I can get horse manure. 1-You need a soil test. Not one you buy at Walmart or the farm store. At minimum, you need one from your County Ag agent. Better, get one from either Ward labs or (my pick) Spectrum Analytic. Get the full test. It's like $40 I think. It's worth it. Tell them what you are trying to grow. (I assume, since it's Georgia, you are trying to grow Bermudagrass.) 2-There are some forms of fertilizers that cause clay particles to cling more tightly together and others that help it break up. A soil test is necessary first, and we can help you know which forms of lime and NPK are better for your situation. 3-Adding organic matter is the way. You need to top dress with compost once a year at minimum. Twice is better. If I had wood chips like you, I would compost those and buy already broken-down compost now. You don't have a lot of soil biology to break it down, which means it will lay there and take forever to break up, even if you incorporate it, though incorporating that is better than nothing for certain. If I had to incorporate chips, I would spread them on the lawn and use the box blade to till them in. HOWEVER, every time you run over that lawn with the tractor, you are compacting your soil and making the situation worse, so you have to balance what's the better way to go. 4--there is a product called humic acid. If you were my customer, I would be applying it to your yard (you can use one of those $10 hose-end sprayers) every two or three months at least at first. 5-Rent a professional aerator in the spring before you overseed. GEt the ride-on machine if you can. (Stinger makes an incredible machine, though I don't know if they sell to rental places. Exmark is the second best I have used.) The walk-behind machines beat the crap out of you. The ride-on machines will make you dance in little circles. Don't just go back and forth. Make 20 passes vertically, horizontally and diagonally. If you hire it done, tell them you will pay extra for them to basically plow your yard with that aerator. Doing it yourself is better because you care more than most people you would pay to do it. (There are some, like me, who take pride in growing good grass but not many.) Make it look like there is not one-inch of your yard that hasn't had a plug pulled out of it. I wish the lawn care thread hadn't gone to archive. There was a lot of good information in there. It's my fault. I've been AWOL and didn't keep up with it. 6-Once you have done this for a couple of seasons, there is another product I will recommend to you to spray on your lawn that may help break it up. But first, use the mechanical means, and topdress. Ifyou can get the grass growing in it, we can help the grass to be strong enough to break up the clay. Grass roots are the best soil improvers on earth. You can help your lawn. Don't give up. |
Nobody ever wakes me at 2 in the morning telling me that my grass is out on the highway.~~Radiopat
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei
Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei
Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe
|
Originally Posted By Kitties-with-Sigs: 6-Once you have done this for a couple of seasons, there is another product I will recommend to you to spray on your lawn that may help break it up. But first, use the mechanical means, and topdress. Ifyou can get the grass growing in it, we can help the grass to be strong enough to break up the clay. Grass roots are the best soil improvers on earth. You can help your lawn. Don't give up. Other than a few bare areas grass grows fine. My goal is to get a good pasture mix going. This spring and fall I put down a blend of "deer pasture" mix, as well as 50 lbs of white clover, 50 lbs of crimson, 5 lbs of radish and about 10 lbs of various whatever I had that could throw out, think mint and random flowers. |
Born with a low tolerance for bullshit
Joined:
Feb 2007
Posts:
53323
EE: 0% (0)
KY, USA
|
How did the mix do? Did all the parts come up as expected? I follow a girl out west who's having trouble getting a horse forage mix to grow, but was able to get a "dry land mix" to grow. I don't know what all is in her dry land mix. I'm always interested in finding grasses that do well without a lot of babying, and learning what conditions each one needs. |
Nobody ever wakes me at 2 in the morning telling me that my grass is out on the highway.~~Radiopat
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei
Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe
Wine is sunlight held together by water~~Galileo Galilei
Well-behaved women rarely make history~~Marilyn Monroe
|
Originally Posted By Orion_Shall_Rise: soil fertility is all math. 'dumptruck' is not a useful unit of measure you need a soil test, a manure test and math to determine the number of tons, cubic yards, or bushels per acre or 1000 sq ft you should apply. over applying nutrient can really hurt crops This. Send samples off first. Then go from there. Otherwise, its just shooting blind. |
Never confuse faith that you will prevail in the end—which you can never afford to lose—with the discipline to confront the most brutal facts of your current reality, whatever they might be. - Adm James Stockdale
|
Originally Posted By 1Andy2: This. Send samples off first. Then go from there. Otherwise, its just shooting blind. Yep. We did this recently on a timbered & grubbed patch. Took 8 tons of lime and the neighbor has spread 15 loads of cow manure. Without a test it’s a shot in the dark & iirc they are free in many states. I have heard of people spreading wood chips on their land instead of manure. We usually only do that on our gardens.. but if I had a manure spreader I’d probably give it a go. |