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Posted: 6/6/2026 3:46:59 PM EDT
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Honest to God, hand on the bible...It doesn't make sense to me either. But brand new you can buy this for $325 right now and with a trigger and a 24 cent #2 split ring this handgun's trigger feels like a nice 2011. Trigger pull was 4lbs 9oz before the #2 split ring and after it I am averaging 3lbs 5oz and a very crisp break and Glock like trigger reset. Unreal 
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Joined:
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| While I prefer a duty weight trigger in any handgun that is not a pure target gun (including 1911's/2011's-- 4.5-5.5 lb), I have shot a few well-tuned 1911's and that trigger pull is really hard to beat for a target gun (Buckmark gives them a good run for the money). I guess I'll have to try a tuned Canik. |
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Originally Posted By leelaw: A good Sig P210 trigger. Hinged, has a little creep, but it's fantastic. Can someone explain why straight pull is so widely considered better than a pivoted trigger? I mean I've never heard someone complain about a Colt SAA trigger compared to a 1911. Even with some semiautomatic SAOs with pivoted triggers, the difference in performance can be negligible. |
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Originally Posted By NN300BLK:Can someone explain why straight pull is so widely considered better than a pivoted trigger? I mean I've never heard someone complain about a Colt SAA trigger compared to a 1911. Even with some semiautomatic SAOs with pivoted triggers, the difference in performance can be negligible. But a pivoting trigger is moving in two directions, horizontally and vertically, since it is moving in an arc. Straight back is only moving horizontally straight back. You can have a heavy, gritty 1911 trigger like anything else. Design is just one factor in the equation. But with polished components, proper weight springs and crisp break, a good 1911 trigger is special to most people who have tried one. Part of the charm may be because it is unique. Not many handguns have a straight pull trigger. Trigger feel is very personal and subjective. Part of it may be how it makes you feel, and with that miniscule differences matter. But even if you are being subjective and comparing performance in speed and accuracy, we all have different hands. What is best for one person may be different for someone else. Performance wise, it's also difficult to separate the trigger from gun it's in, bore axis, recoil system, and how the grip design works for you (or doesn't). |
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Originally Posted By NN300BLK: Can someone explain why straight pull is so widely considered better than a pivoted trigger? I mean I've never heard someone complain about a Colt SAA trigger compared to a 1911. Even with some semiautomatic SAOs with pivoted triggers, the difference in performance can be negligible. I don't think one is inherently better than the other, but they have a distinctly different feel, even when comparing excellent versions of each type. |
| My Timney trigger with the Johnny Glock shoe is just under 3lbs with almost zero travel. It feels similiar to my 1911 trigger. That's also because the striker is precocked and the trigger bar is just falling straight out of it's way. |
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Originally Posted By NN300BLK: Can someone explain why straight pull is so widely considered better than a pivoted trigger? I mean I've never heard someone complain about a Colt SAA trigger compared to a 1911. Even with some semiautomatic SAOs with pivoted triggers, the difference in performance can be negligible. It’s the physics. With a pivoting trigger one of two things is going to happen. Your trigger finger is going to have to slide on the trigger, or you’re not actually pulling straight back. While the amount is minimal and may not even be noticeable to most, it scales the heavier a trigger gets and is often going to cause real world hit factor loss at speed. So in a 3 pound trigger it may not be as noticeable, but a 5 pound trigger you might be seeing some loss of consistency. A lot of people pick up a gun and do a slow trigger pull and judge every sliver of an inch. The reality is when you’re trying to shoot as quick and accurate as possible, that’s when shooter error is actually coming into play and you’re seeing an entirely different approach from slow fire. A straight pull trigger is easier to be consistent with less thought process or fine motor skill, but that can be trained around. And just a side note, this is why I think Glock made their Gen 6 trigger the way they did. After having used a trigger with a shoe, I think every trigger having a clear indexing point is beneficial to all skill levels. One less thing to worry/think about doesn’t hurt. |
