Finally started reading Gorden West's Technician Class 2026-2030 - now reading ARRL's Tech manual (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 9/3/2026 2:16:13 AM EDT
[Last Edit: backbencher][Edited]
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I had some complaints about undefined acronyms in Chapter 1, & called him. He rang back while I was typing up an email to him. Turns out he's prior Army, told him about my brief experience at a Navy base Ham club. The book is of course godawful. Starting w/ Chapter 4, it gives you the FCC question, the possible answers, you're supposed to guess, then he gives you the explanation, then the answer. I can think of no other field of human endeavor that teaches their discipline this way. I have looked for an actual Amateur Radio manual that teaches the subject for years, but every book I find "Teaches the FCC test!" It's a fucking garbage way to learn and I despise every Ham Study book author who writes this way. ETA: To be clear, Mr West is likely one of the nicest people you'll ever talk to, and if you call his office, he will call you back. And if you don't like his manual, he'll recommend another. I am currently reading the ARRL's current Technician manual at Mr West's recommendation. See below for my progress. |
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If you want a manual for "amateur radio" instead of test prep, you'll have a set of encyclopedias. Everyone uses test prep that addresses the test subjects and questions. Of course you're free to read up on any aspect of things that you like, there are resources for almost any niche you can imagine. The ARRL books are in a little different style than Gordon Wests stuff, there are online study options also. You're also free to read the book you have in whatever order you like. It's pretty easy to skip past the multiple choice question and go right to the explanation first if you want that. |
This is...a clue - Pat_Rogers
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I'm not adequately aluminumized for this thread. - gonzo_beyondo
CO, MI, OR - Please lobby your legislators to end discrimination against non-resident CCW permit holders
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Originally Posted By SteelonSteel: My issues was many of the questions and answers don’t really explain the theory or the whys, they just list the answer. Iirc the ARRL test prep manual had citations that you could chase down elsewhere. Yep, at some point Amateur Radio became about passing the test, rather than learning the material. It's incredibly annoying & another form of gatekeeping. "The learning starts when you pass the test." If you'd put out a proper manual, the learning could start before taking the test. |
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Originally Posted By Gamma762: If you want a manual for "amateur radio" instead of test prep, you'll have a set of encyclopedias. Everyone uses test prep that addresses the test subjects and questions. Of course you're free to read up on any aspect of things that you like, there are resources for almost any niche you can imagine. The ARRL books are in a little different style than Gordon Wests stuff, there are online study options also. You're also free to read the book you have in whatever order you like. It's pretty easy to skip past the multiple choice question and go right to the explanation first if you want that. No, you can't, as the question gives the context for the answer, it's just a completely bass-ackwards way of learning. I've heard the encyclopedia excuse before, and it's completely false. You can write a manual that covers theory, law, regulation, & practice for technicians that completely prepares them for the test with no test questions in it. But then learning would occur before the test, and the gatekeepers can't have that. |
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Originally Posted By backbencher: Yep, at some point Amateur Radio became about passing the test, rather than learning the material. It's incredibly annoying & another form of gatekeeping. "The learning starts when you pass the test." If you'd put out a proper manual, the learning could start before taking the test. Originally Posted By backbencher: Originally Posted By SteelonSteel: My issues was many of the questions and answers don’t really explain the theory or the whys, they just list the answer. Iirc the ARRL test prep manual had citations that you could chase down elsewhere. Yep, at some point Amateur Radio became about passing the test, rather than learning the material. It's incredibly annoying & another form of gatekeeping. "The learning starts when you pass the test." If you'd put out a proper manual, the learning could start before taking the test. About midstream I gave in to learning the test because the ARRL manual just didn’t have shit and the links were not much better. I learn best in a classroom and can absorb the theory better because you can ask questions, or learn from other’s questions who are thinking more than I can. Edit….a lot of the guys doing the classes these days really don’t know more than the book. When I see them answer “It just is” as an explanation then I know they probably don’t know anything more than the test book. I get not going in the weeds due to time constraints but that is my impression. That said I appreciate at least they’re doing that much to get interested parties tested. I did acquire an Extra rating but I am an appliance operator. I am ok on antenna building, coax make up, soldering etc. As far as under the hood, not so much on the tiny board circuits of modern equipment. I had all I could do to solder on a tiny RC airplane receiver radio board. The board was the size of a medium postage stamp and the “chips” were smaller than 2mm square. All I had to do was tack on a power lead but I was sweating that I would overheat the board. No idea why they sell it with the power lead not on it. Soldering coax is a piece of cake. I shake too much at my age for the tiny stuff. |
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Originally Posted By SteelonSteel: About midstream I gave in to learning the test because the ARRL manual just didn’t have shit and the links were not much better. I learn best in a classroom and can absorb the theory better because you can ask questions, or learn from other’s questions who are thinking more than I can. Edit….a lot of the guys doing the classes these days really don’t know more than the book. When I see them answer “It just is” as an explanation then I know they probably don’t know anything more than the test book. I get not going in the weeds due to time constraints but that is my impression. That said I appreciate at least they’re doing that much to get interested parties tested. I did acquire an Extra rating but I am an appliance operator. I am ok on antenna building, coax make up, soldering etc. As far as under the hood, not so much on the tiny board circuits of modern equipment. I had all I could do to solder on a tiny RC airplane receiver radio board. The board was the size of a medium postage stamp and the “chips” were smaller than 2mm square. All I had to do was tack on a power lead but I was sweating that I would overheat the board. No idea why they sell it with the power lead not on it. Soldering coax is a piece of cake. I shake too much at my age for the tiny stuff. Hand me a soldering iron, and my hands start shaking like a dog shitting a peach pit.  I looked at the test as a license to learn. It gave me the call sign to allow me to start the experimentation. There is no way to study for a test that would give complete knowledge of all aspects of ham radio. |
World ain't what it seems, is it Gunny?
