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NC, USA
Posted: 8/13/2024 10:55:10 AM EDT
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Has anyone ever heard of a Bren Ten? It is apparently very collectible. I saw one on Morphy Auctions (starts Sept. 10, 2024). Apparently there were only 75 ever made. For you old guys, it's the gun that Sonny Crockett carried in Miami Vice (show, not movie). I read that Jeff Cooper was involved in the creation. I guess it was either the first or one of the first 10mm's ever produced. Morphy Auctions |
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Ya Cooper encouraged the guys ( Dornhaus&Dixion IIRC) but basically threw Them under the bus when it came down to it. Need to be talking to the "new guys" not "old guys" and definitely made more than 75 lol. Magazines on the other hand were sub-contracted out and the sub-contractor dropped the ball on Q.C. and shipped a bunch of non functioning mags. Read "Bren Ten The Heir Apparrent" by Ron Carrillo. |
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Has anyone ever heard of a Bren Ten? Attached File I really really wanted one just like Sonny's! |
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Originally Posted By AFSOC_COP: Pretty sure the “75” is the number of magazines made for the Bren Ten…..EVER  Yep, the original mags are as rare as hens teeth, they now are selling for $400 each, there is a lot of 10 for sale on Gunbroker now for those interested. |
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I have two Bren Ten pistols and several magazines. I bought them in the early 90s when prices were lower than today, but still a big investment back then. One has been hard chromed while the other has been unfired and left alone in the box. All of the mags work fine through the hard chromed gun. The mags were made by MecGar. I think the demise of the gun was the two owners, Dornaus and Dixon privately funded their venture and did not have a lot of capital in the project and the whole magazine issue was them not being able to secure enough from MecGar and customers waiting a long time past their estimated delivery date. Richard Voight of Voight Sporting Goods bought the rights to the Bren Ten and at one point planned to bring the gun back as the Peregrine Falcon. I contacted Peregrine and received a brochure with a price list but Voight never got the project running. Voight sold the rights to the design to Vltor. Viltor debuted an updated design at SHOT Show a few years back and promised to bring the gun back as Bren Ten. Their contact person at the time if memory serves correct was Eric Kincel. Viltor never got the project off the ground supposedly due to them fulfilling military contracts for their other products. Master gunsmith Chuck Warner was working on a modern version that never panned out. I think the Bren Ten was way ahead of its time and failed because the business side was not well thought out. If you handle an actual gun, it has the CZ75 ergonomics and feels pretty good in the hand. Recoil is brisk with full power loads. I have original Norma 200 gr and 170 JHP. I also like the 175gr Winchester Silver Tip. I actually thought a company such as Ruger with their experience in stainless manufacturing could have built the gun successfully. In 2024, with all of the CNC technology, I personally think the Bren Ten could be done in 9mm, .40/10mm, .45 ACP with some design changes that would make manufacturing simpler. EAA/Defiant makes several 10mm variants but nothing as close as the Bren Ten. If a modern version ever came out, I would a pair. |
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Originally Posted By jfk: I have two Bren Ten pistols and several magazines. I bought them in the early 90s when prices were lower than today, but still a big investment back then. One has been hard chromed while the other has been unfired and left alone in the box. All of the mags work fine through the hard chromed gun. The mags were made by MecGar. I think the demise of the gun was the two owners, Dornaus and Dixon privately funded their venture and did not have a lot of capital in the project and the whole magazine issue was them not being able to secure enough from MecGar and customers waiting a long time past their estimated delivery date. Richard Voight of Voight Sporting Goods bought the rights to the Bren Ten and at one point planned to bring the gun back as the Peregrine Falcon. I contacted Peregrine and received a brochure with a price list but Voight never got the project running. Voight sold the rights to the design to Vltor. Viltor debuted an updated design at SHOT Show a few years back and promised to bring the gun back as Bren Ten. Their contact person at the time if memory serves correct was Eric Kincel. Viltor never got the project off the ground supposedly due to them fulfilling military contracts for their other products. Master gunsmith Chuck Warner was working on a modern version that never panned out. I think the Bren Ten was way ahead of its time and failed because the business side was not well thought out. If you handle an actual gun, it has the CZ75 ergonomics and feels pretty good in the hand. Recoil is brisk with full power loads. I have original Norma 200 gr and 170 JHP. I also like the 175gr Winchester Silver Tip. I actually thought a company such as Ruger with their experience in stainless manufacturing could have built the gun successfully. In 2024, with all of the CNC technology, I personally think the Bren Ten could be done in 9mm, .40/10mm, .45 ACP with some design changes that would make manufacturing simpler. EAA/Defiant makes several 10mm variants but nothing as close as the Bren Ten. If a modern version ever came out, I would a pair. Wow - that was a phenomenal and informative post |
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I kick my self in the butt for not buying a Bren Ten at the Indy 1500 gun show in the early 2000s. A guy had one and he wanted $1500 for it with 2 mags and no box. I was kinda broke at the time, wife lost her job and went back to school. My pants moved when Vltor kept posting pictures of progression of their Bren Ten, I think the gun is cursed since it has a cult following but it never really gets off the ground.... |
If a 147 grn 9mm at 1000 FPS is the hammer of Thor then a 165 grn. 40 at 1200 fps must a lightening bolt from Zeus!