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Originally Posted By dmk0210: There is nothing wrong with a pivoting trigger. SA revolvers can have wonderful triggers that are the chef's kiss. But a pivoting trigger is moving in two directions, horizontally and vertically, since it is moving in an arc. Straight back is only moving horizontally straight back. You can have a heavy, gritty 1911 trigger like anything else. Design is just one factor in the equation. But with polished components, proper weight springs and crisp break, a good 1911 trigger is special to most people who have tried one. Part of the charm may be because it is unique. Not many handguns have a straight pull trigger. Trigger feel is very personal and subjective. Part of it may be how it makes you feel, and with that miniscule differences matter. But even if you are being subjective and comparing performance in speed and accuracy, we all have different hands. What is best for one person may be different for someone else. Performance wise, it's also difficult to separate the trigger from gun it's in, bore axis, recoil system, and how the grip design works for you (or doesn't). Originally Posted By dmk0210: There is nothing wrong with a pivoting trigger. SA revolvers can have wonderful triggers that are the chef's kiss. But a pivoting trigger is moving in two directions, horizontally and vertically, since it is moving in an arc. Straight back is only moving horizontally straight back. You can have a heavy, gritty 1911 trigger like anything else. Design is just one factor in the equation. But with polished components, proper weight springs and crisp break, a good 1911 trigger is special to most people who have tried one. Part of the charm may be because it is unique. Not many handguns have a straight pull trigger. Trigger feel is very personal and subjective. Part of it may be how it makes you feel, and with that miniscule differences matter. But even if you are being subjective and comparing performance in speed and accuracy, we all have different hands. What is best for one person may be different for someone else. Performance wise, it's also difficult to separate the trigger from gun it's in, bore axis, recoil system, and how the grip design works for you (or doesn't). Originally Posted By -OdieGreen-: It’s the physics. With a pivoting trigger one of two things is going to happen. Your trigger finger is going to have to slide on the trigger, or you’re not actually pulling straight back. While the amount is minimal and may not even be noticeable to most, it scales the heavier a trigger gets and is often going to cause real world hit factor loss at speed. So in a 3 pound trigger it may not be as noticeable, but a 5 pound trigger you might be seeing some loss of consistency. A lot of people pick up a gun and do a slow trigger pull and judge every sliver of an inch. The reality is when you’re trying to shoot as quick and accurate as possible, that’s when shooter error is actually coming into play and you’re seeing an entirely different approach from slow fire. A straight pull trigger is easier to be consistent with less thought process or fine motor skill, but that can be trained around. And just a side note, this is why I think Glock made their Gen 6 trigger the way they did. After having used a trigger with a shoe, I think every trigger having a clear indexing point is beneficial to all skill levels. One less thing to worry/think about doesn’t hurt. I get what both of you're saying from a theoretical standpoint in terms of the trigger moving in two axes and I get the idea that a straight pull cares less about trigger finger position, but I rarely see it in practice for me. I will admit that my example Colt SAA generally has a very light and crisp trigger without take up, which obviously minimizes and issues that occurs from said movement; and this often true of many SAO guns except having minimal take up. I also have a lot of controlled pairs under my belt, so perhaps I have somewhat trained around it. I agree with you -OdieGreen- that the indexing is very important/helpful which I appreciate on my Echelon and Hellcat since my finger finds "home" every time. I also agree with you dmk0210 that the internal polish and quality of the trigger components play a large role in trigger pull quality as well. With certain firearms, you get this from the factory and other firearms see a big improvement after the break in period because we're doing "deburring through wear" by putting 50-500 rounds through the gun. |
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Originally Posted By NN300BLK:I get what both of you're saying from a theoretical standpoint in terms of the trigger moving in two axes and I get the idea that a straight pull cares less about trigger finger position, but I rarely see it in practice for me. I will admit that my example Colt SAA generally has a very light and crisp trigger without take up, which obviously minimizes and issues that occurs from said movement; and this often true of many SAO guns except having minimal take up... I also agree with you dmk0210 that the internal polish and quality of the trigger components play a large role in trigger pull quality as well. ... It's kind of like when a girl is smoking hot and good in bed, you care less about her being narcissistic and neurotic.  |
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Originally Posted By dmk0210: When you have a nicely tuned trigger, smooth, crisp, with short over travel, reset and takeup, you care less about any deficiencies in design. It's kind of like when a girl is smoking hot and good in bed, you care less about her being narcissistic and neurotic. It's true. On the first point... on a 1911, I can't reach the mag catch without breaking my grip and they are heavy! But man are they fun to shoot. With the XDM Elite, the grip was always too blocky for me, but I could really shoot that gun well. The only reason I sold it was because the Echelon was just that much better. On the second point, no comment except... what was I thinkin'. |
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Originally Posted By DVCER: I’m going to have to ask, where does the split ring go? Trigger bar to trigger return spring. But I have since removed it as the trigger pull got too light for my taste. Put everything back to stock and changed out the factory striker spring for a Glock 6lb heavy duty spring and now the trigger is about perfect. |