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Originally Posted By backbencher: Yep, at some point Amateur Radio became about passing the test, rather than learning the material. It's incredibly annoying & another form of gatekeeping. "The learning starts when you pass the test." If you'd put out a proper manual, the learning could start before taking the test. You're not wrong in the opinions you've voiced. It sounds like you want to fully understand everything before you take any of the exams. That is all well and good, and you can certainly proceed as you wish. The ARRL offers many books that you might enjoy, from which you may build your knowledge. I will suggest that you consider what I think of as a more pragmatic approach, and that is to hold your nose and study to past the test(s) in order to get your license and then continue to build your knowledge. I say this because there are so many aspects to amateur radio that you will likely spend years learning before you consider yourself truly knowledgeable, and you could be enjoying radio operation as you do that. My suggested method for passing the exams is here. I think you should attempt Technician and General right off the bat. No real point in stopping at Technician. |
Don't confuse where I live with where I'm from.
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Originally Posted By Emoto: You're not wrong in the opinions you've voiced. It sounds like you want to fully understand everything before you take any of the exams. That is all well and good, and you can certainly proceed as you wish. The ARRL offers many books that you might enjoy, from which you may build your knowledge. I will suggest that you consider what I think of as a more pragmatic approach, and that is to hold your nose and study to past the test(s) in order to get your license and then continue to build your knowledge. I say this because there are so many aspects to amateur radio that you will likely spend years learning before you consider yourself truly knowledgeable, and you could be enjoying radio operation as you do that. My suggested method for passing the exams is here. I think you should attempt Technician and General right off the bat. No real point in stopping at Technician. Originally Posted By Emoto: Originally Posted By backbencher: Yep, at some point Amateur Radio became about passing the test, rather than learning the material. It's incredibly annoying & another form of gatekeeping. "The learning starts when you pass the test." If you'd put out a proper manual, the learning could start before taking the test. You're not wrong in the opinions you've voiced. It sounds like you want to fully understand everything before you take any of the exams. That is all well and good, and you can certainly proceed as you wish. The ARRL offers many books that you might enjoy, from which you may build your knowledge. I will suggest that you consider what I think of as a more pragmatic approach, and that is to hold your nose and study to past the test(s) in order to get your license and then continue to build your knowledge. I say this because there are so many aspects to amateur radio that you will likely spend years learning before you consider yourself truly knowledgeable, and you could be enjoying radio operation as you do that. My suggested method for passing the exams is here. I think you should attempt Technician and General right off the bat. No real point in stopping at Technician. I'm thinking about it. We'll see if I can stand working through this book and interested enough to order the General. I finally said to hell w/ it last night & went to bed. It remains to be seen if I get through the next 75 pages or throw it across the room. If the terms would be defined before the question was presented the answer is often obvious. There's little actual memorization needed so far - the wavelength/frequency formula and the freq band names. |
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"It sounds like you want to fully understand everything before you take any of the exams" Good luck there buckaroo  There is so much that you can do, that a government test is hopelessly inadequate. If I were Emperor, And I could hire honest men, we could have a friendly agent spend a few minutes with you, you would show you have a clue, and that would be that. But just what kind of test does the government we have, have to use? Back to so much you can do, I have been a ham for almost 50 years, worked dx, was dx, worked satellites, bounced a signal off the moon, built some neat gear, had a couple spectacular spark shows when some of that neat gear wasn't all that, even was part of a real honest to God rescue at sea. And we had the same craptastic study guides back when I got my first ticket. Look at the bright side, we had to give the government something to make them think they are important, so we have tests that children can memorize in a few hours, take the win, get your ticket and then the real learning will happen. Rege AI3V |
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Gordon West got me started Got me to pass the 5wpm CW test. ( after that I had to get on the air to move up) Tech, General, and advanced written. I'll admit, I was going to school for electronics after the Army, and that made it easier, but I can't bitch about Gordon. He's made a lot of people hams. |
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Originally Posted By Colt653: Gordon West got me started Got me to pass the 5wpm CW test. Tech, General, and advanced written. I'll admit, I was going to school for electronics after the Army, and that made it easier, but I can't bitch about Gordon. He's made a lot of people hams. He's sent me 3 emails and called me once so far, I can't complain about him personally. My complaint is purely the format. Basic electromagnetic wave theory & electronic diagrams I did in physics in high school. |
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Originally Posted By SteelonSteel: I did acquire an Extra rating but I am an appliance operator. I am ok on antenna building, coax make up, soldering etc. As far as under the hood, not so much on the tiny board circuits of modern equipment. I had all I could do to solder on a tiny RC airplane receiver radio board. The board was the size of a medium postage stamp and the “chips” were smaller than 2mm square. All I had to do was tack on a power lead but I was sweating that I would overheat the board. No idea why they sell it with the power lead not on it. Soldering coax is a piece of cake. I shake too much at my age for the tiny stuff. See, here is the thing, you have the extra and you build Radio control aircraft, sound pretty bleeping Tecnical to me  This is what I mean about so many things you can do, I play with microwaves, you tinker with RC stuff, the other guy has a data mesh... If we tried to write a test to cover it all, nobody could hope to pass it! Rege |
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Ham radio is a lifelong hobby, and the exam is just the gatekeeper. The study guides aren't meant to teach you the hobby—they're designed to help you pass the test. Get your license first, and then spend the next 30-plus years learning and enjoying it. If you can't get over that hurdle, then there is always GMRS or CB radio.
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“Every man has two deaths, when he is buried in the ground and the last time someone says his name. In some ways, men can be immortal. “ - Ernest Hemingway
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Originally Posted By backbencher: I'm thinking about it. We'll see if I can stand working through this book and interested enough to order the General. I finally said to hell w/ it last night & went to bed. It remains to be seen if I get through the next 75 pages or throw it across the room. If the terms would be defined before the question was presented the answer is often obvious. There's little actual memorization needed so far - the wavelength/frequency formula and the freq band names. Hamstudy.org in the free study mode. Just keep hitting it. If you don't understand something in the question, tap the corner and it goes to the full explanation. (on a PC anyway). Lather, rinse, repeat, until your "SEEN" and "APTITUDE" numbers are all high. |
Don't confuse where I live with where I'm from.
