Posted: 8/22/2025 9:49:08 PM EDT
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https://tennesseefirearms.com/2025/08/tennessees-intent-to-go-armed-and-parks-statutes-are-declared-unconstitutional/?_T__Xq-H1nDq4dNpKhWBQg_aem_bed4JcFkmZwmGX-PramA2A Awesome news. Everyone should be a member! |
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https://tennesseefirearms.com/2025/08/tennessees-intent-to-go-armed-and-parks-statutes-are-declared-unconstitutional/?_T__Xq-H1nDq4dNpKhWBQg_aem_bed4JcFkmZwmGX-PramA2A Made it hot for you Outstanding work by John Harris!! Buddy if you're reading this I truly appreciate the hard work you do for us! |
I think one of the major problems with America today is not enough families sit down to a big plate of squirrels momma just fried up.
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The statute makes it a criminal offense to carry any firearm at any time and at any place, including a person’s on property or in their own home, “with the intent to go armed.” a few comments: I thought TN was already a castle doctrine state. I thougth enhanced permits allowed park carry. Did these change or is the “with the intent to go armed” a legacy law that acted like a catch all or fill in the holes law. |
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Originally Posted By gotigers: a few comments: I thought TN was already a castle doctrine state. I thougth enhanced permits allowed park carry. Did these change or is the “with the intent to go armed” a legacy law that acted like a catch all or fill in the holes law. As I see it, the "intent to go armed" provision stacks the deck against TN gun rights. It mandates that gun rights are not recognized as inherent, they have to be individually and explicitly elucidated. In order for us to get a "new" gun right, it has to specifically allowed by the state. This is similar to how government works under a monarch (see Hobbes' book Leviathan). This is the opposite of how the 2nd Amendment is written and parroted in many state constitutions, where gun rights are considered an inherent right from God, and any limitations on gun rights must be explicitly elucidated. This is the foundational concept of the American experiment, where our rights come from God; they are not dispensed by a monarch. The 2A requires that every restriction on gun rights must be a law, as gun rights (an extension of the right to defense from tyranny) are an inherent right given to us by God. This ruling is along the lines af TFA's push to amend the TN Constitution to recognize RKBA as an inherent, God-given right, congruent with the 2A. It "flips the script". |
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Originally Posted By TSFMultiGun: As I see it, the "intent to go armed" provision stacks the deck against TN gun rights. It mandates that gun rights are not recognized as inherent, they have to be individually and explicitly elucidated. In order for us to get a "new" gun right, it has to specifically allowed by the state. This is similar to how government works under a monarch (see Hobbes' book Leviathan). This is the opposite of how the 2nd Amendment is written and parroted in many state constitutions, where gun rights are considered an inherent right from God, and any limitations on gun rights must be explicitly elucidated. This is the foundational concept of the American experiment, where our rights come from God; they are not dispensed by a monarch. The 2A requires that every restriction on gun rights must be a law, as gun rights (an extension of the right to defense from tyranny) are an inherent right given to us by God. This ruling is along the lines af TFA's push to amend the TN Constitution to recognize RKBA as an inherent, God-given right, congruent with the 2A. It "flips the script". Yeah, ok. I was looking at it as flipping some state laws, but it is flipping the principal of where the rights come from and it aint the state. Thanks |
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Not exactly but it’s easy to get confused. The law was basically, it’s illegal to carry. Getting a permit is a defense against the charge of intending to go armed. Just like it’s illegal to kill someone but self defense is a defense against the charge of murder. That means cops can still harass you if you have a gun. And you have to prove you’re not guilty using the permit as a defense. Now you can carry rifles, pistols, whatever openly and a cop can’t say that just seeing the weapon is reasonable suspicion of committing a crime. The commie pinko anti gun RINOs in TN state gov basically tried to pass off the permitless carry as constitutional carry but it was nothing but a defense against a crime. Now that the underlying intent to go armed is gone, the permit and permitless carry may be meaningless. And it seems rifle carry is gtg now so I can switch back to carrying my SBR instead of AR pistol with the gay brace BS |
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Castle doctrine is different. If you shoot some knuckleheads and get charged with murder and are arguing self defense, you have to prove that you were reasonably in fear of imminent bodily harm or death. Castle doctrine says that if you are in your home, this is presumed and instead of you having to prove you were in fear, the prosecution has to prove you were not. It applies not just to guns but frying pans ball bats swords etc. Stand your ground laws eliminate the duty to retreat. So you can see there are a lot of complicated layers. TN syg and castle doctrine laws are good. We just had crappy gun laws. |