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Originally Posted By jfk: I have two Bren Ten pistols and several magazines. I bought them in the early 90s when prices were lower than today, but still a big investment back then. One has been hard chromed while the other has been unfired and left alone in the box. All of the mags work fine through the hard chromed gun. The mags were made by MecGar. I think the demise of the gun was the two owners, Dornaus and Dixon privately funded their venture and did not have a lot of capital in the project and the whole magazine issue was them not being able to secure enough from MecGar and customers waiting a long time past their estimated delivery date. Richard Voight of Voight Sporting Goods bought the rights to the Bren Ten and at one point planned to bring the gun back as the Peregrine Falcon. I contacted Peregrine and received a brochure with a price list but Voight never got the project running. Voight sold the rights to the design to Vltor. Viltor debuted an updated design at SHOT Show a few years back and promised to bring the gun back as Bren Ten. Their contact person at the time if memory serves correct was Eric Kincel. Viltor never got the project off the ground supposedly due to them fulfilling military contracts for their other products. Master gunsmith Chuck Warner was working on a modern version that never panned out. I think the Bren Ten was way ahead of its time and failed because the business side was not well thought out. If you handle an actual gun, it has the CZ75 ergonomics and feels pretty good in the hand. Recoil is brisk with full power loads. I have original Norma 200 gr and 170 JHP. I also like the 175gr Winchester Silver Tip. I actually thought a company such as Ruger with their experience in stainless manufacturing could have built the gun successfully. In 2024, with all of the CNC technology, I personally think the Bren Ten could be done in 9mm, .40/10mm, .45 ACP with some design changes that would make manufacturing simpler. EAA/Defiant makes several 10mm variants but nothing as close as the Bren Ten. If a modern version ever came out, I would a pair. And more recently Chuck Warner was trying to resurrect the design. To the point he took money from a lot of investors who never received their firearms. Now that he's had his troubles with the ATF I suspect they never will. |
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Originally Posted By nipster74: And more recently Chuck Warner was trying to resurrect the design. To the point he took money from a lot of investors who never received their firearms. Now that he's had his troubles with the ATF I suspect they never will. I would have bought a gun or two if Chuck would have gotten the project running. The people who have the "shut up and take my money mentality" have to expect to get nothing or be patient as hell. I will never buy a brand new designed gun until the design has been out for a while. Something I learned from reading and watching all of these debacles happen. |
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Originally Posted By 50-140: Bren 10, Coonan .357, two pistols that will always be more mythical than real. |
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Originally Posted By nipster74: And more recently Chuck Warner was trying to resurrect the design. To the point he took money from a lot of investors who never received their firearms. Now that he's had his troubles with the ATF I suspect they never will. A guy who is local to me was big into the Chick Warner project. He supplied Chuck with several frames and a couple of complete guns for R&D (ie reverse engineering). He was big on me being in on the ground floor. I told him when I saw the first 500 (that was anticipated number of pistols in the first run) come out, I'd drop $3K on the the first pistol of the second run. Following the progress on the webpage and seeing the continued push back due to whatever excuse of the week they had, I was not expecting anyone to ever receive a pistol. Then Chuck got his shop raided by the ATF. All the frames and parts made to that point were seized. My friend claimed to have lost all the stuff he left to Chuck. Long story short, the friend was indicted by the Federal Grand Jury for the northern district of Florida for 60 some counts of wire fraud related to the project. So I dodged a $3K loss on the project. The Bren Ten was a great idea. Poorly executed. The pre production hype combined with the lack of an infrastructure capable of keeping up with demand, doomed it to failure from the start. |
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If ever there was a cursed pistol, the Bren Ten is it. God know how much money has been flushed down the drain with that project. It seems every ten years or so another attempt is made. Only thing close might be the Automag. I suspect EAA/Tangfolio could come up with something close but the market would say not close enough and walk away. Always thought they had a odd appearance, like the design was never completely finished. |
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Originally Posted By Plancha123: Has anyone ever heard of a Bren Ten? It is apparently very collectible. I saw one on Morphy Auctions (starts Sept. 10, 2024). Apparently there were only 75 ever made. For you old guys, it's the gun that Sonny Crockett carried in Miami Vice (show, not movie). I read that Jeff Cooper was involved in the creation. I guess it was either the first or one of the first 10mm's ever produced. Morphy Auctions Just saw this major league OP fail.  Instead of tossing out factually erroneous statements masquerading as timid speculation, try reading the book: “Bren Ten: The Heir Apparent,” by the late great Ron Carrillo.  It is still, hands-down, the best and most accurate history ever written both of the origins of the 10mm AUTO cartridge and the first commercial production 10mm gun - the Bren Ten and its variations. |