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Originally Posted By Emoto: Hamstudy.org in the free study mode. Just keep hitting it. If you don't understand something in the question, tap the corner and it goes to the full explanation. (on a PC anyway). Lather, rinse, repeat, until your "SEEN" and "APTITUDE" numbers are all high. Originally Posted By Emoto: Originally Posted By backbencher: I'm thinking about it. We'll see if I can stand working through this book and interested enough to order the General. I finally said to hell w/ it last night & went to bed. It remains to be seen if I get through the next 75 pages or throw it across the room. If the terms would be defined before the question was presented the answer is often obvious. There's little actual memorization needed so far - the wavelength/frequency formula and the freq band names. Hamstudy.org in the free study mode. Just keep hitting it. If you don't understand something in the question, tap the corner and it goes to the full explanation. (on a PC anyway). Lather, rinse, repeat, until your "SEEN" and "APTITUDE" numbers are all high. It's not the understanding I have an issue with. I did 9 months as a Signal officer on a battalion staff. It's the presentation order that's driving me crazy. |
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Originally Posted By Asheville-Hippy: See, here is the thing, you have the extra and you build Radio control aircraft, sound pretty bleeping Tecnical to me This is what I mean about so many things you can do, I play with microwaves, you tinker with RC stuff, the other guy has a data mesh... If we tried to write a test to cover it all, nobody could hope to pass it! Rege Originally Posted By Asheville-Hippy: Originally Posted By SteelonSteel: I did acquire an Extra rating but I am an appliance operator. I am ok on antenna building, coax make up, soldering etc. As far as under the hood, not so much on the tiny board circuits of modern equipment. I had all I could do to solder on a tiny RC airplane receiver radio board. The board was the size of a medium postage stamp and the “chips” were smaller than 2mm square. All I had to do was tack on a power lead but I was sweating that I would overheat the board. No idea why they sell it with the power lead not on it. Soldering coax is a piece of cake. I shake too much at my age for the tiny stuff. See, here is the thing, you have the extra and you build Radio control aircraft, sound pretty bleeping Tecnical to me This is what I mean about so many things you can do, I play with microwaves, you tinker with RC stuff, the other guy has a data mesh... If we tried to write a test to cover it all, nobody could hope to pass it! Rege The amount of gaslighting in this thread is amusing. I'm not asking for an improved test - I'm asking for a reorganized manual. There is already agreement in the community on what new hams need to know. What is lacking is the presentation of that information in a logical manner. Did your history teacher in school give you the test before she taught the class? |
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Originally Posted By K9-Bob: Ham radio is a lifelong hobby, and the exam is just the gatekeeper. The study guides aren't meant to teach you the hobby—they're designed to help you pass the test. Get your license first, and then spend the next 30-plus years learning and enjoying it. If you can't get over that hurdle, then there is always GMRS or CB radio. One can learn a lot if one actually did spend the time under the hood on the old classic sets that often came as kits. That’s a small niche in the guys that want to mess with an old Halicrafters. Not everyone will take the time. The only old gear I have is the 811H and a Ten Tek tuner. I have had them uncovered mostly to blow the dust out and check for component failures. |
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I certainly wouldn’t mind improved methods and new textbooks. The current books are skeletal in my opinion. I don’t think the level of classroom instruction for deep understanding is possible in a format that gets the job done in a few weeks of weekends or Wednesday nights. Frankly who would put that much free time in to teach it. God bless the guys that volunteer instruct and test now. They are giving back to the next generation of hams within what is reasonable for a volunteer. I don’t think there will be a class room instruction that would meet my desires unless you were paying for like at a technical college. That said, there is nothing keeping anyone from reading to learn. Heck it took a little bit of drive to get myself to do all three levels of test learning and testing. Post testing and a lot more HF use and a lot more from the book clicked. |
| If it's book work you want, find a used "Radio Amateurs Handbook". The basic theory doesn't change much; if any, so any recent copy will do. There was a license manual for each license class, but I don't recall how well they represented the actual test. Good luck with your quest. 73, Rob |
Sic semper tyrannis!
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Originally Posted By backbencher: It's not the understanding I have an issue with. I did 9 months as a Signal officer on a battalion staff. It's the presentation order that's driving me crazy. Hmm. Ok. Did yo see on Hamstudy that you can select specific sub-elements to concentrate on. Maybe that would be an improvement for you. |
Don't confuse where I live with where I'm from.