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Originally Posted By taliv: Also, FBL and the AG This new AG Skirmetti has actually done some good for us. The previous guy got tired of my emails. I don't feel like he really put up much of a fight in this specific case; I think he knew this was a fucked up deal, but was never going to get the support in the legislature to make it right, and that's where all the fruity versions of permits sprouted from. |
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Originally Posted By high_order1: wellll This new AG Skirmetti has actually done some good for us. The previous guy got tired of my emails. I don't feel like he really put up much of a fight in this specific case; I think he knew this was a fucked up deal, but was never going to get the support in the legislature to make it right, and that's where all the fruity versions of permits sprouted from. At least the issue of carrying is something that the state Constitution allows the state legislature some limited (for the purpose of dealing with crime) authority over. Given that the state legislature has now passed a ban on Glock switches (which they have no Constitutional authority to do), while some of the republicans that supported the legislation were openly admitting that Glock switches were already banned by federal law, it seems that some members of the state legislature have gotten too comfortable. |
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Originally Posted By JPN: At least the issue of carrying is something that the state Constitution allows the state legislature some limited (for the purpose of dealing with crime) authority over. Given that the state legislature has now passed a ban on Glock switches (which they have no Constitutional authority to do), while some of the republicans that supported the legislation were openly admitting that Glock switches were already banned by federal law, it seems that some members of the state legislature have gotten too comfortable. Originally Posted By JPN: At least the issue of carrying is something that the state Constitution allows the state legislature some limited (for the purpose of dealing with crime) authority over. Given that the state legislature has now passed a ban on Glock switches (which they have no Constitutional authority to do), while some of the republicans that supported the legislation were openly admitting that Glock switches were already banned by federal law, it seems that some members of the state legislature have gotten too comfortable. Well, I think they are scared. New governor is coming whether anyone wants it or not, and it is happening during a Trump cycle. With the constant increasing bluing of the state capitol, influx of... people; i think (hope) some of them have a rough time of it. One of my locals: Monty Fritts This issue and recent developments demand I keep my House District 32 constituents informed of my continuing viewpoint. I offer the following in response to the call by some for the TN Attorney General and Nashville establishment to appeal a recent court ruling that determined Tennessee's "intent to go armed" code is indeed unconstitutional. A group of Plaintiffs were forced to bring suit against the Defendants (Governor Lee and others) regarding infringements against our Creator endowed rights. The people felt they had found NO help in the legislature nor with the Governor. So, they brought a lawsuit. The Plaintiffs, the people, won the case against the Defendants, government and Nashville establishment. Now some in government are suggesting that the State of Tennessee should spend more of your money fighting against your rights. I say NO! Below is my reply: I support legislation, carried by you or me or another Patriot to secure the rights of Tennesseans. The same Governor and Nashville establishment who actively works against our pro liberty bills by sending their minions with philosophical opinions to offices and committees has worked against this ruling. I hope they repent, for it is not only unconstitutional but also sinful to usurp authorities that Constitution nor Almighty God has granted them. For state employees to expend any, or any additional, tax dollars to argue against the citizen's Creator endowed right to keep and bear arms is the wrong thing to do. There should never be found precedent where state employees argue to infringe upon our rights. That should have stopped in the 60s (18 and 19). Shame on the governor and the Nashville establishment for the infringement to this point. No good deed has been served in this instance by the Nashville establishment. The concept of liberty is indeed binary, pro or against. The establishment in Nashville has been against to this point and I have little confidence that further aggression against my liberty and the liberty of Tennesseans perpetrated by Tennessee employees will benefit posterity. |
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Memphis democrat London Lamar seems to disagree with the ruling. "This ruling puts Tennesseans at greater risk by tying the hands of law enforcement officers who encounter people who are armed and potentially dangerous. If police can no longer investigate someone for the intent to go armed, officers are left waiting until a crime has already been committed — a failed public safety policy that puts lives on the line.“ Maybe he should be investigated/arrested for the bribes he will likely take in the future, since he's such a firm believer in not waiting until a crime has been committed? |
Earthsheltered house - a reinforced bunker that even the treehuggers consider to be socially acceptable.
Earthbag house - like an earthsheltered house, but cheaper and easier to DIY.
Earthbag house - like an earthsheltered house, but cheaper and easier to DIY.