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Originally Posted By Emoto: Hmm. Ok. Did yo see on Hamstudy that you can select specific sub-elements to concentrate on. Maybe that would be an improvement for you. Originally Posted By Emoto: Originally Posted By backbencher: It's not the understanding I have an issue with. I did 9 months as a Signal officer on a battalion staff. It's the presentation order that's driving me crazy. Hmm. Ok. Did yo see on Hamstudy that you can select specific sub-elements to concentrate on. Maybe that would be an improvement for you. No, it's not the presentation order of the topics - it's the presentation of Question, Multiple Choice Answers, Actual Knowledge that I'm trying to learn, Answer. The correct order would be Sub Topic, Actual Knowledge, Questions, Multiple Choice Answers, Answers, Next Sub Topic. Like in every other fucking manual you've ever read. |
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Originally Posted By TVille: Do you want to learn radio, VHF, HF, theory, or get a ham license? Gordon West books, and most, and aimed at getting the license. If you want o really learn RF theory, these study guides and books are designed to teach how to pass the exams. I know. The entire hobby teaches to the test. |
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Originally Posted By backbencher: I know. The entire hobby teaches to the test. Originally Posted By backbencher: Originally Posted By TVille: Do you want to learn radio, VHF, HF, theory, or get a ham license? Gordon West books, and most, and aimed at getting the license. If you want o really learn RF theory, these study guides and books are designed to teach how to pass the exams. I know. The entire hobby teaches to the test. No it doesn't. The people trying to facilitate people passing the test to enter the hobby teach to the test. The tests are just a few cherry picked topics and questions to make sure you're aware of some regulatory issues and practical aspects, and demonstrate that you're capable of learning technical information. They are not an all-encompassing instruction manual for amateur radio. The "entire hobby" is a giant fractal pattern of 1000 niches each of which has its own knowledge base, and the only "test" there is your own capabilities and desires. |
This is...a clue - Pat_Rogers
I'm not adequately aluminumized for this thread. - gonzo_beyondo
CO, MI, OR - Please lobby your legislators to end discrimination against non-resident CCW permit holders
I'm not adequately aluminumized for this thread. - gonzo_beyondo
CO, MI, OR - Please lobby your legislators to end discrimination against non-resident CCW permit holders
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Originally Posted By robmkivseries70: If it's book work you want, find a used "Radio Amateurs Handbook". The basic theory doesn't change much; if any, so any recent copy will do. There was a license manual for each license class, but I don't recall how well they represented the actual test. Good luck with your quest. 73, Rob Maybe something updated along those lines and spotlighted by the ARRL. This morning having my coffee while my brain is just rebooting I had a thought, The West and ARRL test manuals are more equivalent to a college lab guide and not the text book with deeper explanation. Or more fairly a blend of the two but losing a lot of the comprehensive coverage of a textbook. It took me in to adulthood before I figured out my preferred learning methods. I want the classroom and deep experience with labs. Yes I learned by doing but more than once in the military learning OJT I was left hanging with just enough training to get the day’s mission done. They never got around to teaching everything they learned in the official military school. Whether they assumed you never needed certain methods it bothered me to know I was only competent in the skills we used regularly and not the soup to nuts. |
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I think I see what the OP wants but between the hobby being a spiderweb of paths to follow and the limits of a classroom led by volunteers he is against it to get a manual with thorough logical progression. What we have is the product of the situational reality. Years of instructor experience striking a balance. One reason it is what it is because students would not all want the deep dive or not be able to commit to longer and more frequent classes. As it is the amount of sign ups for classes and test session no shows is fairly high. Our local instructors take great pleasure in every tech and upgrade. Sometimes a class is scheduled and people sign up but only one applicant shows up. That’s with just two or three days for tech class with homework reading. While I am getting off track about classes and people factors it illustrates that the limit of people who would truly want to tackle the full test book. Too many want the shortest route. If such a manual came to my attention I might buy it after thumbing through it. i am slightly nerdy enough to buy and flip through the 3” thick old and venerable Antenna Book. |
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I think this is kind of similar: I looked into flying school to learn how to fly an airplane. I want to fly jets commercially, but they started me on a Cessna 152, not a 777. They didn't teach me a damned thing about jet engines, compressors, blade materials, bearings, electronic theory, GPS (or however the heck they know where they are) or maintenance. I'm very disappointed... |
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Originally Posted By TVille: I think this is kind of similar: I looked into flying school to learn how to fly an airplane. I want to fly jets commercially, but they started me on a Cessna 152, not a 777. They didn't teach me a damned thing about jet engines, compressors, blade materials, bearings, electronic theory, GPS (or however the heck they know where they are) or maintenance. I'm very disappointed... I took ground school in high school. With an actual text book that did cover the topics that would be on the test. But we weren't given the test first and the explanation after. |
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Originally Posted By backbencher: The amount of gaslighting in this thread is amusing. I'm not asking for an improved test - I'm asking for a reorganized manual. There is already agreement in the community on what new hams need to know. What is lacking is the presentation of that information in a logical manner. Did your history teacher in school give you the test before she taught the class? Remember you are dealing with the govt here. They make the rules, and everyone that wants to play radio has to jump through the hoops, just like owning a suppressor or sbr. Once you get the test out of the way, it's over and done with and you are free to pursue the areas that interest you. |
World ain't what it seems, is it Gunny?
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I wanted to be a porn star in my youth, but there wasn't a structured training program—so I had to settle for OJT instead. Ham radio is a lot like that.
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“Every man has two deaths, when he is buried in the ground and the last time someone says his name. In some ways, men can be immortal. “ - Ernest Hemingway
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Originally Posted By backbencher: I took ground school in high school. With an actual text book that did cover the topics that would be on the test. But we weren't given the test first and the explanation after. Originally Posted By backbencher: Originally Posted By TVille: I think this is kind of similar: I looked into flying school to learn how to fly an airplane. I want to fly jets commercially, but they started me on a Cessna 152, not a 777. They didn't teach me a damned thing about jet engines, compressors, blade materials, bearings, electronic theory, GPS (or however the heck they know where they are) or maintenance. I'm very disappointed... I took ground school in high school. With an actual text book that did cover the topics that would be on the test. But we weren't given the test first and the explanation after. I was a civil air patrol cadet. To advance in the ranks you had to learn the big aviation manual. Then take a test for each advancement. That book is long gone but it was a very good textbook on the basics of aircraft flight, instruments, etc. A ham book in a similar format would be welcome in my eyes. A beginner’s bible text book. Thorough but still digestible for 12-15 year olds. |
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@backbencher AFAIK, what you want does not seem to exist in the amateur radio world. From a science and engineering perspective the available educational materials are generally a weird collection of factoids as opposed to a set of structured lessons in electrical and electromagnetic theory, application of that theory, and best practices. Even the materials that appear to be well organized skip tons of theory and basic information. There are many reasons for this, some good, some bad. Most people in the hobby just want the license as fast as possible and never go beyond the "appliance operator" stage. If they can't buy it then they don't do it. Reading manuals, figuring out cables, connectors and circuits, and soldering their own solutions and inventions are becoming more and more rare in the hobby. And you will find there is a lot of superstition, mythology and outright bad information running around the typical ham's brain. Present company excepted, of course  If you want a classical, bottom-up, building block type of education you are going to have to do that on your own. You'll have to find the right materials and online courses to create a mini-university level curriculum. I effectively did the bottom-up approach as I had a university engineering degree under my belt and been practicing electrical and RF systems engineering for almost 25 years when I went and passed exams on a lark (when they dropped the Morse code requirement ). I looked at the question pool study sites and discovered I was good to go except for the regulatory material (Federal and ARRL), and a few odd factoids here and there on the technical side.My opinion on this is that the basis of the knowledge pool is so large, and in some places deep, too, that it would simply take too long to really learn the material the way you seem to want to. Not that there is anything wrong with that, mind you! But it's not just a simple layer underlying the test questions, it's a very big layer. At any rate, here's a list of topics that form the basis of all things associated with the amateur radio licensing tests. - Basic DC and AC electrical theory. - The practical applications of that for DC and AC electrical power and control systems. - Become passingly familiar with the National Electrical Code as it is the basis for most of the electrical safety rules. - Electromagnetic theory followed by practical applications of that for radio communications. This is the biggest chunk of knowledge. The list of subtopics here is quite long. - RF safety, which is a separate topic from electrical power safety. - Title 47 of the U.S. Code, Part 97 (47USC97), which covers all of the FCC rules and reg's. - The ARRL "guidelines" that layer over the top of the federal reg's, particularly the ARRL recommended band plans, as the ARRL has insinuated it's own opinions and desires into the exam question pool. How deep you go down each or all of those knowledge areas is up to you. Whether you attempt to study them before or after the fact is also up to you. |
"Cogito, ergo armatum sum."
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Originally Posted By backbencher: Yep, at some point Amateur Radio became about passing the test, rather than learning the material. It's incredibly annoying & another form of gatekeeping. "The learning starts when you pass the test." If you'd put out a proper manual, the learning could start before taking the test. It is, but at the same time, ham is a hobby where you learn as you go. So much of the stuff covered in the tests isn't anything new. They barely cover newer digital modes. Focusing on raw theory and legal should be the point, which is mostly the Tech and some of the General, and leave the rest up to the licensee to figure out/learn. |
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You're not wrong, OP. Frankly, the test should be stuff you have to *know*, such as procedure, rules, and regulations. And that's it. All the technical / engineering / science stuff should be removed. But... folks be passionate about their hobbies. Worst argument I've been in here in the ham forum was on this subject.? Frankly, the tests - such as they are - ARE gatekeeping in precisely the way you describe. The tests aren't testing for knowledge. They're the first hurdle, gate, test that say "this fella has at least *this much* interest in that he's willing to memorize this stuff. so he's prob cool to join our club." I'm not convinced it's the best way. But... perhaps they have a point. On the other hand that point is often "don't let amateur become CB (or GMRS)." But you know what you hear on either of those across almost the entire United States? ... silence. So I'm not sure "don't let amateur become CB" is the zinger some hams seem to think it is. |
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Originally Posted By TinLeg: You're not wrong, OP. Frankly, the test should be stuff you have to *know*, such as procedure, rules, and regulations. And that's it. All the technical / engineering / science stuff should be removed. But... folks be passionate about their hobbies. Worst argument I've been in here in the ham forum was on this subject.? Frankly, the tests - such as they are - ARE gatekeeping in precisely the way you describe. The tests aren't testing for knowledge. They're the first hurdle, gate, test that say "this fella has at least *this much* interest in that he's willing to memorize this stuff. so he's prob cool to join our club." I'm not convinced it's the best way. But... perhaps they have a point. On the other hand that point is often "don't let amateur become CB (or GMRS)." But you know what you hear on either of those across almost the entire United States? ... silence. So I'm not sure "don't let amateur become CB" is the zinger some hams seem to think it is. I'm not complaining about what's on the tests. But there is a way to teach the knowledge the test is looking for other than giving me random questions and the knowledge I need to answer them AFTER the question. |
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What you want doesn't seem to exist. It is what it is. You could 'roll your own' using the book you have as an outline, Reverse it, research any terms/concepts that you don't know or understand, and re-write the book from the perspective you are looking for. If you do this, You definitely will become proficient in the material and also have created a resource for others who may learn in the same way that you learn. Just a thought. Also, Maybe this thread will help https://www.ar15.com/forums/outdoors/-/22-604477/ Maybe videos may help, these guys are excellent teachers: https://www.youtube.com/c/W4EEY I do hope you will continue your journey toward getting on the air. |
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Originally Posted By backbencher: When was that? Originally Posted By backbencher: Originally Posted By radioshooter: Dick Bash started the "know the answers" for people to memorize and PASS. Before that, people had to learn stuff. When was that? Dick Bash was 1980's: https://archive.org/details/finalexam00dick/mode/1up But the 70's it was AMECO: https://archive.org/details/amecoradioamateu00mart I probably had one of the AMECO books when I got my novice ticket - 1977 . And here is 1952... https://www.worldradiohistory.com/BOOKSHELF-ARH/Technology/Technology-Handbooks/License-Manual-ARRL-1952.pdf Rege |
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Originally Posted By TVille: I think this is kind of similar: I looked into flying school to learn how to fly an airplane. I want to fly jets commercially, but they started me on a Cessna 152, not a 777. They didn't teach me a damned thing about jet engines, compressors, blade materials, bearings, electronic theory, GPS (or however the heck they know where they are) or maintenance. I'm very disappointed... Ham radio is similiar. When my grandfather became a ham in 1932, you could not buy an antenna or a transmitter or receiver. You had to build it yourself. Today, while some people assemble kits and a few design and build their own tube amps or solid state amps from scratch, that is no longer required and the vast majority don't do any of that. I like building antennas, so I learned antenna theory past the concept of electrons jumping off the wire. Ham radio today has an operator focus, much like aviation, although there are still some remnants of build it facts tested on like ohms law. OP, the ham tests are very much nothing but a gate keeper just like it seems to be, mostly so people understand the regs and will operate within the law and established band plans, but there are still hold overs about very basic theory that is mostly useless. The tests are just like every other govt license test. They give you the master question bank and the correct answers. I have a EE degree, ( helped get one on the first MRI machines to work ) that I used before becoming a pilot, and even I just studied the questions and correct answers to pass the test. Once you past the test you can buy the ARRL antenna book and learn antenna theory, or a book on how SDR transceivers work, and experiment if you desire, or about how power amplifiers work and how not to kill your self with high voltage when you take the cover off. But none of that is on the test anymore and most people just pass the test and then learn and explore through operating what aspects of the hobby they enjoy the most. It is just the way of the current world. Even if you went and got a 4 year BS in EE, you are not going to learn everything there is to know about radio, propagation, reception, noise, high voltage, components, antennas, etc that is why the info is not setup to learn, it is too much information and few care to learn about it. The test is nothing but a gate keeper established from bygone years. It is just the way it is. If you try to learn everything there is to know theory wise, you are banging your head into a brick wall trying to get into the next room instead of just using the door. My recommendation is to just accept that, get your license to at least General if not Extra Class ( because fun stuff happens below General ) and learn the aspects of what interests you, there are plenty of technical books about how and why the equipment works including the use of propagation and wave theory but there is nothing all encompassing because it will not all fit in just a few books. A good book to start is the ARRL Antenna Book, where