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Originally Posted By JPN: Memphis democrat London Lamar seems to disagree with the ruling. "This ruling puts Tennesseans at greater risk by tying the hands of law enforcement officers who encounter people who are armed and potentially dangerous. If police can no longer investigate someone for the intent to go armed, officers are left waiting until a crime has already been committed a failed public safety policy that puts lives on the line." Maybe he should be investigated/arrested for the bribes he will likely take in the future, since he's such a firm believer in not waiting until a crime has been committed? Originally Posted By JPN: Memphis democrat London Lamar seems to disagree with the ruling. "This ruling puts Tennesseans at greater risk by tying the hands of law enforcement officers who encounter people who are armed and potentially dangerous. If police can no longer investigate someone for the intent to go armed, officers are left waiting until a crime has already been committed a failed public safety policy that puts lives on the line." Maybe he should be investigated/arrested for the bribes he will likely take in the future, since he's such a firm believer in not waiting until a crime has been committed? Originally Posted By lokt: This is outstanding. Would be nice if Gov Lee and his AG would announce that they are not challenging the ruling. have you... written him? (the AG, the gov doesn't really matter much now) |
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So, it's now legal for me to take my pistol hiking if I have my non-resident FL concealed carry permit with me? FL (and many other states) have reciprocity with TN. The prior law was not clear at all- (paraphrasing) one statute read TN enhanced carry permit only for parks carry, and another statute said people with out of state permits with reciprocity can carry under the same restrictions as a TN resident. I'd like to get a TN enhanced carry permit, but I can't even apply for one because I don't have plastic drivers license yet. The paper license doesn't have a DD number, and I'm almost a month into waiting for a plastic drivers license to get to me in the mail. That said, nothing better than seeing a setback to tyranny. Just hope the local cops/judges actually pay attention to this ruling. |
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Originally Posted By biometrician: So, it's now legal for me to take my pistol hiking if I have my non-resident FL concealed carry permit with me? FL (and many other states) have reciprocity with TN. The prior law was not clear at all- (paraphrasing) one statute read TN enhanced carry permit only for parks carry, and another statute said people with out of state permits with reciprocity can carry under the same restrictions as a TN resident. I'd like to get a TN enhanced carry permit, but I can't even apply for one because I don't have plastic drivers license yet. The paper license doesn't have a DD number, and I'm almost a month into waiting for a plastic drivers license to get to me in the mail. That said, nothing better than seeing a setback to tyranny. Just hope the local cops/judges actually pay attention to this ruling. The state apparently has 30 days from the date the ruling was issued, to decide whether or not to appeal the ruling to a higher court. |
Earthsheltered house - a reinforced bunker that even the treehuggers consider to be socially acceptable.
Earthbag house - like an earthsheltered house, but cheaper and easier to DIY.
Earthbag house - like an earthsheltered house, but cheaper and easier to DIY.
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Originally Posted By JPN: The state apparently has 30 days from the date the ruling was issued, to decide whether or not to appeal the ruling to a higher court. They decided to appeal |
"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin
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That is unfortunate. |
Earthsheltered house - a reinforced bunker that even the treehuggers consider to be socially acceptable.
Earthbag house - like an earthsheltered house, but cheaper and easier to DIY.
Earthbag house - like an earthsheltered house, but cheaper and easier to DIY.
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Seems that the explanation from the AG's office is that they think the court's ruling went too far, since it completely invalidates two laws, even though those laws could be Constitutional "in some situations". Wasn't the court's argument that the "intent to go armed" law was worded too broadly, so that it could be applied to situations that it shouldn't be applied to? Sounds like they are admitting to the court's main point, while saying "yeah, but they shouldn't have done that". |
Earthsheltered house - a reinforced bunker that even the treehuggers consider to be socially acceptable.
Earthbag house - like an earthsheltered house, but cheaper and easier to DIY.
Earthbag house - like an earthsheltered house, but cheaper and easier to DIY.