you will learn antenna theory, types of grounding you need that will cost more than your house, noise, and the simple fact that every antenna is a dipole abbreviated in only 1024 pages complete with pictures. I understand you want to understand the test questions and answers, I think the best place to do that is Hamstudy.org. You can study the material by test section and can click on the narrative of why the answer is the correct answer. It doesn't go completely in depth, but it can give you an understanding of why. There are about 900 test questions and they are organized by subject matter and the hamstudy.org does present each section and the whys to each answer. Since the test is only 35 or 50 question, you end up getting just 1 or 2 questions from each section so it seems random, but there are many questions in each section in the MQB and using hamstudy.org can give you some continuity on those questions and the why of each correct answer. It also can give you generated practice tests and keep track of the questions you get right and the questions you get wrong by each section but the big part is the section organization and the reasons. maybe that would help. |
Mach
Nobody is coming to save us.
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Nobody is coming to save us.
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I agree with Mach. Put simply, @backbencher, you have two goals that appeared to be a single goal, but are really two separate ones. In no particular order:
You sought your ideal of how this ought to be, which is certainly fine, but it turns out that as far as any of us know, your desired structure is not available. One thing I can tell you is that learning about radio is (or can be) a lifelong pursuit that doesn't really end. There is SO MUCH to it that I am not very confident that anyone can reach a point where they can truly declare that they know all or most of it. Given the fact that this learning will almost certainly be ongoing indefinitely, what your real choice consists of is where along that endless spectrum of learning will you decide to take the exams. Only you can answer that question, but in reality the exams are just an administrative hurdle that one must leap, in order to start doing stuff. Even though it kind of rubs you the wrong way, I really suggest studying for and banging out the exams via something like hamstudy.org so that it is out of the way, then continuing your ongoing education. As you study for the exams, you can make note of particular areas that interest you the most, then seek out additional books or other sources for those later. In the meantime, you can have some fun on the radio. |
Don't confuse where I live with where I'm from.
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Originally Posted By Mach: The entire aviation industry, for pilots, no longer has anything to do with knowing the systems anymore. When I started, they taught systems, the pilot actually controlled analog systems and valves and you benefited from understanding what you were doing. Those days are long gone. Now the systems are complicated digital control systems and the industry figured out pilots do not need to know systems and why it works. Pilots just need to know how to operate those systems effectively. Safety went up and training costs went down. yes money has a lot to do with it. Ham radio is similiar. When my grandfather became a ham in 1932, you could not buy an antenna or a transmitter or receiver. You had to build it yourself. Today, while some people assemble kits and a few design and build their own tube amps or solid state amps from scratch, that is no longer required and the vast majority don't do any of that. I like building antennas, so I learned antenna theory past the concept of electrons jumping off the wire. Ham radio today has an operator focus, much like aviation, although there are still some remnants of build it facts tested on like ohms law. OP, the ham tests are very much nothing but a gate keeper just like it seems to be, mostly so people understand the regs and will operate within the law and established band plans, but there are still hold overs about very basic theory that is mostly useless. The tests are just like every other govt license test. They give you the master question bank and the correct answers. I have a EE degree, ( helped get one on the first MRI machines to work ) that I used before becoming a pilot, and even I just studied the questions and correct answers to pass the test. Once you past the test you can buy the ARRL antenna book and learn antenna theory, or a book on how SDR transceivers work, and experiment if you desire, or about how power amplifiers work and how not to kill your self with high voltage when you take the cover off. But none of that is on the test anymore and most people just pass the test and then learn and explore through operating what aspects of the hobby they enjoy the most. It is just the way of the current world. Even if you went and got a 4 year BS in EE, you are not going to learn everything there is to know about radio, propagation, reception, noise, high voltage, components, antennas, etc that is why the info is not setup to learn, it is too much information and few care to learn about it. The test is nothing but a gate keeper established from bygone years. It is just the way it is. If you try to learn everything there is to know theory wise, you are banging your head into a brick wall trying to get into the next room instead of just using the door. My recommendation is to just accept that, get your license to at least General if not Extra Class ( because fun stuff happens below General ) and learn the aspects of what interests you, there are plenty of technical books about how and why the equipment works including the use of propagation and wave theory but there is nothing all encompassing because it will not all fit in just a few books. A good book to start is the ARRL Antenna Book, where you will learn antenna theory, types of grounding you need that will cost more than your house, noise, and the simple fact that every antenna is a dipole abbreviated in only 1024 pages complete with pictures. I understand you want to understand the test questions and answers, I think the best place to do that is Hamstudy.org. You can study the material by test section and can click on the narrative of why the answer is the correct answer. It doesn't go completely in depth, but it can give you an understanding of why. There are about 900 test questions and they are organized by subject matter and the hamstudy.org does present each section and the whys to each answer. Since the test is only 35 or 50 question, you end up getting just 1 or 2 questions from each section so it seems random, but there are many questions in each section in the MQB and using hamstudy.org can give you some continuity on those questions and the why of each correct answer. It also can give you generated practice tests and keep track of the questions you get right and the questions you get wrong by each section but the big part is the section organization and the reasons. maybe that would help. Originally Posted By Mach: Originally Posted By TVille: I think this is kind of similar: I looked into flying school to learn how to fly an airplane. I want to fly jets commercially, but they started me on a Cessna 152, not a 777. They didn't teach me a damned thing about jet engines, compressors, blade materials, bearings, electronic theory, GPS (or however the heck they know where they are) or maintenance. I'm very disappointed... The entire aviation industry, for pilots, no longer has anything to do with knowing the systems anymore. When I started, they taught systems, the pilot actually controlled analog systems and valves and you benefited from understanding what you were doing. Those days are long gone. Now the systems are complicated digital control systems and the industry figured out pilots do not need to know systems and why it works. Pilots just need to know how to operate those systems effectively. Safety went up and training costs went down. yes money has a lot to do with it. Ham radio is similiar. When my grandfather became a ham in 1932, you could not buy an antenna or a transmitter or receiver. You had to build it yourself. Today, while some people assemble kits and a few design and build their own tube amps or solid state amps from scratch, that is no longer required and the vast majority don't do any of that. I like building antennas, so I learned antenna theory past the concept of electrons jumping off the wire. Ham radio today has an operator focus, much like aviation, although there are still some remnants of build it facts tested on like ohms law. OP, the ham tests are very much nothing but a gate keeper just like it seems to be, mostly so people understand the regs and will operate within the law and established band plans, but there are still hold overs about very basic theory that is mostly useless. The tests are just like every other govt license test. They give you the master question bank and the correct answers. I have a EE degree, ( helped get one on the first MRI machines to work ) that I used before becoming a pilot, and even I just studied the questions and correct answers to pass the test. Once you past the test you can buy the ARRL antenna book and learn antenna theory, or a book on how SDR transceivers work, and experiment if you desire, or about how power amplifiers work and how not to kill your self with high voltage when you take the cover off. But none of that is on the test anymore and most people just pass the test and then learn and explore through operating what aspects of the hobby they enjoy the most. It is just the way of the current world. Even if you went and got a 4 year BS in EE, you are not going to learn everything there is to know about radio, propagation, reception, noise, high voltage, components, antennas, etc that is why the info is not setup to learn, it is too much information and few care to learn about it. The test is nothing but a gate keeper established from bygone years. It is just the way it is. If you try to learn everything there is to know theory wise, you are banging your head into a brick wall trying to get into the next room instead of just using the door. My recommendation is to just accept that, get your license to at least General if not Extra Class ( because fun stuff happens below General ) and learn the aspects of what interests you, there are plenty of technical books about how and why the equipment works including the use of propagation and wave theory but there is nothing all encompassing because it will not all fit in just a few books. A good book to start is the ARRL Antenna Book, where you will learn antenna theory, types of grounding you need that will cost more than your house, noise, and the simple fact that every antenna is a dipole abbreviated in only 1024 pages complete with pictures. I understand you want to understand the test questions and answers, I think the best place to do that is Hamstudy.org. You can study the material by test section and can click on the narrative of why the answer is the correct answer. It doesn't go completely in depth, but it can give you an understanding of why. There are about 900 test questions and they are organized by subject matter and the hamstudy.org does present each section and the whys to each answer. Since the test is only 35 or 50 question, you end up getting just 1 or 2 questions from each section so it seems random, but there are many questions in each section in the MQB and using hamstudy.org can give you some continuity on those questions and the why of each correct answer. It also can give you generated practice tests and keep track of the questions you get right and the questions you get wrong by each section but the big part is the section organization and the reasons. maybe that would help. Thanks, I'll take a look at HamStudy.org. Mr West recommended the ARRL manual that I had looked at before, so I have a current copy on the way, should get here tomorrow. When I looked at the version in 2019, the introduction was full of outdated propaganda - talk to people around the world for free! Talk to people about your specific hobby for free! as if the internet did not exist. I discounted it because of that, and because it seemed dedicated to teaching the test. Well, the recommended alternative has slightly less propaganda and even more teaching of the test, so I'll try the ARRL manual. As for the suggestion above that I rewrite the book, I don't have the interest in writing a manual for a hobby that I have thought about joining most of my life but that I find increasingly an anachronistic LARP, much like SCA or a RenFaire. As for the persistent claim that a manual that would cover all of Ham Radio would be an encyclopedia, I agree. I'm not asking for that. I'm asking for a textbook or manual appropriate for Technician Class that simply presents the answers ahead of the questions - like any other manual outside of Amateur Radio you've ever read. It sounds like the ARRL manual may be the ticket. |
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Originally Posted By backbencher: I'm asking for a textbook or manual appropriate for Technician Class that simply presents the answers ahead of the questions - like any other manual outside of Amateur Radio you've ever read. Originally Posted By backbencher: I'm asking for a textbook or manual appropriate for Technician Class that simply presents the answers ahead of the questions - like any other manual outside of Amateur Radio you've ever read. There are a few reasons why the material is generally presented that way, one major reason is so that folks don't spend time looking at material they already know. If you already know some part of the test material then you can just skip ahead and work on material that you don't already know. Originally Posted By backbencher: a hobby that I have thought about joining most of my life Almost everyone in amateur radio has talked to a several people who have said the same thing. I don't know that there is a solid answer to why it's such a difficulty for some. The best I can tell you is that amateur radio is a self-directed, individual pursuit. It's up to each person to learn and do. For all the complaints I've heard over the years about the perceived oppressive authoritarianism of amateur radio, I tend to think it's the opposite - that the lack of outside direction - or culpability - is an unusual and unsettling experience. There is no boss, no commander, no drill sergeant, to require, direct or motivate, it's just up to every individual to both pass the tests as well as whatever you want to do in operating. For sure there are regulations as well as common operating practices, social pressures, that sort of thing, but ultimately the callsign is yours and yours alone. Most amateurs have run into youth/kids who are licensed (as have I) and that's often thrown out as a data point for getting past the tests. There may be some validity to that, but part of the reason may be that youth are already in a school/learning mode, and have a parent/adult generally pushing them to get it done. Other radio folks can help, answer questions, invite people to group events, etc, but in the end the individual has to just do it. |