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https://newschannel9.com/news/local/tennessee-judges-ruling-on-law-restricting-guns-in-parks-playgrounds-appealed-tuesday HAMILTON COUNTY, Tenn. A ruling from a panel of Tennessee judges last week could have led to less restrictions when it comes to carrying guns at parks and recreation areas. Now, the state's attorney general and governor are pushing back against that ruling. The case has been another test of the limits of a 2022 U.S. Supreme Court ruling that has allowed gun rights advocates to take aim at more Second Amendment restrictions nationwide. The Tennessee laws that were deemed unconstitutional by the panel of judges include one that generally outlaws carrying a gun in a park or similar area, except for someone with a permit to carry a handgun. The second law involves the somewhat ambiguous offense of the "intent to go armed," which includes broad exceptions and legal defenses. Both are misdemeanors. "I was kind of surprised." At Harrison Bay State Park visitors like Matt Hastings are soaking in the quiet. But the debate over guns in these spaces is anything but quiet. Last week a panel of judges struck down two Tennessee laws restricting gun use. According to a court ruling, this decision stems from this lawsuit filed by Gun Owners of America and the Gun Owners Foundation, who argue the laws violate the second amendment. Gun Owners of America national spokesman Luis Valdes called the ruling a victory. "This is a monumental win. This truly turns Tennessee into a real constitutional carry state." But Tennessee Attorney General Jonathan Skrmetti and governor Bill Lee are now appealing that ruling, arguing that it takes away important tools to protect public safety. Hastings says he see some benefits to the ruling, but he says he has concerns about a lack of safety training. "I went and took classes for conceal and carry. So, you know, for me, it actually was training... how to shoot, when to use it, the laws behind it, and all that stuff. So when I heard that anybody could carry, I don't know. I'm kind of shocked by that." Valdes argues striking down gun restrictions makes law-abiding people safer. "Criminals break the law, and all gun control laws on the books, all they do is disarm the law abiding public." Senate Democratic Caucus Chairwoman Senator London Lamar says the ruling will make Tennessee's public safety crisis worse. "By tying the hands of law enforcement officers who encounter people who are armed and potentially dangerous." In 2023, Tennessee settled a different lawsuit and allowed 18- to 20-year-olds to carry handguns, including under a 2021 law that made handgun carry permits optional. |
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Luis Valdes is doing the Lord's work. He's a member here BTW but doesn't post here as much since he took a leadership role at GOA. What everyone needs to keep in mind is that Tennessee's "intent to go armed" law is a Jim Crow law left over from reconstruction. https://davekopel.org/2A/Mags/dark-secret-of-jim-crow.html |
I think one of the major problems with America today is not enough families sit down to a big plate of squirrels momma just fried up.
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Originally Posted By bodybagger: Luis Valdes is doing the Lord's work. He's a member here BTW but doesn't post here as much since he took a leadership role at GOA. What everyone needs to keep in mind is that Tennessee's "intent to go armed" law is a Jim Crow law left over from reconstruction. https://davekopel.org/2A/Mags/dark-secret-of-jim-crow.html And that's the reason that particular law was written the way it was. The vague concept of "intent to go armed" gave a police officer legal justification to arrest a black person for being in the white part of town, while ignoring the white people who were carrying the same things (guns were just one of the weapons listed in that state law). |
Earthsheltered house - a reinforced bunker that even the treehuggers consider to be socially acceptable.
Earthbag house - like an earthsheltered house, but cheaper and easier to DIY.
Earthbag house - like an earthsheltered house, but cheaper and easier to DIY.
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I came here soon as I saw that. I hate they are landing on the wrong side of this. |
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Originally Posted By gotigers: Big gov, politicians, bureaucrats, etc will always be against us. No matter what side they say they are on. Originally Posted By gotigers: Originally Posted By high_order1: I came here soon as I saw that. I hate they are landing on the wrong side of this. Big gov, politicians, bureaucrats, etc will always be against us. No matter what side they say they are on. Truth. Sometimes a good one does get inside the machine though. They are so few and far between, they're basically inconsequential. The people we really want/need inside the machine want no part of it. |
Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.
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At least the court has said the ruling stands pending appeal. https://tennesseefirearms.com/2025/09/hughes-court-requet-by-lee-and-skrmetti-to-continue-enforcing-unconstitutional-laws/ |
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this guy says he had no choice but to appeal. (shrugs) https://tennesseestar.com/commentary/commentary-ag-jonathan-skrmetti-is-a-second-amendment-champion-and-conservative-hero/admin/2025/09/16/?feed_id=13466&_unique_id=68c98eb7bb12c |
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Originally Posted By high_order1: this guy says he had no choice but to appeal. (shrugs) https://tennesseestar.com/commentary/commentary-ag-jonathan-skrmetti-is-a-second-amendment-champion-and-conservative-hero/admin/2025/09/16/?feed_id=13466&_unique_id=68c98eb7bb12c Wow. I couldn't finish reading it, because it exceeded my limit for "I support the 2nd amendment, but..." twisted reasoning. Did he bother to make any comment comparing this "It's his job to appeal this" situation, to the recent decision to not defend the law (which the left has filed a lawsuit against) imposing a penalty on city and county legislators who vote to have their county or city violate state law? |
Earthsheltered house - a reinforced bunker that even the treehuggers consider to be socially acceptable.
Earthbag house - like an earthsheltered house, but cheaper and easier to DIY.
Earthbag house - like an earthsheltered house, but cheaper and easier to DIY.