This is...a clue - Pat_Rogers
I'm not adequately aluminumized for this thread. - gonzo_beyondo
CO, MI, OR - Please lobby your legislators to end discrimination against non-resident CCW permit holders
I'm not adequately aluminumized for this thread. - gonzo_beyondo
CO, MI, OR - Please lobby your legislators to end discrimination against non-resident CCW permit holders
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Friend of mine, another ham, once said "There's no wrong way to do ham radio". What he meant by that is there's so many avenues the one "hobby" can take, there's no one test or niche that can adequately test/evaluate competence of the entire hobby. The stuff I'm interested in with "ham radio" isn't your stereotypical ham stuff. Does that make it any less hammy if i'm in GHz and QAM/ASK vs. kHz and SSB/AM? I don't do HF, at all. Am I less of an extra for that? I took a different avenue than a DX'er/contester. Still the same hobby, still had to pass the same tech/gen/extra exams. The test I'd write would be radically different from the existing tests because of the path I took and my interests. Hard part for a lot of new hams that want the whole enchilada is going from "I need to understand everything before I take the test", to "I need to study to pass the test to get that license to learn". It's a gateway, minimum requirements, awareness of the procedures and hazards in the hobby. Yes, it's kind of backwards, but with great power (1500W) comes some responsibility for safety, operating procedures, and rules. I look at it kind of like OSHA - They're the law when it comes to workplace safety, but there's jobs/tasks/businesses that fall under OSHA's purview that OSHA doesn't even know exists. They write the generics, the "here's the right way to manage these common hazards", but when something happens in one of those niche positions, that's where incorporation by reference comes in and they're calling in industry/field experts. |
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Originally Posted By SnowMule: Does that make it any less hammy if i'm in GHz and QAM/ASK vs. kHz and SSB/AM? I don't do HF, at all. I do do HF, and a current fascination is a post I read about a relatively easy/inexpensive way to do 10GHz. The experimental history of amateur radio as reflected by the tests is why that kind of thing is allowed. |
This is...a clue - Pat_Rogers
I'm not adequately aluminumized for this thread. - gonzo_beyondo
CO, MI, OR - Please lobby your legislators to end discrimination against non-resident CCW permit holders
I'm not adequately aluminumized for this thread. - gonzo_beyondo
CO, MI, OR - Please lobby your legislators to end discrimination against non-resident CCW permit holders
|
Originally Posted By Gamma762: There are a few reasons why the material is generally presented that way, one major reason is so that folks don't spend time looking at material they already know. If you already know some part of the test material then you can just skip ahead and work on material that you don't already know. Almost everyone in amateur radio has talked to a several people who have said the same thing. I don't know that there is a solid answer to why it's such a difficulty for some. The best I can tell you is that amateur radio is a self-directed, individual pursuit. It's up to each person to learn and do. For all the complaints I've heard over the years about the perceived oppressive authoritarianism of amateur radio, I tend to think it's the opposite - that the lack of outside direction - or culpability - is an unusual and unsettling experience. There is no boss, no commander, no drill sergeant, to require, direct or motivate, it's just up to every individual to both pass the tests as well as whatever you want to do in operating. For sure there are regulations as well as common operating practices, social pressures, that sort of thing, but ultimately the callsign is yours and yours alone. Most amateurs have run into youth/kids who are licensed (as have I) and that's often thrown out as a data point for getting past the tests. There may be some validity to that, but part of the reason may be that youth are already in a school/learning mode, and have a parent/adult generally pushing them to get it done. Other radio folks can help, answer questions, invite people to group events, etc, but in the end the individual has to just do it. Originally Posted By Gamma762: Originally Posted By backbencher: I'm asking for a textbook or manual appropriate for Technician Class that simply presents the answers ahead of the questions - like any other manual outside of Amateur Radio you've ever read. There are a few reasons why the material is generally presented that way, one major reason is so that folks don't spend time looking at material they already know. If you already know some part of the test material then you can just skip ahead and work on material that you don't already know. Originally Posted By backbencher: a hobby that I have thought about joining most of my life Almost everyone in amateur radio has talked to a several people who have said the same thing. I don't know that there is a solid answer to why it's such a difficulty for some. The best I can tell you is that amateur radio is a self-directed, individual pursuit. It's up to each person to learn and do. For all the complaints I've heard over the years about the perceived oppressive authoritarianism of amateur radio, I tend to think it's the opposite - that the lack of outside direction - or culpability - is an unusual and unsettling experience. There is no boss, no commander, no drill sergeant, to require, direct or motivate, it's just up to every individual to both pass the tests as well as whatever you want to do in operating. For sure there are regulations as well as common operating practices, social pressures, that sort of thing, but ultimately the callsign is yours and yours alone. Most amateurs have run into youth/kids who are licensed (as have I) and that's often thrown out as a data point for getting past the tests. There may be some validity to that, but part of the reason may be that youth are already in a school/learning mode, and have a parent/adult generally pushing them to get it done. Other radio folks can help, answer questions, invite people to group events, etc, but in the end the individual has to just do it. In Civil Air Patrol, I had an interest as a teenager, and money and Morse Code were the obstacles. After college, I was into computers, and the internet and cell phones replaced any need I had for Amateur Radio. When I spent 9 months in a hurricane zone, I tried to keep a Ham Radio club alive, but there was very little interest, despite a beautiful antenna farm and an operational repeater. I had more interest after that, and have looked for a textbook for several years now to no avail. We'll see what I think about the ARRL manual tomorrow. |